Home demolitions on the increase

[Lipush]

Loinboy -

You appear to be taking Lipush's comment out of context, though possibly accidentally.

Weeks ago Muslims killed children in France, in the name of the Palestinian children who have died. What was their crime? What was the crime of Illan Halimi? Also died in the name of the same war? It is not about Israel, it is about Islam going against our people wherever they live. We have seen in in Mumbai, France, USA, Argentina, and too many places to mention. If it was only Palestine, then their would have been no war outside Israel. But when they teach to "slay all Jews" and that even the "tree and stone" will tell them to kill us, it is brainwashing. Not air force or soldiers can make and excuse to call to slay an entire nation simple because their Hadith says we brings out Allah's wrath.

When she says it is not about Israel, she goes on to say it IS about Jews - as in Jews everywhere, and not only in Israel.

Thus, it is not an act against Israeli aggression based on politics, but an attack against the Jewish people as a whole. This suggests that the attacks are not as much political as racial.

I think she is right - many Islamic leaders do not see their enemy as the nation state of Israel, but the entire Jewish people anywhere, anytime, very many of whom are not Zionist at all.

How do Jews living in France get to be legitimate targets in a war ostensibly against Israel?

THANK YOU

That was my point exactly.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Tinmore -

But all the concessions are from the Palestinians. They have to let Israel keep everything it has stolen.

What is Israel conceding?

In my plan, Israel is giving up 90% of the West Bank, plus land south and north-east of the West Bank, and Eastern Jerusalem.

That is a very, very big concession.

They are also giving up some Right of Return, and offering to recognise a Palestinian state.

I call that a fairly even deal.

Israel is giving up...

Why do people always say giving? That is not Israel's to give. It makes it sound like Israel is playing Santa Clause.

 

[Lipush]

Tinmore -

But all the concessions are from the Palestinians. They have to let Israel keep everything it has stolen.

What is Israel conceding?

In my plan, Israel is giving up 90% of the West Bank, plus land south and north-east of the West Bank, and Eastern Jerusalem.

That is a very, very big concession.

They are also giving up some Right of Return, and offering to recognise a Palestinian state.

I call that a fairly even deal.

Israel is giving up...

Why do people always say giving? That is not Israel's to give. It makes it sound like Israel is playing Santa Clause.

Why does Israel has to give up on things to make peace, while the Palestinians don't?

 

[Sunni Man]

Why does Israel has to give up on things to make peace, while the Palestinians don't?

Just another example of the collective mental illness called "Jew Think" in which realty has no role in the thought process.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Tinmore -



In my plan, Israel is giving up 90% of the West Bank, plus land south and north-east of the West Bank, and Eastern Jerusalem.

That is a very, very big concession.

They are also giving up some Right of Return, and offering to recognise a Palestinian state.

I call that a fairly even deal.

Israel is giving up...

Why do people always say giving? That is not Israel's to give. It makes it sound like Israel is playing Santa Clause.

Why does Israel has to give up on things to make peace, while the Palestinians don't?

That is based on the false premise that Israel actually owns anything.

 

[Saigon]

Why does Israel has to give up on things to make peace, while the Palestinians don't?

Just another example of the collective mental illness called "Jew Think" in which realty has no role in the thought process.

You seem like a smart and pleasanr guy, Sunni, in which case you should be able to debate without racism.

 

[Billo_Really]

Loinboy -

You appear to be taking Lipush's comment out of context, though possibly accidentally.

When she says it is not about Israel, she goes on to say it IS about Jews - as in Jews everywhere, and not only in Israel.

Thus, it is not an act against Israeli aggression based on politics, but an attack against the Jewish people as a whole. This suggests that the attacks are not as much political as racial.

I think she is right - many Islamic leaders do not see their enemy as the nation state of Israel, but the entire Jewish people anywhere, anytime, very many of whom are not Zionist at all.

How do Jews living in France get to be legitimate targets in a war ostensibly against Israel?

The same way American's are a target all over the world because of our neocon foreign policy agenda. Although I'm completely against these wars and what we are doing in the ME, as an American, I bear the burden of responsibility of what my government does, whether I like it or not. Because everything my government does, is done in my name. Even the ones I don't vote for, what they do, is still my fault.

I understand her point, I just disagree with it. Let me also say, I'm completely on her side in regards to the issue of targeting the innocent, jewish or not, that take no part in hostilities. I condemn the rocket attacks, as well as all the extra-judicial killings that go on around the world. However, I'm not going to scapegoat an entire religion as the cause of these killings.

In order to understand the problem, you have to put yourself in their shoes. You have to ask yourself, "Why are they teaching this hatred to their children?" And it's not because of the ideology with which people worship. There's a billion muslims out there and only a very small portion of extremists commit these violent acts. To simply blame this on their religion is ridiculous.

 

[Sunni Man]

Why does Israel has to give up on things to make peace, while the Palestinians don't?

Just another example of the collective mental illness called "Jew Think" in which realty has no role in the thought process.

You seem like a smart and pleasanr guy, Sunni, in which case you should be able to debate without racism.

Jews are not a race.

Just saying

 

[Saigon]

Loinboy -

Those are interesting comments - good posting.

I also agree with you regarding the role of faith. I've always seen poverty as being the single biggest driving force in terror, and I think that is as true in Israel/Palestine as I do in Kurdistan, the Congo, Kashmir or Uganda.

 

[Saigon]

Just another example of the collective mental illness called "Jew Think" in which realty has no role in the thought process.

You seem like a smart and pleasanr guy, Sunni, in which case you should be able to debate without racism.

Jews are not a race.

Just saying

No, but labeling any group of people, either on the basis of religion, skin colour or religion, is equally pointless and unintelligent.

Elsewhere on this board I just had the same discussion about someone mouthing off at Muslims - I think both sides could do better.

 

[Billo_Really]

No, but labeling any group of people, either on the basis of religion, skin colour or religion, is equally pointless and unintelligent.

Elsewhere on this board I just had the same discussion about someone mouthing off at Muslims - I think both sides could do better.

You're a breath of fresh air!
(Even though you're now called Ho Chi Min city)

 

[Sunni Man]

No, but labeling any group of people, either on the basis of religion, skin colour or religion, is equally pointless and unintelligent.

Pointless, maybe; unintelligent; it has nothing to do with intelligence.

 

[docmauser1]

Loinboy - Those are interesting comments - good posting.

Crap, as usual, of course.

 

[docmauser1]

You're a breath of fresh air!

'Twas funny air.

 

[Lipush]

Why does Israel has to give up on things to make peace, while the Palestinians don't?

Just another example of the collective mental illness called "Jew Think" in which realty has no role in the thought process.

I am officialy adding you to my ignore list from now on. You're controled by Jew hatred and that is not something I tolerant.

Bye now.

 

[Lipush]

Why do people always say giving? That is not Israel's to give. It makes it sound like Israel is playing Santa Clause.

Why does Israel has to give up on things to make peace, while the Palestinians don't?

That is based on the false premise that Israel actually owns anything.

"false premise"? Who decides that ? You?

The world has recognized Israel's right of exitence in 48. Not you and not other crazy people can overlook that. Any land that is not part of Judea or Samaria, or Gaza, is for Israel to give, or NOT to give.

 

[Saigon]

No, but labeling any group of people, either on the basis of religion, skin colour or religion, is equally pointless and unintelligent.

Pointless, maybe; unintelligent; it has nothing to do with intelligence.

There are intelligent racists, but that does not make racism intelligent.

Posting the kind of thing that you did earlier is like tattooing the words "You can fairly much ignore me" on your forehead.

It just isn't cool.

 

[Lipush]

Loinboy -

You appear to be taking Lipush's comment out of context, though possibly accidentally.

When she says it is not about Israel, she goes on to say it IS about Jews - as in Jews everywhere, and not only in Israel.

Thus, it is not an act against Israeli aggression based on politics, but an attack against the Jewish people as a whole. This suggests that the attacks are not as much political as racial.

I think she is right - many Islamic leaders do not see their enemy as the nation state of Israel, but the entire Jewish people anywhere, anytime, very many of whom are not Zionist at all.

How do Jews living in France get to be legitimate targets in a war ostensibly against Israel?

The same way American's are a target all over the world because of our neocon foreign policy agenda. Although I'm completely against these wars and what we are doing in the ME, as an American, I bear the burden of responsibility of what my government does, whether I like it or not. Because everything my government does, is done in my name. Even the ones I don't vote for, what they do, is still my fault.

I understand her point, I just disagree with it. Let me also say, I'm completely on her side in regards to the issue of targeting the innocent, jewish or not, that take no part in hostilities. I condemn the rocket attacks, as well as all the extra-judicial killings that go on around the world. However, I'm not going to scapegoat an entire religion as the cause of these killings.

In order to understand the problem, you have to put yourself in their shoes. You have to ask yourself, "Why are they teaching this hatred to their children?" And it's not because of the ideology with which people worship. There's a billion muslims out there and only a very small portion of extremists commit these violent acts. To simply blame this on their religion is ridiculous.

1. With your first point I highly disagree, and besides disagreeing, it's not a good comparison with what I have said.

First, I disagree because even with you as an American, the person who targets you doesn't know who are you, what do you think or believe, how do you see things in general, and politic as a specific issue.

The person who attacks an American in Europe or Israel, or India ror whatever, attacks you simple because you belong to a country that its govenment does things the other person does not accept. But you, yourself, are a person who can very well act for peace, not participate in any war, being clean from any blood, the person who wrong you deos not know that. You take responsibility for what your government does? Sure, you do, but you are not THE government, and there are things that you are not always in control of. That's the difference between being a civilians and a battle soldier. you're more exposed as a civilian, and people should not target you, because civilian is someone who's not armed, not makes decisions, and not always able of controling things.

What you say is basically saying that all the Gernams had responsibility over the doing of the Nazi regime, when we know that while many were brainwashed, the civilians were also under oppression.

Civilian, in general, should never pay for the wrongs of the government. a civilian at many cases votes for a leadership that he believes can change things. But after voting it's the government which decides what to do with the power given to it. And we see in many cases that they use their power, a thing which brings our protests and demonstrations.

I will take responsibility for what I can change, and influence, not things I have no control over.

That is why we southernes are so pissed with the corrent situation. People expect us to carry a burden we don't wanna nor ABLE of carrying.

Why a child in Sderot or Ashkelon should carry a burden of being traumatized by missile rockets, simply because his mother voted Likud?

For the fairness of dicussion, the same goes for the children of Gaza.

2. The second point, is that your comparison is wrong. Even if an American does get wrongly hurt, or killed, they do it because he's AMERICAN.

Many of the Jews who have been hurt by terrorists all over the world, were not Israelis. Its not like they take responsibility of the govenment in Israel, they are not even CITIZENS who're able to do that. Many of them got hurt simply for being JEWISH. That's like being hurt because you're hindu or Christian or Buddhist. That's racist, not political.

Lets say Jews start blowing up Muslim neighborhoods in UK in name of what's happening to southen Israelis. I would have liked seeing the world's response to THAT.

Rediculous.

 

[bobgnote]

The reason Israel gets to renege on the Oslo Peace Accords and continue its purge of Palestinians is Christian support, from the US and UK, mainly. This support has been conspiratorial, since the 19th Century, and it violates our separation clause, standing army clause, enumeration of powers relative to 'common defense,' USCA 4 security, USCA 5/14 due process, RICO, and Sedition Act.

Mark Twain on Palestine: "..... A desolate country whose soil is rich enough, but is given over wholly to weeds... a silent mournful expanse.... a desolation.... we never saw a human being on the whole route.... hardly a tree or shrub anywhere. Even the olive tree and the cactus, those fast friends of a worthless soil, had almost deserted the country." (The Innocents Abroad, p. 361-362)

http://www.palestineremembered.com/Acre/Articles/Story845.htm

Mark Twain visited the region soon after the end of hostilities between Christian and Muslim Druze at Mount Lebanon, where over ten thousand Christian Arabs (mostly Maronites) were massacred in 1861, and that should explain his blatant racist remarks in respect of the Turks, Arabs, and Muslims in general.

"[In Constantinople,] Mosques are plenty, churches are plenty, graveyards are plenty, but moral and whisky are scarce. The Koran does not permit Mohammedans to drink. Their natural instinct do not permit them to be moral. They say the Sultan has eight hundred wives. This almost amounts to bigamy. It makes our cheeks burn with shame to see such a thing permitted here in Turkey. We do not mind to see such thing in Salt Lake City, however." (The Innocents Abroad, p. 210-211)

"Greek, Turkish, and Armenian morals consist only in attending church regularly on the appointed Sabbath, and in breaking the ten commandments all the balance of the week. It comes natural to them to lie and cheat in the first place, and then they go on and improve on nature until they arrive at perfection." (The Innocents Abroad, p. 212)

Twain kept-a-rollin' all night long; the US started supporting Israel, to violate our own laws, so Israel will always abuse the Palestinians, including to blow off the Oslo Accords, after the 1995 assassination, of former Israeli PM Yitzhak Rabin. Colin Powell brought Bush Administration pressure, on Israel, when GW Bush was busy blowing off Palestinians and letting the Israelis bulldoze.

But Israel is a fascist-Zionist hegemon, which does not intend to get along, with Palestinians:

"We must expel Arabs and take their places."
-- David Ben Gurion, 1937, Ben Gurion and the Palestine Arabs, Oxford University Press, 1985.

"Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves ... politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves... The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country."
-- David Ben Gurion, quoted on pp 91-2 of Chomsky's Fateful Triangle, which appears in Simha Flapan's "Zionism and the Palestinians pp 141-2 citing a 1938 speech.

"Jewish villages were built in the place of Arab villages. You do not even know the names of these Arab villages, and I do not blame you because geography books no longer exist. Not only do the books not exist, the Arab villages are not there either. Nahlal arose in the place of Mahlul; Kibbutz Gvat in the place of Jibta; Kibbutz Sarid in the place of Huneifis; and Kefar Yehushua in the place of Tal al-Shuman. There is not a single place built in this country that did not have a former Arab population."
-- Moshe Dayan, April 1969, Ha'aretz; quoted in Edward Said, 'Zionism from the Standpoint of Its Victims', Social Text, Volume 1, 1979, 7-58.

"There is no such thing as a Palestinian people... It is not as if we came and threw them out and took their country. They didn't exist."
-- Golda Meir, statement to The Sunday Times, 15 June, 1969.

"The Partition of Palestine is illegal. It will never be recognized .... Jerusalem was and will for ever be our capital. Eretz Israel will be restored to the people of Israel. All of it. And for Ever."
-- Menachem Begin, the day after the U.N. vote to partition Palestine.

"The settlement of the Land of Israel is the essence of Zionism. Without settlement, we will not fulfill Zionism. It's that simple."
-- Yitzhak Shamir, Maariv, 02/21/1997.

"Everybody has to move, run and grab as many (Palestinian) hilltops as they can to enlarge the (Jewish) settlements because everything we take now will stay ours...Everything we don't grab will go to them."
-- Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of the Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, Nov. 15, 1998.

"Israel should have exploited the repression of the demonstrations in China, when world attention focused on that country, to carry out mass expulsions among the Arabs of the territories."
-- Benyamin Netanyahu, then Israeli Deputy Foreign Minister, former Prime Minister of Israel, speaking to students at Bar Ilan University, from the Israeli journal Hotam, November 24, 1989.

You just cannot argue with a load of assholes, all getting over with the help of AIPAC and US-ZOG-fueled organized criminal activity, but there was the late Yitzhak Rabin, who tried to make peace:

"[Israel will] create in the course of the next 10 or 20 years conditions which would attract natural and voluntary migration of the refugees from the Gaza Strip and the west Bank to Jordan. To achieve this we have to come to agreement with King Hussein and not with Yasser Arafat."
-- Yitzhak Rabin (a "Prince of Peace" by Clinton's standards), explaining his method of ethnically cleansing the occupied land without stirring a world outcry. (Quoted in David Shipler in the New York Times, 04/04/1983 citing Meir Cohen's remarks to the Knesset's foreign affairs and defense committee on March 16.)

For deviating from the path of the bulldozer, a right-wing law student named Yigal Amir shot Rabin, November 4, 1995, at the end of a rally, in support of the Oslo Accords.

You cannot argue with assholes, assholes, and more assholes! The Zionists still insist Jews are so Semitic, despite years of cross-breeding since diaspora, any opposition to Zionism is 'anti-Semitism.' Never mind Arabs and others are also children of Abraham of Ur, and therefore Semitic people, many having lived continuously, in the Middle East, to now be threatened by the US conspiracy with Israel. The US is not going to be popular.

That the US-ZOG conspiracy supports this shit is the basis for all US trouble, in the Middle East. This trouble underlies a lot of US friction, with Russia, China, and others. Assholes is, as assholes does!

 

[Sunni Man]

No, but labeling any group of people, either on the basis of religion, skin colour or religion, is equally pointless and unintelligent.

Pointless, maybe; unintelligent; it has nothing to do with intelligence.

There are intelligent racists, but that does not make racism intelligent.

Posting the kind of thing that you did earlier is like tattooing the words "You can fairly much ignore me" on your forehead.

It just isn't cool.

One again, the Jews are Not a race.

But the Israeli Jews have a majority "group think" when it comes to Israel. Where reality and morals are suspended and base instincts rule their behavior. Basically, it's a tribal response like all primitive collectives emote when threatened.