If minimum wage were raised ...

[Iceweasel]

Very poor choice to bring up Google in this thread to make your "point"

Google Salaries and Benefits | Glassdoor

Google is near or at the top of the pay scale in nearly every job.

NO ONE cares how greedy a company is as long as we the taxpayer aren't subsidizing them or their wages.

Google is wildly successful because they don't have much in the way of competition. You can't use their salary figures in highly competive fields. But that isn't what we were talking about. Not subsidized huh?


Google's Billions In Internet Subsidies... -SVW
Google is the world's single largest user of Internet bandwidth. But it doesn't have to pay for most of the bandwidth it consumes, in the form of its spiderbots copying web pages, and YouTube video streams.

A study in December 2008 estimated Google's 'free' bandwidth use to be about $6.9 billion, today it could be double that amount. [Precursor study- December 2008]

Scott Cleland, head of Precursor, is a leading Google critic especially of its position supporting net neutrality. Google has been lobbying the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) to maintain net neutrality regulations, which prevent Telcos from charging companies for bandwidth based on usage. He claims that Google is pushing net neutrality because it is the biggest beneficiary of such rules.

 

[Iceweasel]

You're clearly the one with no knowledge here.

Let's take a fictional restaurant.

Let's assume 10 wage earners at minimum wage .Now let's take the industry standard and say that labor is 30% of sales. So $2,900 * .30X gives us x=$sales per week.

Or $8700 i sales per week.

What does 10 emplyees at minimum wage have to do with weekly sales figures?

Now, let's assume minimum wage is raised to $10 an hour giving this restaurant an additional labor cost of $900 a week for a total of $3700 in labor costs. Or a 10% increase in costs.

Now remember, this is abut the WORST case scenario b/c few if any businesses have all their employees at minimum wage. So we can set 10% as the most a companies payroll would go up by if the minimum wage were raised to $10 an hour.

So, we can see that unless greedy and stupid a company should raise prices by no more than 10% to offset increased labor costs. An increase of 10% given that the minimum wage increased would be acceptable to consumers but any more than that and consumers would likely balk.

Many restaurants are barely squeaking by. If they sell alcohol that's where they make the money. And you don't think a $3,600 increase in obligations will hurt the profit margin? BTW, 900x4=3,600 not 3,700. I will assume that you are not the accountant at the restaurant.

So your #3 with cheese would go from $3.69 to $4. Now , I don't know about you , but I find myself noticing that prices have ALREADY been rising by about that much every year without any minimum wage increase. Meaning no likely impact on pricing, which once again, if you look at historical inflation data you would see it agrees with that assesment

No, you left out cost increases for everything else. Rent, utilities, food, equipment, repairs, taxes, supplies, etc.

 

[Dragonlady]

Amazing that conservatives are prepared to accept that costs on everything have gone up but still not prepared to accept that this is also true for their workers. Rent, food car expenses, everything has gone up for working folks except their wages. Americans have increased productivity and profits. Shouldn't they be entitled to a raise as a reward for this?

Not according to conservatives. That money should go to executives and shareholders but not the people who did the work that made it happen.

 

[OnePercenter]

Amazing that conservatives are prepared to accept that costs on everything have gone up but still not prepared to accept that this is also true for their workers. Rent, food car expenses, everything has gone up for working folks except their wages. Americans have increased productivity and profits. Shouldn't they be entitled to a raise as a reward for this?

Not according to conservatives. That money should go to executives and shareholders but not the people who did the work that made it happen.

Right on!

That's why my plan is a win-win

-Raise minimum wage to $23.50/hr. Based on where minimum wage should be using 1970-2013 rise in food, shelter, and transportation.

-Eliminate all business subsidies (deductions/write-off’s/write-downs) except for employee expenses which are deducted dollar-for-dollar on all city, state, and Federal taxes and fees.

-Adjust Social Security and private/public retirement and pension payments using 1970-2013 price structure.

-Back down ALL costs, prices, fees, to January 1, 2009 levels and hold them for 10 years.

-Recall ALL off-shore investments tax free, and disallow any further off-shore investments.

 

[Iceweasel]

Amazing that conservatives are prepared to accept that costs on everything have gone up but still not prepared to accept that this is also true for their workers. Rent, food car expenses, everything has gone up for working folks except their wages. Americans have increased productivity and profits. Shouldn't they be entitled to a raise as a reward for this?

Not according to conservatives. That money should go to executives and shareholders but not the people who did the work that made it happen.

Wages have gone up, what are you talking about? I agree that they haven't gone up enough but it's due to the poor economy. I'd like to see the stats on American workers being more productive. Are you sure that isn't due to automation?

 

[BillyZane]

You're clearly the one with no knowledge here.

Let's take a fictional restaurant.

Let's assume 10 wage earners at minimum wage .Now let's take the industry standard and say that labor is 30% of sales. So $2,900 * .30X gives us x=$sales per week.

Or $8700 i sales per week.

What does 10 emplyees at minimum wage have to do with weekly sales figures?

Now, let's assume minimum wage is raised to $10 an hour giving this restaurant an additional labor cost of $900 a week for a total of $3700 in labor costs. Or a 10% increase in costs.

Now remember, this is abut the WORST case scenario b/c few if any businesses have all their employees at minimum wage. So we can set 10% as the most a companies payroll would go up by if the minimum wage were raised to $10 an hour.

So, we can see that unless greedy and stupid a company should raise prices by no more than 10% to offset increased labor costs. An increase of 10% given that the minimum wage increased would be acceptable to consumers but any more than that and consumers would likely balk.

Many restaurants are barely squeaking by. If they sell alcohol that's where they make the money. And you don't think a $3,600 increase in obligations will hurt the profit margin? BTW, 900x4=3,600 not 3,700. I will assume that you are not the accountant at the restaurant.

So your #3 with cheese would go from $3.69 to $4. Now , I don't know about you , but I find myself noticing that prices have ALREADY been rising by about that much every year without any minimum wage increase. Meaning no likely impact on pricing, which once again, if you look at historical inflation data you would see it agrees with that assesment

No, you left out cost increases for everything else. Rent, utilities, food, equipment, repairs, taxes, supplies, etc.

If quibbling over a $100 math error is the best you have, well then I'm wasting my time

Oh, and any restaurant, or other business, that is barely getting by should consider shutting the doors. FAR too many people open businesses that fail because they are stupid

No successful restaurant, or indeed ANY, business is going to fail because of a 10% , again AT MOST, increase in labor costs.

You seem to be suggesting that you believe the minimum wage law is in place to help support barely operable businesses stay afloat, it is not.

 

[Foxfyre]

Amazing that conservatives are prepared to accept that costs on everything have gone up but still not prepared to accept that this is also true for their workers. Rent, food car expenses, everything has gone up for working folks except their wages. Americans have increased productivity and profits. Shouldn't they be entitled to a raise as a reward for this?

Not according to conservatives. That money should go to executives and shareholders but not the people who did the work that made it happen.

Right on!

That's why my plan is a win-win

-Raise minimum wage to $23.50/hr. Based on where minimum wage should be using 1970-2013 rise in food, shelter, and transportation.

-Eliminate all business subsidies (deductions/write-off’s/write-downs) except for employee expenses which are deducted dollar-for-dollar on all city, state, and Federal taxes and fees.

-Adjust Social Security and private/public retirement and pension payments using 1970-2013 price structure.

-Back down ALL costs, prices, fees, to January 1, 2009 levels and hold them for 10 years.

-Recall ALL off-shore investments tax free, and disallow any further off-shore investments.

Just one comment here. Google government price controls and read up on the history and consequences of that somehwere other than on leftwing propaganda sites. Here is a good place to start but is defnitely not the only or last word on the subject:

http://object.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/serials/files/regulation/2001/4/morton.pdf

Much of the same dynamics occur with government controlling the cost of labor.

 

[Dragonlady]

Wages have gone up, what are you talking about? I agree that they haven't gone up enough but it's due to the poor economy. I'd like to see the stats on American workers being more productive. Are you sure that isn't due to automation?

For low and middle income workers, the wages haven't kept pace with inflation. A lot of that is due to manufacturing moving offshore. The competition for the remaining jobs has been so brisk that companies don't have to raise wages to attract workers because of the high number of people looking for work.

Every time I see the Walmart add talking about bringing manufacturing jobs back to the US, I throw up a little in my mouth. Walmart was instrumental in a lot of jobs going overseas in the first place. They pushed suppliers to move manufacturing to third world countries to cut wholesale prices.

 

[BillyZane]

Amazing that conservatives are prepared to accept that costs on everything have gone up but still not prepared to accept that this is also true for their workers. Rent, food car expenses, everything has gone up for working folks except their wages. Americans have increased productivity and profits. Shouldn't they be entitled to a raise as a reward for this?

Not according to conservatives. That money should go to executives and shareholders but not the people who did the work that made it happen.

Wages have gone up, what are you talking about? I agree that they haven't gone up enough but it's due to the poor economy. I'd like to see the stats on American workers being more productive. Are you sure that isn't due to automation?

Jesus man, how many excuses are willing to make for businesses who are too cheap to pay a decent wage?

Sure automation has made Americans more productive, and theoretically that means more profit per employee for the employer. Meanwhile the stupid tax payer is subsidizing these wages.

 

[BillyZane]

Amazing that conservatives are prepared to accept that costs on everything have gone up but still not prepared to accept that this is also true for their workers. Rent, food car expenses, everything has gone up for working folks except their wages. Americans have increased productivity and profits. Shouldn't they be entitled to a raise as a reward for this?

Not according to conservatives. That money should go to executives and shareholders but not the people who did the work that made it happen.

Right on!

That's why my plan is a win-win

-Raise minimum wage to $23.50/hr. Based on where minimum wage should be using 1970-2013 rise in food, shelter, and transportation.

-Eliminate all business subsidies (deductions/write-off’s/write-downs) except for employee expenses which are deducted dollar-for-dollar on all city, state, and Federal taxes and fees.

-Adjust Social Security and private/public retirement and pension payments using 1970-2013 price structure.

-Back down ALL costs, prices, fees, to January 1, 2009 levels and hold them for 10 years.

-Recall ALL off-shore investments tax free, and disallow any further off-shore investments.

Just one comment here. Google government price controls and read up on the history and consequences of that somehwere other than on leftwing propaganda sites. Here is a good place to start but is defnitely not the only or last word on the subject:

http://object.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/serials/files/regulation/2001/4/morton.pdf

Much of the same dynamics occur with government controlling the cost of labor.

his minimum wage is way too high as well.

 

[OnePercenter]

Amazing that conservatives are prepared to accept that costs on everything have gone up but still not prepared to accept that this is also true for their workers. Rent, food car expenses, everything has gone up for working folks except their wages. Americans have increased productivity and profits. Shouldn't they be entitled to a raise as a reward for this?

Not according to conservatives. That money should go to executives and shareholders but not the people who did the work that made it happen.

Right on!

That's why my plan is a win-win

-Raise minimum wage to $23.50/hr. Based on where minimum wage should be using 1970-2013 rise in food, shelter, and transportation.

-Eliminate all business subsidies (deductions/write-off’s/write-downs) except for employee expenses which are deducted dollar-for-dollar on all city, state, and Federal taxes and fees.

-Adjust Social Security and private/public retirement and pension payments using 1970-2013 price structure.

-Back down ALL costs, prices, fees, to January 1, 2009 levels and hold them for 10 years.

-Recall ALL off-shore investments tax free, and disallow any further off-shore investments.

Just one comment here. Google government price controls and read up on the history and consequences of that somehwere other than on leftwing propaganda sites. Here is a good place to start but is defnitely not the only or last word on the subject:

http://object.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/serials/files/regulation/2001/4/morton.pdf

Much of the same dynamics occur with government controlling the cost of labor.

Former price controls don't include a huge subsidy, mine does.

 

[OnePercenter]

Right on!

That's why my plan is a win-win

-Raise minimum wage to $23.50/hr. Based on where minimum wage should be using 1970-2013 rise in food, shelter, and transportation.

-Eliminate all business subsidies (deductions/write-off’s/write-downs) except for employee expenses which are deducted dollar-for-dollar on all city, state, and Federal taxes and fees.

-Adjust Social Security and private/public retirement and pension payments using 1970-2013 price structure.

-Back down ALL costs, prices, fees, to January 1, 2009 levels and hold them for 10 years.

-Recall ALL off-shore investments tax free, and disallow any further off-shore investments.

Just one comment here. Google government price controls and read up on the history and consequences of that somehwere other than on leftwing propaganda sites. Here is a good place to start but is defnitely not the only or last word on the subject:

http://object.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/serials/files/regulation/2001/4/morton.pdf

Much of the same dynamics occur with government controlling the cost of labor.

his minimum wage is way too high as well.

Not so. Take price increases (1970-2013) on three key items; food, shelter, and transportation, you'll find that I'm spot-on.

 

[eddy106]

I think you are missing an important point. If the minimum wage were raised, then all items that you buy at the store would also have to rise to cover those costs. Many want to argue that raising the minimum wage would lower the amount of poverty. Studies conducted on this remain very inconclusive. In fact, if everything rises, then the poverty level will have to rise too. If it were true that raising minimum wage put an end to poverty, then when wages went from 75 cents to a dollar, poverty would have ended, and we all know that was not the case.

 

[BillyZane]

I think you are missing an important point. If the minimum wage were raised, then all items that you buy at the store would also have to rise to cover those costs. Many want to argue that raising the minimum wage would lower the amount of poverty. Studies conducted on this remain very inconclusive. In fact, if everything rises, then the poverty level will have to rise too. If it were true that raising minimum wage put an end to poverty, then when wages went from 75 cents to a dollar, poverty would have ended, and we all know that was not the case.

There's a balance there for sure. You raise the minimum wage to $15 or higher and yes, prices will have to rise. Even a healthy business couldn't absorb that.

But $10 an hour? That's negligible in the grand scheme of things and I think most consumers would simply refuse to pay much higher prices than what we see now.

I just don't know how anyone can defend the current minimum wage with a straight face. I mean no person should have to expand an hour of labor at any job just to buy a gallon of milk. And that's basically where we are. An hour at minimum wage will after taxes pay for a gallon of milk.

 

[Iceweasel]

I just don't know how anyone can defend the current minimum wage with a straight face. I mean no person should have to expand an hour of labor at any job just to buy a gallon of milk. And that's basically where we are. An hour at minimum wage will after taxes pay for a gallon of milk.

I wouldn't defend it at all. Government has no business setting wages. That isn't why our government was formed. If it costs X amount of dollars to live the employer will have to pay x amount of dollars to keep someone worthwhile. Somehow we managed before the law went into effect. True story.

 

[OnePercenter]

I think you are missing an important point. If the minimum wage were raised, then all items that you buy at the store would also have to rise to cover those costs. Many want to argue that raising the minimum wage would lower the amount of poverty. Studies conducted on this remain very inconclusive. In fact, if everything rises, then the poverty level will have to rise too. If it were true that raising minimum wage put an end to poverty, then when wages went from 75 cents to a dollar, poverty would have ended, and we all know that was not the case.

That's why my plan is perfect. None of what you state will happen.

 

[OnePercenter]

I just don't know how anyone can defend the current minimum wage with a straight face. I mean no person should have to expand an hour of labor at any job just to buy a gallon of milk. And that's basically where we are. An hour at minimum wage will after taxes pay for a gallon of milk.

I wouldn't defend it at all. Government has no business setting wages. That isn't why our government was formed. If it costs X amount of dollars to live the employer will have to pay x amount of dollars to keep someone worthwhile. Somehow we managed before the law went into effect. True story.

Regulations are to control greed.

 

[Iceweasel]

Regulations are to control greed.

Define greed.

 

[OnePercenter]

Regulations are to control greed.

Define greed.

Intense and selfish desire for something, especially wealth and power.

 

[Iceweasel]

Regulations are to control greed.

Define greed.

Intense and selfish desire for something, especially wealth and power.

That's rather vague isn't it?