Harry Hopkins....Soviet Spy

[Camp]

Hopkins was misidentified as a spy by a former KGB agent who defected and was promoting a book. The agent "suspected" Hopkins was a spy based on a lecture he had heard 20 years before his defection by an agent who was making recollections over 20 years after WWII had ended. Oleg Gordievsky, the defecting agent, had no direct or empirical knowledge of Hopkin's or what the Verona documents designated as "Agent 19". He was a small child during WWII. The reference to Agent 19 which appeared in the declassified (1995) documents led to further claims that Hopkins was a spy.
Later indisputable evidence surfaced that cleared Hopkins and identified Laurence Duggan as "Agent 19.
These facts do not fit well with the conspiracy theory that Hopkins, the trusted aid to FDR, was a commie spy.
Interestingly, Gen. George C. Marshall commented that Hopkins would never be recognized for the invaluable service he provided the nation during WWII.

7. Isn't it interesting that you and the cadre of chumps believe all of the Liberal propaganda, in the face of mountains of evidence.


There is a fascinating book about the KGB, "The Sword and the Shield: The Mitrokhin Archive and the Secret History of the KGB," by Christopher Andrew and, Vasili Mitrokhin

......I've read it....have you?


Mitrokhin's documents showed that Hopkins had warned the Soviet ambassador that the FBI had learned through a bug it had placed in the home of Steve Nelson, a Soviet illegal agent, that Nelson was getting money from the embassy. He met (KGB head in USA) Ahkmerov from time to time, giving him information to send to Moscow and receiving secret messages from Stalin....Ray Wannall, former FBI assistant director for counter-intelligence, says he always suspected that Hopkins was a Soviet agent and that this is proof of his treachery.
seed-flame: 16 Venona Secrets, etc.



Here's the deal: if you are finally convinced of Hopkins' duplicity......you can run away and hide.
That's the pro forma of Liberals when they are embarrassed.

Mitrokhin had a specialty? Do you know what it was?

 

[PoliticalChic]

Harry Hopkins....Soviet Spy deserves an answer, which is "nope."

Good to see that you haven't eschewed your usual level of depth and insight.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Hopkins was misidentified as a spy by a former KGB agent who defected and was promoting a book. The agent "suspected" Hopkins was a spy based on a lecture he had heard 20 years before his defection by an agent who was making recollections over 20 years after WWII had ended. Oleg Gordievsky, the defecting agent, had no direct or empirical knowledge of Hopkin's or what the Verona documents designated as "Agent 19". He was a small child during WWII. The reference to Agent 19 which appeared in the declassified (1995) documents led to further claims that Hopkins was a spy.
Later indisputable evidence surfaced that cleared Hopkins and identified Laurence Duggan as "Agent 19.
These facts do not fit well with the conspiracy theory that Hopkins, the trusted aid to FDR, was a commie spy.
Interestingly, Gen. George C. Marshall commented that Hopkins would never be recognized for the invaluable service he provided the nation during WWII.

7. Isn't it interesting that you and the cadre of chumps believe all of the Liberal propaganda, in the face of mountains of evidence.


There is a fascinating book about the KGB, "The Sword and the Shield: The Mitrokhin Archive and the Secret History of the KGB," by Christopher Andrew and, Vasili Mitrokhin

......I've read it....have you?


Mitrokhin's documents showed that Hopkins had warned the Soviet ambassador that the FBI had learned through a bug it had placed in the home of Steve Nelson, a Soviet illegal agent, that Nelson was getting money from the embassy. He met (KGB head in USA) Ahkmerov from time to time, giving him information to send to Moscow and receiving secret messages from Stalin....Ray Wannall, former FBI assistant director for counter-intelligence, says he always suspected that Hopkins was a Soviet agent and that this is proof of his treachery.
seed-flame: 16 Venona Secrets, etc.



Here's the deal: if you are finally convinced of Hopkins' duplicity......you can run away and hide.
That's the pro forma of Liberals when they are embarrassed.

Mitrokhin had a specialty? Do you know what it was?

I know exactly what Mitrokhin was, and who he is.


The question was, have you read his book?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Harry Hopkins....Soviet Spy deserves an answer, which is "nope."

Jake Starkey, history buff deserves an answer, which is "dope"

More people in FDR White House reported to Stalin than to FDR

 

[Camp]

7. Isn't it interesting that you and the cadre of chumps believe all of the Liberal propaganda, in the face of mountains of evidence.


There is a fascinating book about the KGB, "The Sword and the Shield: The Mitrokhin Archive and the Secret History of the KGB," by Christopher Andrew and, Vasili Mitrokhin

......I've read it....have you?


Mitrokhin's documents showed that Hopkins had warned the Soviet ambassador that the FBI had learned through a bug it had placed in the home of Steve Nelson, a Soviet illegal agent, that Nelson was getting money from the embassy. He met (KGB head in USA) Ahkmerov from time to time, giving him information to send to Moscow and receiving secret messages from Stalin....Ray Wannall, former FBI assistant director for counter-intelligence, says he always suspected that Hopkins was a Soviet agent and that this is proof of his treachery.
seed-flame: 16 Venona Secrets, etc.



Here's the deal: if you are finally convinced of Hopkins' duplicity......you can run away and hide.
That's the pro forma of Liberals when they are embarrassed.

Mitrokhin had a specialty? Do you know what it was?

I know exactly what Mitrokhin was, and who he is.


The question was, have you read his book?

I don't think you know what Mitrokhin's specialty was. I didn't ask what he was or who he was. Yes, I read much of it when it was first published. I didn't want to fill my head with uncalled for disinformation so I put it down.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Expecting a 100% Correlation between Venona cables, McCarthy List and the complete list of Stalin's American spies is like expecting John Gotti to have kept meticulous records of all the people he had whacked and all the crimes his guys committed.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Mitrokhin had a specialty? Do you know what it was?

I know exactly what Mitrokhin was, and who he is.


The question was, have you read his book?

I don't think you know what Mitrokhin's specialty was. I didn't ask what he was or who he was. Yes, I read much of it when it was first published. I didn't want to fill my head with uncalled for disinformation so I put it down.

Two patterns have been established...

1. You have a problem with telling the truth.

2. You have strong opinions with no expertise to back them up.
When it comes to reading works covering the issues at hand, you have more excises as to why you haven't read them than the Kennedys have cousins.



In short, you are a waste of entirely good bytes.



You're dismissed.

 

[Camp]

I know exactly what Mitrokhin was, and who he is.


The question was, have you read his book?

I don't think you know what Mitrokhin's specialty was. I didn't ask what he was or who he was. Yes, I read much of it when it was first published. I didn't want to fill my head with uncalled for disinformation so I put it down.

Two patterns have been established...

1. You have a problem with telling the truth.

2. You have strong opinions with no expertise to back them up.
When it comes to reading works covering the issues at hand, you have more excises as to why you haven't read them than the Kennedys have cousins.



In short, you are a waste of entirely good bytes.



You're dismissed.

The patterns that were established long ago:

1. You are unable to make your case with normal historical sources used by scholars and historians and rely on propaganda put out by pundits and political commentators or distorted and twisted rhetorical interpretations of sources.

2. When challanged about alleged facts you resort to attacking the person asking the questions and hide from answering the question.

 

[SmedlyButler]

First I'll answer a question you pose towards the end of this poorly conceived and executed continuation of an attack on this quintessentially American political master. (Churchill called him "Lord Root of the Matter". In one of the volumes of his autobiography he said ths of Hopkins;
"There he sat, slim, frail, ill, but absolutely glowing with refined comprehension of the Cause. It was to be the defeat, ruin, and slaughter of Hitler, to the exclusion of all other purposes, loyalties, or aims. In the history of the United States few brighter flames have burned.
Harry Hopkins always went to the root of the matter. I have been present at several great international conferences, where twenty or more of the most important executive personages were gathered together. When the discussion flagged and all seemed baffled, it was on these occasions he would rap out the deadly question, "Surely, Mr. President, here is the point we have got to settle. Are we going to face it or not?" Faced it always was, and, being faced, was conquered. He was a true leader of men, and alike in ardour and in wisdom in times of crisis he has rarely been excelled. His love for the causes of the weak and poor was matched by his passion against tyranny, especially when tyranny was, for the time, triumphant."

The answer to your query "How am I doing so far"? would be a resounding, room rattling guffaw if it wasn't for the fact that your attack, a pathetically manufactured web of conspiracy and lies though it may be, is on a great American 68 years dead who is not here to throw truth back into your face.

To start with, your short bio does Hopkins a disservice. His influence and participation in the events of the mid 20th century are way broader and deeper than your short outline suggests, but that's not really the heart of the matter, this is;
. "The leading evidence that Hopkins was a spy for Joseph Stalin is presented by Herbert Romerstein and Eric Breindel in their 2000 book, "The Venona Secrets: Exposing Soviet Espionage and America's Traitor."

Every serious scholar since the revelations of the Vassiliev notebooks do not give any credence to their "evidence". I pointed this out in a previous post;
"These notebooks put a “case closed” end to the mystery of “19.” Source no. “19” was Laurence Duggan. Duggan had joined the State Department in 1930 and served as Latin American Division chief, 1935–37, and then chief of the Division of the American Republics (merger of the Latin American and Mexican Divisions). In 1940 he became a senior advisor to the Secretary of State on Latin America. He left the State Department in 1944. He was recruited as a Soviet spy in 1935 and remained an active source until he left the State Department". LINK:Hopkins was not Agent 19

I don't know why you keep repeating this disccredited slander.

Next: Where did you come up with this? "One of those groups, led by Lee Pressman, was established within the Department of Agriculture in late 1933, and Hopkins was a member"

Pressmen's own testimony before the House Un-American Activities Committee is clear;

Mr. PRESSMAN. I was asked to join [the Communist Party] by a man named Harold Ware. For the reasons which I have already indicated, I assented, and I joined with the group which had, in addition to myself, three other persons, all of whom at that time were in the Department of Agriculture.
.........
Mr. NIXON. .... Just so there will be absolute clarity of the record, as I understand, the records of this committee show that the three members of the group who were in the Department of Agriculture were John Abt, Nathan Witt, and Henry Collins?
Some back and forth about whether Collins was a member....
Mr. WOOD. I will ask you to name the other employee of the Department of Agriculture who was a member of the group.
Mr. PRESSMAN. The third person among the individuals who have been named as members of this group who was an employee of the Department of Agriculture when I was in 1934 was Charles Kramer.

Pressmen named Abt, Nathan Witt, and Kramer as the three other members of his group. LINK: HUAC Testimony

You seem to see some machiavellian nature in Hopkins relationship with FDR, really it's pretty simple;

Churchill again, "As FDR's point man or unofficial emissary, Winston Churchill held Hopkins in high esteem, once remarking, "He was the most faithful and perfect channel of communication between the president and me." Or, "Beloved by some--such as Churchill, who believed that Hopkins "always went to the root of the matter"--and was trusted by most--including the paranoid Stalin--there were nevertheless those who resented the influence of "the White House Rasputin."-David Roll

And then you really enter the twighlight zone. Emanuel M. Josephson? Really? The "paranoid's paranoid". e.g.;

"Josephson argues that almost half of all US presidents were drawn from the Roosevelt - Adams -Delano "dynasty" and the dynasty acquired ambitions to return the US to some kind of elected monarchy. FDR had absorbed from Germany the "Bismarxist ideology" and during his administration had entered alliance with the Rockefeller empire. This alliance, along with the long established naval interests of the Roosevelt-Delano branch of the dynasty, that accounts for US participation in the world wars and cold war."

Josephson is the archetype for the History as Conspiracy school. Check out his bibliography.
Maybe you should edit your copy and pastes a little better, leaving this out... 5. "Josephson, who was hardly an admirer of Roosevelt and his New Deal, lacks references for his allegations" might have been a good idea.

And Murray Garsson makes a fine star witness; God only knows what manipulation of reality went on between him and Josephson.

"After his release from prison, Murray Garsson was impoverished and subsisted on the charity of friends. For the last three weeks of his life, Garsson, destitute, lived in the reception room of Dr. Emanuel Josephson, 230 East 61st Street. Dr. Josephson prescribed barbiturates for Garsson. On March 7, 1957, Garsson was found unconscious at the foot of a staircase in the 61st Street building. He was taken to Bellevue Hospital, where he died a few days later. Milton Helpern, the chief medical examiner, performed an autopsy and determined the cause of death was brain hemorrhage, the result of a fall down a flight of stairs." LINK: Murray Garrson's pathetic life, and death

No human being is perfect, you can find fault in the most saintly among us. You have failed miserably even at this simple task. You should have followed my hint;

"And there's only one path that I've left open for you to take in your feverish desire to actually hang something out there that might negatively reflect on Hopkin's brilliant and honorable career. So find this minor footnote and exploit it to the best abilities of those you will C&P."

You didn't, and you've produced nothing except more impotent clawing at a great man's reputation.

 

[PoliticalChic]

First I'll answer a question you pose towards the end of this poorly conceived and executed continuation of an attack on this quintessentially American political master. (Churchill called him "Lord Root of the Matter". In one of the volumes of his autobiography he said ths of Hopkins;
"There he sat, slim, frail, ill, but absolutely glowing with refined comprehension of the Cause. It was to be the defeat, ruin, and slaughter of Hitler, to the exclusion of all other purposes, loyalties, or aims. In the history of the United States few brighter flames have burned.
Harry Hopkins always went to the root of the matter. I have been present at several great international conferences, where twenty or more of the most important executive personages were gathered together. When the discussion flagged and all seemed baffled, it was on these occasions he would rap out the deadly question, "Surely, Mr. President, here is the point we have got to settle. Are we going to face it or not?" Faced it always was, and, being faced, was conquered. He was a true leader of men, and alike in ardour and in wisdom in times of crisis he has rarely been excelled. His love for the causes of the weak and poor was matched by his passion against tyranny, especially when tyranny was, for the time, triumphant."

The answer to your query "How am I doing so far"? would be a resounding, room rattling guffaw if it wasn't for the fact that your attack, a pathetically manufactured web of conspiracy and lies though it may be, is on a great American 68 years dead who is not here to throw truth back into your face.

To start with, your short bio does Hopkins a disservice. His influence and participation in the events of the mid 20th century are way broader and deeper than your short outline suggests, but that's not really the heart of the matter, this is;
. "The leading evidence that Hopkins was a spy for Joseph Stalin is presented by Herbert Romerstein and Eric Breindel in their 2000 book, "The Venona Secrets: Exposing Soviet Espionage and America's Traitor."

Every serious scholar since the revelations of the Vassiliev notebooks do not give any credence to their "evidence". I pointed this out in a previous post;
"These notebooks put a “case closed” end to the mystery of “19.” Source no. “19” was Laurence Duggan. Duggan had joined the State Department in 1930 and served as Latin American Division chief, 1935–37, and then chief of the Division of the American Republics (merger of the Latin American and Mexican Divisions). In 1940 he became a senior advisor to the Secretary of State on Latin America. He left the State Department in 1944. He was recruited as a Soviet spy in 1935 and remained an active source until he left the State Department". LINK:Hopkins was not Agent 19

I don't know why you keep repeating this disccredited slander.

Next: Where did you come up with this? "One of those groups, led by Lee Pressman, was established within the Department of Agriculture in late 1933, and Hopkins was a member"

Pressmen's own testimony before the House Un-American Activities Committee is clear;

Mr. PRESSMAN. I was asked to join [the Communist Party] by a man named Harold Ware. For the reasons which I have already indicated, I assented, and I joined with the group which had, in addition to myself, three other persons, all of whom at that time were in the Department of Agriculture.
.........
Mr. NIXON. .... Just so there will be absolute clarity of the record, as I understand, the records of this committee show that the three members of the group who were in the Department of Agriculture were John Abt, Nathan Witt, and Henry Collins?
Some back and forth about whether Collins was a member....
Mr. WOOD. I will ask you to name the other employee of the Department of Agriculture who was a member of the group.
Mr. PRESSMAN. The third person among the individuals who have been named as members of this group who was an employee of the Department of Agriculture when I was in 1934 was Charles Kramer.

Pressmen named Abt, Nathan Witt, and Kramer as the three other members of his group. LINK: HUAC Testimony

You seem to see some machiavellian nature in Hopkins relationship with FDR, really it's pretty simple;

Churchill again, "As FDR's point man or unofficial emissary, Winston Churchill held Hopkins in high esteem, once remarking, "He was the most faithful and perfect channel of communication between the president and me." Or, "Beloved by some--such as Churchill, who believed that Hopkins "always went to the root of the matter"--and was trusted by most--including the paranoid Stalin--there were nevertheless those who resented the influence of "the White House Rasputin."-David Roll

And then you really enter the twighlight zone. Emanuel M. Josephson? Really? The "paranoid's paranoid". e.g.;

"Josephson argues that almost half of all US presidents were drawn from the Roosevelt - Adams -Delano "dynasty" and the dynasty acquired ambitions to return the US to some kind of elected monarchy. FDR had absorbed from Germany the "Bismarxist ideology" and during his administration had entered alliance with the Rockefeller empire. This alliance, along with the long established naval interests of the Roosevelt-Delano branch of the dynasty, that accounts for US participation in the world wars and cold war."

Josephson is the archetype for the History as Conspiracy school. Check out his bibliography.
Maybe you should edit your copy and pastes a little better, leaving this out... 5. "Josephson, who was hardly an admirer of Roosevelt and his New Deal, lacks references for his allegations" might have been a good idea.

And Murray Garsson makes a fine star witness; God only knows what manipulation of reality went on between him and Josephson.

"After his release from prison, Murray Garsson was impoverished and subsisted on the charity of friends. For the last three weeks of his life, Garsson, destitute, lived in the reception room of Dr. Emanuel Josephson, 230 East 61st Street. Dr. Josephson prescribed barbiturates for Garsson. On March 7, 1957, Garsson was found unconscious at the foot of a staircase in the 61st Street building. He was taken to Bellevue Hospital, where he died a few days later. Milton Helpern, the chief medical examiner, performed an autopsy and determined the cause of death was brain hemorrhage, the result of a fall down a flight of stairs." LINK: Murray Garrson's pathetic life, and death

No human being is perfect, you can find fault in the most saintly among us. You have failed miserably even at this simple task. You should have followed my hint;

"And there's only one path that I've left open for you to take in your feverish desire to actually hang something out there that might negatively reflect on Hopkin's brilliant and honorable career. So find this minor footnote and exploit it to the best abilities of those you will C&P."

You didn't, and you've produced nothing except more impotent clawing at a great man's reputation.

I didn't read your post yet, Smugly, but look forward to doing so shortly.

I just came back to the thread to post another significant piece of the puzzle in exposing Harry Hopkins.


Serendipity....I generally spend time between posting in reading and studying...and, as luck would have it I went to chapter seven of Chesly Manly's " The Twenty Year Revolution."

The following gives insight into the motives of Soviet agent, Harry Hopkins.


"Harry Hopkins, Roosevelt's alter ego, was the most powerful individual in the government because of his singular, almost hypnotic influence upon the President.

Even before the United States formally entered the war, Hopkins made it clear that he saw the struggle as a world revolution. In an article published in the American Magazine in July, 1941, he wrote:

"This is not only a fight for freedom of speech, religion and assembly. It is a fight for economic freedom for the people of the world, a fight to fulfill in this generation all that our fathers fought and strove for in the last 200 years. . . When a democratic victory is won, then the great wealth of the world must be shared with all people."

Manly, "The Twenty Year Revolution," p.95.




You wrote this:
"Harry Hopkins was a true patriot who labored through the period in question sick with cancer but tirelessly for America and the World."

Yes...but the world he fought for was a Soviet world, and a Soviet America, complete with gulags and genocide.

Every communist from Marx on has the deepest of beliefs that no number of executions, slaughters, genocides must stand in the way of world domination.
This applies to Harry Hopkins, as well.

This is your icon?


Not mine.

 

[PoliticalChic]

First I'll answer a question you pose towards the end of this poorly conceived and executed continuation of an attack on this quintessentially American political master. (Churchill called him "Lord Root of the Matter". In one of the volumes of his autobiography he said ths of Hopkins;
"There he sat, slim, frail, ill, but absolutely glowing with refined comprehension of the Cause. It was to be the defeat, ruin, and slaughter of Hitler, to the exclusion of all other purposes, loyalties, or aims. In the history of the United States few brighter flames have burned.
Harry Hopkins always went to the root of the matter. I have been present at several great international conferences, where twenty or more of the most important executive personages were gathered together. When the discussion flagged and all seemed baffled, it was on these occasions he would rap out the deadly question, "Surely, Mr. President, here is the point we have got to settle. Are we going to face it or not?" Faced it always was, and, being faced, was conquered. He was a true leader of men, and alike in ardour and in wisdom in times of crisis he has rarely been excelled. His love for the causes of the weak and poor was matched by his passion against tyranny, especially when tyranny was, for the time, triumphant."

The answer to your query "How am I doing so far"? would be a resounding, room rattling guffaw if it wasn't for the fact that your attack, a pathetically manufactured web of conspiracy and lies though it may be, is on a great American 68 years dead who is not here to throw truth back into your face.

To start with, your short bio does Hopkins a disservice. His influence and participation in the events of the mid 20th century are way broader and deeper than your short outline suggests, but that's not really the heart of the matter, this is;
. "The leading evidence that Hopkins was a spy for Joseph Stalin is presented by Herbert Romerstein and Eric Breindel in their 2000 book, "The Venona Secrets: Exposing Soviet Espionage and America's Traitor."

Every serious scholar since the revelations of the Vassiliev notebooks do not give any credence to their "evidence". I pointed this out in a previous post;
"These notebooks put a “case closed” end to the mystery of “19.” Source no. “19” was Laurence Duggan. Duggan had joined the State Department in 1930 and served as Latin American Division chief, 1935–37, and then chief of the Division of the American Republics (merger of the Latin American and Mexican Divisions). In 1940 he became a senior advisor to the Secretary of State on Latin America. He left the State Department in 1944. He was recruited as a Soviet spy in 1935 and remained an active source until he left the State Department". LINK:Hopkins was not Agent 19

I don't know why you keep repeating this disccredited slander.

Next: Where did you come up with this? "One of those groups, led by Lee Pressman, was established within the Department of Agriculture in late 1933, and Hopkins was a member"

Pressmen's own testimony before the House Un-American Activities Committee is clear;

Mr. PRESSMAN. I was asked to join [the Communist Party] by a man named Harold Ware. For the reasons which I have already indicated, I assented, and I joined with the group which had, in addition to myself, three other persons, all of whom at that time were in the Department of Agriculture.
.........
Mr. NIXON. .... Just so there will be absolute clarity of the record, as I understand, the records of this committee show that the three members of the group who were in the Department of Agriculture were John Abt, Nathan Witt, and Henry Collins?
Some back and forth about whether Collins was a member....
Mr. WOOD. I will ask you to name the other employee of the Department of Agriculture who was a member of the group.
Mr. PRESSMAN. The third person among the individuals who have been named as members of this group who was an employee of the Department of Agriculture when I was in 1934 was Charles Kramer.

Pressmen named Abt, Nathan Witt, and Kramer as the three other members of his group. LINK: HUAC Testimony

You seem to see some machiavellian nature in Hopkins relationship with FDR, really it's pretty simple;

Churchill again, "As FDR's point man or unofficial emissary, Winston Churchill held Hopkins in high esteem, once remarking, "He was the most faithful and perfect channel of communication between the president and me." Or, "Beloved by some--such as Churchill, who believed that Hopkins "always went to the root of the matter"--and was trusted by most--including the paranoid Stalin--there were nevertheless those who resented the influence of "the White House Rasputin."-David Roll

And then you really enter the twighlight zone. Emanuel M. Josephson? Really? The "paranoid's paranoid". e.g.;

"Josephson argues that almost half of all US presidents were drawn from the Roosevelt - Adams -Delano "dynasty" and the dynasty acquired ambitions to return the US to some kind of elected monarchy. FDR had absorbed from Germany the "Bismarxist ideology" and during his administration had entered alliance with the Rockefeller empire. This alliance, along with the long established naval interests of the Roosevelt-Delano branch of the dynasty, that accounts for US participation in the world wars and cold war."

Josephson is the archetype for the History as Conspiracy school. Check out his bibliography.
Maybe you should edit your copy and pastes a little better, leaving this out... 5. "Josephson, who was hardly an admirer of Roosevelt and his New Deal, lacks references for his allegations" might have been a good idea.

And Murray Garsson makes a fine star witness; God only knows what manipulation of reality went on between him and Josephson.

"After his release from prison, Murray Garsson was impoverished and subsisted on the charity of friends. For the last three weeks of his life, Garsson, destitute, lived in the reception room of Dr. Emanuel Josephson, 230 East 61st Street. Dr. Josephson prescribed barbiturates for Garsson. On March 7, 1957, Garsson was found unconscious at the foot of a staircase in the 61st Street building. He was taken to Bellevue Hospital, where he died a few days later. Milton Helpern, the chief medical examiner, performed an autopsy and determined the cause of death was brain hemorrhage, the result of a fall down a flight of stairs." LINK: Murray Garrson's pathetic life, and death

No human being is perfect, you can find fault in the most saintly among us. You have failed miserably even at this simple task. You should have followed my hint;

"And there's only one path that I've left open for you to take in your feverish desire to actually hang something out there that might negatively reflect on Hopkin's brilliant and honorable career. So find this minor footnote and exploit it to the best abilities of those you will C&P."

You didn't, and you've produced nothing except more impotent clawing at a great man's reputation.

Rather than deny testimony, as Garsson's, you write this: "After his release from prison, Murray Garsson was impoverished and subsisted on the charity of friends."

So?


"You have failed miserably even at this simple task."
Wishful thinking, Smugly?

I'm not even half finished with either you or Hopkins.




8. . "...the New Yorker described Hopkins as “an articulate propagandist for all-out aid to the Russians.”

Yet the presidential aide’s influence became the subject of controversy in 1949, when a U.S. Army officer who had worked in the Lend-Lease program, Maj. George R. Jordan, testified to Congress that wartime shipments to Russia approved by Hopkins included uranium and other materials necessary to the development of atomic weapons.

Jordan testified that the Soviets also used Lend-Lease shipments to smuggle back to Moscow classified U.S. documents about the top-secret Manhattan Project. Much of Jordan’s testimony about the flow of stolen secrets to Moscow was corroborated by Victor Kravchenko, a Soviet official who defected in 1944 — and whom Hopkins unsuccessfully sought to have handed back over to the Russians. ViralRead » Top FDR Aide Hopkins Was Soviet Agent; Book Examines ?Betrayal?


BTW....have you read any of Kravchenko's "I Chose Freedom"? He was known as 'the first defector.'



“an articulate propagandist for all-out aid to the Russians.”


What was it you claimed in your uninformed post....

" "Harry Hopkins was a true patriot who labored through the period in question sick with cancer but tirelessly for America and the World. He actually worked himself to death for America. You and your sniveling yapping back-stabbing ilk are not fit to lick his boots."



Beginning to appear as though you are the boot-liker....and you appear to enjoy Hopkins' boots, eh?

 

[Moonglow]

Hopkins was a tireless worker...for Stalin and Communism.

That's why the Left loves and defends him

Do you masturbate to fantasies like this?

 

[PoliticalChic]

Let's return to this bit of nonsense:

"Harry Hopkins was a true patriot who labored through the period in question sick with cancer but tirelessly for America and the World. He actually worked himself to death for America. You and your sniveling yapping back-stabbing ilk are not fit to lick his boots."



Unless one considers giving Stalin planes that would have saved American lives, and sending supplies to the USSR that would have better served our armed forces, and making certain that the USSR got the atomic bomb, and allowing Stalin to plan D-day, as 'working tirelessly for America,' ....

...unless you believe the above, then Hopkins did his tireless work for the Soviets.


9. There is absolutely no evidence of Hopkins's patriotism outside of the fact that he worked in the White House. None. All that there is an assumption, a faith based in wishful thinking.

It provides for Hopkins the kind of benefit of the doubt that the Liberals never give to an opponents, as in Goldwater's vote against the 1964 Civil Rights Act, or Trent Lott joking that Strom Thurmond had been elected.


In 1998, the late US Air Force historian Eduard Mark published a break-through Hopkins analysis, a meticulous examination of what appears to be the first damning document to emerge from the Venona record against Hopkins. It was a partly decrypted Venona cable, authored by Akhmerov, in which a very senior Roosevelt administration official, code named "Source 19," conveyed the content of a private, top secret conversation between Roosevelt and Churchill in late May 1943 about the invasion of Normandy, which, at the time, was a year away. By a process of elimination, this is what Mark concludes: "it is probable virtually to the point of certainty" that Harry Hopkins is Source 19.
Eduard Mark, "Venona's Source 19 and the 'Trident' Conference of May 1943; Diplomacy or Espionage?" From "Intelligence and National Security 113, no. 2, April 1998, p. 1-31.

a. See http://65.54.113.26/Publication/57558173

 

[SmedlyButler]

If you've read "The Sword and the Shield" how did you miss this?

This statement by the author himself, Christopher Andrew regarding the braggadocio of the Russian defectors and informants;

.... “these boasts were far from the truth. Hopkins was an American patriot with little sympathy for the Soviet system. But he was deeply impressed by the Soviet war effort.” The Sword and the Shield: The Mitrokhin Archive and the Secret History of the KGB, 1999

Repeat this is the opinion of the friggin author. Are you going to try to rewrite his book as well as history?

BTW...I like your cute little nickname for me. Smugly Backside. It's almost as if you're subconsciously channeling those many members of the fairer sex who have insisted I have "a very nice butt." You naughty girl. (I'm not claiming that description myself, I'm just sayin' that's what they say.)

 

[PoliticalChic]

If you've read "The Sword and the Shield" how did you miss this?

This statement by the author himself, Christopher Andrew regarding the braggadocio of the Russian defectors and informants;

.... “these boasts were far from the truth. Hopkins was an American patriot with little sympathy for the Soviet system. But he was deeply impressed by the Soviet war effort.” The Sword and the Shield: The Mitrokhin Archive and the Secret History of the KGB, 1999

Repeat this is the opinion of the friggin author. Are you going to try to rewrite his book as well as history?

BTW...I like your cute little nickname for me. Smugly Backside. It's almost as if you're subconsciously channeling those many members of the fairer sex who have insisted I have "a very nice butt." You naughty girl. (I'm not claiming that description myself, I'm just sayin' that's what they say.)

I can see where the idea of conflating the study of Harry Hopkins with your backside originates.....having a nickname in common.


Perhaps we will get back to the charms of your backside at a later date.

I'm certain that many will find an OP of your creation nothing less than fascinating.





As soon as I have a chance I'll continue with my endeavor, and you can continue playing "woodsman, spare this tree!!!"

 

[SmedlyButler]

If you keep using these nutbars as sources and "evidence" people are going to suspect you are a nutbar yourself...whoops, too late.


....together with tthe absense of any corroboration from millions of documents released from Soviet and U.S. archives in the decades since the 1940's leads to the conclusion that Jordan either lied for publicity and profit or was delusional. Jordans own testimony before the House was fraught with condradictions, the most blatant of which was his statement that in the spring of 1944 Hopkins called him from Washington and ordered him to expedite shipents of Uranium to the Russians. When Jordan was informed that this was highly unlikely because Hopkins was flat on his back at the Mayo Clinic in Minnesota, he changed his testimony....LINK

Eduard Mark (Your E. Mark BTW, more of him later), an Air Force historian said "The truth bears little resemblence to all the allegations of the psychopathic Mr. Jordan."

In the 1960's Jordan publicly "condemned fluoridation as a secret Russian revolutionary technique to deaden" the minds of Americans. Hmmm....

 

[SmedlyButler]

You gave a dozen distorted out of context anectdotal examples of people who viewed Obama with spiritual feelings. I think only two of them mentioned messiah and some were purposefully sarcastic. After listing your cut and paste avalanche you did as you usualy do, you declared victory. Who cares?
Now defend the use of THE HOMEPAGE OF DC DAVE as a legitimate source for use in a debate about FDR, STALIN AND WWII.

I hate to miss out on entertainment, I just love a good fantasy.

 

[SmedlyButler]

You mentioned the Sword and the Shield (intimating I presume that it provided further "evidence" of your Hopkins as spy theory) and I pointed out that the author himself said it was a lie, he categorized it as;

"...far from the truth. Hopkins was an American patriot with little sympathy for the Soviet system. But he was deeply impressed by the Soviet war effort.”

And you have no comment. Typical

And stop trying to lure me into discussing my "backside". Is there such a thing as sexual harassment on an Internet political junkie Forum? Anybody?

 

[Bfgrn]

During the Great Depression conservatives raised the same objections to F.D.R.’s programs that conservatives today raise about Obama's. Conservatives during the Great Depression said the economy must be left alone and it would correct itself in the long run. Commerce Secretary Harry Hopkins shot back: “People don’t eat in the long run. They eat every day.”

Harry Hopkins was a great American, not a traitorous piece of shit like PC and her right wing ilk.

Another great 'Harry' said it best way back in 1948:

"Republicans approve of the American farmer, but they are willing to help him go broke. They stand four-square for the American home--but not for housing. They are strong for labor--but they are stronger for restricting labor's rights. They favor minimum wage--the smaller the minimum wage the better. They endorse educational opportunity for all--but they won't spend money for teachers or for schools. They approve of social security benefits-so much so that they took them away from almost a million people. They think modern medical care and hospitals are fine--for people who can afford them. They believe in international trade--so much so that they crippled our reciprocal trade program, and killed our International Wheat Agreement. They favor the admission of displaced persons--but only within shameful racial and religious limitations.They consider electrical power a great blessing--but only when the private power companies get their rake-off. They say TVA is wonderful--but we ought never to try it again. They condemn "cruelly high prices"--but fight to the death every effort to bring them down. They think American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire of Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it."
President Harry S. Truman

 

[SmedlyButler]

This is from an article by two Conservative scholars from the Conservative FrontPageMag. They prove that Harry Hopkins was not Agent 19 and describe how and why Edourd Mark came to the wrong conclusion. (They were friends and colleagues of Mark) I've given you the bottom line from this article before. You continue to assert HH was agent 19. Was West that hypnotic? Repeating a lie or misconception over and over will not make it true.

I hate to C&P so much of this but maybe you don't have time to follow the LINK I've also edited it to shorten, hopefully without losing impact and in no way changing conclusions.

".... But while hundreds of cover names were identified, there remained hundreds that were not due to the paucity of the information provided about the person’s activities. One of those unidentified cover names was a Soviet source with the cover name “19.
Source “19” appears in a single Venona message numbered 812, dated 29 May 1943, and sent to Moscow from the New York station of the NKGB (predecessor to the Cold War era KGB). The NKGB station operated out of the Soviet diplomatic consulate in New York City. The National Security Agency declassified the decrypted Venona messages in 1995-96 and has made them public on the web".[3]

"In 1999 we published Venona: Decoding Soviet Espionage in America, a book that explored what could be learned from the Venona decryptions about Soviet intelligence operations in the United States. We discussed the mysterious “19” at length,....."

".... Unfortunately, the deciphered parts of the message do not give the exact date of Source no. 19’s conversation with Roosevelt and Churchill.”[5] Additionally, we noted that even the identity of Zamestitel was not clear. Since in Russian it means “deputy,” Venona project analysts at first though it referred to Vice President Henry Wallace but later suggested that it might be Harry Hopkins. We thought the original Wallace designation the more likely."

"....While we judged “19” to be unidentifiable, a colleague had reached a different conclusion. The late Eduard Mark published an essay in 1998 entitled “Venona’s Source 19 and the Trident Conference of May 1943: Diplomacy or Espionage?”[6] We knew and respected Mark’s scholarly ability. We discussed the agent “19” issue with him as he was preparing his essay (and we were then preparing our Venona book) and, at his request, commented on early drafts of his essay. Mark’s argument was essentially a “last man standing” one. He meticulously went over records of who was known to have been at various Trident-related events to narrow down the list of who was present simultaneously with Roosevelt, Churchill, and Wallace and could plausibly have discussed the second front issue. (Mark also considered the possibility of Zamestitel being Hopkins but, as we had, thought Wallace more likely.) Mark came down to seeing only four plausible candidates for “19”: Harry Hopkins, Canadian Prime Minister Mackenzie King, London-based Lend-Lease coordinator W. Averill Harriman, and Britain’s Lord Beaverbrook. He then considered each in turn and finally concluded, “the fact remains that there is no plausible candidate for 19 but Hopkins.”[7]

"....We disagreed and told him so when his essay was still in draft form. In our view a “last man standing” argument is indirect and circumstantial and is only convincing when one can definitely identify all of the possible candidates and eliminate all but one. While the records of who attended formal Trident conference events were largely reliable, those of Trident-related events, particularly less formal social events, were not. Record keeping in that era of social functions were simply too casual to be regarded as definitive. Not everyone on an invitation list showed up, and those that did would, particularly if they were of senior standing, bring a guest. Mark was of the view that most social events could be ignored because something as sensitive as the second front would not be discussed. Our view was that senior officials in that era were notorious for gossiping about such matters among themselves even at such events and those venues could not be ruled out. Consequently, one could not be confident of knowing all of the possible candidates for “19” and a “last man standing” argument could not be viewed with certainty due to the fragility of the scaffolding of evidence.

Mark, however, was confident of his argument and proceeded with publication. We made note of his argument that “19” was Hopkins in our Venona book which was published subsequent to Mark’s essay and noted that he also concluded “that the readable portions of the message do not allow a clear determination of whether Hopkins/19 was a Soviet covert source or as a benign ‘back channel’ diplomatic contact between Roosevelt and the Soviets. We agree that the partial decryption and ambiguity of the message does not allow a confident judgment on Source no. 19’s relationship to the Soviets; while impressed by Mark’s analysis, we view the evidence as too slim to enable us to reach a judgment about Source No. 19’s identity."

Their final conclusion in this matter came some time later, and I've given this to you before with the link;Again the LINK

We did not, in fact, give any more thought to the identity of “19” until we gained access to the Vassiliev notebooks. These notebooks put a “case closed” end to the mystery of “19.” Source no. “19” was Laurence Duggan. Duggan had joined the State Department in 1930 and served as Latin American Division chief, 1935–37, and then chief of the Division of the American Republics (merger of the Latin American and Mexican Divisions). In 1940 he became a senior advisor to the Secretary of State on Latin America. He left the State Department in 1944. He was recruited as a Soviet spy in 1935 and remained an active source until he left the State Department.

Agent 19 was Duggan Repeat after me Agent 19 was Duggan. I think CAMP gave you this before and maybe others. Do you ever admit you're wrong? Are you afraid removing one of the cards will cause the whole structure to fall?