Here are the “rich” Mamdani wants to tax

[ColonelAngus]

Actually, I am more so Libertarian than politically left and I do have in mind a way to save the USA Dollar and pay off the USA national debt that I believe is really based on a pack of many century old lies that only the officials at BigBanking have the wisdom and the ability to keep overly productive USA Citizens from destroying the environment with their astonishing productive capability.

The problem with my theory is that I must admit that these Neo-Malthusians are NOT one hundred percent in error, the USA worker is indeed astonishingly productive and the productivity of USA workers does, to at least some degree, threaten the environment.

Zone1 Thread 'Reverse Engineering of a Real Estate Boom and Paying off the USA national debt?'

Yesterday at 9:11 AM

For about fifty of my sixty six years I have been rather obsessively studying Theology, Spirituality and especially near death experience accounts.

I believe that the gifted Pastor David Wilkerson in 1973 was given a prediction for the future of the USA that theoretically can be Reverse Engineered?

[Pastor David Wilkerson] :

"There will be a sudden rush to buy farms, ranches, and homes in the country.

Thousands will attempt to flee from cities, hoping that a return to the land and
nature will provide security. There will be a growing urge to "get away from it
all"---and much money...

• DennisPTate
• Replies: 0
• Forum: Clean Debate Zone

We CAN pay it down by having an export surplus.

We can export energy.

One of the dumbest ideas is A faster-growing population fueled by immigration could also create more demand for everything from housing to cars to dishwashers. This could result in a stronger economy that can help pay down the debt.

That bullshit is actually out there.

What will happen is that the USA will cease to be bolstered by the petro dollar and hyper inflation will render the dollar worthless, and thereby basically eliminating debt.

We are not going to reduce social programs. We are not going to reduce military spending. We will not introduce a federal sales tax.

The debt number does not matter at this point, because the USA has no intention of reducing it.

 

[DennisPTate]

We CAN pay it down by having an export surplus.

We can export energy.

One of the dumbest ideas is A faster-growing population fueled by immigration could also create more demand for everything from housing to cars to dishwashers. This could result in a stronger economy that can help pay down the debt.

That bullshit is actually out there.

What will happen is that the USA will cease to be bolstered by the petro dollar and hyper inflation will render the dollar worthless, and thereby basically eliminating debt.

We are not going to reduce social programs. We are not going to reduce military spending. We will not introduce a federal sales tax.

The debt number does not matter at this point, because the USA has no intention of reducing it.

In a way you are correct but you would be dependent on some nation, somewhere having an intelligent and ethical central banking policy that does not leave ninety nine percent of money creation to privately own BigBanks who create more and more and more Compound Interest Over Time owing on all the loans that they put into the economy.

I believe that President Abraham Lincoln showed how money can be created in a way that benefits USA taxpayers.

 

[Woodznutz]

I don’t think that makes a lot of sense.

Stepping up the basis is for the inheritors. It doesn’t have much to do with the estate.

If you step up the cost basis to current market value, there is no tax owed on the inherited property. Cost basis is predicated on replacement cost or current market value.

The increased monetary value of a property doesn't change the nature of the property, just the inflated price. All the higher price is doing is keeping up with the inflated value of the currency. There is no real "gain" from the inflated value.

 

[Woodznutz]

I believe that President Abraham Lincoln showed how money can be created in a way that benefits USA taxpayers.

Many believe he was killed for that reason.

 

[Marener]

If you step up the cost basis to current market value, there is no tax owed on the inherited property. Cost basis is predicated on replacement value or current market value.

When it comes to federal and NY state estate tax, the inheritors don’t pay the taxes, the estate does.

The estate pays taxes based on the fair market value of the property.

Once the estate transfers the assets to the inheritors, the cost basis is stepped up to fair market value.

They’re separate issues.

 

[Dorian Mode]

The OTHER thing is I’d rather CHOOSE where my money goes, rather than leave it to an increasingly socialist government that will use it to keep people on welfare.

My will lists charities I care about. I’d rather my money to to Alzheimer’s research, the poor abused animals, and a couple of others.

I wouldn't get too worked up about this. It seems more like political posturing before a midterm than reality. Reality tells me there is no way leftist politicians would ever bite the hands that feed them. We've had 8 years of Clinton, 8 years Of Obama and 4 of Joe Biden and during those years the wealth of the middle class shrunk and the wealth of the elite class grew significantly all while the socialist rhetoric grew even more. Leftist politicians "say" things to get stupid people to believe their BS so they'll vote for them, but then after the election they do the complete opposite and return to their preferred form of government: Kleptocracy. Let me remind you and everyone else here with a 3 digit IQ: Don't listen to politicians, watch them. Politicians never tell the truth. Actions never lie.

 

[Woodznutz]

When it comes to federal and NY state estate tax, the inheritors don’t pay the taxes, the estate does.

The estate pays taxes based on the fair market value of the property.

Once the estate transfers the assets to the inheritors, the cost basis is stepped up to fair market value.

They’re separate issues.

I see a distinction without a difference here.

What is the mechanism by which NY state collects the inheritance taxes? How is the estate actually taxed and how are the taxes collected? It seems that part of the property must be either sold or indebted in order to pay the tax before it is released to the heirs. Does the property go into probate or receivership upon the death of the owners?

 

[Marener]

I see a distinction without a difference here.

What is the mechanism by which NY state collects the inheritance taxes? How is the estate actually taxed and how are the taxes collected? It seems that part of the property must be either sold or indebted in order to pay the tax before it is released to the heirs. Does the property go into probate or receivership upon the death of the owners?

The estate is a separate legal entity and would be in probate until it’s settled.

The point is how or whether you ever tax the capital gains on property when it’s inherited.

If you step up the basis and don’t have an estate tax, then the capital gains from the estate are entirely lost to taxation. Sounds great except it would allow wealthy families to get way wealthier.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

I wouldn't get too worked up about this. It seems more like political posturing before a midterm than reality. Reality tells me there is no way leftist politicians would ever bite the hands that feed them. We've had 8 years of Clinton, 8 years Of Obama and 4 of Joe Biden and during those years the wealth of the middle class shrunk and the wealth of the elite class grew significantly all while the socialist rhetoric grew even more. Leftist politicians "say" things to get stupid people to believe their BS so they'll vote for them, but then after the election they do the complete opposite and return to their preferred form of government: Kleptocracy. Let me remind you and everyone else here with a 3 digit IQ: Don't listen to politicians, watch them. Politicians never tell the truth. Actions never lie.

Covid was weaponized in order to engineer a massive transfer of wealth from the middle class to the elites unprecedented in American history. Every leftist in this forum was all for it as they supported shutting down small business so as to enrich the technocrats and the multi-national conglomerates.


.........while claiming that they stood for the little guy, no less.

 

[ColonelAngus]

In a way you are correct but you would be dependent on some nation, somewhere having an intelligent and ethical central banking policy that does not leave ninety nine percent of money creation to privately own BigBanks who create more and more and more Compound Interest Over Time owing on all the loans that they put into the economy.

I believe that President Abraham Lincoln showed how money can be created in a way that benefits USA taxpayers.

It would take a TRILLION DOLLAR surplus for 40 years to pay it off if we have no more budget deficits.

It is just not going to happen.

The people crying the Fed does not give away enough free crap will really be upset when the dollar collapses.

I have not seen any REAL empirical plan to eliminate or even REDUCE the debt.

 

[my2¢]

Mamdani believes New York hasn't sent enough of its old farts off to Florida?

 

[Dorian Mode]

Covid was weaponized in order to engineer a massive transfer of wealth from the middle class to the elites unprecedented in American history. Every leftist in this forum was all for it as they supported shutting down small business so as to enrich the technocrats and the multi-national conglomerates.


.........while claiming that they stood for the little guy, no less.

Absolutely true. And all it cost them was the 2024 election and they have to endure 4 more years of Trump. Don't forget the massive increase in inflation that started soon after Biden entered the WH. Note that the rich can hedge for inflation and even make money on the way up, like the banking industry, but the middle class and the poor can't. Biden was a career establishment politician who worked tirelessly for the wealthy donor class. But try and tell that to a dumocrap and all they can say is Biden is one of us, not a racist, and never benefitted himself or his family with his influence. Ditto for Obama. The first black POTUS made life harder for the black community and that's when the black community started paying attention to Trump.

 

[Woodznutz]

The estate is a separate legal entity and would be in probate until it’s settled.

The point is how or whether you ever tax the capital gains on property when it’s inherited.

If you step up the basis and don’t have an estate tax, then the capital gains from the estate are entirely lost to taxation. Sounds great except it would allow wealthy families to get way wealthier.

Anything above $7.14 million is taxed in NY, and taxes on large estates can reach 16 percent, so the very rich don't escape.

 

[Woodznutz]

When it comes to federal and NY state estate tax, the inheritors don’t pay the taxes, the estate does.

The estate pays taxes based on the fair market value of the property.

Once the estate transfers the assets to the inheritors, the cost basis is stepped up to fair market value.

They’re separate issues.

Separate issues but the same pot of money.

 

[Marener]

Anything above $7.14 million is taxed in NY, and taxes on large estates can reach 16 percent, so the very rich don't escape.

I was responding to another poster who suggested there should be no estate tax whatsoever.

To me, that’s only defensible if you get rid of the step up basis on inheritances.

 

[BackAgain]

It would take a TRILLION DOLLAR surplus for 40 years to pay it off if we have no more budget deficits.

It is just not going to happen.

The people crying the Fed does not give away enough free crap will really be upset when the dollar collapses.

I have not seen any REAL empirical plan to eliminate or even REDUCE the debt.

Our disgraceful debt problem is at or very near to the top of the list of matters in which our government’s inaction could yield our doom.

The debt endangers all of us in terms of our national defense. It is akin to a weed that will once could be simply pulled from the grass. Now the weeds have taken over the lawn

 

[Concerned American]

Great. Let's talk about that home. What did they pay for it? $80,000. Let's make it $100,000. We got a $700,000 capital gain. At 20%, that is $140,000. Married, sell the damn place, get the $500,000 home capital gains exemption, shave a hundred grand on that tax bill.

They leave the house to the kids. They are only $50,000 over the exemption. So what, the kids can't come up with ten grand for $800,000? If that is the case, damn Skippy it ought to go to the state.

So the state can fritter it away plus. SMFH

 

[Woodznutz]

I was responding to another poster who suggested there should be no estate tax whatsoever.

To me, that’s only defensible if you get rid of the step up basis on inheritances.

If there's no inheritance tax the step up is a moot point.

To the extent that inheritance taxes are used to benefit the undeserving then there should be no inheritance tax. Why punish success and reward failure.

 

[Marener]

If there's no inheritance tax the step up is a moot point.

To the extent that inheritance taxes are used to benefit the undeserving then there should be no inheritance tax. Why punish success and reward failure.

Not at all. You could elect to maintain the step up basis and eliminate all estate and inheritance taxes, which would let massive amounts of capital gains go completely untaxed.

 

[Dorian Mode]

Our disgraceful debt problem is at or very near to the top of the list of matters in which our government’s inaction could yield our doom.

The debt endangers all of us in terms of our national defense. It is akin to a weed that will once could be simply pulled from the grass. Now the weeds have taken over the lawn

Everyone said this when the debt went over 10 trillion. My guess is they will say this when it goes over 50 trillion. But that doesn't mean we should embrace public debt. In fact, wise people should wonder why we even have a public debt in the first place. Why do we borrow money from the Fed instead of just print it ourselves? Anyway, this is a rhetorical question, but I encourage people to take a few hours off from hating Trump and research the battles that raged between the government and the bankers leading to the creation and closure of 2 central banks and the inevitable opening of a third. Remember, he who controls the money controls the world.