Iran may receive S-300 anti-aircraft missile systems from Russia

[irosie91]

Your point?

Simple question: Were Reagan, Rummy and all neocons, anti-Semites?

they were indifferent. just as lots of people were indifferent in the 1930s. In fact
the world was indifferent to the Armenian genocide and the Pol Pot
genocides-----too. Most people in the US were indifferent to lynchings in
the southern part of the USA too. -------how did you feel about the genocides
that took place in Biafra and East Pakistan in 1971? Iraqi jews fled Iraq when
Saddam starting lynching jews in Baghdad. Lots ended up in Israel

 

[irosie91]

The US entered Iranian waters during a response to an attack by Iranian gunboats on US helicopters. The USS Vincennes chased the gunboats back into Iranian waters. The Iranians stopped targeting and firing on American aircraft operating in the Persian Gulf after the shootdown of IR 655.

Here's a seldom seen picture of the result of our shooting down an Iranian civilian airline....Again, how would WE have reacted?

Military error in an arena of conflict created by the Iranian scum

 

[Camp]

The US entered Iranian waters during a response to an attack by Iranian gunboats on US helicopters. The USS Vincennes chased the gunboats back into Iranian waters. The Iranians stopped targeting and firing on American aircraft operating in the Persian Gulf after the shootdown of IR 655.

Here's a seldom seen picture of the result of our shooting down an Iranian civilian airline....Again, how would WE have reacted?

American pilots would have identified themselves as a commercial airliner in response to the half dozen request by a war ship to identify themselves. They also would not be flying over an area where combat was taking place. Air controllers would have warned them away from the area instead of allowing them to fly in a direct path to a war ship under attack from Iranian forces.

 

[irosie91]

The US entered Iranian waters during a response to an attack by Iranian gunboats on US helicopters. The USS Vincennes chased the gunboats back into Iranian waters. The Iranians stopped targeting and firing on American aircraft operating in the Persian Gulf after the shootdown of IR 655.

Here's a seldom seen picture of the result of our shooting down an Iranian civilian airline....Again, how would WE have reacted?

American pilots would have identified themselves as a commercial airliner in response to the half dozen request by a war ship to identify themselves. They also would not be flying over an area where combat was taking place. Air controllers would have warned them away from the area instead of allowing them to fly in a direct path to a war ship under attack from Iranian forces.

That's good to know------stay out of arenas of conflct-----seems
reasonable but I did not know it is PROTOCOL

 

[Indofred]

The US entered Iranian waters during a response to an attack by Iranian gunboats on US helicopters

Helicopters that were fired up by small arms whilst invading Iranian airspace.
Limp excuses and half stories don't excuse mass murder.

 

[Indofred]

Air controllers would have warned them away from the area instead of allowing them to fly in a direct path to a war ship under attack from Iranian forces.

Except the Iranian controllers didn't know a US warship was invading Iranian waters to attack Iranian boats that had fired on an invading aircraft.
The aircraft had no warnings at all, because the daft murdering US navy didn't use the correct frequencies, nor did they check the fully operating civilian transponder signal the aircraft was using.

Of course, the US reports lied about these minor facts, only admitting them when they ran out of lies and the ability to cover up the murders.

 

[irosie91]

The US entered Iranian waters during a response to an attack by Iranian gunboats on US helicopters

Helicopters that were fired up by small arms whilst invading Iranian airspace.
Limp excuses and half stories don't excuse mass murder.

why would Iran fire on US helicopters?. It does not take much
to bring a helicopter down------were the helicopters engaged in
BOMBING ---Iran? Firing on a helicopter is INTENT TO KILL

 

[irosie91]

Air controllers would have warned them away from the area instead of allowing them to fly in a direct path to a war ship under attack from Iranian forces.

Except the Iranian controllers didn't know a US warship was invading Iranian waters to attack Iranian boats that had fired on an invading aircraft.
The aircraft had no warnings at all, because the daft murdering US navy didn't use the correct frequencies, nor did they check the fully operating civilian transponder signal the aircraft was using.

Of course, the US reports lied about these minor facts, only admitting them when they ran out of lies and the ability to cover up the murders.

the definition of "MURDER" includes "mens rea" -----there must be an
EVIL INTENT sometimes called Accidental manslaughter is not murder.

The evil intent requirement is as old as the bible. There is no evidence
at all that the USA was there for the pre determined purpose of shooting
a plane down

 

[Indofred]

The US entered Iranian waters during a response to an attack by Iranian gunboats on US helicopters

Helicopters that were fired up by small arms whilst invading Iranian airspace.
Limp excuses and half stories don't excuse mass murder.

why would Iran fire on US helicopters?. It does not take much
to bring a helicopter down------were the helicopters engaged in
BOMBING ---Iran? Firing on a helicopter is INTENT TO KILL

Tell me, what would the US do if an armed Iranian helicopter entered US airspace?
I don't think we need an answer to that one.

 

[ESay]

nat4900

If I understand correctly, you are an American citizen (or live there constantly). What would you do if you were the US president and had a limitless power? I mean the current situation – considering Russia, the Middle East, China, and so on.

 

[nat4900]

nat4900

If I understand correctly, you are an American citizen (or live there constantly). What would you do if you were the US president and had a limitless power? I mean the current situation – considering Russia, the Middle East, China, and so on.

Interesting that you're addressing me directly...and YES, I am an American citizen, veteran, older (and semi-retired), white, middle-class and Christian....By all accounts, I should be "conservative" but the good Lord has blessed me with a good dose of objectivity.

"Limitless powers," as the US certainly has, carries with it an extremely heavy burden of responsibility.....What Obama is doing vis-a-vis Iran, is exactly right.....I don't think that, in the long run Iran will accept the proposed deal....and that should actually heave some praise on Kerry since the deal is far, far from "appeasement" to the current Iranian regime.

Nonetheless, were (by some miracle) Iran to acquiesce, Obama could be credited with avoiding yet another devastating conflict that would embroil not only us and our European allies, but would be disastrous to Israel.

Iran will eventually have her nukes......The "dam" toward nuclear armaments was opened when Israel accumulated 300 of her own nukes and the removasl of Hussein from Iraq, was a welcomed "gift" to Iran.

However, if a deal was not ever or even entertained, the drums of war would increase in that region.....now we at least have some much needed dialogue that may show the average Iranian that we are not blindly following the mandates of Israel and that some objectivity by our own governhment exists.

 

[ESay]

Iran will eventually have her nukes......The "dam" toward nuclear armaments was opened when Israel accumulated 300 of her own nukes and the removasl of Hussein from Iraq, was a welcomed "gift" to Iran.

To say the truth, I think that Israel has developed its nuclear arsenal not because of its desire to spend money on wasteful projects. Throughout the period of its independence, it has constantly been threatened by its neighbours with promises to push it into the sea. Considering the size and the number of the neighbours, what would you do if you were one who is responsible for Israel’s security?


If I understand you correctly, you welcome the deal with Iran, but you don’t think that Iran will abide by its provisions.
What do you think the US government should do if Iran refuses to sign a final deal in June and declares its intention to create a nuclear bomb?

 

[nat4900]

Iran will eventually have her nukes......The "dam" toward nuclear armaments was opened when Israel accumulated 300 of her own nukes and the removasl of Hussein from Iraq, was a welcomed "gift" to Iran.

To say the truth, I think that Israel has developed its nuclear arsenal not because of its desire to spend money on wasteful projects. Throughout the period of its independence, it has constantly been threatened by its neighbours with promises to push it into the sea. Considering the size and the number of the neighbours, what would you do if you were one who is responsible for Israel’s security?


If I understand you correctly, you welcome the deal with Iran, but you don’t think that Iran will abide by its provisions.
What do you think the US government should do if Iran refuses to sign a final deal in June and declares its intention to create a nuclear bomb?

Well, that is actually two questions......

Israel, nuclear capabilities have NOT stopped any of the discord in the region....and actually made it worse by beginning an arms race for nukes....Israel was well capable to defend herself with conventional weapons....and the "cost" of building a nuclear arsenal was subsidized by US taxpayers at the tune of 3-6 billions per year.

Second, if Iran decides to pursue her nuclear capabilities, there is nothing that the rest of the world can do...NOTHING.
Sure, Israel can bomb away, but that will only delay the inevitable by months with the ADDED animosity toward her from virtually all other Muslim countries and castigation from most of her current allies.

 

[ESay]

Israel, nuclear capabilities have NOT stopped any of the discord in the region....and actually made it worse by beginning an arms race for nukes....Israel was well capable to defend herself with conventional weapons....and the "cost" of building a nuclear arsenal was subsidized by US taxpayers at the tune of 3-6 billions per year.

Israel hasn’t had any intention to stop any discord in the region. Its very goal was and is to preserve its existence. And yes, you are right about its capabilities to defend itself with conventional weapons and it has done so. It hasn’t used nuclear weapons, has it? But does it mean that it needn’t have developed its nuclear arsenal?

Actually, it was the Israeli’s Muslim neighbours who provoked the race for nukes in the Middle East by attacking Israel from the very beginning and threatening to eventually destroy it.

Second, if Iran decides to pursue her nuclear capabilities, there is nothing that the rest of the world can do...NOTHING.
Sure, Israel can bomb away, but that will only delay the inevitable by months with the ADDED animosity toward her from virtually all other Muslim countries and castigation from most of her current allies.

Okay, it is nothing that can be done. So, Iran eventually creates a nuclear bomb. What, for example, Saudis reaction will be in this case?

And unfortunately you didn’t answer what you would do if you were America’s ruler.

 

[nat4900]

Israel, nuclear capabilities have NOT stopped any of the discord in the region....and actually made it worse by beginning an arms race for nukes....Israel was well capable to defend herself with conventional weapons....and the "cost" of building a nuclear arsenal was subsidized by US taxpayers at the tune of 3-6 billions per year.

Israel hasn’t had any intention to stop any discord in the region. Its very goal was and is to preserve its existence. And yes, you are right about its capabilities to defend itself with conventional weapons and it has done so. It hasn’t used nuclear weapons, has it? But does it mean that it needn’t have developed its nuclear arsenal?

Actually, it was the Israeli’s Muslim neighbours who provoked the race for nukes in the Middle East by attacking Israel from the very beginning and threatening to eventually destroy it.

Second, if Iran decides to pursue her nuclear capabilities, there is nothing that the rest of the world can do...NOTHING.
Sure, Israel can bomb away, but that will only delay the inevitable by months with the ADDED animosity toward her from virtually all other Muslim countries and castigation from most of her current allies.

Okay, it is nothing that can be done. So, Iran eventually creates a nuclear bomb. What, for example, Saudis reaction will be in this case?

And unfortunately you didn’t answer what you would do if you were America’s ruler.

Nonesense.......Israel's 300 nukes have ONLY started an arms race for comparable destructive weapons.....If Israel has not used them it is because the wrath from Pakistan, China, Noth Korea and Russia would obliterate her and she'd be the moral equivalent of Nazi Germany.
Now, it may be different...parity will evetually be reached with Iran's nukes...and soon to follow, Saudi nukes.
No other country (except for us) has used nukes but the arms race may unleash havoc...an arms race that, regardless of how you like to spin it, was started by Israel in that region.

What would I do if I were the leader of the West???? Exactly what the Obama administration is doing.

 

[ESay]

Nonesense.......Israel's 300 nukes have ONLY started an arms race for comparable destructive weapons.....If Israel has not used them it is because the wrath from Pakistan, China, Noth Korea and Russia would obliterate her and she'd be the moral equivalent of Nazi Germany.
Now, it may be different...parity will evetually be reached with Iran's nukes...and soon to follow, Saudi nukes.
No other country (except for us) has used nukes but the arms race may unleash havoc...an arms race that, regardless of how you like to spin it, was started by Israel in that region.

Okay, I see your point.

Maybe you know that Iran began developing its nuclear programme it the 1970-s when there was a shah and Iran was an ally of the US and had very good relationship with Israel. I think that a nuclear race would begin even with Israel’s arsenal.

I can’t condemn Israel for developing the nuclear programme, to say the truth. It is the same if someone would condemn a person, whose neighbours are constantly trying to rob and kill him, for trying to buy a riffle instead of knife to protect himself. Of course, he should be prohibited from buying a rifle because it may provoke his neighbours to buy more riffles!

What would I do if I were the leader of the West???? Exactly what the Obama administration is doing.

Yes, I also think that the Obama administration is going in a right direction by trying to clinch a deal.



Well, thanks for your answers.

 

[nat4900]

Nonesense.......Israel's 300 nukes have ONLY started an arms race for comparable destructive weapons.....If Israel has not used them it is because the wrath from Pakistan, China, Noth Korea and Russia would obliterate her and she'd be the moral equivalent of Nazi Germany.
Now, it may be different...parity will evetually be reached with Iran's nukes...and soon to follow, Saudi nukes.
No other country (except for us) has used nukes but the arms race may unleash havoc...an arms race that, regardless of how you like to spin it, was started by Israel in that region.

Okay, I see your point.

Maybe you know that Iran began developing its nuclear programme it the 1970-s when there was a shah and Iran was an ally of the US and had very good relationship with Israel. I think that a nuclear race would begin even with Israel’s arsenal.

I can’t condemn Israel for developing the nuclear programme, to say the truth. It is the same if someone would condemn a person, whose neighbours are constantly trying to rob and kill him, for trying to buy a riffle instead of knife to protect himself. Of course, he should be prohibited from buying a rifle because it may provoke his neighbours to buy more riffles!

What would I do if I were the leader of the West???? Exactly what the Obama administration is doing.

Yes, I also think that the Obama administration is going in a right direction by trying to clinch a deal.



Well, thanks for your answers.

...and thank you for the decent and cordial dialogue without the usual profanity often found on this forum....

My only addition (or different perspective) to what you stated above is that no country...and this is strictly personal for me.....should develop the devastating nuclear weaponry if that country knows full well that use of such weapons is tantamount to a suicidal pact. (and, obviously, that includes the U.S. and Russia and China with the moronic pursuit of nitrogen weapons.)

 

[Bleipriester]

Russia likes to use the S-300 as a threat and and example of the kind sophisticated high tech weapon system it produces. The last thing they want is to actually have to prove it's worth in battle. The S-300 will easily be defeated and become the latest of Russian embarrassments.

The S-300 and its successor are the most sophisticated systems. Nothing to "defeat easily".
Iran, however, claims its own system will be better than the S-300 and Iran is a leader in developing missiles.
Iran Homemade air defense system to be ready in 2 yrs better than S-300 RT News

 

[skye]

Russia likes to use the S-300 as a threat and and example of the kind sophisticated high tech weapon system it produces. The last thing they want is to actually have to prove it's worth in battle. The S-300 will easily be defeated and become the latest of Russian embarrassments.

I agree.

I am sure the Israel Defense Forces will take the necessary steps to deal with this challenge, it's not like this is the first time they defeat problems of this nature.

Israel will prevail in the end as it always does!

 

[rhodescholar]

Russia likes to use the S-300 as a threat and and example of the kind sophisticated high tech weapon system it produces. The last thing they want is to actually have to prove it's worth in battle. The S-300 will easily be defeated and become the latest of Russian embarrassments.

I agree.

I am sure the Israel Defense Forces will take the necessary steps to deal with this challenge, it's not like this is the first time they defeat problems of this nature.

Israel will prevail in the end as it always does!

I have news for you people, russia held off selling the s-300 not because of obama or western pressure, he did so because israel threatened to go public with the methods they used to defeat it several times in the past (like in syria), which would kill its marketability on the world markets; can't sell a lock that already has a publicly known decryption key...

But now russia needs the money desperately as its economy goes down the tubes, so it has no choice - which will lead to a joint israeli-US attack on iran in the near future which will wipe the system out, assuming iran ever figures out how to use it.