Is America the greatest country in the world?

[Foxfyre]

...and America remains the greatest country in the world.

It cannot possibly be consider the greatest country in the world when you fell head first into a recession. Meanwhile, Australia, a country smaller than the US and with a much smaller economy, chugged along nicely.

maybe we can export Obama and our Progressives to Australia when he loses in November?

It is true that Australia, the 6th largest country in the world in area, and 52nd in the world in population with a population of under 22 million--smaller than Texas, only slightly larger than New York State--has enjoyed a stable population and a much more stable economy than we have.

Following recessionary trends in the early 90's, economic reforms have reduced regulation and increased free market principles and keeping a low public debt--a trial stimulus produced little good--and the government now pretty much spends only what it takes in--so that Australia's economy is now the world's 3rd most free (according to the Heritage Foundation) and 5th in the world in GDP. They also have strict and stricly enforced immigration policies and a business friendly environment that keeps their unemployment at near full employment.

It is true that Australians receive a lot of government benefits--their personal tax rate is close to outs--and a high mandated minimum wage. But from what I am told by real life American friends who have lived in Australia, they are beginning to also develop an entitlement mentality and are slowly and surely stretching government benefits past the maximum so that taxes will have to be steadily increased or expensive deficits will continue to increase as the people object to any cuts in benefits. When balancing the eduction budget required a small reduction in pay and slightly longer hours, the teacher's went on strike in Victoria this summer. The effect of recently established carbon tax is yet untested. Costs of doing business and prices are pretty high.

Australia is as vulnerable to entitlement mentality creep and dominance as we are, and it is likely to be as destructive in Australia as it is here. And many of the same dynamics exist. As exists in the USA, the largest group making up almost 50% of those living in poverty is found among single parents with dependent children. The Australian poverty rate is set at just over 14% compared to the USA 15%, but as is the case in the USA, Australian poverty is relative to others in the country. Australia's poor, as the USA's poor, would be deemed well off among the poor in undeveloped countries.

Australia has been its own independent country for only a little over 100 years. The USA, being its own country for more than twice as long, was #1 in the world in just about everything good 100 years ago. Australia has plenty of time to develop the same ills we have. (I only hope the Australia people are still so ruggedly independent that they will be smarter than us and not allow that to happen.)

I am happy, however, that Noomi feels her country is the greatest in the world. I think everybody ought to be able to feel that way about their country.

 

[Foxfyre]

And once again, I have to point out that it is not constructive to try to compare an economy and a highly diverse population of more than 300 million with a highly homogenous one that is smaller than a single U.S. state.

 

[Wiseacre]

I've never been real big about comparisons to any other country. I do think it's fair to say we ain't as great as we once were, the generation that went through the depression and won WWII and then went on to build the foundations of the greatest economy the world has ever seen, was a hard act to follow. They had their warts though, social injustice was still the name of the game in many places.

Today we've made serious inroads over that social injustice, but the pendulum may have swung too far to the other way in terms of the so-called safety net that is too large. Personal responsibility and the work ethic are not what they once were, and the current generation doesn't seem to care about the problems they are leaving to posterity. Nothing great about that. We are divided in so many ways, unwilling to agree on which way to go or cooperate to find workable solutions and compromises. Our leadership is insufficient, and we don't seem to be paying much attention. More than we were, the Tea Partys are evidence of that. But nowhere near enough.

 

[Unkotare]

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/05/washington/05aids.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

 

[Foxfyre]

I've never been real big about comparisons to any other country. I do think it's fair to say we ain't as great as we once were, the generation that went through the depression and won WWII and then went on to build the foundations of the greatest economy the world has ever seen, was a hard act to follow. They had their warts though, social injustice was still the name of the game in many places.

Today we've made serious inroads over that social injustice, but the pendulum may have swung too far to the other way in terms of the so-called safety net that is too large. Personal responsibility and the work ethic are not what they once were, and the current generation doesn't seem to care about the problems they are leaving to posterity. Nothing great about that. We are divided in so many ways, unwilling to agree on which way to go or cooperate to find workable solutions and compromises. Our leadership is insufficient, and we don't seem to be paying much attention. More than we were, the Tea Partys are evidence of that. But nowhere near enough.

I agree that it is foolish to compare the USA, unique among all nations on Earth, to any other country except to note that our founding principles have been superior to those of any other country.

The Tea Party and other movements like it were and are our best hope to regain our former greatness though. The Tea Party is doing its damndest to raise conciousness about those values that made America great--personal freedom/liberty, recognition of unalienable rights, a work ethic thati includes earning what you receive from any source, paying for what we get, fiscal responsibility, personal and government moral integrity that is impossible when controlled by political correctness, and a people who govern themselves free of an authoriarian government who assigns them their rights.

And of course those who want that authoritarian government and the nanny state, and who simply shrug off a sixteen trillion dollar debt and increasing corruption among those who dole out government charity and the recipients of that charity are trashing and demonizing and marginalizing the Tea Party as much as possible. They know they have succeeded when people who think like the Tea Partiers disassociate themselves from the Tea Party or similar groups to avoid the derision and contemptuous comments thrown at them.

The pro nanny state people will not even look at our former greatness, but point to the pockets of social injustice as the sum total of what previous generations were all about. And they shrug off any negatives brought about by their own present ideology as inconsequential.

I am deeply afraid time is running out to restore America to its greatness. After this generation, there will be too few left to speak out for it. And the great experiment will have failed.

 

[Unkotare]

[

I am deeply afraid time is running out to restore America to its greatness. After this generation, there will be too few left to speak out for it. And the great experiment will have failed.

That kind of pessimism and defeatism is absolutely unAmerican.

 

[Wiseacre]

[

I am deeply afraid time is running out to restore America to its greatness. After this generation, there will be too few left to speak out for it. And the great experiment will have failed.

That kind of pessimism and defeatism is absolutely unAmerican.

Taken out of context. Fail.

 

[Unkotare]

[

I am deeply afraid time is running out to restore America to its greatness. After this generation, there will be too few left to speak out for it. And the great experiment will have failed.

That kind of pessimism and defeatism is absolutely unAmerican.

Taken out of context. Fail.

That kind of whining is just bitchy nonsense.

 

[ScienceRocks]

It is great as we have freedom of speech. This is what makes it great!

 

[waltky]

This just in...

Drug overdose may have killled woman who won $1 million in lottery but kept getting welfare
29 Sept.`12 -- A drug overdose may have killed Amanda Clayton, a Detroit-area woman who won a $1 million lottery prize but kept collecting welfare benefits, police said Saturday.

Ecorse police Sgt. Cornelius Herring said Clayton, 25, of Lincoln Park was found dead about 9 a.m. Saturday at a home, The Associated Press said. Ecorse is southwest of Detroit. Clayton won the $1 million prize in September.

In April, prosecutors accused Clayton of collecting $5,475 in food and medical benefits from August 2011 through March that she would not have received had she reported the lottery winnings and income from a job she held from June through October 2011. In June, she pleaded no contest to fraud and was sentenced to nine months' probation in July.

Her attorney has said Clayton repaid about $5,500, the AP reported. "It's simply common sense that million-dollar lottery winners forfeit their right to public assistance," Michigan Attorney General Bill Schuette said in a statement. In April, Gov. Rick Snyder signed a law requiring lottery officials to tell Human Services about new winners, the AP said.

Source

 

[LoneLaugher]

Nutters are easily moved by romantic portrayals of our history.

The fact is that we are born of greatness and of sickening cruelty.

We took many cues from the experiences of others as we built this country. We must continue to learn from others. There is much room for improvement. Clearly so.

The desire to claim number one status should not overwhelm the desire to reach it.

 

[oldernwiser]

I've never been real big about comparisons to any other country. I do think it's fair to say we ain't as great as we once were, the generation that went through the depression and won WWII and then went on to build the foundations of the greatest economy the world has ever seen, was a hard act to follow. They had their warts though, social injustice was still the name of the game in many places.

Today we've made serious inroads over that social injustice, but the pendulum may have swung too far to the other way in terms of the so-called safety net that is too large. Personal responsibility and the work ethic are not what they once were, and the current generation doesn't seem to care about the problems they are leaving to posterity. Nothing great about that. We are divided in so many ways, unwilling to agree on which way to go or cooperate to find workable solutions and compromises. Our leadership is insufficient, and we don't seem to be paying much attention. More than we were, the Tea Partys are evidence of that. But nowhere near enough.

I agree that it is foolish to compare the USA, unique among all nations on Earth, to any other country except to note that our founding principles have been superior to those of any other country.

The Tea Party and other movements like it were and are our best hope to regain our former greatness though. The Tea Party is doing its damndest to raise conciousness about those values that made America great--personal freedom/liberty, recognition of unalienable rights, a work ethic thati includes earning what you receive from any source, paying for what we get, fiscal responsibility, personal and government moral integrity that is impossible when controlled by political correctness, and a people who govern themselves free of an authoriarian government who assigns them their rights.

And of course those who want that authoritarian government and the nanny state, and who simply shrug off a sixteen trillion dollar debt and increasing corruption among those who dole out government charity and the recipients of that charity are trashing and demonizing and marginalizing the Tea Party as much as possible. They know they have succeeded when people who think like the Tea Partiers disassociate themselves from the Tea Party or similar groups to avoid the derision and contemptuous comments thrown at them.

The pro nanny state people will not even look at our former greatness, but point to the pockets of social injustice as the sum total of what previous generations were all about. And they shrug off any negatives brought about by their own present ideology as inconsequential.

I am deeply afraid time is running out to restore America to its greatness. After this generation, there will be too few left to speak out for it. And the great experiment will have failed.

Foxfyre, I have some concerns with this statement. While I will agree that there are a number of questions that need answers, the Tea Party seems to have an agenda which is not at all consistent with Constitutional rights. In fact, it's more consistent with corporate rights. Having it's roots based in the machinations of a couple of "robber barons" - brothers by the name of Koch - does nothing to instill a great deal of faith in their long term objective. My greatest fear is that instead of returning us to our post-Revolutionary dogma, the Tea Party is inadvertently (or maybe not) opening the door to corporatism and replacing democracy with plutocracy.

One could argue that the current manipulation of our news media is a necessary first step in establishing control over the people of this country. This was the exact tactic the Soviets used to instill Communism. Although we have the freedom of the press, "grass roots" bodies - which according to many of the documentaries I've watched on the subject - are in fact organized by groups like Americans For Progress, a Koch funded organization. They exert a great deal of influence mainly because they ask the questions that are on everyone's minds but fall short in the answers to those questions. Their main tactic has been to attempt to discredit any idea which is anathema to their positions - and constant ridicule in the press rather than objective examination is not an answer. The main theme, however, is consistently "Being rich is good" - any argument to that statement draws calls of "socialism".

To be fair, the business model of the Tea Party press is sound. Conservative viewership sells products - no doubt about that. In response, other media outlets are attempting to cash in and serve a liberal point of view. It still doesn't make it right, and in the end destroys the objectivity we need to solve the problems we're facing.

There are a number of ways in which we could effect a better economic outlook and save the entitlement programs. The fact is though, that if our system worked the way our models show, entitlements would be minimal on their own even with all the so-called give-aways. One could make the argument that the corporate structure and tax law has shifted in a way which precludes those on the low end of the scale from ever being able to rise above their stations, and that current philosophy will do nothing more than INCREASE the number of people in need. This, to me, is the driving principle behind the Tea Party and has nothing to do with the principles this country began with - where we helped our neighbors to establish themselves all the while knowing that the favor would be repaid in the future.

I'm sorry - this country has lost it's way. But the Tea Party shows me the bleakest possible outcome.

 

[Politico]

Wow 25 pages for the tea party that isn't actually a party. All these years and I have yet to see anyone with a T by their name lol.

 

[Meathead]

America's greatness was in large part in the opportunities it offered who had the drive to succeed. This is sadly been eroded of late and along with it the greatness of the country. When so much of the populous feels entitled and is looking for and voting on that feeling, there is little pride left in the people.

 

[jan]

Essentially the same resources are available today to Americans as a hundred years ago. America has the capacity to be what Americans want. To say that it is presently that way would be a horrible thought. Even if we were to say it is presently the best in the world, no one would disagree that it could be better.

But what has changed? (If anything.) And why has it changed? Many of us recall a time when as a people we once would not have even thought to disrespect the National Anthem, the flag, the Pledge of Allegiance. We were unashamed in our patriotic displays and enthusiasm, and we mostly shared values of church, family, Christmas programs at school whether we were Christian or not, a generic prayer before the highschool football game whether we were religious or not. Being a real man who supported his family was deemed a virtue and an expectation for all and in the small towns, everybody disciplined everybody's kids and kids were expected to grow up as educated, responsible, mature citizens. The traditional family was the backbone of the nation. We knew our nation was imperfect, but we honestly believed it was better than any other and we believed in ourselves that we could find ways to fix whatever ailed it.

Silly nostalgic myths some of our younger generation would say. But those of us who lived it know it was real.

But...was it real, or was it Memorax? Let's face it...information was quite limited back then...TV was in black and white and went off the air at night...we had all of three channels to choose from back then. National and local news probably didn't report everything...I'm sure they left quite a few tidbits of information out. The internet was non existent.

My point is that we thought what the movers and shakers of the time wanted us to think and those movers and shakers were mainly our parents. We knew what they wanted us to know...nothing more, nothing less. We were spoon fed and maybe even brainwashed and lulled into a state of contentment...at least until the '60's when all hell broke loose and it was all of a sudden "the decade of assassinations". No child growing up during the 60's could help but feel insecure as all the leaders got knocked off one by one and the war in Vietnam waged on with it's nightly pictorials on the evening news.

Perhaps you are romanticizing the past more than it deserves?

 

[skye]

Oh Lord ,,,, many great countries in the world .... many ,,,not just one ,,,, nope my dears not only one sorry

 

[Connery]

The time is not at hand yet to declare the US the greatest country in the world, besides nationalist threads are a bore. I have been to several countries and I went because they were great in their own way. Every country I have studied was great in their own way.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

The time is not at hand yet to declare the US the greatest country in the world, besides nationalist threads are a bore. I have been to several countries and I went because they were great in their own way. Every country I have studied was great in their own way.

After 250 years and you don't think America is the greatest Country on the planet? Move your god damn ass we or I don't want your faggot ass here.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Is there anything more pathetic than an arrogant dummy?


“The fundamental cause of trouble in the world is that the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.”
― Bertrand Russell

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Is there anything more pathetic than an arrogant dummy?


“The fundamental cause of trouble in the world is that the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.”
― Bertrand Russell

Why must you continue talking about yourself in that way? I'LL BE HERE TO GIVE YOU YOUR BITCH SLAP DUMB ASS.