If voters don’t feel relief, the economy isn’t fixed

[Marener]

Biden or whoever was acting in Biden's place had four long years to screw up pretty much everything. Yes, President Trump may be blowing sunshine up our skirts a bit when he claims things are much better. Well many things are better but when the cheapest loaf of bread is still $2 and a head of iceberg lettuce is $2.28, people don't feel things are better.

He certainly isn't making them worse.

But honest people understand everything in four years of incompetence cannot always be fixed in one year. We are seeing energy prices, utilities coming down. The border is closed and slowly but surely the illegals are being sent home. I am confident that at the end of Trump's four years all will be much better.

His tariff policy is almost certainly making inflation worse than it would have been.

We’d all be better off if Trump had literally done nothing.

 

[martybegan]

Inflation is when costs go up. Deflation is when costs go down.

You brought up inflation, and it’s highly relevant since that’s the pointy end of the spear when it comes to economic data. People feel inflation. They don’t necessarily feel GDP growth.

Inflation is when the value of money goes down, it is a monetary function, not a direct function of costs as applied to products which can be impacted by transient or even permanent impacts.

Same with deflation, it is an intrinsic property of money, in this case money increasing in value.

The fact flat screen TV's went from $5000 to $500 dollars for a similar unit isn't deflation, it's due to production improvements, R&D costs being paid off, and market competition forces.

 

[citygator]

Oh no, you got me.

Kyrsten Sinema, who negotiated the bill, voted to block it because the vote was a ‘cynical, political game’

Two of the border deal’s chief Senate negotiators, Oklahoma Republican James Lankford and Arizona independent Kyrsten Sinema, voted against advancing the measure Thursday, protesting what they said was an unserious process focused on political optics. The bill’s third major sponsor, Connecticut Democrat Chris Murphy, voted in favor.

Bipartisan border bill loses support, fails procedural vote in U.S. Senate

The U.S. Senate failed Thursday to advance a border security bill as both parties seek to hone their messages on immigration policy in the runup to November’s elections

azmirror.com

Um... No. The republicans had already killed the bill in a procedural vote much to the dismay of Lankford. What Lankford opposed was making his republican cohorts vote on it on the record when it was obvious it wouldnt pass. That is why he opposed it. Not the bill, but this second attempt to bring up the bill.

I am curious. Do you have someone feeding you this outright misinformation or do you drum it up yourself? It's a real question. I am curious how you decided to use this procedural vote and spin it as Lankford being against the bill. Is it a misunderstanding on your part or are you bein manipulated? Im so curious.

 

[Marener]

Inflation is when the value of money goes down, it is a monetary function, not a direct function of costs as applied to products which can be impacted by transient or even permanent impacts.

Same with deflation, it is an intrinsic property of money, in this case money increasing in value.

The fact flat screen TV's went from $5000 to $500 dollars for a similar unit isn't deflation, it's due to production improvements, R&D costs being paid off, and market competition forces.

The value of money is not an intrinsic property.

What does the value of money mean? It means how much shit can you get for your money. How is it measured? By checking the costs of products. Not one product. A lot of products.

If costs go down like Trump promised, that’s called deflation.

 

[Foxfyre]

His tariff policy is almost certainly making inflation worse than it would have been.

We’d all be better off if Trump had literally done nothing.

And yet inflation and interest rates and deficits are coming down. So that blows up your talking point right there.

You on the left want the world to continue to exploit and use unfair trade practices on the America you hate. President Trump who loves America and Americans demands fair trade practices or those who presume we will always be their sugar daddy will pay a hefty price for that.

 

[martybegan]

The value of money is not an intrinsic property.

What does the value of money mean? It means how much shit can you get for your money. How is it measured? By checking the costs of products. Not one product. A lot of products.

If costs go down like Trump promised, that’s called deflation.

yes, it is. With fiat money it is based on the strength and the confidence in the economy of the country issuing it.

If eggs go up due to shortages and then go back down again due to the market adjusting, is that inflation and deflation?

 

[Marener]

And yet inflation and interest rates are coming down. So that blows up your talking point right there.

Interest rates would have come down quicker and inflation would be lower without tariffs.

This isn’t a talking point.

 

[Foxfyre]

Interest rates would have come down quicker and inflation would be lower without tariffs.

This isn’t a talking point.

Show your proof from a credible non TDS infused source. Otherwise you're just spewing dishonest talking point.

America has been exploited, used, and abused by its allies and losing good paying jobs and ability to provide for itself in critical commodities for many decades. President Trump is putting a stop to that which cannot but help Americans.

Only a corrupt leftist could criticize that.

 

[Marener]

yes, it is. With fiat money it is based on the strength and the confidence in the economy of the country issuing it.

That’s literally the definition of extrinsic value. Money is worthless by itself. Its only value comes from its relationship to our economy. That’s extrinsic value.

A loaf of bread has intrinsic value because you can eat it. Money has no intrinsic value.

You’re embarrassing yourself.

If eggs go up due to shortages and then go back down again due to the market adjusting, is that inflation and deflation?

A little, yeah. Inflation isn’t the price of one product but the prices of many products combined. So eggs going up and down aren’t going to have much of an impact. Furthermore, we often strip out volatile items like food and energy to get a better sense of the economic patterns.

Do you know how inflation is calculated? It doesn’t seem like you do.

 

[martybegan]

That’s literally the definition of extrinsic value. Money is worthless by itself. Its only value comes from its relationship to our economy. That’s extrinsic value.

A loaf of bread has intrinsic value because you can eat it. Money has no intrinsic value.

You’re embarrassing yourself.


A little, yeah. Inflation isn’t the price of one product but the prices of many products combined. So eggs going up and down aren’t going to have much of an impact. Furthermore, we often strip out volatile items like food and energy to get a better sense of the economic patterns.

Do you know how inflation is calculated? It doesn’t seem like you do.

Intrinsic property of money.

Just like "space-time inflating" it isn't that we notice a meter is now 1.1 meters, it's that the meter itself increased and we now see the larger value as a meter.

And you are thinking fungible, and still getting it wrong.

 

[Marener]

Show your proof from a credible non TDS infused source. Otherwise you're just spewing dishonest talking point.

America has been exploited, used, and abused by its allies and losing good paying jobs and ability to provide for itself in critical commodities for many decades. President Trump is putting a stop to that which cannot but help Americans.

Only a corrupt leftist could criticize that.

Your faith in Trump doesn’t seem to be substantiated by data and prone to a lot of emotional language like “used and abused”.

How Tariffs Are Affecting Prices in 2025

A model suggests that although tariffs have been only partially passed through to consumers, they already have exerted measurable pressure on prices.

www.stlouisfed.org

I think his policies are making us worse off.

 

[Foxfyre]

Your faith in Trump doesn’t seem to be substantiated by data and prone to a lot of emotional language like “used and abused”.

How Tariffs Are Affecting Prices in 2025

A model suggests that although tariffs have been only partially passed through to consumers, they already have exerted measurable pressure on prices.

www.stlouisfed.org

I think his policies are making us worse off.

I am supposed to assume that what a TDS infused leftist thinks is the way it actually is?

My faith in Trump is based on his track record in his first term and the good results we are seeing in this one. Nobody is saying tariffs have had no affect on anything. Of course they have. All economic policy affects something.

But the tariffs are bringing investment and jobs into America instead of us constantly bleeding them to other countries. That is something the leftist commentaries never mention.

 

[Marener]

Intrinsic property of money.

Just like "space-time inflating" it isn't that we notice a meter is now 1.1 meters, it's that the meter itself increased and we now see the larger value as a meter.

And you are thinking fungible, and still getting it wrong.

What the **** did I just read?

This gibberish has nothing to argue against. You’re just saying the same wrong shit over again.

 

[justoffal]

WTF does that mean?

It's lib speak for...."nothingness is often pregnant"....

Hope that helps....

Jo

 

[martybegan]

What the **** did I just read?

This gibberish has nothing to argue against. You’re just saying the same wrong shit over again.

I guess physics isn't your strong point.

 

[Marener]

I am supposed to assume that what a TDS infused leftist thinks is the way it actually is?

My faith in Trump is based on his track record in his first term and the good results we are seeing in this one. Nobody is saying tariffs have had no affect on anything. Of course they have. All economic policy affects something.

But the tariffs are bringing investment and jobs into America instead of us constantly bleeding them to other countries. That is something the leftist commentaries never mention.

The investments and jobs don’t seem to be materializing. Job growth this year is extremely weak. Unemployment is up. Wage growth is slowing. The data isn’t backing you up.

Like I said, inflation would be lower if it hadn’t been for tariffs. With lower inflation, the Fed would have lowered interest rates quicker. Now they’re stuck in a position where they have higher than desired inflation and higher than desired unemployment. They’re forced to triage the unemployment and risk worsening inflation.

Stop being so emotional.

 

[Delldude]

The republicans had already killed the bill in a procedural vote much to the dismay of Lankford.

They voted against it after Lankford released the bills text. And some dems joined them.

Lankford voted against his own bill twice, once on a procedure vote and once on final passage.

 

[martybegan]

The investments and jobs don’t seem to be materializing. Job growth this year is extremely weak. Unemployment is up. Wage growth is slowing. The data isn’t backing you up.

Like I said, inflation would be lower if it hadn’t been for tariffs. With lower inflation, the Fed would have lowered interest rates quicker. Now they’re stuck in a position where they have higher than desired inflation and higher than desired unemployment. They’re forced to triage the unemployment and risk worsening inflation.

Stop being so emotional.

You must have changed your meds, another one of your personalities has shown up on this board, less annoying, but only marginally so, and more concern trolling than before.

 

[Marener]

I guess physics isn't your strong point.

I doubt you understand physics any better than economics.

Do you know how inflation is calculated?

 

[martybegan]

I doubt you understand physics any better than economics.

Do you know how inflation is calculated?

How it's calculated is due to the fact that the actual property can't be ascertained directly, so you use things like the CPI.

We can only figure it out empirically. but the theoretical property of inflation has to do with the purchasing power of the money itself.