Marener
Diamond Member
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I don't know why Trump supporters even want to have elections anymore. The result doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is if Trump supporters feel they won, which they always do.
If Democrats Criminalize Opposition And Cripple The Court, Democracy Is Dead
- Thread starter Doc7505
- Start date
Billiejeens
Diamond Member
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You simply could have stopped at -
"I don't know"
Virtually anything could have been inserted after that.
Marener
Diamond Member
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I got everything wrong. Elections no longer matter to Trump supporters. They just believe whatever they want to believe.
progressive hunter
Diamond Member
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dont you mean a democratic process??
why are you guys so afraid to say republic and constitution and insist on lying??
Dante Reawakened
Lifer
- May 4, 2022
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well said.We are that, too!
But it doesn't mean what you think it means.... You see Democracy as a form of Government System... Like a Republic, a Monarchy, a Democracy, a what ever..... however, when everyone, including myself uses democracy, we are not using it as the SYSTEM of government we have, but the PROCESS of govt we use.... Which is the process of individual citizens, voting for their representatives and leaders...
We have a Republic system, and we vote for our representatives and leaders to run it...thus a democracy as well.
We are both. It isn't one over another.
I'd ask the troglodytes here: Ever hear of Democratic Socialism? Are they a socialist state, or a democratic one?
The Federalist and Anti-federalist Debates on Diversity and the Extended Republic
This curriculum unit explores some of the most important arguments of those opposing or supporting the ratification of the U.S. Constitution.
edsitement.neh.gov
The United States of America is both a constitutional republic and representative democracy (Dante claims this to be so, because some here deny this reality). What is it about this fact that some people do not understand, fail to grasp, seek to deny? Why do some engage in this denial? Is it an ideological stance/defense, a political tactic, a mental tic?
How is it that during Dante's visits here @ USMB through the years many a thread here have been hijacked with shouts and battles over as simple an issue of 'what from of government' or 'what form of political structure' do we have? This speaks to ignorance and denial in the general population of a supposed 'exceptional' people.
If we do not know and cannot agree on what form of government and political system we have, how the heck are we exceptional in the positive sense?
oh yeah, we are a federation too
Dante Reawakened
Lifer
- May 4, 2022
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not really such a difficult concept to grasp: Federalist Republic with Representative Democracy
primer:
Overview
In September of 1787, the delegates to the Convention in Philadelphia presented their work to the American public for ratification. The proposed Constitution marked a clear departure from the Articles of Confederation, which had essentially established a federal “league of friendship” between thirteen sovereign and largely independent states. Under the newly proposed plan of government, the union between the states would be strengthened under a national government that derived its authority—at least in part—directly from the American people rather than purely from the state legislatures. And under the new Constitution, the people would be represented equally in the House, regardless of the state in which they lived—unlike the Articles of Confederation, according to which the Continental Congress equally represented the states. In other words, the proposed Constitution would make the United States a nation of one people rather than a loose confederation of states.
The proposed Constitution, and the change it wrought in the nature of the American Union, spawned one of the greatest political debates of all time. In addition to the state ratifying conventions, the debates also took the form of a public conversation, mostly through newspaper editorials, with Anti-federalists on one side objecting to the Constitution, and Federalists on the other supporting it. Writers from both sides tried to persuade the public that precious liberty and self-government, hard-earned during the late Revolution, were at stake in the question.
Anti-federalists such as the Federal Farmer, Centinel, and Brutus argued that the new Constitution would eventually lead to the dissolution of the state governments, the consolidation of the Union into “one great republic” under an unchecked national government, and as a result the loss of free, self-government.
Brutus especially believed that in such an extensive and diverse nation, nothing short of despotism “could bind so great a country under one government.” Federalists such as James Madison (writing as Publius) countered that it was precisely a large nation, in conjunction with a well-constructed system of government, which would help to counter the “mortal disease” of popular governments: the “dangerous vice” of majority faction. In an extended republic, interests would be multiplied, Madison argued, making it difficult for a majority animated by one interest to unite and oppress the minority. If such a faction did form, a frame of government that included “auxiliary precautions” such as separation of powers and legislative checks and balances would help to prevent the “factious spirit” from introducing “instability, injustice, and confusion … into the public councils.”
from The Federalist and Anti-federalist Debates on Diversity and the Extended Republic EDSITEment
primer:
Overview
In September of 1787, the delegates to the Convention in Philadelphia presented their work to the American public for ratification. The proposed Constitution marked a clear departure from the Articles of Confederation, which had essentially established a federal “league of friendship” between thirteen sovereign and largely independent states. Under the newly proposed plan of government, the union between the states would be strengthened under a national government that derived its authority—at least in part—directly from the American people rather than purely from the state legislatures. And under the new Constitution, the people would be represented equally in the House, regardless of the state in which they lived—unlike the Articles of Confederation, according to which the Continental Congress equally represented the states. In other words, the proposed Constitution would make the United States a nation of one people rather than a loose confederation of states.
The proposed Constitution, and the change it wrought in the nature of the American Union, spawned one of the greatest political debates of all time. In addition to the state ratifying conventions, the debates also took the form of a public conversation, mostly through newspaper editorials, with Anti-federalists on one side objecting to the Constitution, and Federalists on the other supporting it. Writers from both sides tried to persuade the public that precious liberty and self-government, hard-earned during the late Revolution, were at stake in the question.
Anti-federalists such as the Federal Farmer, Centinel, and Brutus argued that the new Constitution would eventually lead to the dissolution of the state governments, the consolidation of the Union into “one great republic” under an unchecked national government, and as a result the loss of free, self-government.
Brutus especially believed that in such an extensive and diverse nation, nothing short of despotism “could bind so great a country under one government.” Federalists such as James Madison (writing as Publius) countered that it was precisely a large nation, in conjunction with a well-constructed system of government, which would help to counter the “mortal disease” of popular governments: the “dangerous vice” of majority faction. In an extended republic, interests would be multiplied, Madison argued, making it difficult for a majority animated by one interest to unite and oppress the minority. If such a faction did form, a frame of government that included “auxiliary precautions” such as separation of powers and legislative checks and balances would help to prevent the “factious spirit” from introducing “instability, injustice, and confusion … into the public councils.”
from The Federalist and Anti-federalist Debates on Diversity and the Extended Republic EDSITEment
EDSITEment! is a project of the National Endowment for the Humanities
BlindBoo
Diamond Member
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I mean the election processes as well as the justification to govern from the people.
"Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,"
DI 1776.
Curried Goats
Diamond Member
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They're just desperate people searching for the magic combination of words they think mean they get to hold on to power, legitimately.well said.
I'd ask the troglodytes here: Ever hear of Democratic Socialism? Are they a socialist state, or a democratic one?
The Federalist and Anti-federalist Debates on Diversity and the Extended Republic
This curriculum unit explores some of the most important arguments of those opposing or supporting the ratification of the U.S. Constitution.
The United States of America is both a constitutional republic and representative democracy (Dante claims this to be so, because some here deny this reality). What is it about this fact that some people do not understand, fail to grasp, seek to deny? Why do some engage in this denial? Is it an ideological stance/defense, a political tactic, a mental tic?
How is it that during Dante's visits here @ USMB through the years many a thread here have been hijacked with shouts and battles over as simple an issue of 'what from of government' or 'what form of political structure' do we have? This speaks to ignorance and denial in the general population of a supposed 'exceptional' people.
If we do not know and cannot agree on what form of government and political system we have, how the heck are we exceptional in the positive sense?
oh yeah, we are a federation too
Dante Reawakened
Lifer
- May 4, 2022
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Bumper sticker slogans/memes/pedestrian lingo
progressive hunter
Diamond Member
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fact remains as was pointed out last night that there are no democracy's on the planet but yet people insist that we are a democracy when in reality we are a constitutional republic,,,
I cant for the life of me can understand why people insist on lying about that
- Banned
- #131
Our Democracy died when Queer Barry used the government (IRS) to undermine the Tea Party grassroots opposition.
Trump gave it a reprieve but was given a death blow when the 2020 Presidential election was stolen by dishonest vote counting. (voters decide nothing, those who count the votes decide everything) It was further destroyed by the blatant weaponization of the Federal government against opposition by the Potatohead administration.
We are a Banana Republic now.
Democracy requires a certain amount of honesty to work and the Democrats have thrown that out the window. They don't give a crap. Like all Leftest Revolutionaries they believe in any means necessary to achieve their Socialist goals.
Our Founding Fathers knew that Democracy could fail at any time and that is why we have the Second Amendment. However, it is up us to do what is necessary to preserve our Republic. Like Franklin said "A Republic if you can keep it".
Trump gave it a reprieve but was given a death blow when the 2020 Presidential election was stolen by dishonest vote counting. (voters decide nothing, those who count the votes decide everything) It was further destroyed by the blatant weaponization of the Federal government against opposition by the Potatohead administration.
We are a Banana Republic now.
Democracy requires a certain amount of honesty to work and the Democrats have thrown that out the window. They don't give a crap. Like all Leftest Revolutionaries they believe in any means necessary to achieve their Socialist goals.
Our Founding Fathers knew that Democracy could fail at any time and that is why we have the Second Amendment. However, it is up us to do what is necessary to preserve our Republic. Like Franklin said "A Republic if you can keep it".
Billiejeens
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In the US case it is demonstrated in our being a representative republic.
Curried Goats
Diamond Member
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Even more than that. An excuse for sedition. If we're not a democracy then it's totally fine for Mike Pence to decide who the next president is. It's allowed because we're a Constitutional Republic, not a democracy or some equivalent nonsense.
BlindBoo
Diamond Member
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It is still a Republican form of Government.
BlindBoo
Diamond Member
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Most citizens don't understand the electoral process much less the definition of a republican form of government. Pols from both sides of the isle use "US Democracy", "Constitutional Republic" and a "Republic" interchangeably to describe our republican form of government.
progressive hunter
Diamond Member
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then how is lying to them help them understand what we are and how our process works??
democracy is a flat out lie,, the others are not,,
at this point I think some of the people lie on purpose to confuse the simple minded,, I choose to not continue the lie and help people understand what we are and how it works,,
Dante Reawakened
Lifer
- May 4, 2022
- 9,126
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- #137
Form of government?
How about a constitutional federal republic?
People trying to be exact, are often caught up in their own follies/bullshit.
I like this one:
republic, form of government in which a state is ruled by representatives of the citizen body. Modern republics are founded on the idea that sovereignty rests with the people, though who is included and excluded from the category of the people has varied across history. Because citizens do not govern the state themselves but through representatives, republics may be distinguished from direct democracy, though modern representative democracies are by and large republics. The term republic may also be applied to any form of government in which the head of state is not a hereditary monarch.
Republic | Definition, History, & Facts | Britannica
Republic, form of government in which a state is ruled by representatives of the citizen body. Modern republics are founded on the idea that sovereignty rests with the people, though who is included and excluded from the category of the people has varied across history.
www.britannica.com
Dante Reawakened
Lifer
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progressive hunter
Diamond Member
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as long as its not called a democracy you would at least be close,,Form of government?
How about a constitutional federal republic?
People trying to be exact, are often caught up in their own follies/bullshit.
I like this one:
republic, form of government in which a state is ruled by representatives of the citizen body. Modern republics are founded on the idea that sovereignty rests with the people, though who is included and excluded from the category of the people has varied across history. Because citizens do not govern the state themselves but through representatives, republics may be distinguished from direct democracy, though modern representative democracies are by and large republics. The term republic may also be applied to any form of government in which the head of state is not a hereditary monarch.
Republic | Definition, History, & Facts | Britannica
Republic, form of government in which a state is ruled by representatives of the citizen body. Modern republics are founded on the idea that sovereignty rests with the people, though who is included and excluded from the category of the people has varied across history.
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Says the gaslighter. Trump wants to throw the Constitution away.PROJECTION MONKEY
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