Gays Should STOP Defending Islam

[RWNJ]

Talk about a logical disconnect...

Gays Should STOP Defending Islam - Geller Report

The logical disconnect is in your head when you lump 1.8 billion Muslims together.

I did no such thing. I was commenting about Islam. Which just happens to have 1.8 billion followers. Most of them follow the Quran, which DEMANDS the death of gays. If you lived in a Muslim country, you would have no choice but to follow that command, since they would kill you for not doing so.

 

[Hum Dinger]

What is it the Christian bible says about homoseuxals...


If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. (Leviticus 20:13)

One question for the Christians out there:

Isn't the Christian Bible divided into 2 parts? The New Testament and the Old Testament?

If you're a 'Christian' you should only pay attention to the New Testament. The only part of the Old Testament that is pertinent to a Christian is the 10 Commandments. That's because "Jesus Taught the Law of Moses".

The Old Testament is a long drawn out history of the Jewish people. You can support just about any argument from something in the Old Testament. Even Hitler used quotes form the Old Testament to justify his views.

No it doesn't work like that.

And anybody can take biblical text out of context and justify anything with it.

Christians do not use only the NT. Children learn both OT and NT verses in Sunday school, and we do not discount the OT at all.

But we also know and understand the OT because we study it, and we study the NT, and we look at them as comprehensively as we can...we take into account context and history and the nature of God and prophecy. There are layers upon layers of understanding. The OT is used to illuminate the NT and to give background and to confirm it. The NT is full of biblical references to the OT and the OT deals with prophesies and wisdom that enlighten us.

I was raised as a Christian as well and know that the OT is taught along with the NT.

But what I'm asking isn't how Christianity is taught. I'm asking (or stating rather) that Christians giving creedence to the OT is basically a extreme mistake. There is a REASON why the Bible is divided into the OT and the NT. That's because for a Christian, the OT is obsolete, except for giving a historical context to the NT.

The OT is not obsolete. Christians do not believe it's obsolete.

I know that Christians do not believe it's obsolete, but Christians SHOULD believe it's obsolete.

Do the words 'Old' and 'New' mean anything?

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Where are you guys with your Muslim/Christian comparison on the treatment of gays?

Muslims have organized and have thrown homosexuals off of buildings in the Middle East recently.

When have Christians in Americans organized and thrown gays off of buildings?

The difference is not between Christians and Muslims. It is between Theocracies and Democracies where there is a rule of law and secular government. There are indeed Christians who would like to kill gays but they are not allowed to here.

By the way, homosexuality carries criminal penalties to 76 countries and most are m=not Muslim

 

[RWNJ]

What is it the Christian bible says about homoseuxals...


If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. (Leviticus 20:13)

One question for the Christians out there:

Isn't the Christian Bible divided into 2 parts? The New Testament and the Old Testament?

If you're a 'Christian' you should only pay attention to the New Testament. The only part of the Old Testament that is pertinent to a Christian is the 10 Commandments. That's because "Jesus Taught the Law of Moses".

The Old Testament is a long drawn out history of the Jewish people. You can support just about any argument from something in the Old Testament. Even Hitler used quotes form the Old Testament to justify his views.

No it doesn't work like that.

And anybody can take biblical text out of context and justify anything with it.

Christians do not use only the NT. Children learn both OT and NT verses in Sunday school, and we do not discount the OT at all.

But we also know and understand the OT because we study it, and we study the NT, and we look at them as comprehensively as we can...we take into account context and history and the nature of God and prophecy. There are layers upon layers of understanding. The OT is used to illuminate the NT and to give background and to confirm it. The NT is full of biblical references to the OT and the OT deals with prophesies and wisdom that enlighten us.

I was raised as a Christian as well and know that the OT is taught along with the NT.

But what I'm asking isn't how Christianity is taught. I'm asking (or stating rather) that Christians giving creedence to the OT is basically a extreme mistake. There is a REASON why the Bible is divided into the OT and the NT. That's because for a Christian, the OT is obsolete, except for giving a historical context to the NT.

The OT is not obsolete. Christians do not believe it's obsolete.

I know that Christians do not believe it's obsolete, but Christians SHOULD believe it's obsolete.

Do the words 'Old' and 'New' mean anything?

The Ten Commandments are Old Testament. Are you saying that they are no longer valid?

 

[Reasonable]

Talk about a logical disconnect...

Gays Should STOP Defending Islam - Geller Report

The logical disconnect is in your head when you lump 1.8 billion Muslims together.

I did no such thing. I was commenting about Islam. Which just happens to have 1.8 billion followers. Most of them follow the Quran, which DEMANDS the death of gays. If you lived in a Muslim country, you would have no choice but to follow that command, since they would kill you for not doing so.

Most Muslims DO NOT DEMAND the death of gays. Many Muslims ARE gay you dumbass

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Of course they do.

Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.

Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.

Sounds like all those people are long dead and stoning in the Western world is too. Those are historical actions.

Quran (8:65) - "O Prophet, exhort the believers to fight..."
Quran (9:123) - "O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."

Sahih Bukhari (52:220) - Allah's Apostle said... 'I have been made victorious with terror'
Do you see a time frame? Those Jews killed certain people, when they were dead that was that. What do you see that indicates those things from Islam have historical context?

Abu Dawud (14:2527) - The Prophet said: Striving in the path of Allah (jihad) is incumbent on you along with every ruler, whether he is pious or impious

The one above implies forever.

The bible didn't change though did it? We used to use the same bible to stone adulterers and justify slavery. Golly, could it be cultural and not religious?

The Bible does not, in any way, condone slavery. And the ones who used it to do so were Godless Liberals. Doing what they do best. Lying.

You've obviously never read it.

How the Bible was used to justify slavery, abolitionism

Irrelevant. The Bible does not endorse slavery. Those who claim that it does are not Christians, because the Bible clearly condemns slavery. It actually called for the death of anyone who practiced it. And before you make yourself look like a complete idiot by claiming that the Bible does support slavery, keep in mind that that the slavery it mentions is, for all intents and purposes, indentured servitude. Which, BTW, is not at all similar to modern slavery. The Bible calls that man-stealing, and condemns it in no uncertain terms.

The Bible has a list of rules and regulations for how to treat slaves. How is that not an endorsement?

Please provide the passage from the Bible that condemns slavery.

 

[RWNJ]

Talk about a logical disconnect...

Gays Should STOP Defending Islam - Geller Report

The logical disconnect is in your head when you lump 1.8 billion Muslims together.

I did no such thing. I was commenting about Islam. Which just happens to have 1.8 billion followers. Most of them follow the Quran, which DEMANDS the death of gays. If you lived in a Muslim country, you would have no choice but to follow that command, since they would kill you for not doing so.

Most Muslims DO NOT DEMAND the death of gays. Many Muslims ARE gay you dumbass

Islam condemns homosexuals, and demands their death. If a Muslim claims to be gay, they are not really a Muslim. Just like someone who sleeps around cannot be a Christian. Neither one is obeying what their religion teaches, you dumbass.

 

[koshergrl]

Sounds like all those people are long dead and stoning in the Western world is too. Those are historical actions.

Quran (8:65) - "O Prophet, exhort the believers to fight..."
Quran (9:123) - "O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."

Sahih Bukhari (52:220) - Allah's Apostle said... 'I have been made victorious with terror'
Do you see a time frame? Those Jews killed certain people, when they were dead that was that. What do you see that indicates those things from Islam have historical context?

Abu Dawud (14:2527) - The Prophet said: Striving in the path of Allah (jihad) is incumbent on you along with every ruler, whether he is pious or impious

The one above implies forever.

The bible didn't change though did it? We used to use the same bible to stone adulterers and justify slavery. Golly, could it be cultural and not religious?

The Bible does not, in any way, condone slavery. And the ones who used it to do so were Godless Liberals. Doing what they do best. Lying.

You've obviously never read it.

How the Bible was used to justify slavery, abolitionism

Irrelevant. The Bible does not endorse slavery. Those who claim that it does are not Christians, because the Bible clearly condemns slavery. It actually called for the death of anyone who practiced it. And before you make yourself look like a complete idiot by claiming that the Bible does support slavery, keep in mind that that the slavery it mentions is, for all intents and purposes, indentured servitude. Which, BTW, is not at all similar to modern slavery. The Bible calls that man-stealing, and condemns it in no uncertain terms.

The Bible has a list of rules and regulations for how to treat slaves. How is that not an endorsement?

Please provide the passage from the Bible that condemns slavery.

The bible doesn't condemn slavery.
However biblical slaves had particular rights that we don't associate with slaves today.
And the Bible told God's people to release slaves every 7 years, btw.

 

[koshergrl]

What is it the Christian bible says about homoseuxals...


If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. (Leviticus 20:13)

One question for the Christians out there:

Isn't the Christian Bible divided into 2 parts? The New Testament and the Old Testament?

If you're a 'Christian' you should only pay attention to the New Testament. The only part of the Old Testament that is pertinent to a Christian is the 10 Commandments. That's because "Jesus Taught the Law of Moses".

The Old Testament is a long drawn out history of the Jewish people. You can support just about any argument from something in the Old Testament. Even Hitler used quotes form the Old Testament to justify his views.

No it doesn't work like that.

And anybody can take biblical text out of context and justify anything with it.

Christians do not use only the NT. Children learn both OT and NT verses in Sunday school, and we do not discount the OT at all.

But we also know and understand the OT because we study it, and we study the NT, and we look at them as comprehensively as we can...we take into account context and history and the nature of God and prophecy. There are layers upon layers of understanding. The OT is used to illuminate the NT and to give background and to confirm it. The NT is full of biblical references to the OT and the OT deals with prophesies and wisdom that enlighten us.

I was raised as a Christian as well and know that the OT is taught along with the NT.

But what I'm asking isn't how Christianity is taught. I'm asking (or stating rather) that Christians giving creedence to the OT is basically a extreme mistake. There is a REASON why the Bible is divided into the OT and the NT. That's because for a Christian, the OT is obsolete, except for giving a historical context to the NT.

The OT is not obsolete. Christians do not believe it's obsolete.

I know that Christians do not believe it's obsolete, but Christians SHOULD believe it's obsolete.

Do the words 'Old' and 'New' mean anything?

No, Christians should not believe it's obsolete, because it isn't. The Holy Spirit exists in the scripture..both Old and New testaments. It is holy in and of itself as the Word.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Talk about a logical disconnect...

Gays Should STOP Defending Islam - Geller Report

The logical disconnect is in your head when you lump 1.8 billion Muslims together.

I did no such thing. I was commenting about Islam. Which just happens to have 1.8 billion followers. Most of them follow the Quran, which DEMANDS the death of gays. If you lived in a Muslim country, you would have no choice but to follow that command, since they would kill you for not doing so.

While it seems to be true that all of the countries that have a legal death penalty for being gay are majority Muslim ( with the exception of Nigeria which is equally split between Christianity and Islam) there is more acceptance for homosexuality among Muslims that there is among Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, and Evangelical Christin's Religious Landscape Study

So, the premise of this thread, that gays should not defend Muslims is stupid and a lie.

 

[Reasonable]

Talk about a logical disconnect...

Gays Should STOP Defending Islam - Geller Report

The logical disconnect is in your head when you lump 1.8 billion Muslims together.

I did no such thing. I was commenting about Islam. Which just happens to have 1.8 billion followers. Most of them follow the Quran, which DEMANDS the death of gays. If you lived in a Muslim country, you would have no choice but to follow that command, since they would kill you for not doing so.

Most Muslims DO NOT DEMAND the death of gays. Many Muslims ARE gay you dumbass

Islam condemns homosexuals, and demands their death. If a Muslim claims to be gay, they are not really a Muslim. Just like someone who sleeps around cannot be a Christian. Neither one is obeying what their religion teaches, you dumbass.

There are many practicing Muslims in the US that are gay, moron.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Talk about a logical disconnect...

Gays Should STOP Defending Islam - Geller Report

The logical disconnect is in your head when you lump 1.8 billion Muslims together.

I did no such thing. I was commenting about Islam. Which just happens to have 1.8 billion followers. Most of them follow the Quran, which DEMANDS the death of gays. If you lived in a Muslim country, you would have no choice but to follow that command, since they would kill you for not doing so.

Most Muslims DO NOT DEMAND the death of gays. Many Muslims ARE gay you dumbass

Islam condemns homosexuals, and demands their death. If a Muslim claims to be gay, they are not really a Muslim. Just like someone who sleeps around cannot be a Christian. Neither one is obeying what their religion teaches, you dumbass.

There are many practicing Muslims in the US that are gay, moron.

He is calling you a dumb ass?? Not only is he the dumbass, but he is a dishonest dumbass. The people who are pushing the premise of the OP do not give a **** about gays. They just use it for an excuse to bash Muslims.

 

[Lastamender]

Talk about a logical disconnect...

Gays Should STOP Defending Islam - Geller Report

The logical disconnect is in your head when you lump 1.8 billion Muslims together.

I did no such thing. I was commenting about Islam. Which just happens to have 1.8 billion followers. Most of them follow the Quran, which DEMANDS the death of gays. If you lived in a Muslim country, you would have no choice but to follow that command, since they would kill you for not doing so.

Most Muslims DO NOT DEMAND the death of gays. Many Muslims ARE gay you dumbass

Islam condemns homosexuals, and demands their death. If a Muslim claims to be gay, they are not really a Muslim. Just like someone who sleeps around cannot be a Christian. Neither one is obeying what their religion teaches, you dumbass.

There are many practicing Muslims in the US that are gay, moron.

Who cares, that does not change the fact gays are killed in Islamic countries. Gays should speak against Islam.

 

[Lastamender]

The logical disconnect is in your head when you lump 1.8 billion Muslims together.

I did no such thing. I was commenting about Islam. Which just happens to have 1.8 billion followers. Most of them follow the Quran, which DEMANDS the death of gays. If you lived in a Muslim country, you would have no choice but to follow that command, since they would kill you for not doing so.

Most Muslims DO NOT DEMAND the death of gays. Many Muslims ARE gay you dumbass

Islam condemns homosexuals, and demands their death. If a Muslim claims to be gay, they are not really a Muslim. Just like someone who sleeps around cannot be a Christian. Neither one is obeying what their religion teaches, you dumbass.

There are many practicing Muslims in the US that are gay, moron.

He is calling you a dumb ass?? Not only is he the dumbass, but he is a dishonest dumbass. The people who are pushing the premise of the OP do not give a **** about gays. They just use it for an excuse to bash Muslims.

Take a look at Islam and tell me why you would not bash it? Do you have any idea what is says? And I bash Islam not Muslims.

 

[RWNJ]

The bible didn't change though did it? We used to use the same bible to stone adulterers and justify slavery. Golly, could it be cultural and not religious?

The Bible does not, in any way, condone slavery. And the ones who used it to do so were Godless Liberals. Doing what they do best. Lying.

You've obviously never read it.

How the Bible was used to justify slavery, abolitionism

Irrelevant. The Bible does not endorse slavery. Those who claim that it does are not Christians, because the Bible clearly condemns slavery. It actually called for the death of anyone who practiced it. And before you make yourself look like a complete idiot by claiming that the Bible does support slavery, keep in mind that that the slavery it mentions is, for all intents and purposes, indentured servitude. Which, BTW, is not at all similar to modern slavery. The Bible calls that man-stealing, and condemns it in no uncertain terms.

The Bible has a list of rules and regulations for how to treat slaves. How is that not an endorsement?

Please provide the passage from the Bible that condemns slavery.

The bible doesn't condemn slavery.
However biblical slaves had particular rights that we don't associate with slaves today.
And the Bible told God's people to release slaves every 7 years, btw.

The Bible DOES condemn slavery. Once again, the slavery mentioned in Scripture is not at all similar to modern slavery. In fact, people used to voluntarily enter into indentured servitude if they could not support their family. Someone would allow them to work for them while supporting them and their family. There were also those who could not pay a debt. In that case, it wasn't voluntary, and they were released once the debt was paid. But the Bible does indeed condemn modern slavery, where people are considered property.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

The Bible does not, in any way, condone slavery. And the ones who used it to do so were Godless Liberals. Doing what they do best. Lying.

You've obviously never read it.

How the Bible was used to justify slavery, abolitionism

Irrelevant. The Bible does not endorse slavery. Those who claim that it does are not Christians, because the Bible clearly condemns slavery. It actually called for the death of anyone who practiced it. And before you make yourself look like a complete idiot by claiming that the Bible does support slavery, keep in mind that that the slavery it mentions is, for all intents and purposes, indentured servitude. Which, BTW, is not at all similar to modern slavery. The Bible calls that man-stealing, and condemns it in no uncertain terms.

The Bible has a list of rules and regulations for how to treat slaves. How is that not an endorsement?

Please provide the passage from the Bible that condemns slavery.

The bible doesn't condemn slavery.
However biblical slaves had particular rights that we don't associate with slaves today.
And the Bible told God's people to release slaves every 7 years, btw.

The Bible DOES condemn slavery. Once again, the slavery mentioned in Scripture is not at all similar to modern slavery. In fact, people used to voluntarily enter into indentured servitude if they could not support their family. Someone would allow them to work for them while supporting them and their family. There were also those who could not pay a debt. In that case, it wasn't voluntary, and they were released once the debt was paid. But the Bible does indeed condemn modern slavery, where people are considered property.

Then please provide the passage from the Bible condoning slavery.

 

[Seawytch]

Of course they do.

Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.

Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.

Sounds like all those people are long dead and stoning in the Western world is too. Those are historical actions.

Quran (8:65) - "O Prophet, exhort the believers to fight..."
Quran (9:123) - "O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."

Sahih Bukhari (52:220) - Allah's Apostle said... 'I have been made victorious with terror'
Do you see a time frame? Those Jews killed certain people, when they were dead that was that. What do you see that indicates those things from Islam have historical context?

Abu Dawud (14:2527) - The Prophet said: Striving in the path of Allah (jihad) is incumbent on you along with every ruler, whether he is pious or impious

The one above implies forever.

The bible didn't change though did it? We used to use the same bible to stone adulterers and justify slavery. Golly, could it be cultural and not religious?

The Bible does not, in any way, condone slavery. And the ones who used it to do so were Godless Liberals. Doing what they do best. Lying.

You've obviously never read it.

How the Bible was used to justify slavery, abolitionism

Irrelevant. The Bible does not endorse slavery. Those who claim that it does are not Christians, because the Bible clearly condemns slavery. It actually called for the death of anyone who practiced it. And before you make yourself look like a complete idiot by claiming that the Bible does support slavery, keep in mind that that the slavery it mentions is, for all intents and purposes, indentured servitude. Which, BTW, is not at all similar to modern slavery. The Bible calls that man-stealing, and condemns it in no uncertain terms.

Those that supported/support slavery and segregation felt that passages in the bible supported their position. That you don't agree with their position is irrelevant.

"Is Segregation Scriptural?" by Bob Jones Sr, 1960

I don't believe the bible justifies not baking a wedding cake, but many here argue it does.

 

[Seawytch]

The Bible does not, in any way, condone slavery. And the ones who used it to do so were Godless Liberals. Doing what they do best. Lying.

You've obviously never read it.

How the Bible was used to justify slavery, abolitionism

Irrelevant. The Bible does not endorse slavery. Those who claim that it does are not Christians, because the Bible clearly condemns slavery. It actually called for the death of anyone who practiced it. And before you make yourself look like a complete idiot by claiming that the Bible does support slavery, keep in mind that that the slavery it mentions is, for all intents and purposes, indentured servitude. Which, BTW, is not at all similar to modern slavery. The Bible calls that man-stealing, and condemns it in no uncertain terms.

The Bible has a list of rules and regulations for how to treat slaves. How is that not an endorsement?

Please provide the passage from the Bible that condemns slavery.

The bible doesn't condemn slavery.
However biblical slaves had particular rights that we don't associate with slaves today.
And the Bible told God's people to release slaves every 7 years, btw.

The Bible DOES condemn slavery. Once again, the slavery mentioned in Scripture is not at all similar to modern slavery. In fact, people used to voluntarily enter into indentured servitude if they could not support their family. Someone would allow them to work for them while supporting them and their family. There were also those who could not pay a debt. In that case, it wasn't voluntary, and they were released once the debt was paid. But the Bible does indeed condemn modern slavery, where people are considered property.

Cite the bible verses that condemn slavery.

 

[Seawytch]

All three do that. Thanks for playing.

Sorry none of the others have open ended commands to kill like the Koran, and I am not playing.

Of course they do.

Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.

Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.

Sounds like all those people are long dead and stoning in the Western world is too. Those are historical actions.

Quran (8:65) - "O Prophet, exhort the believers to fight..."
Quran (9:123) - "O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."

Sahih Bukhari (52:220) - Allah's Apostle said... 'I have been made victorious with terror'
Do you see a time frame? Those Jews killed certain people, when they were dead that was that. What do you see that indicates those things from Islam have historical context?

Abu Dawud (14:2527) - The Prophet said: Striving in the path of Allah (jihad) is incumbent on you along with every ruler, whether he is pious or impious

The one above implies forever.

The bible didn't change though did it? We used to use the same bible to stone adulterers and justify slavery. Golly, could it be cultural and not religious?

Do we do either? Islam is different and dangerous to anything that is not Islamic.

We DID...and used the bible to justify it all. The bible didn't change.

 

[koshergrl]

You've obviously never read it.

How the Bible was used to justify slavery, abolitionism

Irrelevant. The Bible does not endorse slavery. Those who claim that it does are not Christians, because the Bible clearly condemns slavery. It actually called for the death of anyone who practiced it. And before you make yourself look like a complete idiot by claiming that the Bible does support slavery, keep in mind that that the slavery it mentions is, for all intents and purposes, indentured servitude. Which, BTW, is not at all similar to modern slavery. The Bible calls that man-stealing, and condemns it in no uncertain terms.

The Bible has a list of rules and regulations for how to treat slaves. How is that not an endorsement?

Please provide the passage from the Bible that condemns slavery.

The bible doesn't condemn slavery.
However biblical slaves had particular rights that we don't associate with slaves today.
And the Bible told God's people to release slaves every 7 years, btw.

The Bible DOES condemn slavery. Once again, the slavery mentioned in Scripture is not at all similar to modern slavery. In fact, people used to voluntarily enter into indentured servitude if they could not support their family. Someone would allow them to work for them while supporting them and their family. There were also those who could not pay a debt. In that case, it wasn't voluntary, and they were released once the debt was paid. But the Bible does indeed condemn modern slavery, where people are considered property.

Then please provide the passage from the Bible condoning slavery.

Paul tells slaves to obey their earthly masters..but again...the slaves in Paul's time were Roman slaves, mostly prisoners of war..and generally eligible to hold property and to be freed (or purchase their own freedom) after a certain amount of time.

Christianity was considered a *slave* religion, btw.