Yet, without background checks there is no way of knowing about those long histories of crime and violence, is there?
What are you talking about? Criminals have criminal records.....when they are arrested, in the commission of a crime or with an illegal gun in their possession, the cop runs their name and history, and they can then be arrested.......and locked up....then released by people like you, where they go on to commit another crime.
Background checks do nothing to stop criminals or mass shooters from getting guns. What they do? Is allow you and anti-gunners to demand gun registration...because after you get universal background checks, criminals will still get illegal guns, and mass public shooters will still get guns.....then you will come forward and say..we need to register all guns.....knowing, since I keep telling you, that criminals do not have to register their illegal guns since it violates their 5th Amendment Rights against self incrimination....
Haynes v. United States - Wikipedia
Haynes argued that, because he was a convicted felon and thus prohibited from owning a firearm, requiring him to register was essentially requiring him to make an open admission to the government that he was in violation of the law, which was thus a violation of his right not to incriminate himself.
Majority opinion[edit]
In a 7-1 decision, the Court ruled in 1968 in favor of Haynes. Earl Warren dissented in a one sentence opinion and Thurgood Marshall did not participate in the ruling.
As with many other 5th amendment cases, felons and others prohibited from possessing firearms could not be compelled to incriminate themselves through registration.[3][4] The National Firearms Act was amended after Haynes to make it apply only to those who could lawfully possess a firearm. This eliminated prosecution of prohibited persons, such as criminals, and cured the self-incrimination problem.
And mass public shooters will simply register their guns.....and then shoot people with them...
There is nothing about gun registration that makes any sense to normal people who know the issue..
Your claim is stupid. Background checks do work, and universal background checks would work better. I don't care how many times you say they don't, cause you are wrong.
No, background checks do now work.....you can't show how they work..... criminals steal their guns or use straw buyers..... mass shooters almost to a shooter have all undergone current, federal background checks which means they would be able to pass any universal background check for a private sale.
There is no intelligent argument for universal background checks that do not consist solely on getting universal gun registration...
Most illegal guns are purchased by straw purchasers in states that have lax background checks. And there are NO Federal requirements for background checks. It's state to state. Well, except for FFL sellers. Many states are not universal background check states and there is where the straw buyers go and gets their weapons they transport to the areas where the weapons bring the highest fees. The ARs and top line handguns go across the southern border to the cartels while the junk heads for the Gangs in the Metro Areas. You don't even need an ID or even be able to speak english to buy the guns. Your wet dream or nightmare that universal background checks means universal gun registration really needs some mental help. Now that the general public is no longer listening to your "They are coming for our guns" BS, you flip the 45 and start playing side B, "Background Checks leads directly to Universal Gun Registrations". After so many years of the same stupid song, I wonder what side C will be.
Well, except for FFL sellers.
And you could have stopped right there.....
Universal background checks do not stop straw buyers....straw buyers can pass current, federal background checks, which means they can pass any universal background check as well......what part of that dynamic do you morons not understand?
The Cartels are getting military weapons from the Mexican military and from other South American countries, as well as Europe and China........
The only reason to have universal background checks is to be able to demand universal gun registration....that is the only reason. Criminals steal their guns or use straw buyers, negating universal background checks the same way they negate current federal background checks. Mass public shooters pass current federal background checks when they buy their guns....or they too steal them....negating universal background checks....so the only reason for universal background checks is to demand gun registration....the only reason.
The guns are already registered by the Manufacturer. And until they leave the FFL who is must report the sale and to whom for new gun sales, the guns can be tracked. There are enough registrations there already. Do you mean you want more? Keep it up and you just might get your wish.
You keep coming back to background checks will always lead to gun registration for all guns sales. Ain't going to happen unless the public safety gets so bad that the government is forced to make it so. Again, do you really want to keep blocking universal background checks? That, alone, will ultimately lead to universal gun registrations due to public safety. I think it would be too much of a hassle, myself. The two aren't linked unless it becomes a public safety issue like automatic weapons and sawed off shotguns. The AR-15 was well on it's way to heading that direction but the gun crazies have grown up a bit and that threat is going down to a manageable level in most areas. And your actions and public opinions were helping to keep it going in the direction of being labeled a public danger. So a lot of people should send you thank you notes on that one.
To date, the figures don't lie. If I used the pre 2013 figures, Colorado was on the straw buyers list for exporting guns to chicago. Until 2018, Illinois was on that same list. Take a look at this graph for 2103 to 2016, you will see a trend. Illinois is no longer on this list since it went to the universal background checks. Colorado was on the same list in 2012 the year before it passed the universal background checks.
You will notice that Indiana is the #1 supplier now. It does not require private sales to need a background check like Colorado and Illinios does. You will notice the trend is that of primarily Red States on the list. The only reason Texas is so low is that it's quite a distance to transport those guns and if they get stopped, it's usually a felony in both State and Federal so they go to closer states. There isn't one single universal background check state on this list.
The reason there isn't any universal background checks is, the State of Illinois can track the gun back to the originating state. Once they do that, it's not that difficult to find where the background check was run using state records. There is no Federal Database to use so the State must use the courts in the state the weapon originated in in order to access the background check records. Welcome to the 10th and the 14th amendment. They protect you until that gun is used in the performance of a crime and is recovered. But they can be used to backtrack to an illegal sale. Chances are, using Texas as a yardstick, selling those weapons knowing that they are going to be transported outside the state is probably a felony. Even if it's not, it is a Federal Felony. And transporting those weapons has been an Illinois Felony for a number of years even before they went to universal background checks.
You will notice that Wisconsin is on that list. In 2015 they went to universal background checks and they went from #2 to #4 even with the sales from 2013 to 2014 because they pretty well stopped. Pretty much, all the states have moved up because of the loss of Illinois and Wisconsin from the straw man purchases. The Illegal Gun Sellers will go to the easiest and safest states to make their purchases where they aren't even required to show as much as an ID much less establish residency to make those purchases.
Hate to break it to you but the FFL shops are NOT the problem and never were since 1968 when they were required to run background checks for all sales under Federal Law. Out of State Purchasers will avoid FFL sellers like the plague since any NEW sales will go into a Federal Database. And even though the used guns won't go into that database, the FFL seller is required by law to report any sales over 3 guns during a specific time period. Plus, he or she will demand to see your ID and want to establish your residency. Even if all the paperwork seems in order, if he senses that it might be a hinky sale he will report the sale. His license is on the line along with his freedom. The last thing he wants to see is a sale to be tracked back to his shop. Even then, he will require a court order for the Authorities to access that single one background check for that specific weapon. It's called Police Work and the ATF is pretty damned good at it if given the tools.
Universal Background Checks do more than that. They also check the Mental Health Database, the Court Systems and more to find out if the person really should be allowed to purchase a weapon. It's already proven that it lowers the suicide rate by guns, martial killings by guns, and a lot more. And this is according to Rand Corporation. Since Universal Background Checks are so new, all the other benefits that they claim are inconclusive because there hasn't been enough time to compile the data for enough years. One year does not make a trend or even much of a difference. But to say that Universal Background Checks make no difference is just plain lying.
Now, if you want to keep blocking universal background checks, the only other option is universal gun registration. That's where it might end up unless we find a different method. In this case, Universal Background Checks are a good compromise without going to far over the line. So go ahead, keep fighting it. You either get universal background checks nor OR you get Universal Gun Registrations later. But Universal Background Checks do not have to lead to Universal Gun Registrations unless it becomes a Public Safety issue and falls under the 1934 Firearms Act.
