CDZ gun magazine bullet limits...they only effect law abiding gun owners so why do we need them.

[alang1216]

[
Why do you thin it is possible to enact a law that will prevent people from breaking the law?
Why not just enact a law that prevent people from committing violent crime?

Criminal law, by its nature, is enforced after the law is broken; it is impossible to enact a law that will prevent someone from breaking the law.

You don't have much imagination. We do it all the time. We have bank reporting laws on depositing large amounts of cash to impede drug dealing. The gun control laws we have are meant to prevent gun crimes. You can debate their effectiveness but not their intent.

 

[alang1216]

I can't think of a better use of my tax dollars than to ensure gun owners have some level of knowledge. Police or FBI approved trainers can teach classes at night or on weekends at local high schools. A written or oral exam to pass.

If it is free maybe...but no........when you are talking about limiting a right in the hope that the police and FBI...can take time and energy away from actual criminal control...and won't find reasons to withhold classes...sorry, not the way to do it....

So a written or oral exam....I take it you are fine with the same for blacks and voting?

If there is money allocated it will happen. I have no problem tying state or federal gun control laws to training funding. Congress can mandate you can't have one without the other.

A free class to educate voters? I'm OK with it so long as it isn't targeted at a particular group. Considering the state of our government it's worth a shot.

 

[alang1216]

What other crime do you prevent before it has happened....murder? We made it against the law to commit murder...do we stop them before they happen or after they happen....?

Same with guns...we have laws that state you cannot use a gun to commit a crime, or buy, own or carry a gun as a felon.........and if you break those laws you are arrested....

That is how all laws work...you guys seem to think that guns are different...that you can stop the crime before it happens....and since you focus on that....... actual gun violence and the actual gun criminals are never addressed.

We have banking laws to stop drug dealers. There are speed bumps on my street to prevent speeding.

 

[M14 Shooter]

[
Why do you thin it is possible to enact a law that will prevent people from breaking the law?
Why not just enact a law that prevent people from committing violent crime?
Criminal law, by its nature, is enforced after the law is broken; it is impossible to enact a law that will prevent someone from breaking the law.

You don't have much imagination. We do it all the time. We have bank reporting laws on depositing large amounts of cash to impede drug dealing. The gun control laws we have are meant to prevent gun crimes. You can debate their effectiveness but not their intent.

And... none of these laws prevent people from doing those very things. You make my point.

 

[alang1216]

We have bank reporting laws on depositing large amounts of cash to impede drug dealing. The gun control laws we have are meant to prevent gun crimes. You can debate their effectiveness but not their intent.

And... none of these laws prevent people from doing those very things. You make my point.

Are you saying they are 0% effective? If so, I'm sure you're wrong. If you're saying they're not 100% effective then I'm sure you're right.
"Better a diamond with a flaw than a pebble without." — Confucius

 

[M14 Shooter]

We have bank reporting laws on depositing large amounts of cash to impede drug dealing. The gun control laws we have are meant to prevent gun crimes. You can debate their effectiveness but not their intent.

And... none of these laws prevent people from doing those very things. You make my point.

Are you saying they are 0% effective?

My position is obvious:
Laws cannot prevent actions; a law cannot prevent someone from breaking another law.
Enacting a law that restricts the tights of the law abiding based on the false premise that a law can prevent someone from breaking another law is, at best, nonsensical.

You believe I am wrong?
Why don't you propose a law that will prevent people form committing murder?
Do that and we won't need more gun control.

 

[GaryDog]

Going from a 14,000 per year epidemic to 8,000 per year isn't 55% and isn't a cure.

US murders
1993: 24526
2014: 11961 = 12565 fewer murders = 51.23%
US Gun related murders:
1993: 17413
2014: 8124 = 9289 fewer murders = 53.31%

The point demonstrated here is that your claim of an "epidemic" is ignorant and/or dishonest hyperbole

Uh, no not really.

Which kills more Americans: Guns or cars?

That's an epidemic /\/\/\/\

 

[GaryDog]

We have bank reporting laws on depositing large amounts of cash to impede drug dealing. The gun control laws we have are meant to prevent gun crimes. You can debate their effectiveness but not their intent.

And... none of these laws prevent people from doing those very things. You make my point.

Are you saying they are 0% effective?

My position is obvious:
Laws cannot prevent actions; a law cannot prevent someone from breaking another law.
Enacting a law that restricts the tights of the law abiding based on the false premise that a law can prevent someone from breaking another law is, at best, nonsensical.

You believe I am wrong?
Why don't you propose a law that will prevent people form committing murder?
Do that and we won't need more gun control.

It's called a murder law. Without them, we'd have a LOT more murders.

I really can't tell if you're serious. There can't be anyone this dumb who also knows how to turn on a computer or phone.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Going from a 14,000 per year epidemic to 8,000 per year isn't 55% and isn't a cure.

US murders
1993: 24526
2014: 11961 = 12565 fewer murders = 51.23%
US Gun related murders:
1993: 17413
2014: 8124 = 9289 fewer murders = 53.31%
The point demonstrated here is that your claim of an "epidemic" is ignorant and/or dishonest hyperbole

Uh, no not really.

Yes. Really. Your graph does nothing to disprove my post.

"Epidemic" remains a term of mindless hyperbole

Now, go find a different talking point.

 

[GaryDog]

Going from a 14,000 per year epidemic to 8,000 per year isn't 55% and isn't a cure.

US murders
1993: 24526
2014: 11961 = 12565 fewer murders = 51.23%
US Gun related murders:
1993: 17413
2014: 8124 = 9289 fewer murders = 53.31%
The point demonstrated here is that your claim of an "epidemic" is ignorant and/or dishonest hyperbole

Uh, no not really.

Yes. Really. Your graph does nothing to disprove my post.

"Epidemic" remains a term of mindless hyperbole

Now, go find a different talking point.

We've had more people die in this country from gun violence since 2001 than all U.S. soldiers during WWII. We've had more people die in the past 6 weeks from gun violence than terrorism since 2001.

What, exactly, is an epidemic to you? Gun violence fits all the definitions of one. And it's spreading. The more people who have guns, the more people feel they need guns (thanks to the blatant scare tactics by the NRA). It fits every definition of a disease.

 

[2aguy]

I can't think of a better use of my tax dollars than to ensure gun owners have some level of knowledge. Police or FBI approved trainers can teach classes at night or on weekends at local high schools. A written or oral exam to pass.

If it is free maybe...but no........when you are talking about limiting a right in the hope that the police and FBI...can take time and energy away from actual criminal control...and won't find reasons to withhold classes...sorry, not the way to do it....

So a written or oral exam....I take it you are fine with the same for blacks and voting?

If there is money allocated it will happen. I have no problem tying state or federal gun control laws to training funding. Congress can mandate you can't have one without the other.

A free class to educate voters? I'm OK with it so long as it isn't targeted at a particular group. Considering the state of our government it's worth a shot.

So...you are fine with not letting blacks vote without passing a literacy test, or a test on how the government works...right? As long as it was free..right?

 

[2aguy]

Going from a 14,000 per year epidemic to 8,000 per year isn't 55% and isn't a cure.

US murders
1993: 24526
2014: 11961 = 12565 fewer murders = 51.23%
US Gun related murders:
1993: 17413
2014: 8124 = 9289 fewer murders = 53.31%
The point demonstrated here is that your claim of an "epidemic" is ignorant and/or dishonest hyperbole

Uh, no not really.

Yes. Really. Your graph does nothing to disprove my post.

"Epidemic" remains a term of mindless hyperbole

Now, go find a different talking point.

We've had more people die in this country from gun violence since 2001 than all U.S. soldiers during WWII. We've had more people die in the past 6 weeks from gun violence than terrorism since 2001.

What, exactly, is an epidemic to you? Gun violence fits all the definitions of one. And it's spreading. The more people who have guns, the more people feel they need guns (thanks to the blatant scare tactics by the NRA). It fits every definition of a disease.

90% of the shooters are criminals its long criminal histories.....I want to focus on them...you are worried about John Q. Citizen.....they guy not shooting people......

3 million people in Chicago.....1,300 are known to be shooters by the police...you want to focus on the 3 million...not the known, 1,300 criminals.........that is why nothing you do works.....

 

[2aguy]

Going from a 14,000 per year epidemic to 8,000 per year isn't 55% and isn't a cure.

US murders
1993: 24526
2014: 11961 = 12565 fewer murders = 51.23%
US Gun related murders:
1993: 17413
2014: 8124 = 9289 fewer murders = 53.31%
The point demonstrated here is that your claim of an "epidemic" is ignorant and/or dishonest hyperbole

Uh, no not really.

Yes. Really. Your graph does nothing to disprove my post.

"Epidemic" remains a term of mindless hyperbole

Now, go find a different talking point.

We've had more people die in this country from gun violence since 2001 than all U.S. soldiers during WWII. We've had more people die in the past 6 weeks from gun violence than terrorism since 2001.

What, exactly, is an epidemic to you? Gun violence fits all the definitions of one. And it's spreading. The more people who have guns, the more people feel they need guns (thanks to the blatant scare tactics by the NRA). It fits every definition of a disease.

Then this is the only disease where the more people have it...the lower the gun mirdered rate goes...you have been shown that guns in the hands of law abiding people does not increase the gun murder rate...and as more people own guns, our gun mirder rate went down.....Britain banned and confiscated guns from law abiding people.....and their gun mirder and crime rate did not change.....

You are w I no...your solutions do not address the actual problem...

As that one meme shows....you would take someone's car away from them because their neighbor is driving drunk..and expect that to lower drunk driving.....

 

[2aguy]

We have bank reporting laws on depositing large amounts of cash to impede drug dealing. The gun control laws we have are meant to prevent gun crimes. You can debate their effectiveness but not their intent.

And... none of these laws prevent people from doing those very things. You make my point.

Are you saying they are 0% effective?

My position is obvious:
Laws cannot prevent actions; a law cannot prevent someone from breaking another law.
Enacting a law that restricts the tights of the law abiding based on the false premise that a law can prevent someone from breaking another law is, at best, nonsensical.

You believe I am wrong?
Why don't you propose a law that will prevent people form committing murder?
Do that and we won't need more gun control.

It's called a murder law. Without them, we'd have a LOT more murders.

I really can't tell if you're serious. There can't be anyone this dumb who also knows how to turn on a computer or phone.

And we have gun law...if you commit a crime with a gun you go to jail....

That is why we have 357,000,000 guns and only 8,124 gun mirdered in 2014.....our gun laws stop murder......what you want has happened.....now we go after the one who ignore the law.....

 

[2aguy]

Going from a 14,000 per year epidemic to 8,000 per year isn't 55% and isn't a cure.

US murders
1993: 24526
2014: 11961 = 12565 fewer murders = 51.23%
US Gun related murders:
1993: 17413
2014: 8124 = 9289 fewer murders = 53.31%
The point demonstrated here is that your claim of an "epidemic" is ignorant and/or dishonest hyperbole

Uh, no not really.

Yes. Really. Your graph does nothing to disprove my post.

"Epidemic" remains a term of mindless hyperbole

Now, go find a different talking point.

We've had more people die in this country from gun violence since 2001 than all U.S. soldiers during WWII. We've had more people die in the past 6 weeks from gun violence than terrorism since 2001.

What, exactly, is an epidemic to you? Gun violence fits all the definitions of one. And it's spreading. The more people who have guns, the more people feel they need guns (thanks to the blatant scare tactics by the NRA). It fits every definition of a disease.

How is it an epidemic if you go from 200 million guns to 357,000,000 guns and the gun mirder rate goes down 49%? That isn't how it works.....

And the disease vector.....does not work on guns...but nice try........the spread of disease is not an act of will....murdering someone for money is.........

 

[2aguy]

Going from a 14,000 per year epidemic to 8,000 per year isn't 55% and isn't a cure.

US murders
1993: 24526
2014: 11961 = 12565 fewer murders = 51.23%
US Gun related murders:
1993: 17413
2014: 8124 = 9289 fewer murders = 53.31%

The point demonstrated here is that your claim of an "epidemic" is ignorant and/or dishonest hyperbole

Uh, no not really.

Which kills more Americans: Guns or cars?

That's an epidemic /\/\/\/\

Cars kill more people....

Accidental gun death 2014... 586

Accidental car death...33,000

 

[2aguy]

Going from a 14,000 per year epidemic to 8,000 per year isn't 55% and isn't a cure.

US murders
1993: 24526
2014: 11961 = 12565 fewer murders = 51.23%
US Gun related murders:
1993: 17413
2014: 8124 = 9289 fewer murders = 53.31%

The point demonstrated here is that your claim of an "epidemic" is ignorant and/or dishonest hyperbole

Uh, no not really.

Which kills more Americans: Guns or cars?

That's an epidemic /\/\/\/\

Those numbers are wrong......Japan, China and South Korea have higher suicide rates than we do.....but they only allow criminals and cops to have guns......

Also.....France has a higher suicide rate than we do....and extreme gun control.......your photo is wrong......

 

[2aguy]

What other crime do you prevent before it has happened....murder? We made it against the law to commit murder...do we stop them before they happen or after they happen....?

Same with guns...we have laws that state you cannot use a gun to commit a crime, or buy, own or carry a gun as a felon.........and if you break those laws you are arrested....

That is how all laws work...you guys seem to think that guns are different...that you can stop the crime before it happens....and since you focus on that....... actual gun violence and the actual gun criminals are never addressed.

We have banking laws to stop drug dealers. There are speed bumps on my street to prevent speeding.

And yet drugs are are used and people speed.........357,000,000 guns in private hands less than 8,124 of them are so see to commit mirder...our gun laws already work.....

 

[2aguy]

[
Why do you thin it is possible to enact a law that will prevent people from breaking the law?
Why not just enact a law that prevent people from committing violent crime?

Criminal law, by its nature, is enforced after the law is broken; it is impossible to enact a law that will prevent someone from breaking the law.

You don't have much imagination. We do it all the time. We have bank reporting laws on depositing large amounts of cash to impede drug dealing. The gun control laws we have are meant to prevent gun crimes. You can debate their effectiveness but not their intent.

Yes...if you commit a crime with a gun...you get arrested......

Like banking laws...if you are a felon, you can't buy, own or carry a gun........you will be arrested....the problem is the justice system lets them go.......over and over again...


Stop focusing on law abiding gun Owners and focus on the actual problem.....criminals who use guns for crime......

 

[GaryDog]

Going from a 14,000 per year epidemic to 8,000 per year isn't 55% and isn't a cure.

US murders
1993: 24526
2014: 11961 = 12565 fewer murders = 51.23%
US Gun related murders:
1993: 17413
2014: 8124 = 9289 fewer murders = 53.31%

The point demonstrated here is that your claim of an "epidemic" is ignorant and/or dishonest hyperbole

Uh, no not really.

Which kills more Americans: Guns or cars?

That's an epidemic /\/\/\/\

Cars kill more people....

Accidental gun death 2014... 586

Accidental car death...33,000

Lies, damned lies, and 2aguy's statistics.