What's new
US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Germany finally recognises it committed genocide in Namibia (killing 100K) after being sued. Germany will pay $1.34 billion compensation to Namibia

52ndStreet

Gold Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2008
Messages
3,377
Reaction score
456
Points
130
What about the other European Blood sucker , land robbers and rapist nations that stool billions in natural resources, when are they going to pay up?!!
 

zaangalewa

Gold Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2015
Messages
10,951
Reaction score
883
Points
140
As a German I have to say that very most Germans have absolutely not any idea about Namibia nor what Germany has to do with this country nor what has happened in fighting Herero and Nama.

The idea of colonies never had been very popular in Germany and in case of this genocide 2 names are in the center: Emperor William II, who had been educated from Queen Victoria, and Lothar von Trotha - the leader of an army of 15,000 soldiers - a noble, who had been a shame for his family. Nearly all Germans who had to do with this problem liked to fire Lothar von Trotha, because of his incompetence and his lack of moral - but the emperor William II supported Lothar von Trotha. I have just simple to say in this context: It exist good reasons why Germany got rid of the nobels and became a republic - unfortunatelly this had caused side effects, which had been a much bigger tragedy.

And I have also a little difficulties to understand people who excuse themselves to be Germans because of crimes 110 years ago, which they personally never had done. And I am a little angry on the Herero and Nama because they say now the offer of 1.3 billion are an offence of us Germans. They like to get 477 billion Euro. For what? Because they were killed after they had attacked the Germans, who had lived in Namibia in this mad time of history? How comes it that they are still alive? Who lived by the way in the area where Herero and Nama live today (and/or before 1904) - and what had happened with the people, who had lived there, before the Herero and Nama lived there?
 
Last edited:

zaangalewa

Gold Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2015
Messages
10,951
Reaction score
883
Points
140
What about the other European Blood sucker , land robbers and rapist nations that stool billions in natural resources, when are they going to pay up?!!

What about the other Europeans "Blood suckers" who made modern forms of agriculture, made streets and cities and founded schools and universities? And had introduced concepts like "justice" for example?
 

52ndStreet

Gold Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2008
Messages
3,377
Reaction score
456
Points
130
Yes , they made roads, brought their legal system, yet billions were stolen in the form of natural resources, and are still being stolen. ! This money could have been used in the African countries from which they were stolen. Millions still living in poverty from this European theft. That is still going on today.! So don't try to say they built roads and brought their legal system. The damage has been done, and is still being done.
 

zaangalewa

Gold Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2015
Messages
10,951
Reaction score
883
Points
140
Yes , they made roads, brought their legal system, yet billions were stolen in the form of natural resources, and are still being stolen. !
Not so from Germans in Namibia - as far as I know - nor in any other of the colonies of the totally stupid Prussian emperor over Germany, the Brit William II. The investments in colonies from Germany had been always higher than the profits as far as I heard.

This money could have been used in the African countries from which they were stolen.

Money? Stolen? In Africa? From native Africans? ... Hmmm ... As far as I know stole the Arabs complete villages and the Brits sold this slaves in the USA. This was in a time when for example the Bey of Algier made also Europeans in masses to slaves in Arabia. Ever heard anything about why and how the USA stopped this idiots in Algier?


Millions still living in poverty from this European theft
That is still going on today.!

Any concrete example? And how much money do you like to get from Arabs and other Asians and/or Africans who were also slave hunterers and/or had fought for British and other salve traders?

So don't try to say
?
they built roads and brought their legal system.

Not only this. One of the main roots of all modern civilisations in the world is Europe.

The damage has been done, and is still being done.

One moment please: Do you like to say we can get some Herero and Nama from time to time as gladiators for our not existing circusses in the dead country Bohemia, where no German lives any longer from the millions, who had once lived there, wimp? How much money?



PS: As far as I heard was once deployed here the second Nubian legion under our Roman ancestors. Perhaps it is a good idea to continue this tradition. How many Herero and Nama like to be soldiers in a NATO-army which we can use worldwide in international missions against terrorists? We have anyway to increase our military budget - so perhaps this could be a good idea for you to get more money - and for the world to get more security.
 
Last edited:

Bernhard

Gold Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2020
Messages
312
Reaction score
250
Points
173
Location
Berlin, Germany
IMO, it's pretty obvious that Germany had no right to take these lands in Namibia, and that committing genocide on tribes there was a crime.

IMO, it's an act of patriotism to admit misdeeds in our history. Some people seem to believe you either have to love your country and whitewash its history, or you have to hate it and wallow in guilt ... I say both approaches are silly. You can love your country, love the good sides as much as you take responsibility for the bad sides, especially when you're not personally responsible.
 

zaangalewa

Gold Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2015
Messages
10,951
Reaction score
883
Points
140
IMO, it's pretty obvious that Germany had no right to take these lands in Namibia, and that committing genocide on tribes there was a crime.

IMO, it's an act of patriotism to admit misdeeds in our history. Some people seem to believe you either have to love your country and whitewash its history, or you have to hate it and wallow in guilt ... I say both approaches are silly. You can love your country, love the good sides as much as you take responsibility for the bad sides, especially when you're not personally responsible.

Do you speak with me? You should perhaps know something about Germans: We have a tendence to prefer to kill our enemies - because to make slaves out of them is ignoble.
 
Last edited:

Bernhard

Gold Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2020
Messages
312
Reaction score
250
Points
173
Location
Berlin, Germany
IMO, it's pretty obvious that Germany had no right to take these lands in Namibia, and that committing genocide on tribes there was a crime.

IMO, it's an act of patriotism to admit misdeeds in our history. Some people seem to believe you either have to love your country and whitewash its history, or you have to hate it and wallow in guilt ... I say both approaches are silly. You can love your country, love the good sides as much as you take responsibility for the bad sides, especially when you're not personally responsible.

Do you speak with me?

Not in particular... I was just stating my feelings on the topic.
 

zaangalewa

Gold Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2015
Messages
10,951
Reaction score
883
Points
140
IMO, it's pretty obvious that Germany had no right to take these lands in Namibia,

Had the Herero and Nama the right to take this land when others had lived there before they came into this area of the world?

and that committing genocide on tribes there was a crime.

I'm not very satisfied with the expression "genocide" in this context, because genocide is an expression from the year 1948 which had in the origin exclusivelly only to do with the so called Holocaust (=Endlösung), who had been from a German point of view only outside of Germany a genocide. Inside of Germany this genocide had been a fratricide.

IMO, it's an act of patriotism

Patrio what? Germans are not patriots. We think normally idiots govern our country. This has to do with Hitler.

to admit misdeeds in our history.

We are the only people on the whole planet, who are doing so.

Some people seem to believe you either have to love your country and whitewash its history, or you have to hate it and wallow in guilt ...

?

I say both approaches are silly.

?

You can love your country,

Germany? Why shouId I? Germans murdered a big part of my German family.

love the good sides

Which good sides? But sure - why not to love the good sides?

as much as you take responsibility for the bad sides,

Which bad sides? And what has this to do with me?

especially when you're not personally responsible.

?
 

Bernhard

Gold Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2020
Messages
312
Reaction score
250
Points
173
Location
Berlin, Germany
IMO, it's pretty obvious that Germany had no right to take these lands in Namibia,

Had the Herero and Nama the right to take this land when others had lived there before they came into this area of the world?

This really doesn't matter. Germans invaded this land. They murdered two tribes. That was wrong. There is really nothing more to say about that.


and that committing genocide on tribes there was a crime.

I'm not very satisfied with the expression "genocide" in this context, because genocide is an expression from the year 1948 which had in the origin exclusivelly only to do with the so called Holocaust (=Endlösung), who had been from a German point of view only outside of Germany a genocide. Inside of Germany this genocide had been a fratricide.

"Genocide" is a word that describes the attempt to not just mass murder people, but the intent to annihilate an entire people. That is what happened. Nobody in the world cares what you feel about this word.


IMO, it's an act of patriotism

Patrio what? Germans are not patriots. We think normally idiots govern our country. This has to do with Hitler.

I'm a German, and I'm a patriot. Go figure. Don't tell me what I am supposed to feel towards my country.


to admit misdeeds in our history.

We are the only people on the whole planet, who are doing so.

There are never entire peoples who do this or that. There are different views on patriotism and nationalism within any people.

Some people seem to believe you either have to love your country and whitewash its history, or you have to hate it and wallow in guilt ...

?

? Do you have reading problems?

I say both approaches are silly.

?

?

You can love your country,

Germany? Why shouId I? Germans murdered a big part of my German family.

Who said you should?

love the good sides

Which good sides?

For starters, Germany is among the top 15 countries in the world on most rankings, when it comes to quality of life, public health, freedom of speech, democratic standards, equality of wealth and so on ...

... to make it short, life is pretty good in Germany, compared to most other countries on this planet.


as much as you take responsibility for the bad sides,

Which bad sides?

For example, admitting that colonialism was not a good thing, and, of course, everything that happened between 1933 and 1945 in this country is not exactly a good example, including the Holocaust on 6 million Jews and starting a world war that resulted in the death of ca. 40 million people.

especially when you're not personally responsible.

?

I was born long after German colonialism and Nazi rule, so I can't say I'm personally responsible for any of these crimes. Got it?
 

Tommy Tainant

Gold Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2016
Messages
28,326
Reaction score
7,883
Points
290
Location
Y Cae Ras
IMO, it's pretty obvious that Germany had no right to take these lands in Namibia, and that committing genocide on tribes there was a crime.

IMO, it's an act of patriotism to admit misdeeds in our history. Some people seem to believe you either have to love your country and whitewash its history, or you have to hate it and wallow in guilt ... I say both approaches are silly. You can love your country, love the good sides as much as you take responsibility for the bad sides, especially when you're not personally responsible.
Americans,right wingers, have a hatred of reparations because they fear their taxes may go up to cover their debt to black folk.
 

zaangalewa

Gold Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2015
Messages
10,951
Reaction score
883
Points
140
IMO, it's pretty obvious that Germany had no right to take these lands in Namibia,

Had the Herero and Nama the right to take this land when others had lived there before they came into this area of the world?

This really doesn't matter. Germans invaded this land.

What was totally normal during this time time of history. Germans did not do so a very long time of history. We were not enthusiats of the idea "colonies" as were nerly all other Europeans. The problem started indeed with the destruction of the Holy empire of German (=United) Nation by the French mass-murderer Napoleon Bonaparte. He forced us to give him soldiers to fight against Russai for example - so also this problem started with this damned mass-murderer.

In the fight against Napoleon Bonaparte an international war with mass-murderers all over the European world had started in Germany. In the end all this international super-idiots took care that the Prussians - an army which owned a land - had overtaken Germany. You don't think this is important? Wrong: It is - otherwise you are not able to understand how its was possible that had happened this side-effect tragedy in Namibia.

Since this damned war an unholy kind of alliance between the Prussians (this are the people which the world calls normally "Germans") and the Brits had dominated the German history. The Prussians had conquered one by next German country and had called them - don't be astonished "Colony of Prussia". They had thrown out Austria from the not any longer existing German Bund (=Union) and in a last step they had forced the king of Bavaria to become a traitor of his own people and to sell his country to the Prussians - because he did not like to go in war with the mighty Prussian army which dominated now everthying in whole Germany.

The king of the Prussians became now the emperor over Germany in Versailles - in the tradition of the French emperor Napoleon Bonaparte. Germany degraded itselve to a military dictatorship with a Prussain army which had suffered the so called "Kadavergehorsam" - what means the soldiers of the Prussian army (and every German had to be there for some time) were trained with very modern methods to lose everything what was an own personality and to become nothing else than an executive organ without any own opinion about anything - not even about the own death.

And exactly this was the resason why the stupid orders of the criminal Brit William II and his general staff were such a catastophe. This man had been without any scruple and had been one of the worst criminals - not far from the criminal energy of the monster - ah sorry: "king" - of Belgium, whose deeds you can see in the Kongo.

So I hope you understand now better the time of history and the situation within Germany in which this had happened. When I was a little child I still grew up in a world where everyone had hated the Prussians more than any other enemy of Germany which ever had existed, although they had been Germans on their own and we had a lot of enemies because of world war 2. Slowly we moved this hate on Prussians in a more humorful way to see all this problems of history, because no one is just simple able to live in hate without to lose the own soul.

Now to Namibia and the crimes there in very short words. It started with an attack of the Herero and Nama against the German seddlers there. I do not discuss about sense and nonsense of colonies now. It was clear that the seddlers had to be protected from this violent attaccs. So the Herero and Nama knew an reaction will come. But why did they think this reaction would had been more soft? I guess they had this delusion because they knew that we Germans normally react calm. What they totally underestimated was it that the Germans in this time of histoey fulfilled every order they got. It was for all Germans - also later under Hitler - always clear that not this one who executes an order is guilty - in a similar way how a sword is not able to be guilty, because it is used for murder. Fighting Germans don't think and don't discuss. They like to solve a problem forever. In this time of history it was not wrong what they did. Discussions about "What is a genocide" will start decades later after Hitler.

Nevertheless they made crimes which had been also crimes in this time of history. One crime had it been to take away the German citizenship from the Herero and Nama. Traditionally the German citizenship is able to be given - but not able to be taken. You will think this is unimportant - but it is not. In case the Herero and Nama had stayed to be citizens of Germany then this had not justified a military action - it had to be an action of policemen in this case. An the other crime - if it had happened what I do not really know in the moment - was to fight against women and children. It looks like they did so, if I'm right. If so then the word "genocide" is justified. Even in the middle ages when we had hard fights agains heathens from the East of Europe our knights had the duty to adopt children of the enemies. Unfortunatelly it makes not any sense to be angry any longer on the Prussians, because the Prussians not exist any longer. This most mighty German tribe is dead. "Who takes the sword dies by the sword" is a famous word of the bible in such contextes. The Herero and Nama still exist. But the price was high for them.

They murdered two tribes. That was wrong.

Sure. But what had you done? The same, isn't it? Who has a lot of power in the hands easily is able to make something wrong.

There is really nothing more to say about that.

Aha. That's by the way a typical Prussian expression.

and that committing genocide on tribes there was a crime.

I'm not very satisfied with the expression "genocide" in this context, because genocide is an expression from the year 1948 which had in the origin exclusivelly only to do with the so called Holocaust (=Endlösung), who had been from a German point of view only outside of Germany a genocide. Inside of Germany this genocide had been a fratricide.

"Genocide" is a word that describes the attempt to not just mass murder people, but the intent to annihilate an entire people. That is what happened. Nobody in the world cares what you feel about this word.

For the Brit William II this people were perhaps only an possibility to show to his grandma Queen Victoria that he is a strong man and ruler. Who knows?

IMO, it's an act of patriotism

Patrio what? Germans are not patriots. We think normally idiots govern our country. This has to do with Hitler.

I'm a German, and I'm a patriot.

Don't be ridiculous. The only patriots in Germany are the Bavarians. All other "patriots" are pseudo Nazis.

Go figure. Don't tell me what I am supposed to feel towards my country.

You call your Germany every second day a "shit country", isn't it? And after a while you think - "life in other countries is also not better."

to admit misdeeds in our history.

We are the only people on the whole planet, who are doing so.

There are never entire peoples who do this or that. There are different views on patriotism and nationalism within any people.

Sophisticated bullshit. We are fanatics in context "truth" - not only in case of our enemeis - also in case of our friends and also in case of us own. If we are not able to be so then we get depressions. Better to be an asshole than to be depressive, isn't it, "Adrenalinbolzen"?

Some people seem to believe you either have to love your country and whitewash its history, or you have to hate it and wallow in guilt ...

?

? Do you have reading problems?

I say both approaches are silly.

?

?

You can love your country,

Germany? Why shouId I? Germans murdered a big part of my German family.

Who said you should?

:lol:

love the good sides

Which good sides?

For starters, Germany is among the top 15 countries in the world on most rankings, when it comes to quality of life,

And? Helps this the frogs which our mayor had "murdered" about five years ago, because he is an idiot who knows only somehting about business but not about life?

public health, freedom of speech,

A strange thing that I have not the feeling my right of free speech is realized in Germany.

democratic standards, equality of wealth

Equality of what? ... In Germany? ... Are you sure you live on planet Earth?

and so on ...

... to make it short, life is pretty good in Germany, compared to most other countries on this planet.

And what do you know now about the life in Namibia? Nearly nothing - isn't it? I heard it is not bad there.

as much as you take responsibility for the bad sides,

Which bad sides?

For example, admitting that colonialism was not a good thing,

It was what it was. William II made for example Ireland free and Hitler made India free. Does this mean William II and Hitler were nice men?

and, of course, everything that happened between 1933 and 1945 in this country is not exactly a good example,

?

including the Holocaust on 6 million Jews and starting a world war that resulted in the death of ca. 40 million people.

Stalin and Hitler started world war 2 together in the secret part of the Ribbentrop-Molotow-Pact where they both together decided to eliminate Poland again.

especially when you're not personally responsible.

?

I was born long after German colonialism and Nazi rule, so I can't say I'm personally responsible for any of these crimes. Got it?

So why do you pay money for the crimes of the Prussian emperor Wiliam II and the commander Lothar von Trotha and his army of 15,000 men?

 
Last edited:

52ndStreet

Gold Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2008
Messages
3,377
Reaction score
456
Points
130
Yes , they made roads, brought their legal system, yet billions were stolen in the form of natural resources, and are still being stolen. !
Not so from Germans in Namibia - as far as I know - nor in any other of the colonies of the totally stupid Prussian emperor over Germany, the Brit William II. The investments in colonies from Germany had been always higher than the profits as far as I heard.

This money could have been used in the African countries from which they were stolen.

Money? Stolen? In Africa? From native Africans? ... Hmmm ... As far as I know stole the Arabs complete villages and the Brits sold this slaves in the USA. This was in a time when for example the Bey of Algier made also Europeans in masses to slaves in Arabia. Ever heard anything about why and how the USA stopped this idiots in Algier?


Millions still living in poverty from this European theft
That is still going on today.!

Any concrete example? And how much money do you like to get from Arabs and other Asians and/or Africans who were also slave hunterers and/or had fought for British and other salve traders?

So don't try to say
?
they built roads and brought their legal system.

Not only this. One of the main roots of all modern civilisations in the world is Europe.

The damage has been done, and is still being done.

One moment please: Do you like to say we can get some Herero and Nama from time to time as gladiators for our not existing circusses in the dead country Bohemia, where no German lives any longer from the millions, who had once lived there, wimp? How much money?



PS: As far as I heard was once deployed here the second Nubian legion under our Roman ancestors. Perhaps it is a good idea to continue this tradition. How many Herero and Nama like to be soldiers in a NATO-army which we can use worldwide in international missions against terrorists? We have anyway to increase our military budget - so perhaps this could be a good idea for you to get more money - and for the world to get more security.

Namibia has many Diamond feilds, copper , and zinc, and natural gas feilds. Billions of dollars worth of these natural resources were stolen from Namibia. Do the research sir. I need not have to tell you these historical facts.?! This theft is still happening today.!!
 

zaangalewa

Gold Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2015
Messages
10,951
Reaction score
883
Points
140
Yes , they made roads, brought their legal system, yet billions were stolen in the form of natural resources, and are still being stolen. !
Not so from Germans in Namibia - as far as I know - nor in any other of the colonies of the totally stupid Prussian emperor over Germany, the Brit William II. The investments in colonies from Germany had been always higher than the profits as far as I heard.

This money could have been used in the African countries from which they were stolen.

Money? Stolen? In Africa? From native Africans? ... Hmmm ... As far as I know stole the Arabs complete villages and the Brits sold this slaves in the USA. This was in a time when for example the Bey of Algier made also Europeans in masses to slaves in Arabia. Ever heard anything about why and how the USA stopped this idiots in Algier?


Millions still living in poverty from this European theft
That is still going on today.!

Any concrete example? And how much money do you like to get from Arabs and other Asians and/or Africans who were also slave hunterers and/or had fought for British and other salve traders?

So don't try to say
?
they built roads and brought their legal system.

Not only this. One of the main roots of all modern civilisations in the world is Europe.

The damage has been done, and is still being done.

One moment please: Do you like to say we can get some Herero and Nama from time to time as gladiators for our not existing circusses in the dead country Bohemia, where no German lives any longer from the millions, who had once lived there, wimp? How much money?



PS: As far as I heard was once deployed here the second Nubian legion under our Roman ancestors. Perhaps it is a good idea to continue this tradition. How many Herero and Nama like to be soldiers in a NATO-army which we can use worldwide in international missions against terrorists? We have anyway to increase our military budget - so perhaps this could be a good idea for you to get more money - and for the world to get more security.

Namibia has many Diamond feilds, copper , and zinc, and natural gas feilds.
So what?
Billions of dollars worth of these natural resources were stolen from Namibia.

Really? As far as I heard it werer agricultural products which came once from Namibia.

Do the research sir.

Hmmm ... will not be easy two and a half world wars later ... and in an atmosphere which is full of nonsense in all questions around colonialism and full of idiocies about everything what has to do with Germany. ... Oh - it is easy: The first German seddlers there made mixed farming - specially cattle breeding was important. They also experimented with Merino and Karakul sheeps.

Important were also diamonds and copper. In this context it was impossible to use cars and lorries in Namibia in this time of history - so more than 2000 km railroads were made ... and about 4000 km lines for telegraphy and/or telephone.

And as far as I can see this all was totally normal business - without any form of slavery or thievery. The Europeans in Namibia had to follow the German laws and the indigen population had their own system of justice.

I need not have to tell you these historical facts.?! This theft is still happening today.!!

What is happening today in Namibia? ...
 
Last edited:

52ndStreet

Gold Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2008
Messages
3,377
Reaction score
456
Points
130
The South African Apartheid racists have been moving to Namibia. They call it South West Africa. That's whats been happening.
 

zaangalewa

Gold Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2015
Messages
10,951
Reaction score
883
Points
140
The South African Apartheid racists have been moving to Namibia. They call it South West Africa. That's whats been happening.

What you perhaps don't know: The South West Africa Company Limited (Deutsch: "Südwestafrikanische Gesellschaft") was not a German company. It had been a company from London under British law and the owners had been Brits. Since 1900 it was only under control of the Prussian Government over Germany in Berlin. And after Germany had lost her ¿British exploited? colony the South West Africa Company Limited continued to do whatever they had done there.

I would not be astonished if "the Brits" - whoever they had been in this concrete situation - had caused this desaster within South West Africa. I always said for example emperor William II - a Prussian and a Brit - destroyed Germany with only one sentence. It was a sentence of the so called "Hun speech". (It had been by the way also a totally stupid British idea to call Germans "Huns" - but as I said yet: the Brit William II had been educated there.) This sentence had been "Gefangene werden nicht gemacht" = "No prisoners will be taken".
With such an u-n-b-e-l-i-e-v-a-b-l-e order to be murderers this damned criminal high traitor had sent soldiers to China, who had to support the Brits in their drug trades for the free trade of opium in China. As far as I remember I read once one of the commanders in China in context of this wrong mission had been a man with the name "Lothar von Trotha", who will had been sent later to the only colony with German seddlers in the world: South West Africa.
 
Last edited:

52ndStreet

Gold Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2008
Messages
3,377
Reaction score
456
Points
130
What is your point. I just told you that racist white South Africans have been migrating to Namibia for the past 40 to 50 years now.!!
 

USMB Server Goals

Total amount
$350.00
Goal
$350.00

New Topics

Most reactions - Past 7 days

Forum List

Top