High court authorizes routine DNA collection

[Synthaholic]

...there was that awful scifi movie a couple of years ago, where there was a means to identify who would commit a crime before it occured, and then the govt terminated that person.

Yeah, Minority Report with Tom Cruise. Actually, I thought it was pretty good; thought-provoking and a great greenhouse scene, a gene-splice scientist woman who has her houseplants trained as guardplants. Now THERE's DNA manipulation.

Spielberg. His best, after Schindler's List.

 

[EriktheRed]

???

An odd thing to post.

Scalia is a constitutionalist. He supports the Constitution in virtually every ruling.

Generally there are 5 justices who side with the Constitution, and 4 who oppose it. This was a bit odd - but then with an arrest the case for 4th amendment protection is questionable - when fingerprints were challenged, arrest was ruled a defacto warrant.

There is nothing strange about it. Scalia thinks the constitution allows the government to regulate what people do in private.

Didn't he write the majority opinion on cops no longer needing a warrant to knock down your front door?

He was definitely one of the more vocal dissenters in the ruling that struck down state sodomy laws.

 

[Synthaholic]

Why would anyone object unless they have something to hide?

 

[Locke11_21]

This is a case of not who is right or wrong, but what is right or wrong. While I rarely agree with justices Kagan, Sotomayor and Ginsberg, they along with Scalia looked out for and protected our rights and liberties. Props to Kagan, Sotomayor, Ginsberg and Scalia for doing their best in this case.

I extend my middle finger to Breyer, Roberts, Thomas, Kennedy and Alito for giving America the middle finger and moving us yet one step closer to a police state. I would love nothing more than to see the left, the right and in between pressure congress to impeach Justice Roberts.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Why would anyone object unless they have something to hide?

Why would anyone think an argument like this makes sense?

 

[Synthaholic]

Why would anyone object unless they have something to hide?

Why would anyone think an argument like this makes sense?

I think he was being facetious.

 

[thereisnospoon]

That is true but not accurate.
For example, per legal precedent we do not have the right to remain silent when upon a traffic stop a police officer asks routine basic questions, such as, do you know why I stopped you?...Or, are you the owner of this vehicle? What is your name and address?

Of course you do.

Doing so is not in your best interest, as an infraction would lead to detention and perhaps arrest. But you have every right to remain silent and will never be charged for doing so.

Or if taken to a police station for an interview as a person of interest or witness.
Maranda only applies to those placed under arrest. It is at that point the Maranda Warning is to be given. Not before.

Miranda, which has been overturned, merely requires that the police inform you of your rights. It has no bearing on actual rights, which are confirmed in the Constitution. I don't need to be told by a cop that I have a right to free speech in order to have that right - nor do I need a cop to tell me that I have 5th amendment rights to have those.

You have zero obligation to talk to the police at any time.



Miranda informs, does not confer, rights. The only question is what will or will not be admitted. Cops using a sap or telephone book to beat a confession out of a suspect will still have difficulty getting the confession admitted should they get caught.

If a person is not under arrest, police can use deceptive methods, such as offering liquid refreshment with the idea of collecting DNA.

Which is why a person should NEVER talk to the police. The police are a hostile entity with an agenda detrimental to the well being of the citizenry.

Or if in a search of a crime victim's premises, hair, blood, saliva and other bodily fluids are collected without a warrant. No warrant is required. DNA samples may be collected from these substances. I think the SCOTUS ruled in the case that DNA is equivalent to a finger print.

I keep a notice on my gun safe that permission is NOT granted for search and that entry into the residence is an act of trespass, citing California Criminal Code.

The cops are just another criminal street gang.

"Of course you do.

Doing so is not in your best interest, as an infraction would lead to detention and perhaps arrest. But you have every right to remain silent and will never be charged for doing so. "
There is case law that disagrees with you. A recent case just decided the question as to what a police officer may ask and when he or she may ask.
It was decided that asking a person to identify themselves is an ordinary request and not covered under Miranda.
North Carolina General Statute...HB 414 subsection 20-49.4
When on duty, upon reasonable belief that any vehicle is being
2 operated in violation of any provision of this Article or of any other
3 law regulating the operation of vehicles to require the driver thereof to
4 stop and exhibit his driver's license and the registration card issued for
5 the vehicle, and submit to an inspection of such vehicle, the
6 registration plates and registration card thereon or to an inspection and
7 test of the equipment of such vehicle.

The police are just another criminal street gang...Until the douchebag down the street throws a nasty ass wild party that keep you up past 2 am on a night when you have to go to work the next morning.
Or until some idiot crashes into you car and takes off. Or until someone burglarizes your home while you were on vacation.
Come on.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

That is true but not accurate.
For example, per legal precedent we do not have the right to remain silent when upon a traffic stop a police officer asks routine basic questions, such as, do you know why I stopped you?...Or, are you the owner of this vehicle? What is your name and address?

Of course you do.

Doing so is not in your best interest, as an infraction would lead to detention and perhaps arrest. But you have every right to remain silent and will never be charged for doing so.



Miranda, which has been overturned, merely requires that the police inform you of your rights. It has no bearing on actual rights, which are confirmed in the Constitution. I don't need to be told by a cop that I have a right to free speech in order to have that right - nor do I need a cop to tell me that I have 5th amendment rights to have those.

You have zero obligation to talk to the police at any time.



Miranda informs, does not confer, rights. The only question is what will or will not be admitted. Cops using a sap or telephone book to beat a confession out of a suspect will still have difficulty getting the confession admitted should they get caught.



Which is why a person should NEVER talk to the police. The police are a hostile entity with an agenda detrimental to the well being of the citizenry.

Or if in a search of a crime victim's premises, hair, blood, saliva and other bodily fluids are collected without a warrant. No warrant is required. DNA samples may be collected from these substances. I think the SCOTUS ruled in the case that DNA is equivalent to a finger print.

I keep a notice on my gun safe that permission is NOT granted for search and that entry into the residence is an act of trespass, citing California Criminal Code.

The cops are just another criminal street gang.

"Of course you do.

Doing so is not in your best interest, as an infraction would lead to detention and perhaps arrest. But you have every right to remain silent and will never be charged for doing so. "
There is case law that disagrees with you. A recent case just decided the question as to what a police officer may ask and when he or she may ask.
It was decided that asking a person to identify themselves is an ordinary request and not covered under Miranda.
North Carolina General Statute...HB 414 subsection 20-49.4
When on duty, upon reasonable belief that any vehicle is being
2 operated in violation of any provision of this Article or of any other
3 law regulating the operation of vehicles to require the driver thereof to
4 stop and exhibit his driver's license and the registration card issued for
5 the vehicle, and submit to an inspection of such vehicle, the
6 registration plates and registration card thereon or to an inspection and
7 test of the equipment of such vehicle.

The police are just another criminal street gang...Until the douchebag down the street throws a nasty ass wild party that keep you up past 2 am on a night when you have to go to work the next morning.
Or until some idiot crashes into you car and takes off. Or until someone burglarizes your home while you were on vacation.
Come on.

Showing a Drivers license is not the same as answering a question.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Of course you do.

Doing so is not in your best interest, as an infraction would lead to detention and perhaps arrest. But you have every right to remain silent and will never be charged for doing so.



Miranda, which has been overturned, merely requires that the police inform you of your rights. It has no bearing on actual rights, which are confirmed in the Constitution. I don't need to be told by a cop that I have a right to free speech in order to have that right - nor do I need a cop to tell me that I have 5th amendment rights to have those.

You have zero obligation to talk to the police at any time.



Miranda informs, does not confer, rights. The only question is what will or will not be admitted. Cops using a sap or telephone book to beat a confession out of a suspect will still have difficulty getting the confession admitted should they get caught.



Which is why a person should NEVER talk to the police. The police are a hostile entity with an agenda detrimental to the well being of the citizenry.

I keep a notice on my gun safe that permission is NOT granted for search and that entry into the residence is an act of trespass, citing California Criminal Code.

The cops are just another criminal street gang.

"Of course you do.

Doing so is not in your best interest, as an infraction would lead to detention and perhaps arrest. But you have every right to remain silent and will never be charged for doing so. "
There is case law that disagrees with you. A recent case just decided the question as to what a police officer may ask and when he or she may ask.
It was decided that asking a person to identify themselves is an ordinary request and not covered under Miranda.
North Carolina General Statute...HB 414 subsection 20-49.4
When on duty, upon reasonable belief that any vehicle is being
2 operated in violation of any provision of this Article or of any other
3 law regulating the operation of vehicles to require the driver thereof to
4 stop and exhibit his driver's license and the registration card issued for
5 the vehicle, and submit to an inspection of such vehicle, the
6 registration plates and registration card thereon or to an inspection and
7 test of the equipment of such vehicle.

The police are just another criminal street gang...Until the douchebag down the street throws a nasty ass wild party that keep you up past 2 am on a night when you have to go to work the next morning.
Or until some idiot crashes into you car and takes off. Or until someone burglarizes your home while you were on vacation.
Come on.

Showing a Drivers license is not the same as answering a question.

Correct. And most states, at least the ones I have researched, agree.
However, I am discussing the most simple questions. Those such as when a police officer asks a person they have stopped their name and address. The nature of their business at the time of the stop. These are not protected by Maranda.
In fact, if one is not carrying ID and refuses to self Identify, which is their right, that person is most likely going to be detained or even taken to a police station so that the person can be identified.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

"Of course you do.

Doing so is not in your best interest, as an infraction would lead to detention and perhaps arrest. But you have every right to remain silent and will never be charged for doing so. "
There is case law that disagrees with you. A recent case just decided the question as to what a police officer may ask and when he or she may ask.
It was decided that asking a person to identify themselves is an ordinary request and not covered under Miranda.
North Carolina General Statute...HB 414 subsection 20-49.4
When on duty, upon reasonable belief that any vehicle is being
2 operated in violation of any provision of this Article or of any other
3 law regulating the operation of vehicles to require the driver thereof to
4 stop and exhibit his driver's license and the registration card issued for
5 the vehicle, and submit to an inspection of such vehicle, the
6 registration plates and registration card thereon or to an inspection and
7 test of the equipment of such vehicle.

The police are just another criminal street gang...Until the douchebag down the street throws a nasty ass wild party that keep you up past 2 am on a night when you have to go to work the next morning.
Or until some idiot crashes into you car and takes off. Or until someone burglarizes your home while you were on vacation.
Come on.

Showing a Drivers license is not the same as answering a question.

Correct. And most states, at least the ones I have researched, agree.
However, I am discussing the most simple questions. Those such as when a police officer asks a person they have stopped their name and address. The nature of their business at the time of the stop. These are not protected by Maranda.
In fact, if one is not carrying ID and refuses to self Identify, which is their right, that person is most likely going to be detained or even taken to a police station so that the person can be identified.

If a cop stops me and asks for my name I can ask why he wants to know before I answer. If he does have a legitimate reason to ask I can walk away and all he can do is watch.

You seem to think Miranda is a magic spell,. all it involves is what police can ask you with the intent to use at trial. It has nothing to do with me invoking my right to remain silent every single time a police officer says hello.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Showing a Drivers license is not the same as answering a question.

Correct. And most states, at least the ones I have researched, agree.
However, I am discussing the most simple questions. Those such as when a police officer asks a person they have stopped their name and address. The nature of their business at the time of the stop. These are not protected by Maranda.
In fact, if one is not carrying ID and refuses to self Identify, which is their right, that person is most likely going to be detained or even taken to a police station so that the person can be identified.

If a cop stops me and asks for my name I can ask why he wants to know before I answer. If he does have a legitimate reason to ask I can walk away and all he can do is watch.

You seem to think Miranda is a magic spell,. all it involves is what police can ask you with the intent to use at trial. It has nothing to do with me invoking my right to remain silent every single time a police officer says hello.

You may do that.. However, the police officer will them judge you as being confrontational. And in the eyes of the law, the police officer is not wrong. That sets a progression of events which will go down the wrong road.
"It has nothing to do with me invoking my right to remain silent every single time a police officer says hello.".....
Sorry, in most states, you do not have that right.
If one refuses to identify one's self, the law permits the police to detain that person until their identity is known.
Question...Why on earth would anyone antagonize a police officer by refusing to give one's name. It's not logical.
Just tell officer your name and be on your way.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Of course you do.

Doing so is not in your best interest, as an infraction would lead to detention and perhaps arrest. But you have every right to remain silent and will never be charged for doing so.



Miranda, which has been overturned, merely requires that the police inform you of your rights. It has no bearing on actual rights, which are confirmed in the Constitution. I don't need to be told by a cop that I have a right to free speech in order to have that right - nor do I need a cop to tell me that I have 5th amendment rights to have those.

You have zero obligation to talk to the police at any time.



Miranda informs, does not confer, rights. The only question is what will or will not be admitted. Cops using a sap or telephone book to beat a confession out of a suspect will still have difficulty getting the confession admitted should they get caught.



Which is why a person should NEVER talk to the police. The police are a hostile entity with an agenda detrimental to the well being of the citizenry.

I keep a notice on my gun safe that permission is NOT granted for search and that entry into the residence is an act of trespass, citing California Criminal Code.

The cops are just another criminal street gang.

"Of course you do.

Doing so is not in your best interest, as an infraction would lead to detention and perhaps arrest. But you have every right to remain silent and will never be charged for doing so. "
There is case law that disagrees with you. A recent case just decided the question as to what a police officer may ask and when he or she may ask.
It was decided that asking a person to identify themselves is an ordinary request and not covered under Miranda.
North Carolina General Statute...HB 414 subsection 20-49.4
When on duty, upon reasonable belief that any vehicle is being
2 operated in violation of any provision of this Article or of any other
3 law regulating the operation of vehicles to require the driver thereof to
4 stop and exhibit his driver's license and the registration card issued for
5 the vehicle, and submit to an inspection of such vehicle, the
6 registration plates and registration card thereon or to an inspection and
7 test of the equipment of such vehicle.

The police are just another criminal street gang...Until the douchebag down the street throws a nasty ass wild party that keep you up past 2 am on a night when you have to go to work the next morning.
Or until some idiot crashes into you car and takes off. Or until someone burglarizes your home while you were on vacation.
Come on.

Showing a Drivers license is not the same as answering a question.

Sure it is...

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Correct. And most states, at least the ones I have researched, agree.
However, I am discussing the most simple questions. Those such as when a police officer asks a person they have stopped their name and address. The nature of their business at the time of the stop. These are not protected by Maranda.
In fact, if one is not carrying ID and refuses to self Identify, which is their right, that person is most likely going to be detained or even taken to a police station so that the person can be identified.

If a cop stops me and asks for my name I can ask why he wants to know before I answer. If he does have a legitimate reason to ask I can walk away and all he can do is watch.

You seem to think Miranda is a magic spell,. all it involves is what police can ask you with the intent to use at trial. It has nothing to do with me invoking my right to remain silent every single time a police officer says hello.

You may do that.. However, the police officer will them judge you as being confrontational. And in the eyes of the law, the police officer is not wrong. That sets a progression of events which will go down the wrong road.
"It has nothing to do with me invoking my right to remain silent every single time a police officer says hello.".....
Sorry, in most states, you do not have that right.
If one refuses to identify one's self, the law permits the police to detain that person until their identity is known.
Question...Why on earth would anyone antagonize a police officer by refusing to give one's name. It's not logical.
Just tell officer your name and be on your way.

Question, why on Earth wouldn't people antagonize police? It keeps them honest, and keeps our rights intact.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

"Of course you do.

Doing so is not in your best interest, as an infraction would lead to detention and perhaps arrest. But you have every right to remain silent and will never be charged for doing so. "
There is case law that disagrees with you. A recent case just decided the question as to what a police officer may ask and when he or she may ask.
It was decided that asking a person to identify themselves is an ordinary request and not covered under Miranda.
North Carolina General Statute...HB 414 subsection 20-49.4
When on duty, upon reasonable belief that any vehicle is being
2 operated in violation of any provision of this Article or of any other
3 law regulating the operation of vehicles to require the driver thereof to
4 stop and exhibit his driver's license and the registration card issued for
5 the vehicle, and submit to an inspection of such vehicle, the
6 registration plates and registration card thereon or to an inspection and
7 test of the equipment of such vehicle.

The police are just another criminal street gang...Until the douchebag down the street throws a nasty ass wild party that keep you up past 2 am on a night when you have to go to work the next morning.
Or until some idiot crashes into you car and takes off. Or until someone burglarizes your home while you were on vacation.
Come on.

Showing a Drivers license is not the same as answering a question.

Sure it is...

No it is not.

If I am driving a car I need to show a license to verify that I have legal permission to drive.

By the way, if I do not have a license it does not give the cop the right to beat the crap out of me.

 

[Murhy]

Im not sure how this has turned into what police officers can or can not do....because its just irrelevant to the op....however...to clear it all up....police officers can basically do whatever they want....and unfortunately for us, about 60% of cops are assholes that just want a gun a badge and a name, (20% want to be awesome and just uphold the law like they are supposed to do, and the other 20% just need the job.) and the only way that you are going to keep your "rights," is to film that cop from start to finish, otherwise they are going to take a big steamer on the first and fourth amendment, and you're going to be wondering what happened.....some people still think that the justice system is on their side..

 

[paulitician]

Faith in Government and our Supreme Court is rapidly slipping away. Clearly, the NWO Globalists have seized our Supreme Court. So who or what do the People turn to when all faith is lost? I guess we'll see.