Is homeschooling a good solution?

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

What happens when the home schooler doesn't know the subject matter?..

more than likely the case.

also more than likely the case that the homeschooler has a religious agenda in wanting to keep their kid away from public school.

there are virtually no standards for homeschooled kids.

A.) That's not true at all. The state's educational curriculum must be followed by the home schooled just as it is by the public schooled. And the home schooled take the same "standardized testing" that the public school student takes.

B.) What is the problem with a "religious agenda"? That's what this country was largely founded on - religious freedom.

C.) Lets pretend that a parent is incapable of teaching the curriculum and lets pretend that there are "no standards" for homeschooled children (and I can tell you unequivocally 100% that is not the case) - so what? Where does anyone derive the power to over rule a parent on how their child should be educated and where is that power derived from? Why is the left so afraid of freedom? Why do they feel the need to push their agenda and ideology on everyone else? How about we just try freedom? You indoctrinate your children if that's what you desire, I'll home school and liberate my children. We all win. You're happy. I'm happy. Unless of course, you really do want to force your will on others. In that case, you wouldn't be happy in this scenario. But I would like to think that's not who you really are.

Not in all states. To which state are you referring?

it's not true in most states

You did not answer the question.

 

[jillian]

And many of those budget shortcomings are due to teachers unions EVERY time a schools receives $5 in new funding there are the teachers right there, wanting $4 of that applied to teachers' salaries.

you want your kids taught but don't want to pay teachers?

there is limitless money for corporate welfare....

and unnecessary military equipment that even the military doesn't want ....

and agricultural subsidies....

and payment for Michele Bachmann's family farm

and her husband's pretend pray away the gay practice....

but "teachers unions" are the problem?

A) where did I say I don't want to pay teachers?

B) Corporate welfare, LOL give me a break

C) I believe there is much waste in defense spending, that can and should be cut. Hell, I'd do away with the Air Force in it's entirety if it were up to me

D) I'm against paying farmers to not grow a crop, its stupid.

E) See D

Oh, I guess you just liberally jumped to a conclusion not supported by facts there eh?

no.....if you jump to criticizing teachers unions, you clearly want to divest teachers of their bargaining power and want to screw them.

hence my comment....by which I stand.

By the way my dear friend - have you forgotten the meaning of "public servant"? A teacher, a police officer, a representative were not intended to make lots of money. It was supposed to be a choice of serving. In return, they were supposed to have job security and a respectable pension.

But somewhere along the way, as the left got greedier and greedier, it became "ask not, what I can do for my country, ask what my country can do for me". And then they brought in unions and demanded exorbitant salaries, cadillac healthcare plans, exorbitant pensions, and oh yeah - part time work with tons of time off.

On what planet does this happen?

it doesn't.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Once again for possible penetration of some thick craniums, i do not think home schooling should be eliminated, but in my experience, the harm is in there being no supervision of the educational process. My biggest beef on this thread is people advocating for homeschooling by bashing public school teachers.

Worst teachers on the planet are probably the ones teaching on Indian reservations... Federal government employees

A lot has gone wrong with the Indian Reservations. Teachers are the least of the problem.[/QUOT

Once again for possible penetration of some thick craniums, i do not think home schooling should be eliminated, but in my experience, the harm is in there being no supervision of the educational process. My biggest beef on this thread is people advocating for homeschooling by bashing public school teachers.

The Worst teachers on the planet are probably the ones teaching on Indian reservations... Federal government employees

Some of the best teachers are in the Department of Defense Dependents schools. We were all government employees too!

Here is what you get from total federal control and pure socialism… this is where I grew up.


home to an entire Native American population living in conditions equivalent to those found among the poorest third world countries. Left in the wake of a terrible absence of resources, members of the Lakota Sioux Tribe are left feeling broken, hopeless and unimportant. Mostly unknown or forgotten by mainstream society, the average U.S. resident knows little, if anything, about the true history and current state of the Native American Indians. The below statistics and facts chronicle just one nation, the Lakota Sioux of the Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota.

• The population of the Pine Ridge Reservation is 18,834.
• At 11,000-square miles, the Pine Ridge Reservation is the second largest Native American Reservation in the U.S.
• Alcoholism affects eight out of 10 families, contributing to a death rate that is 300 percent higher than the remaining U.S. population.
• 97 percent of the population lives far below the U.S. federal poverty line with a median household income ranging between $2,600 and $3,500 per year.
• Pine Ridge Reservation has no industry, technology or commercial infrastructure to provide employment for its residents, contributing to its 90 percent unemployment rate.
• There is a 70 percent high school dropout rate.
• The average life expectancy on the Reservation is 47 years for men and 52 years for women.
• The teenage suicide rate is 150 percent higher than the U.S. national average.
• The infant mortality rate is the highest on this continent, and about 300 percent higher than the U.S. national average.
• Nearly 50 percent of the adults on the Reservation over the age of 40 have diabetes.
• The tuberculosis rate on the Reservation is approximately 800 percent higher than the national average, with cervical cancer not far behind at 500 percent higher than average.
• There is an estimated average of 17 people living in each family home, a home that may only have two to three rooms.
• There are no banks, motels, discount stores or movie theaters and the one grocery store of moderate size is tasked with providing for the entire community.
• Over 33 percent of homes have no electricity or basic water and sewage systems, forcing many to carry (often contaminated) water from local rivers daily for their personal needs.
• At least 60 percent of homes on the Reservation need to be demolished and replaced due to infestation of potentially fatal black mold, however, there are no insurance or government programs to assist families in replacing their homes.

Granted. Now what does that have to do with the discussion?

Homeschooling is not allowed on the Indian reservation…

Interesting.

 

[Dr.Traveler]

Once again for possible penetration of some thick craniums, i do not think home schooling should be eliminated, but in my experience, the harm is in there being no supervision of the educational process. My biggest beef on this thread is people advocating for homeschooling by bashing public school teachers.

Worst teachers on the planet are probably the ones teaching on Indian reservations... Federal government employees

A lot has gone wrong with the Indian Reservations. Teachers are the least of the problem.[/QUOT

Once again for possible penetration of some thick craniums, i do not think home schooling should be eliminated, but in my experience, the harm is in there being no supervision of the educational process. My biggest beef on this thread is people advocating for homeschooling by bashing public school teachers.

The Worst teachers on the planet are probably the ones teaching on Indian reservations... Federal government employees

Some of the best teachers are in the Department of Defense Dependents schools. We were all government employees too!

Here is what you get from total federal control and pure socialism… this is where I grew up.


home to an entire Native American population living in conditions equivalent to those found among the poorest third world countries. Left in the wake of a terrible absence of resources, members of the Lakota Sioux Tribe are left feeling broken, hopeless and unimportant. Mostly unknown or forgotten by mainstream society, the average U.S. resident knows little, if anything, about the true history and current state of the Native American Indians. The below statistics and facts chronicle just one nation, the Lakota Sioux of the Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota.

• The population of the Pine Ridge Reservation is 18,834.
• At 11,000-square miles, the Pine Ridge Reservation is the second largest Native American Reservation in the U.S.
• Alcoholism affects eight out of 10 families, contributing to a death rate that is 300 percent higher than the remaining U.S. population.
• 97 percent of the population lives far below the U.S. federal poverty line with a median household income ranging between $2,600 and $3,500 per year.
• Pine Ridge Reservation has no industry, technology or commercial infrastructure to provide employment for its residents, contributing to its 90 percent unemployment rate.
• There is a 70 percent high school dropout rate.
• The average life expectancy on the Reservation is 47 years for men and 52 years for women.
• The teenage suicide rate is 150 percent higher than the U.S. national average.
• The infant mortality rate is the highest on this continent, and about 300 percent higher than the U.S. national average.
• Nearly 50 percent of the adults on the Reservation over the age of 40 have diabetes.
• The tuberculosis rate on the Reservation is approximately 800 percent higher than the national average, with cervical cancer not far behind at 500 percent higher than average.
• There is an estimated average of 17 people living in each family home, a home that may only have two to three rooms.
• There are no banks, motels, discount stores or movie theaters and the one grocery store of moderate size is tasked with providing for the entire community.
• Over 33 percent of homes have no electricity or basic water and sewage systems, forcing many to carry (often contaminated) water from local rivers daily for their personal needs.
• At least 60 percent of homes on the Reservation need to be demolished and replaced due to infestation of potentially fatal black mold, however, there are no insurance or government programs to assist families in replacing their homes.

Granted. Now what does that have to do with the discussion?

Homeschooling is not allowed on the Indian reservation…

That's...well that's pretty terrible. If you grew up on a reservation I'm sorry. The way the Native American tribes have been treated on the reservations is one of the country's worst sins and blemishes on our history.

 

[Rustic]

Worst teachers on the planet are probably the ones teaching on Indian reservations... Federal government employees

A lot has gone wrong with the Indian Reservations. Teachers are the least of the problem.[/QUOT

The Worst teachers on the planet are probably the ones teaching on Indian reservations... Federal government employees

Some of the best teachers are in the Department of Defense Dependents schools. We were all government employees too!

Here is what you get from total federal control and pure socialism… this is where I grew up.


home to an entire Native American population living in conditions equivalent to those found among the poorest third world countries. Left in the wake of a terrible absence of resources, members of the Lakota Sioux Tribe are left feeling broken, hopeless and unimportant. Mostly unknown or forgotten by mainstream society, the average U.S. resident knows little, if anything, about the true history and current state of the Native American Indians. The below statistics and facts chronicle just one nation, the Lakota Sioux of the Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota.

• The population of the Pine Ridge Reservation is 18,834.
• At 11,000-square miles, the Pine Ridge Reservation is the second largest Native American Reservation in the U.S.
• Alcoholism affects eight out of 10 families, contributing to a death rate that is 300 percent higher than the remaining U.S. population.
• 97 percent of the population lives far below the U.S. federal poverty line with a median household income ranging between $2,600 and $3,500 per year.
• Pine Ridge Reservation has no industry, technology or commercial infrastructure to provide employment for its residents, contributing to its 90 percent unemployment rate.
• There is a 70 percent high school dropout rate.
• The average life expectancy on the Reservation is 47 years for men and 52 years for women.
• The teenage suicide rate is 150 percent higher than the U.S. national average.
• The infant mortality rate is the highest on this continent, and about 300 percent higher than the U.S. national average.
• Nearly 50 percent of the adults on the Reservation over the age of 40 have diabetes.
• The tuberculosis rate on the Reservation is approximately 800 percent higher than the national average, with cervical cancer not far behind at 500 percent higher than average.
• There is an estimated average of 17 people living in each family home, a home that may only have two to three rooms.
• There are no banks, motels, discount stores or movie theaters and the one grocery store of moderate size is tasked with providing for the entire community.
• Over 33 percent of homes have no electricity or basic water and sewage systems, forcing many to carry (often contaminated) water from local rivers daily for their personal needs.
• At least 60 percent of homes on the Reservation need to be demolished and replaced due to infestation of potentially fatal black mold, however, there are no insurance or government programs to assist families in replacing their homes.

Granted. Now what does that have to do with the discussion?

Homeschooling is not allowed on the Indian reservation…

That's...well that's pretty terrible. If you grew up on a reservation I'm sorry. The way the Native American tribes have been treated on the reservations is one of the country's worst sins and blemishes on our history.

It's Only gotten worse... Thanks to the federal government.

 

[oreo]

I don't believe liberal parents should be forced to make their children attend conservative public schools in red states and vice versa.

Home schooling is great if you want to raise a child with no exposure to any other ideas than your own,

Most people do not have the capability to home school because their own education is lacking or it is not feasible because of work schedules, etc.

If you can do it, great! If not, don't try to use it as a dodge for mandatory attendance laws or you will just be raising another idiot dependent on social services.

Very true--most of the home schooler's that I know are or were teachers themselves. At any rate--some kids do very well with home schooling, others don't. It just depends on who is doing the home schooling.

What we need is more charter schools.

 

[koshergrl]

Only a control freak would want to do away with homeschooling

Only an idiot would post something I did not say My own grandchild is being home schooled. If you read the thread, you would know that.

Then quite knocking homeschooling...

Where did I knock homeschooling in general? Please quote the post. I disagree with the notion that anyone can homeschool.

You are confused. I think a nap might be in order for you.

Everyone has a right to homeschool if they want to… It's not for progressives to say who can homeschool and who cannot.

Where did I say that?

You guys are creating a cottage industry making up shit that I did not say.

Not me. I'm still waiting for you to provide some content.

And I'm praying that you aren't really a teacher, though you are exactly the sort of substandard shill I have come to expect to be teaching in traditional public schools. No wonder kids don't learn anything.

 

[bripat9643]

A failed school system is one that graduates students who are illiterate. How about that definition?

Which ones would that be? The high school where I teach graduates about 95%of our students. None are illiterate.

Many states require competency tests to demonstrate what they have learned. How do you explain those people?

How do you explain inner city schools that fail 60% of their students? Why shouldn't parents of children in these schools have the option of sending their kids elsewhere? The don't have the option of moving to some tony suburb where the real estate prices are in the stratosphere.

Would you please explain that nonsensical gibberish? How do they "fail" the students? Students fail, Schools do not.

Sure they do. In Florida they even give the schools grades. If a school gets an 'F,' all the students become eligible for a voucher.

When a school fails 60% of its students, it's a failure.

You are talking out of your ass again. Those" failing schools" are devised from a complicated formula that has nothing to do with student academic grades. I was a high school administrator in Florida.

BTW, the voucher system ended about a decade ago. It was declared unconstitutional. Please get with the program or stop posting bull shit.

Where did I say anything about student grades? Yeah, right, we know it had nothing to do with student performance. Why would we bother evaluating schools based on student performance?

You're obviously a blowhard and an apologist for government schools.

 

[bripat9643]

Public schools aren't *quality*.

That's a generalization. There are some good public schools.

Actually it's not the schools that are better, it's the parents that are better. In upscale neighborhoods the parents are educated professionals who are motivated for their children to learn. Most of what children learn is taught by their parents. Schools simply put a rubber stamp on it.

I have yet to meet many parents that can handle high school algebra!

In most cases - that's true. But you do realize that a homeschooled student receives materials that shows step-by-step how to teach the assignments. If and when that is not enough, parents can simply turn to the internet for further information, lessons, etc. If that's still not enough - parents can and do hire tutors.

You do realize that is the technology age, don't you? We are way beyond the brick and mortar school churning out cookie cutter curriculum by unionized teachers taking the tax payer for all they are worth. I'm sorry that you feel so threatened by all of this but the reality is, we are still at least a decade away (if not two or three) from learning shifting to a new paradigm (most likely online). So relax. Take a breath.

I have no problem with people who do that. My problem is with those who don't!

I have a student whose father is an instructor in a diesel mechanics class at our community college. Mm has a college degree. Neither one can help their child learn because they "don't get it" and their son does not pay attention in class. What if they decided to pull him out and homeschool him? Do you think he would learn it if they cannot even help him now?

Perhaps its' the teachers in the school that "don't get it." What evidence do you have that the parents are at fault?

 

[bripat9643]

That's a generalization. There are some good public schools.

Actually it's not the schools that are better, it's the parents that are better. In upscale neighborhoods the parents are educated professionals who are motivated for their children to learn. Most of what children learn is taught by their parents. Schools simply put a rubber stamp on it.

I have yet to meet many parents that can handle high school algebra!

In most cases - that's true. But you do realize that a homeschooled student receives materials that shows step-by-step how to teach the assignments. If and when that is not enough, parents can simply turn to the internet for further information, lessons, etc. If that's still not enough - parents can and do hire tutors.

You do realize that is the technology age, don't you? We are way beyond the brick and mortar school churning out cookie cutter curriculum by unionized teachers taking the tax payer for all they are worth. I'm sorry that you feel so threatened by all of this but the reality is, we are still at least a decade away (if not two or three) from learning shifting to a new paradigm (most likely online). So relax. Take a breath.

You are talking to an establishment propagandist, the truth is not of interest to them. Many states now have home schooling that uses the home and uses others being home schooled to pull resources, use educators and teach people how to teach.

Once again for possible penetration of some thick craniums, i do not think home schooling should be eliminated, but in my experience, the harm is in there being no supervision of the educational process. My biggest beef on this thread is people advocating for homeschooling by bashing public school teachers.

From what I've seen, there is no harm. You have failed to produce any evidence of harm.

 

[Unkotare]

Not quite. I have a master's degree in this topic.

How about you? GED? HS diploma?

You have a vested interest in propagating the government school monopoly, so anything you claim can be automatically discounted. You can't use yourself as some kind of authority.

I have done no such thing. I simply disagree with all of the false information that is being used to denigrate my profession. Perhaps you can link to where I said anything of the sort.

My own grandchild is being home schooled.

You haven't proven ANYTHING false.

Only a complete disregard for anything that has been posted by myself and others on this thread could lead you to believe that.

Why do you hate teachers so much that you are forced to lie about them? That is the question you should be addressing.

....I hate teachers in the public s hool system. ..

That's overdoing it a bit, don't you think?

 

[hadit]

I don't believe liberal parents should be forced to make their children attend conservative public schools in red states and vice versa.

Home schooling is great if you want to raise a child with no exposure to any other ideas than your own,

Most people do not have the capability to home school because their own education is lacking or it is not feasible because of work schedules, etc.

If you can do it, great! If not, don't try to use it as a dodge for mandatory attendance laws or you will just be raising another idiot dependent on social services.

Home schooled children outperform their public school counterparts in every metric

That alone is reason to home school your kids

Prove it!

Require that high school dropout Mom that is teaching her kid to take the same tests as her public school counterpart teachers to prove the child is learning!

Go ahead! I dare you!

No one has! That is why your post stinks to high heaven.

We had our kids take the SOL's when their government school counterparts did. They did very well.

 

[hadit]

The answer to that, of course, is to make the environment positive for well performing teachers and negative for poorly performing ones, something teachers' unions fight.

what is "well performing"

what is "poorly performing".

not all classes are equal.

if you get a class of honors students, their numbers aren't going to change....thus no positive performance eval.

if you get a special ed class their numbers aren't going to move much off the dial....

so no positive performance eval.

There are some criteria by which a teacher can be evaluated. Clearly, class composition is a factor.

what criteria?

Does the teacher have a lesson plan ready when class starts? Does he/she know the material?
Does the teacher have all class work graded and back to the students on time?
Does the teacher consistently miss class?
Does the teacher have proper answers for questions asked during class?
Does the teacher bring a political agenda into the classroom?

I'm sure you can think of others.

Ultimately, it comes down to this: Do you think teacher compensation should be merit based or not?

Wow! Nobody told me it was amateur hour!

How well are the professionals doing?

 

[hadit]

That's only acceptable if you're fine with creating a permanent serf class. Kids should have access to quality food and quality education regardless of location in the USA. Accepting anything less is accepting that America doesn't need to be exceptional and that "good enough" will do.

Public schools aren't *quality*.

That's a generalization. There are some good public schools.

Actually it's not the schools that are better, it's the parents that are better. In upscale neighborhoods the parents are educated professionals who are motivated for their children to learn. Most of what children learn is taught by their parents. Schools simply put a rubber stamp on it.

I have yet to meet many parents that can handle high school algebra!

In most cases - that's true. But you do realize that a homeschooled student receives materials that shows step-by-step how to teach the assignments. If and when that is not enough, parents can simply turn to the internet for further information, lessons, etc. If that's still not enough - parents can and do hire tutors.

You do realize that is the technology age, don't you? We are way beyond the brick and mortar school churning out cookie cutter curriculum by unionized teachers taking the tax payer for all they are worth. I'm sorry that you feel so threatened by all of this but the reality is, we are still at least a decade away (if not two or three) from learning shifting to a new paradigm (most likely online). So relax. Take a breath.

Heck, ten years ago my kids were using a totally online curriculum, with teachers for every subject available to answer questions, grade homework and tests, etc.

 

[Wildman]

...conservative public schools...

that is a joke.., RIGHT??

 

[kaz]

I don't believe liberal parents should be forced to make their children attend conservative public schools in red states and vice versa.

Having lived in 8 States literally from coast to coast, I can tell you that all government schools are liberal

Not the school where I teach.

OK, all the schools but one are liberal

 

[kaz]

I don't believe liberal parents should be forced to make their children attend conservative public schools in red states and vice versa.

Having lived in 8 States literally from coast to coast, I can tell you that all government schools are liberal

Not the school where I teach.

Then it is a private school.

Public high school in a rural area. Sorry to bust your bubble.

I think you took what I said too literally. Schools across the country are dominated by the left. I've lived in rich, Republican areas and the government schools are still overwhelmingly left. I've also lived in smaller cities in red areas and they are left. I think you hit the key word for the biggest exceptions when you said "rural"

 

[Contumacious]

A failed school system is one that graduates students who are illiterate. How about that definition?

Which ones would that be? The high school where I teach graduates about 95%of our students. None are illiterate.

Many states require competency tests to demonstrate what they have learned. How do you explain those people?

How do you explain inner city schools that fail 60% of their students? Why shouldn't parents of children in these schools have the option of sending their kids elsewhere? The don't have the option of moving to some tony suburb where the real estate prices are in the stratosphere.

Would you please explain that nonsensical gibberish? How do they "fail" the students? Students fail, Schools do not.

That's just foolish. Of course SCHOOLS fail.

Government schools are incapable of getting rid of incompetent teachers.

Government schools are incapable of enforcing discipline or getting rid of students that drag down the other students and disrupt schools in general.

School unions have secured so much power that they now care only for how much money and power they have, they do NOT, nor have they ever given a rat's behind about the students.

Since I graduated high school in 1963 they have actually had to "re-center" the SAT scores because they were dropping lower and lower. While the bonus points are reduced the higher your actual score, technically you could score well above a perfect score in English and math.

Your ignorance of norm referenced tests is only surpassed by your ignorance of education is general. Schools get rid of incompetent teachers every day. You just know nothing about it because it doesn't bleed. so it doesn't lead the news.

Your concept of unions is the pablum dished out by conservatives and liberals alike who haven't darkened the door of a classroom since they dropped out or were kicked out.

Unions are for the teachers, not the students. That would be like saying the Teamsters are about the trucks!

Home schooling or private schools are the ONLY solution.


Every politically controlled educational system will inculcate the doctrine of state supremacy sooner or later. . . . Once that doctrine has been accepted, it becomes an almost superhuman task to break the stranglehold of the political power over the life of the citizen. It has had his body, property and mind in its clutches from infancy. An octopus would sooner release its prey.

A tax-supported, compulsory educational system is the complete model of the totalitarian state.

– Isabel Paterson, The God of the Machine (1943)

 

[Timmy]

Having guaranteed schooling for all our kids is one of America's best accomplishments.

Our schools are some of the best in the world . Don't believe the hype that are system failed .

 

[bripat9643]

Having guaranteed schooling for all our kids is one of America's best accomplishments.

Our schools are some of the best in the world . Don't believe the hype that are system failed .

Schooling isn't "guaranteed" if you have a 60% failure rate. Also, the ones who supposedly pass can't even read.