Israeli Prime Minister Knocks It Out Of The Park

[PubliusInfinitum]

Podhoretz wrote an article recently that mentioned the bizarre reaction of the American Jewish community in supporting Obama (it was like 85% or mroe) while it was clear that Obama was going to be a big problem for Israel.
I think he attributed it to the liberal Jews' discarding of their faith, and lack of understanding about what Judaism means.
I couldn't agree more.

... As for why Jews support Obama? One...we live here. And contrary to the dual loyalty BS propagated by anti-semitic garbage, we make choices that are better for THIS country, not Israel.

Yeah Podhoretz has usually spot on; that he nailed this one isn't unusual; and that Jillian demonstrates such is even less noteworthy...

But that she advances this, PROVING IT, while overtly attempting to DENY IT... IS HYSTERICAL!

(In at least two contexts and on several levels...)

 

[rayboyusmc]

I am pro Israeli. I am not pro "God's People"

 

[WillowTree]

According to Israel, the U.N is biased against a Jewish state and yet they gave him a forum.

you think giving a "forum" proves they aren't biased?

actually, they've always tried to do hatchet jobs on Israel...

which terrorist supporters did they appoint to this "investigation"?

It is nice to see I am not the only one in here to be shocked at the increasingly open anti-Jewish sentiment that is bantered about in this forum...

no you are not the only one. I am shocked. It's ugly.

 

[Contumacious]

ah - you are now fully engaged in the bigot-backpeddle!

Too late my friend - you have exposed your bigotry for all in here to see. Sadly, some will likely support that bigotry, but i do believe the majority will not...

go ahead and quote the exact part that is "bigotry" go right ahead. I'd love to see you prove it.

You're being very dishonest, but it's not surprising coming from you.

do you support the state of israel?

no!

do you agree with the israeli prime minister's denouncing of the iranian president?

no!


.

 

[The Rabbi]

How ya feel Jillian about Obama threatening Israel and working to pull the plug on them? He is after all YOUR man.

Podhoretz wrote an article recently that mentioned the bizarre reaction of the American Jewish community in supporting Obama (it was like 85% or mroe) while it was clear that Obama was going to be a big problem for Israel.
I think he attributed it to the liberal Jews' discarding of their faith, and lack of understanding about what Judaism means.
I couldn't agree more.

1. To RGS... he isn't pulling the plug on Israel...that's retarded. I have no issue with Netanyahu strenghtening his bargaining position, but Obama's right not to support ADDITIONAL sttlements (note: HE HAS NEVER SAID DISBAND THE ONES THAT ALREADY EXISTED).

2. "Rabbi", are you really surprised? Podhoeretz is a neo-con extremist. A failed policy that has rightly been tossed out the door. But if you look at what the neo-cons have done "for" Israel, honestly, you'll see they weren't friends. They destabilized the middle east by removing the power that balanced Iran's...leaving Ahmadinejad as the strongest leader in that part of the world. Do you think that helped Israel? Or Egypt? Jordan? Lebanon? Do you think it made Lebananon more or less hospitable to Hezbollah? Do you think it made the pals more or less hospitable to Hamas? The middle east has always needed a scalpel...and nuanced problem solving. They NEVER needed the hatchet cheney and his PNAC buddies went in with.

As for why Jews support Obama? One...we live here. And contrary to the dual loyalty BS propagated by anti-semitic garbage, we make choices that are better for THIS country, not Israel. And as I said, I think the neo-con policies were ultimately very dangerous to Israel. How much better would it have been for Baby Bush to have allowed Ahmadinejad to continue to work with this country on terrorism issues (which he was doing until the moron called him one of the "axis of evil"). How much better if Saddam were still in power balancing that venal freak's hold on the mideast?

Finally, even if I didn't think the neo-con, chickenhawks who raped this country's wealth and killed so many of its bravest in a pretend war of choice hurt Israel, they still come pre-packaged with the rabid religious right and the braindead Sarah Palin... Do you really think that someone who wants the end of the world because she thinks she's going to be raptured up should have her finger on the button any more than a fundie loon like Ahmadinejad who thinks he's going to paradise if he takes out Israel?

So your response is to name-call. This means you have no arguments at all. You simply accept the contradiction, close your eyes and think of Tel Aviv.
I'll point out the Israelis considered Saddam every bit the threat they now consider Iran. That pretty well undermines any argument you might have made.
The self deception here is thick.

 

[Polk]

Perhaps you missed it; that Democratic Party hero, Jimmy Carter officially confirmed that Isreal has nukes (a year ago in May: Jimmy Carter says Israel had 150 nuclear weapons - Times Online). So, he leaked classified information, that Dem icon.

What's next? He's going to leak the sky is blue?

That's not the point. It's classified information. Carter knew that and still leaked it. Irrespective of whether it is common suspicion or not, leaking classified information is illegal. By doing so, Carter confirmed what was only on record as a suspicion. He is an A-1 idiot in so many ways, and this is just one of them.

That assumes, of course, his statement was based on classified information. The number he gave it what most outside analysts project is the number of Israeli nuclear weapons.

 

[jillian]

Podhoretz wrote an article recently that mentioned the bizarre reaction of the American Jewish community in supporting Obama (it was like 85% or mroe) while it was clear that Obama was going to be a big problem for Israel.
I think he attributed it to the liberal Jews' discarding of their faith, and lack of understanding about what Judaism means.
I couldn't agree more.

1. To RGS... he isn't pulling the plug on Israel...that's retarded. I have no issue with Netanyahu strenghtening his bargaining position, but Obama's right not to support ADDITIONAL sttlements (note: HE HAS NEVER SAID DISBAND THE ONES THAT ALREADY EXISTED).

2. "Rabbi", are you really surprised? Podhoeretz is a neo-con extremist. A failed policy that has rightly been tossed out the door. But if you look at what the neo-cons have done "for" Israel, honestly, you'll see they weren't friends. They destabilized the middle east by removing the power that balanced Iran's...leaving Ahmadinejad as the strongest leader in that part of the world. Do you think that helped Israel? Or Egypt? Jordan? Lebanon? Do you think it made Lebananon more or less hospitable to Hezbollah? Do you think it made the pals more or less hospitable to Hamas? The middle east has always needed a scalpel...and nuanced problem solving. They NEVER needed the hatchet cheney and his PNAC buddies went in with.

As for why Jews support Obama? One...we live here. And contrary to the dual loyalty BS propagated by anti-semitic garbage, we make choices that are better for THIS country, not Israel. And as I said, I think the neo-con policies were ultimately very dangerous to Israel. How much better would it have been for Baby Bush to have allowed Ahmadinejad to continue to work with this country on terrorism issues (which he was doing until the moron called him one of the "axis of evil"). How much better if Saddam were still in power balancing that venal freak's hold on the mideast?

Finally, even if I didn't think the neo-con, chickenhawks who raped this country's wealth and killed so many of its bravest in a pretend war of choice hurt Israel, they still come pre-packaged with the rabid religious right and the braindead Sarah Palin... Do you really think that someone who wants the end of the world because she thinks she's going to be raptured up should have her finger on the button any more than a fundie loon like Ahmadinejad who thinks he's going to paradise if he takes out Israel?

So your response is to name-call. This means you have no arguments at all. You simply accept the contradiction, close your eyes and think of Tel Aviv.
I'll point out the Israelis considered Saddam every bit the threat they now consider Iran. That pretty well undermines any argument you might have made.
The self deception here is thick.

i'll ignore your non-responsive bs...

cause if you notice, i never insulted YOU.

I have every right to comment on the morons who were in power for eight years. If you take that personally, that's your problem. You asked why Jews support Obama. Partly, it's because he isn't trying to make this country a theocracy like the religious right... part of it is that secular Jews couldn't care less about gay marriage and don't want prayer in schools... and don't like coded racial messages that support the southern strategy. It RIGHTLY makes us distrustful...

oh yeah... and most conservative/reform/secular jews are pro choice...so party platforms that talk about disposing of Roe v Wade don't float our boat.

There's more than one issue in the world.

And I suspect if you ask the israeli's would they have rather had Saddam in power or a destablilized Iraq, which they would pick.

They took out Iraq's nuclear capability... Iraq had no more WMD's... at least none that 200 billion dollars and thousands of lives couldn't find or destroy. And if they have to, they'll take out Iran's...

And just to emphasize the fallacy in your argument:

Friday, 7 February, 2003, 12:59 GMT
Israel warns of Iraq war 'earthquake'

Saddam has traditionally supported the Palestinians

The head of the Israeli army has warned of an "earthquake, which will reshape" the Middle East if America goes to war with Iraq.
Lieutenant-General Moshe Yaalon told an Israeli newspaper that while he expected America to launch a strike, he was more concerned about attacks by Palestinian militants than any danger posed to Israel by Iraq.

BBC NEWS | Middle East | Israel warns of Iraq war 'earthquake'

 

[Si modo]

1. To RGS... he isn't pulling the plug on Israel...that's retarded. I have no issue with Netanyahu strenghtening his bargaining position, but Obama's right not to support ADDITIONAL sttlements (note: HE HAS NEVER SAID DISBAND THE ONES THAT ALREADY EXISTED).

2. "Rabbi", are you really surprised? Podhoeretz is a neo-con extremist. A failed policy that has rightly been tossed out the door. But if you look at what the neo-cons have done "for" Israel, honestly, you'll see they weren't friends. They destabilized the middle east by removing the power that balanced Iran's...leaving Ahmadinejad as the strongest leader in that part of the world. Do you think that helped Israel? Or Egypt? Jordan? Lebanon? Do you think it made Lebananon more or less hospitable to Hezbollah? Do you think it made the pals more or less hospitable to Hamas? The middle east has always needed a scalpel...and nuanced problem solving. They NEVER needed the hatchet cheney and his PNAC buddies went in with.

As for why Jews support Obama? One...we live here. And contrary to the dual loyalty BS propagated by anti-semitic garbage, we make choices that are better for THIS country, not Israel. And as I said, I think the neo-con policies were ultimately very dangerous to Israel. How much better would it have been for Baby Bush to have allowed Ahmadinejad to continue to work with this country on terrorism issues (which he was doing until the moron called him one of the "axis of evil"). How much better if Saddam were still in power balancing that venal freak's hold on the mideast?

Finally, even if I didn't think the neo-con, chickenhawks who raped this country's wealth and killed so many of its bravest in a pretend war of choice hurt Israel, they still come pre-packaged with the rabid religious right and the braindead Sarah Palin... Do you really think that someone who wants the end of the world because she thinks she's going to be raptured up should have her finger on the button any more than a fundie loon like Ahmadinejad who thinks he's going to paradise if he takes out Israel?

So your response is to name-call. This means you have no arguments at all. You simply accept the contradiction, close your eyes and think of Tel Aviv.
I'll point out the Israelis considered Saddam every bit the threat they now consider Iran. That pretty well undermines any argument you might have made.
The self deception here is thick.

i'll ignore your non-responsive bs...

cause if you notice, i never insulted YOU.

I have every right to comment on the morons who were in power for eight years. If you take that personally, that's your problem. You asked why Jews support Obama. Partly, it's because he isn't trying to make this country a theocracy like the religious right... part of it is that secular Jews couldn't care less about gay marriage and don't want prayer in schools... and don't like coded racial messages that support the southern strategy. It RIGHTLY makes us distrustful...

oh yeah... and most conservative/reform/secular jews are pro choice...so party platforms that talk about disposing of Roe v Wade don't float our boat.

There's more than one issue in the world. ....

On that, I agree.

.... And I suspect if you ask the israeli's would they have rather had Saddam in power or a destablilized Iraq, which they would pick. ....

The views of my IDF friends are contradictory to this, but that's just anecdotal.

 

[Sunni Man]

you think giving a "forum" proves they aren't biased?

actually, they've always tried to do hatchet jobs on Israel...

which terrorist supporters did they appoint to this "investigation"?

It is nice to see I am not the only one in here to be shocked at the increasingly open anti-Jewish sentiment that is bantered about in this forum...

no you are not the only one. I am shocked. It's ugly.

I agree with you Willow Tree.

There is alot of uncalled for anti-semitism on this forum.

But, Netanyahu should be criticized the same as any other politician.

And Israel and it's zionist fanitics should also be open for criticism, without a person being labeled anti-semitic for doing so.

 

[The Rabbi]

1. To RGS... he isn't pulling the plug on Israel...that's retarded. I have no issue with Netanyahu strenghtening his bargaining position, but Obama's right not to support ADDITIONAL sttlements (note: HE HAS NEVER SAID DISBAND THE ONES THAT ALREADY EXISTED).

2. "Rabbi", are you really surprised? Podhoeretz is a neo-con extremist. A failed policy that has rightly been tossed out the door. But if you look at what the neo-cons have done "for" Israel, honestly, you'll see they weren't friends. They destabilized the middle east by removing the power that balanced Iran's...leaving Ahmadinejad as the strongest leader in that part of the world. Do you think that helped Israel? Or Egypt? Jordan? Lebanon? Do you think it made Lebananon more or less hospitable to Hezbollah? Do you think it made the pals more or less hospitable to Hamas? The middle east has always needed a scalpel...and nuanced problem solving. They NEVER needed the hatchet cheney and his PNAC buddies went in with.

As for why Jews support Obama? One...we live here. And contrary to the dual loyalty BS propagated by anti-semitic garbage, we make choices that are better for THIS country, not Israel. And as I said, I think the neo-con policies were ultimately very dangerous to Israel. How much better would it have been for Baby Bush to have allowed Ahmadinejad to continue to work with this country on terrorism issues (which he was doing until the moron called him one of the "axis of evil"). How much better if Saddam were still in power balancing that venal freak's hold on the mideast?

Finally, even if I didn't think the neo-con, chickenhawks who raped this country's wealth and killed so many of its bravest in a pretend war of choice hurt Israel, they still come pre-packaged with the rabid religious right and the braindead Sarah Palin... Do you really think that someone who wants the end of the world because she thinks she's going to be raptured up should have her finger on the button any more than a fundie loon like Ahmadinejad who thinks he's going to paradise if he takes out Israel?

So your response is to name-call. This means you have no arguments at all. You simply accept the contradiction, close your eyes and think of Tel Aviv.
I'll point out the Israelis considered Saddam every bit the threat they now consider Iran. That pretty well undermines any argument you might have made.
The self deception here is thick.

i'll ignore your non-responsive bs...

cause if you notice, i never insulted YOU.

I have every right to comment on the morons who were in power for eight years. If you take that personally, that's your problem. You asked why Jews support Obama. Partly, it's because he isn't trying to make this country a theocracy like the religious right... part of it is that secular Jews couldn't care less about gay marriage and don't want prayer in schools... and don't like coded racial messages that support the southern strategy. It RIGHTLY makes us distrustful...

oh yeah... and most conservative/reform/secular jews are pro choice...so party platforms that talk about disposing of Roe v Wade don't float our boat.

There's more than one issue in the world.

And I suspect if you ask the israeli's would they have rather had Saddam in power or a destablilized Iraq, which they would pick.

They took out Iraq's nuclear capability... Iraq had no more WMD's... at least none that 200 billion dollars and thousands of lives couldn't find or destroy. And if they have to, they'll take out Iran's...

And just to emphasize the fallacy in your argument:

Friday, 7 February, 2003, 12:59 GMT
Israel warns of Iraq war 'earthquake'

Saddam has traditionally supported the Palestinians

The head of the Israeli army has warned of an "earthquake, which will reshape" the Middle East if America goes to war with Iraq.
Lieutenant-General Moshe Yaalon told an Israeli newspaper that while he expected America to launch a strike, he was more concerned about attacks by Palestinian militants than any danger posed to Israel by Iraq.

BBC NEWS | Middle East | Israel warns of Iraq war 'earthquake'

Did I say you insulted me? No, I did not. I did say you engaged in name calling as a substitute for argument. And you still do.
Yes, you are right on one point: Liberal Jews support Obama because they are liberals, not because they are Jews. They have abandoned what makes them Jews, opting for a gastronomic Judaism of high-fat foods and Seinfeld re-runs. Thus they are cut loose from the underpinnings of the faith and its values.
The very article you site undermines your argument as it mentions that Saddam supported Pali terrorism and this has been the chief concern of Israeli governments.
As to whether Israeli govts prefer Saddam or Iran, I had no idea you were well enough connected to make such a statement. I sure don't know.

 

[The Rabbi]

It is nice to see I am not the only one in here to be shocked at the increasingly open anti-Jewish sentiment that is bantered about in this forum...

no you are not the only one. I am shocked. It's ugly.

I agree with you Willow Tree.

There is alot of uncalled for anti-semitism on this forum.

But, Netanyahu should be criticized the same as any other politician.

And Israel and it's zionist fanitics should also be open for criticism, without a person being labeled anti-semitic for doing so.

Thanks.
I agree Israel is hardly above criticism. Or that all criticism is anti semitic.
But a lot of it is and in practice it is hard to separate the two.

 

[jillian]

Thanks.
I agree Israel is hardly above criticism. Or that all criticism is anti semitic.
But a lot of it is and in practice it is hard to separate the two.

you understand that sunni is one of the worst propagators of anti-semitic spew on this board, right? he's also a holocaust denier....

 

[The Rabbi]

Thanks.
I agree Israel is hardly above criticism. Or that all criticism is anti semitic.
But a lot of it is and in practice it is hard to separate the two.

you understand that sunni is one of the worst propagators of anti-semitic spew on this board, right? he's also a holocaust denier....

So that makes every post of his wrong?
I call them as I see them. That post looked fine. I have no problem with Muslims, btw.

 

[jillian]

Thanks.
I agree Israel is hardly above criticism. Or that all criticism is anti semitic.
But a lot of it is and in practice it is hard to separate the two.

you understand that sunni is one of the worst propagators of anti-semitic spew on this board, right? he's also a holocaust denier....

So that makes every post of his wrong?
I call them as I see them. That post looked fine. I have no problem with Muslims, btw.

i have no problems with muslims either. i have a problem with liars and holocaust deniers.

I just wanted you to understand that he was being disingenuous in his post.

carry on....

 

[The Rabbi]

I'm sure I am smart enough to figure out his views the more I read of them.

 

[Sunni Man]

you understand that sunni is one of the worst propagators of anti-semitic spew on this board, right? he's also a holocaust denier....

So that makes every post of his wrong?
I call them as I see them. That post looked fine. I have no problem with Muslims, btw.

i have no problems with muslims either. i have a problem with liars and holocaust deniers.

I just wanted you to understand that he was being disingenuous in his post.

carry on....

Then why are you lying Jillian???

I have said many times that I have nothing against the Jewish people or the beautiful religion of Judiasm.

I am only opposed to the state of Israel and the zionists who rule it.

As for the Holocaust; I see alot of flaws in the official story, and know that the victor writes the history books of any conflict.

To say that the holocaust should be open for debate and examination by scholars is NOT anti-semitic, except to zionist fanatics like you Jillian.

 

[jillian]

So that makes every post of his wrong?
I call them as I see them. That post looked fine. I have no problem with Muslims, btw.

i have no problems with muslims either. i have a problem with liars and holocaust deniers.

I just wanted you to understand that he was being disingenuous in his post.

carry on....

Then why are you lying Jillian???

I have said many times that I have nothing against the Jewish people or the beautiful religion of Judiasm.

I am only opposed to the state of Israel and the zionists who rule it.

As for the Holocaust; I see alot of flaws in the official story, and know that the victor writes the history books of any conflict.

To say that the holocaust should be open for debate and examination by scholars is NOT anti-semitic, except to zionist fanatics like you Jillian.

go post another holocaust denying thread....

s'matter, truth hurts?

tough.

 

[jillian]

I'm sure I am smart enough to figure out his views the more I read of them.

if you say so.

 

[SwingVoter]

To say that the holocaust should be open for debate and examination by scholars is NOT anti-semitic

yeah, and while we're at it, I'd like to open a debate on whether the occupation of France really happened, or whether it was just a publicity scam by Churchill and Roosevelt, I mean do we know for sure those soldiers weren't just kicking back on a nice June day on Normandy Beach checking out French chicks in skimpy bathing suits? and what if the Battle of Bulge was really just Churchill whipping it out and claiming his was bigger than Mussolini's?

should this be open for debate and examination by scholars?

 

[WillowTree]

I wonder if muslims take polio shots?