Holy crap - this has to stop!

[Markle]

Straw man argument. I didn't say Federal funding was unimportant, I said it was only a third of it's funding and that none of it could be used for abortions.

If you have some facts, please post them:
For Planned Parenthood abortion stats, ‘3 percent’ and ’94 percent’ are both misleading

Do know the meaning of the word fungible?

Sorry, you are the one with the ignorant, straw man argument.

The "statistics" you quote are frog wash.

They deal exclusively with "contacts". If someone comes in 12 times during the year for contraception pills, they count that as 12 incidents. If someone comes in for an abortion, that is ONE incident. Which generates the most money for Planned Parenthood?

Really, try doing some honest research.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

That ain't a "vote". That's bullshit. And it's why we get a pathetic 55% turnout 45% said, "**** it, what's the point?"

It also makes us dependent on polls to see whether we should even bother to "vote". If your state isn't close --- what's the point? It's already pre-decided FOR you.

If our entire election was controlled by California, New York, Chicago, then wouldn't the rest of the country say the same thing? What's the point of voting?

There ain't no way to make that happen unless you only give votes to the cities.

Doesn't address the (heavily truncated) post, does it?

The cities have the highest population. Of course they would be able to control the entire election if we used the popular vote. The state of Idaho has a population of 1.6 million people. NYC has a population of over 7 million people. That means four states like Idaho couldn't even out vote one city in New York state. Add in the population of California which is nearly 40 million people, the combined population between one Democrat city and one Democrat state would be close to 50 million people. That's fair?

Long as it's 'one person one vote', yup it's fair.

Should California's electoral vote be nullified simply on the basis that it has San Francisco and Los Angeles and San Diego?

Are cities illegal?

You mention NYC with a "population of over seven million" Interestingly that's about the exact number of votes from New York -- the entire state -- in 2016. Over 2.8 million New Yorkers voted for the home team candy, yet Rump got zero electoral votes. That's fair??

Another angle is this ----- what do you suppose our national turnout rate would be if we had a system where every voter's vote actually counted? Think that might upset the apple cart of expectations? Think maybe a lot more New Yorker Rump voters would have turned out since their vote would actually mean something? Because in 2016 the WTA system made sure they didn't mean squat.

My state, and several others, counted up razor thin. Yet my state's electoral voters went and declared "wow it's amazing, literally everybody in our state voted for Rump. Never seen anything like it, it was unanimous".
That's fair?

I tell ya what, "we'll do it this way because this is the way we've always done it" just ain't a good reasoning and never has been. All that does is perpetuate the results you've always had.

What you don't understand is that there is going to be disenfranchisement no matter what system we use. Using the EC, Republicans in blue states have no use for voting. In red states, Democrats have no use for voting. But at least there is a neutralizing system in place.

If the entire country depended on popular vote where just two or three cities, and one or two states determined the election outcome, then over 90% of country would be disenfranchised.

i'm sure as a Democrat, you'd be fine with that. But if 90% of Democrats were disenfranchised, you would have a real problem with such a system.

 

[Wyatt earp]

A comedian having the bad taste to use Trumps severed head as a skit rightfully provoked mass outrage and disgust.

But multiple instances of Obama effigies, of a lynched strung up negro man, something with powerful historic symbolism, did not.

This hate and and anger isn't new, it's been building. But as long as it gets justified nothing will change.

It used to be unthinkable to portray a president in these ways.

On the Trump play....I think it's only crime is bad timing. It was an attempt to portray the current political crisis as analogous to Julius Caesar. I have not seen it but that is the impression I get. A bit like Piss Christ, if you read what the artists INTENT was. I think this play is being used as a device now to stoke further outrage, and like the lefts demonstrations against Milo speaking at universities, the right has crashed, disrupted and protested productions.

I'm a fairly well-informed news junkie. In all honesty, I did not see any representations of petulant former President Barack Hussein Obama as having been lynched. Some far left publications did caricatures of the couple but nothing outrageous. Yes, I'm certain a Bing search will find many but they never hit the mainstream like the tramp Kathy Griffin. There was also no feature, award-winning movie about the assassination of George Bush.

I saw effigies of Obama hanging in a noose hit mainstream news because they were pretty awful. What Griffin did (and she's just a comedian) was also beyond the pale. I think the Obama effigies should have been condemned as strongly as what Griffin did. I don't see any difference there. I hate to think what Trump's young son thought when he saw that, or what Obama's young daughters though also. Pretty aweful stuff.

I see a difference. That preacher had stuff burning and hanging in his church yard virtually ever day. Ain't NOTHING that he didn't hang or burn. He burned Korans. He burned freakin' UNCLE SAM. He was obscure and meaningless. Griffin severed her 1st and LAST head. Possibly illegal. And then BLAMED the Trump family.

There's a long list now. From the burnt GOP campaign HQs to Madonna wanting to "blow up the WhiteHouse". I'm sorry, but making comparisons doesn't ever --- make it right.. ESPECIALLY -- if there is a MOVEMENT that condones this.

News item from Friday about 2 ladies becoming the "Leaders of the Resistance". You give it a NAME and LEADERSHIP -- and it's NOTHING like a psychotic preacher with pyromaniac tendencies...

I wasn't thinking about the nutty preacher - I was thinking about other effigies - there were many. I'm sorry but I don't think it was either obscure or meaningless at all especially in light of the other attacks on Obama and making comparisons makes a valid point - what's happening now happened before and was ignored, until it reached this level. Why was it ok when the right attacked Obama but not when the left attacked Trump? Seems to me it should all have been condemned at the beginning but it wasn't.

You think the first hundred days of Trump was bad? Wasn't any better for Obama: How Years Of The Right-Wing Media’s Obama Hatred Paved The Way For Trump (yes, it's Media Matters)

Here's a list you forget about:
Multiple attacks from media personalities, and even elected officials questioning Obama's birth and legitimacy.
Effigies of a black president hanging from a noose.
On Facebook, Trump’s Longtime Butler Calls for Obama to Be Killed – Mother Jones
Pa. newspaper: Sorry we published letter calling for Obama's execution
Ted Nugent - a celebrity with at least as high a profile and media presence as Griffin repeatedly making references to killing Obama as well as derogatory statements.

You don't think property was destroyed or burned?
Conservatives forget history in discrediting Trump protesters

Obama’s election in 2008 was preceded and followed by violent attacks and property destruction targeted against minorities.

Kaylon Johnson, an African American campaign worker for Obama, was physically assaulted for wearing an Obama T-shirt in Louisiana following the 2008 election. The three white male attackers shouted “**** Obama!” and “****** president!” as they broke Johnson’s nose and fractured his eye-socket, requiring surgery.

More frequently, Obama’s presidency was marked by effigies of our first black president hanging from nooses across the country, for example in Kentucky, Washington State, and Maine, or being burned around the world. What Trump supporters fail to remember is that following Obama’s election, property was destroyed across the country, for example in Pennsylvania, Texas, and North Carolina, and a predominately black church was torched in Massachusetts.​

How about video games killing Obama, or a carnival game - shoot Obama.
And lets not forget multiple assassination threats and shooting bullets at the White House.

It all leads up to what is happening now only then - the people pitching a fit over excessive vitriole justified it.

Multiple attacks from media personalities, and even elected officials questioning Obama's birth and legitimacy.


Again what's wrong with that? a legitimate question due to the requirements of the Constitution.. Us normal workers have no problem providing two forms of ID to get hired legally.



.

 

[Coyote]

A comedian having the bad taste to use Trumps severed head as a skit rightfully provoked mass outrage and disgust.

But multiple instances of Obama effigies, of a lynched strung up negro man, something with powerful historic symbolism, did not.

This hate and and anger isn't new, it's been building. But as long as it gets justified nothing will change.

It used to be unthinkable to portray a president in these ways.

On the Trump play....I think it's only crime is bad timing. It was an attempt to portray the current political crisis as analogous to Julius Caesar. I have not seen it but that is the impression I get. A bit like Piss Christ, if you read what the artists INTENT was. I think this play is being used as a device now to stoke further outrage, and like the lefts demonstrations against Milo speaking at universities, the right has crashed, disrupted and protested productions.

I'm a fairly well-informed news junkie. In all honesty, I did not see any representations of petulant former President Barack Hussein Obama as having been lynched. Some far left publications did caricatures of the couple but nothing outrageous. Yes, I'm certain a Bing search will find many but they never hit the mainstream like the tramp Kathy Griffin. There was also no feature, award-winning movie about the assassination of George Bush.

I saw effigies of Obama hanging in a noose hit mainstream news because they were pretty awful. What Griffin did (and she's just a comedian) was also beyond the pale. I think the Obama effigies should have been condemned as strongly as what Griffin did. I don't see any difference there. I hate to think what Trump's young son thought when he saw that, or what Obama's young daughters though also. Pretty aweful stuff.

I see a difference. That preacher had stuff burning and hanging in his church yard virtually ever day. Ain't NOTHING that he didn't hang or burn. He burned Korans. He burned freakin' UNCLE SAM. He was obscure and meaningless. Griffin severed her 1st and LAST head. Possibly illegal. And then BLAMED the Trump family.

There's a long list now. From the burnt GOP campaign HQs to Madonna wanting to "blow up the WhiteHouse". I'm sorry, but making comparisons doesn't ever --- make it right.. ESPECIALLY -- if there is a MOVEMENT that condones this.

News item from Friday about 2 ladies becoming the "Leaders of the Resistance". You give it a NAME and LEADERSHIP -- and it's NOTHING like a psychotic preacher with pyromaniac tendencies...

I wasn't thinking about the nutty preacher - I was thinking about other effigies - there were many. I'm sorry but I don't think it was either obscure or meaningless at all especially in light of the other attacks on Obama and making comparisons makes a valid point - what's happening now happened before and was ignored, until it reached this level. Why was it ok when the right attacked Obama but not when the left attacked Trump? Seems to me it should all have been condemned at the beginning but it wasn't.

You think the first hundred days of Trump was bad? Wasn't any better for Obama: How Years Of The Right-Wing Media’s Obama Hatred Paved The Way For Trump (yes, it's Media Matters)

Here's a list you forget about:
Multiple attacks from media personalities, and even elected officials questioning Obama's birth and legitimacy.
Effigies of a black president hanging from a noose.
On Facebook, Trump’s Longtime Butler Calls for Obama to Be Killed – Mother Jones
Pa. newspaper: Sorry we published letter calling for Obama's execution
Ted Nugent - a celebrity with at least as high a profile and media presence as Griffin repeatedly making references to killing Obama as well as derogatory statements.

You don't think property was destroyed or burned?
Conservatives forget history in discrediting Trump protesters

Obama’s election in 2008 was preceded and followed by violent attacks and property destruction targeted against minorities.

Kaylon Johnson, an African American campaign worker for Obama, was physically assaulted for wearing an Obama T-shirt in Louisiana following the 2008 election. The three white male attackers shouted “**** Obama!” and “****** president!” as they broke Johnson’s nose and fractured his eye-socket, requiring surgery.

More frequently, Obama’s presidency was marked by effigies of our first black president hanging from nooses across the country, for example in Kentucky, Washington State, and Maine, or being burned around the world. What Trump supporters fail to remember is that following Obama’s election, property was destroyed across the country, for example in Pennsylvania, Texas, and North Carolina, and a predominately black church was torched in Massachusetts.​

How about video games killing Obama, or a carnival game - shoot Obama.
And lets not forget multiple assassination threats and shooting bullets at the White House.

It all leads up to what is happening now only then - the people pitching a fit over excessive vitriole justified it.

Multiple attacks from media personalities, and even elected officials questioning Obama's birth and legitimacy.


Again what's wrong with that? a legitimate question due to the requirements of the Constitution.. Us normal workers have no problem providing two forms of ID to get hired legally.



.

Not a legitimate question when the material has been provided and downright ODD when it was never asked for before from all our previous presidents and Trump.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Yeah the whole problem with reforming the Electoral College system is that it only seems to come up every four years because that's the only time it's in operation. By then it's too late and we scratch our heads and go "why didn't we fix this before?" and we squawk about it and then do nothing. Four years later we do it all over again.

As frustrating as it is to you and your ilk, the Electoral College perfectly serves its purpose. Were it not for the Electoral College, candidates would campaign in a dozen or so cities and the rest of the country would be slaves and cash cows to the citizens of those few wrecked cities.

Actually, replace "cities" with "states" and that's what it does already. The Wisconsins and Ohios get all the action, the Idahos and Massachusettses get the shaft. Both in terms of meeting the candidates and in terms of their vote. And nobody ever bothers with Alaska and Hawaìi --- they split 'em by 'gentlemen's agreement'.

I'm in Carolina (the real one, not the banana republic) so I actually had a vote. My friends and relatives in Mississippi and California and Texas and Washington, had zippo. They could have voted with their states, could have voted against their states, or they could have stayed home. None of those "options" would have made a damn bit of difference to the end result.

That ain't a "vote". That's a farce. And it's why we get a pathetic 55% turnout 45% said, "**** it, what's the point?" Surely you can remember tales of totalitarian states that hold a fake "vote" where the glorious dictator gets an amazing 99% of the vote. Yeah we can relate.

It also makes us dependent on polls to see whether we should even bother to "vote". If your state isn't close --- what's the point? It's already pre-decided FOR you.


Didn't think this through didja?

When that same state elects a governor, does it muster some kind of state electoral college to count up who won each county/parish/borough? Nope --- we do that by direct vote. All 57 states. What's the difference?

Still trying to beat a dead horse are you? Thank God your side will never win and get its way to try to remove the electoral college.




.

 

[Markle]

When that same state elects a governor, does it muster some kind of state electoral college to count up who won each county/parish/borough? Nope --- we do that by direct vote. All 57 states. What's the difference?

Your desperation is duly noted.

Each state, in addition to the Governor also has a House and Senate who also represent the various districts around the state.

We'd have chaos and a total revolt. If twelve cities/states controlled the presidential election. What would prevent them, with the help of the Senate and House from passing taxes on the majority of states in order to support their own spendthrift, wasteful ways?

 

[Wyatt earp]

Qqq

I'm a fairly well-informed news junkie. In all honesty, I did not see any representations of petulant former President Barack Hussein Obama as having been lynched. Some far left publications did caricatures of the couple but nothing outrageous. Yes, I'm certain a Bing search will find many but they never hit the mainstream like the tramp Kathy Griffin. There was also no feature, award-winning movie about the assassination of George Bush.

I saw effigies of Obama hanging in a noose hit mainstream news because they were pretty awful. What Griffin did (and she's just a comedian) was also beyond the pale. I think the Obama effigies should have been condemned as strongly as what Griffin did. I don't see any difference there. I hate to think what Trump's young son thought when he saw that, or what Obama's young daughters though also. Pretty aweful stuff.

I see a difference. That preacher had stuff burning and hanging in his church yard virtually ever day. Ain't NOTHING that he didn't hang or burn. He burned Korans. He burned freakin' UNCLE SAM. He was obscure and meaningless. Griffin severed her 1st and LAST head. Possibly illegal. And then BLAMED the Trump family.

There's a long list now. From the burnt GOP campaign HQs to Madonna wanting to "blow up the WhiteHouse". I'm sorry, but making comparisons doesn't ever --- make it right.. ESPECIALLY -- if there is a MOVEMENT that condones this.

News item from Friday about 2 ladies becoming the "Leaders of the Resistance". You give it a NAME and LEADERSHIP -- and it's NOTHING like a psychotic preacher with pyromaniac tendencies...

I wasn't thinking about the nutty preacher - I was thinking about other effigies - there were many. I'm sorry but I don't think it was either obscure or meaningless at all especially in light of the other attacks on Obama and making comparisons makes a valid point - what's happening now happened before and was ignored, until it reached this level. Why was it ok when the right attacked Obama but not when the left attacked Trump? Seems to me it should all have been condemned at the beginning but it wasn't.

You think the first hundred days of Trump was bad? Wasn't any better for Obama: How Years Of The Right-Wing Media’s Obama Hatred Paved The Way For Trump (yes, it's Media Matters)

Here's a list you forget about:
Multiple attacks from media personalities, and even elected officials questioning Obama's birth and legitimacy.
Effigies of a black president hanging from a noose.
On Facebook, Trump’s Longtime Butler Calls for Obama to Be Killed – Mother Jones
Pa. newspaper: Sorry we published letter calling for Obama's execution
Ted Nugent - a celebrity with at least as high a profile and media presence as Griffin repeatedly making references to killing Obama as well as derogatory statements.

You don't think property was destroyed or burned?
Conservatives forget history in discrediting Trump protesters

Obama’s election in 2008 was preceded and followed by violent attacks and property destruction targeted against minorities.

Kaylon Johnson, an African American campaign worker for Obama, was physically assaulted for wearing an Obama T-shirt in Louisiana following the 2008 election. The three white male attackers shouted “**** Obama!” and “****** president!” as they broke Johnson’s nose and fractured his eye-socket, requiring surgery.

More frequently, Obama’s presidency was marked by effigies of our first black president hanging from nooses across the country, for example in Kentucky, Washington State, and Maine, or being burned around the world. What Trump supporters fail to remember is that following Obama’s election, property was destroyed across the country, for example in Pennsylvania, Texas, and North Carolina, and a predominately black church was torched in Massachusetts.​

How about video games killing Obama, or a carnival game - shoot Obama.
And lets not forget multiple assassination threats and shooting bullets at the White House.

It all leads up to what is happening now only then - the people pitching a fit over excessive vitriole justified it.

Multiple attacks from media personalities, and even elected officials questioning Obama's birth and legitimacy.


Again what's wrong with that? a legitimate question due to the requirements of the Constitution.. Us normal workers have no problem providing two forms of ID to get hired legally.



.

Not a legitimate question when the material has been provided and downright ODD when it was never asked for before from all our previous presidents and Trump.

It was kind of obvious where those presidents were born at and yes it is again any working man knows he has to provide two forms if identification, the only ones who don't have something to hide.




.

 

[Divine Wind]

Why should Planned Parenthood be funded is the better question?

The best way to reduce the number of abortions is by preventing pregnancies, a major mission of Planned Parenthood. Other missions include providing clinical breast examinations, cervical cancer screening, pregnancy testing, testing and treatment for sexually transmitted infections, sex education and vasectomies. Only a third of PP funding is federal, and except in rare circumstances, that funding can't be used for abortion.

Years ago in our state, they pushed to have a lottery system. The claim was that proceeds would help fund our public schools. Okay, so we got the lottery and they paid into our school system. That's when our state government reduced state funding to the schools, so they didn't benefit at all.

When the federal government pays PP to fund other things than abortion, the money they get from other resources goes to abortions. There is no possible way for them to separate all money that comes in. The federal money they get simply offsets their private donations and fees that do go to abortion. If not for federal money, they would't be able to use private money for abortions. They would have to use that money to fund their other services.

It's simple money laundering is what it is. Indirectly, yes, our federal tax dollars are funding PP abortions.

There is that logic, but then it can be applied to all things. Why do churches and non-profits like PP have tax breaks? Shouldn't they all pay full taxes just like everyone else?

As for the abortion issue, I support it. After all, it's mostly Democrats being aborted, isn't it? LOL

Again, the best way to prevent abortions is to prevent unwanted pregnancies. Who helps the most with that concept?

 

[Wyatt earp]

Qqq

I saw effigies of Obama hanging in a noose hit mainstream news because they were pretty awful. What Griffin did (and she's just a comedian) was also beyond the pale. I think the Obama effigies should have been condemned as strongly as what Griffin did. I don't see any difference there. I hate to think what Trump's young son thought when he saw that, or what Obama's young daughters though also. Pretty aweful stuff.

I see a difference. That preacher had stuff burning and hanging in his church yard virtually ever day. Ain't NOTHING that he didn't hang or burn. He burned Korans. He burned freakin' UNCLE SAM. He was obscure and meaningless. Griffin severed her 1st and LAST head. Possibly illegal. And then BLAMED the Trump family.

There's a long list now. From the burnt GOP campaign HQs to Madonna wanting to "blow up the WhiteHouse". I'm sorry, but making comparisons doesn't ever --- make it right.. ESPECIALLY -- if there is a MOVEMENT that condones this.

News item from Friday about 2 ladies becoming the "Leaders of the Resistance". You give it a NAME and LEADERSHIP -- and it's NOTHING like a psychotic preacher with pyromaniac tendencies...

I wasn't thinking about the nutty preacher - I was thinking about other effigies - there were many. I'm sorry but I don't think it was either obscure or meaningless at all especially in light of the other attacks on Obama and making comparisons makes a valid point - what's happening now happened before and was ignored, until it reached this level. Why was it ok when the right attacked Obama but not when the left attacked Trump? Seems to me it should all have been condemned at the beginning but it wasn't.

You think the first hundred days of Trump was bad? Wasn't any better for Obama: How Years Of The Right-Wing Media’s Obama Hatred Paved The Way For Trump (yes, it's Media Matters)

Here's a list you forget about:
Multiple attacks from media personalities, and even elected officials questioning Obama's birth and legitimacy.
Effigies of a black president hanging from a noose.
On Facebook, Trump’s Longtime Butler Calls for Obama to Be Killed – Mother Jones
Pa. newspaper: Sorry we published letter calling for Obama's execution
Ted Nugent - a celebrity with at least as high a profile and media presence as Griffin repeatedly making references to killing Obama as well as derogatory statements.

You don't think property was destroyed or burned?
Conservatives forget history in discrediting Trump protesters

Obama’s election in 2008 was preceded and followed by violent attacks and property destruction targeted against minorities.

Kaylon Johnson, an African American campaign worker for Obama, was physically assaulted for wearing an Obama T-shirt in Louisiana following the 2008 election. The three white male attackers shouted “**** Obama!” and “****** president!” as they broke Johnson’s nose and fractured his eye-socket, requiring surgery.

More frequently, Obama’s presidency was marked by effigies of our first black president hanging from nooses across the country, for example in Kentucky, Washington State, and Maine, or being burned around the world. What Trump supporters fail to remember is that following Obama’s election, property was destroyed across the country, for example in Pennsylvania, Texas, and North Carolina, and a predominately black church was torched in Massachusetts.​

How about video games killing Obama, or a carnival game - shoot Obama.
And lets not forget multiple assassination threats and shooting bullets at the White House.

It all leads up to what is happening now only then - the people pitching a fit over excessive vitriole justified it.

Multiple attacks from media personalities, and even elected officials questioning Obama's birth and legitimacy.


Again what's wrong with that? a legitimate question due to the requirements of the Constitution.. Us normal workers have no problem providing two forms of ID to get hired legally.



.

Not a legitimate question when the material has been provided and downright ODD when it was never asked for before from all our previous presidents and Trump.

It was kind of obvious where those presidents were born at and yes it is again any working man knows he has to provide two forms if identification, the only ones who don't have something to hide.




.

Also do you know what type of a constitutional crisis it would of been if it was found out Obama was not a born citizen?



Every law he signed , every Bill would of been null and void


.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Why should Planned Parenthood be funded is the better question?

The best way to reduce the number of abortions is by preventing pregnancies, a major mission of Planned Parenthood. Other missions include providing clinical breast examinations, cervical cancer screening, pregnancy testing, testing and treatment for sexually transmitted infections, sex education and vasectomies. Only a third of PP funding is federal, and except in rare circumstances, that funding can't be used for abortion.

Years ago in our state, they pushed to have a lottery system. The claim was that proceeds would help fund our public schools. Okay, so we got the lottery and they paid into our school system. That's when our state government reduced state funding to the schools, so they didn't benefit at all.

When the federal government pays PP to fund other things than abortion, the money they get from other resources goes to abortions. There is no possible way for them to separate all money that comes in. The federal money they get simply offsets their private donations and fees that do go to abortion. If not for federal money, they would't be able to use private money for abortions. They would have to use that money to fund their other services.

It's simple money laundering is what it is. Indirectly, yes, our federal tax dollars are funding PP abortions.

There is that logic, but then it can be applied to all things. Why do churches and non-profits like PP have tax breaks? Shouldn't they all pay full taxes just like everyone else?

As for the abortion issue, I support it. After all, it's mostly Democrats being aborted, isn't it? LOL

Again, the best way to prevent abortions is to prevent unwanted pregnancies. Who helps the most with that concept?

So you don't want church and state separate?



Or you just want their money?




What is it?




.

 

[Dr Grump]

[

Why should Planned Parenthood be funded is the better question? Why should immigration be stopped? Because they are coming here taking our jobs. Because they are lowering the pay scale for Americans. Because Mexicans are turning our nation into a bilingual country. Because many here broke our laws. Because we have record amount of drug overdoses in this country (over 50,000 Americans in 2016) Because they are making money here and sending billions across the border.

Any other questions?

Oh, so you only want Mexican immigration stopped. They only do those jobs because nobody else will.
What is wrong with being a bilingual country? What has drug overdoses got to do with anything? They will happen with or without immigration.

 

[Dr Grump]

I've not noticed any terrorists being based in Venezuela. Would you kindly cite where Catholics, Protestants or Mormons have launched fatal terrorist attacks on other countries?

Are you a white American male?

 

[Dr Grump]

Who said immigration should be stopped? Please try to be specific.

.

Follow the thread..

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

[

Why should Planned Parenthood be funded is the better question? Why should immigration be stopped? Because they are coming here taking our jobs. Because they are lowering the pay scale for Americans. Because Mexicans are turning our nation into a bilingual country. Because many here broke our laws. Because we have record amount of drug overdoses in this country (over 50,000 Americans in 2016) Because they are making money here and sending billions across the border.

Any other questions?

Oh, so you only want Mexican immigration stopped. They only do those jobs because nobody else will.
What is wrong with being a bilingual country? What has drug overdoses got to do with anything? They will happen with or without immigration.

No, much of our drugs are coming across that border. We need some kind of wall to make that much more difficult. What's wrong with being a bilingual country? Nothing if the people of that country choose to, but not because other people are coming here forcing us to.

But there lies the problem: If you come to America, then come here to be an American. Don't come here and try to turn us into the place you left. You do things our way, speak our language, assimilate into American society. If you are too lazy to do that, then STF out of our country. We like things the way they are, and we don't need you coming here and changing any of it.

If there are jobs Americans won't do, then that's what forces industry to pay more to attract American workers. If they don't, then they can do without labor or invest in automation. As long as we give industry a way out of paying higher wages, they will continue paying low wages, and that's just not good for our country.

I'm a truck driver and I see the problems we have on the road with these foreign drivers. They are on our roads not being able to speak or read a word of English. They are driving 75,000 pound vehicles right next to your minivan with your family. They are terrible drivers to boot. But worse than that is they are keeping our wages down. Close the border. We don't need these people (legal or illegal) here.

 

[CowboyTed]

Seriously. This toxic partisan political culture is poisoning civil society.

What the hell is wrong with us?

The left and the right pulling hair and screeching their bumpersticker slogans and broad brush pig ignorant partisan blamegaming? What's wrong with us?

I'm no youngster. I've never seen such a dangerous ambient.

We have someone shooting at one of our few remaining bipartisan non political fun charitable events because he wants to kill a bunch of (insert political party).

The rhetoric flooding the country is poisoning us. And no one wants to take responsibility for stepping up and saying "enough already". For changing it.

Our representatives are colleagues first and foremost. Political opponents second. They recognize it. That violence against one is violence against the others and against our very institutions. Why are we unable to recognize that?

It's a damn shame that our president play such a big role in the hatred and isn't the leader we need to heal the wounds.

He's a sucko piece of crap president BUT he is OUR elected representative. His office does stand for something and that includes basic respect. If he's not the leader to heal wounds - WE HAVE TO BE. We can't just crawl around crying and blaming and damaging our society and blaming the election. We CAN'T allow OUR rhetoric to energize our wingnuts into unspeakable actions because we have a p.o.s. president.

Coyote,

Entrenchment has started, sides can go to there bias confirmation news source which has no obligation to balance the news with any facts. Fox News actually sued to have the right to lie to their audience. The right has RINOs and the Left have the Left Nazi crowd, this is tribal and to win we have to be more partisan that the next...

The News Media used to be a loss leader but now has invented a hype business 'Fight, Fight Fight....' ... That is the biggest difference between British & Irish News and US News... First is credibility, if you lie then you own up and confess and say sorry... Doubling down just has interviewers from all sides continually beating with you for months and that is the way it should be...
Saying stupid stuff too right or left is ridiculed, facts matter, compromise is not a dirty word.

Look at the treatment of Mueller in the last week... Certain elements have been attacking him without cause.. No findings but discredit him before he starts... Mueller is a by the book FBI guy, there is nothing there but attacks have rained in on him...

 

[ScienceRocks]

I trust cnn, msnbc, cbs, nbc and abc far before I trust the fake news like Fox, talk radio and right wing blogs that are nothing more then a joke. How the hell can anyone compare the moderate media that has been around for 60 years to the joke that is right wing trash???

 

[CowboyTed]

[

Why should Planned Parenthood be funded is the better question? Why should immigration be stopped? Because they are coming here taking our jobs. Because they are lowering the pay scale for Americans. Because Mexicans are turning our nation into a bilingual country. Because many here broke our laws. Because we have record amount of drug overdoses in this country (over 50,000 Americans in 2016) Because they are making money here and sending billions across the border.

Any other questions?

Oh, so you only want Mexican immigration stopped. They only do those jobs because nobody else will.
What is wrong with being a bilingual country? What has drug overdoses got to do with anything? They will happen with or without immigration.

No, much of our drugs are coming across that border. We need some kind of wall to make that much more difficult. What's wrong with being a bilingual country? Nothing if the people of that country choose to, but not because other people are coming here forcing us to.

But there lies the problem: If you come to America, then come here to be an American. Don't come here and try to turn us into the place you left. You do things our way, speak our language, assimilate into American society. If you are too lazy to do that, then STF out of our country. We like things the way they are, and we don't need you coming here and changing any of it.

If there are jobs Americans won't do, then that's what forces industry to pay more to attract American workers. If they don't, then they can do without labor or invest in automation. As long as we give industry a way out of paying higher wages, they will continue paying low wages, and that's just not good for our country.

I'm a truck driver and I see the problems we have on the road with these foreign drivers. They are on our roads not being able to speak or read a word of English. They are driving 75,000 pound vehicles right next to your minivan with your family. They are terrible drivers to boot. But worse than that is they are keeping our wages down. Close the border. We don't need these people (legal or illegal) here.

As for the wages... You can buy your good from companies that only use American Drivers... Why don't you rely on market forces to decide who can drive or not...

 

[CowboyTed]

[

Why should Planned Parenthood be funded is the better question? Why should immigration be stopped? Because they are coming here taking our jobs. Because they are lowering the pay scale for Americans. Because Mexicans are turning our nation into a bilingual country. Because many here broke our laws. Because we have record amount of drug overdoses in this country (over 50,000 Americans in 2016) Because they are making money here and sending billions across the border.

Any other questions?

Oh, so you only want Mexican immigration stopped. They only do those jobs because nobody else will.
What is wrong with being a bilingual country? What has drug overdoses got to do with anything? They will happen with or without immigration.

No, much of our drugs are coming across that border. We need some kind of wall to make that much more difficult. What's wrong with being a bilingual country? Nothing if the people of that country choose to, but not because other people are coming here forcing us to.

But there lies the problem: If you come to America, then come here to be an American. Don't come here and try to turn us into the place you left. You do things our way, speak our language, assimilate into American society. If you are too lazy to do that, then STF out of our country. We like things the way they are, and we don't need you coming here and changing any of it.

If there are jobs Americans won't do, then that's what forces industry to pay more to attract American workers. If they don't, then they can do without labor or invest in automation. As long as we give industry a way out of paying higher wages, they will continue paying low wages, and that's just not good for our country.

I'm a truck driver and I see the problems we have on the road with these foreign drivers. They are on our roads not being able to speak or read a word of English. They are driving 75,000 pound vehicles right next to your minivan with your family. They are terrible drivers to boot. But worse than that is they are keeping our wages down. Close the border. We don't need these people (legal or illegal) here.

Immigration is just a form of Government Regulation on the workforce... Should not the Market decide... Only communists want to tell our businesses who the can and can't hire. Why so much red tape from government bureaucrats?

As speaking other language, half the languages in the world are spoken on a daily basis in US. Why are you using it as an excuse for Business not to hire the cheapest labour... Ray you say let the market decide when it comes to Healthcare, now you are all out of tune...

 

[Weatherman2020]

Seriously. This toxic partisan political culture is poisoning civil society.

What the hell is wrong with us?

The left and the right pulling hair and screeching their bumpersticker slogans and broad brush pig ignorant partisan blamegaming? What's wrong with us?

I'm no youngster. I've never seen such a dangerous ambient.

We have someone shooting at one of our few remaining bipartisan non political fun charitable events because he wants to kill a bunch of (insert political party).

The rhetoric flooding the country is poisoning us. And no one wants to take responsibility for stepping up and saying "enough already". For changing it.

Our representatives are colleagues first and foremost. Political opponents second. They recognize it. That violence against one is violence against the others and against our very institutions. Why are we unable to recognize that?

So where is the condemnation of the left justifying the shooting?

The left are too busy justifying it.
And the silence of the left over their statements is passive approval.

Scott Pelley of CBS: It’s time to ask whether [Wednesday’s] attack was foreseeable, predictable, self-inflicted.

and
MSNBC Host Suggests Rep. Steve Scalise Deserved To Be Shot Due To Conservative Record

 

[Pogo]

Your desperation is duly noted.

Each state, in addition to the Governor also has a House and Senate who also represent the various districts around the state.

And the nation has Congress. No shit. But the state legislature DOES NOT ELECT THE GOVERNOR. The People do that. Are you too dense to follow the analogy or what?

We'd have chaos and a total revolt. If twelve cities/states controlled the presidential election.

Twelve states or so already do control the presidential election. Don't you get it?? That's why that handful of states -- the so-called "battleground" states which is an absolute bullshit concept that plainly would not exist were it not for the destructive WTA system -- get all the candidates' attention. Nobody campaigns in Wyoming. Nobody campaigns in New York. And absolutely nobody campaigns in Alaska and Hawaìi. Because they don't NEED to.

That's not holding an election --- that's in effect racketeering.