Freedom Of Expression In France

[westwall]

When one reads the actual documents of the Einsatzgruppen in the Bundesarchiv, it is quite clear that it really happened. No matter how far you wish to bury your head in the sand.

The Einsatzgruppen's main job was to kill bolshevik communists.

Most of the Russian communists were jews and the sworn enemies of Germany.

So all the Einsatzgruppen was doing was killing the enemy.

That they happened to be jews had nothing to do with it.

Absolutely wrong. The stated goal of the Einsatzgruppen was the elimination of Jews, Gypsies, and Political Commisars in the captured areas. They kept detailed records of the ammunition expended and the number of people killed (because as one of their Kripos put it "we wouldn't treat our dogs this way") so that they could get extra R&R.

Your understanding of history is crap.

 

[westwall]

Clearly you don't know about the environment effect to human biology. So please do more research.

A small example, the plague by itself changed the biology of whole europe back in the days.

More reading for you...

your statement is IDIOTIC the plague changed nothing there are some theories that some people who SURVIVED the plague did so because they were able ---based on their physiology, to withstand the specific bacerium YERSINNIA PESTIS ----thus more people who could not withstand Yersinnia pestis died than did those who could----that fact does not come close to CHANGING HUMAN BIOLOGY in any significant way

there are a lot more examples of population adaptation than that little one For example----in areas with lots of MALARIA there are more cases of HEMOGLOBINOPATHIES like THALASSEMIA than in places with less malaria-----because the bug needs healthy red blood cells for survival ------but no one in his right mind would describe that fact as PEOPLE ARE NOT THE SAME over there in the area of the MEDITERRNEAN------basically they are about the same as people from New Jersey. Stop playing with ideas that confuse you

Human culture is a part of the human evolution and it effects our biology. Metro dogs in russia changed in their physical appearance in just one generation, simply by migrating to a different environment, cultural area. Apes in different behavioral environments end up being different from their relatives and guess what, in a physical way. If the population is aggressive because the food sources are less in the environment which causes them to be fighting for it all the time, which makes the stronger males more dominant in the population, which ends up having males with more body size than a more peaceful population who doesn't need to fight for food much and parental behavior is more advantageous, which makes body size go down.

So your humans(!?) are so apart from all living things in the nature, they just stay as they are? You have to rethink that part of your logic...

You're describing natural selection, not biological changes. When stresses occur to a ecological system, those that have an advantage survive. Those that don't, die off. The biology doesn't change in the slightest.

Your ascribing changes to dogs is yet another example of natural selection. It was better for a dog to be smaller in the environment you describe so the dogs that were bigger died off before they could breed, the smaller dogs remained. Biology is the same. Just the genes of the individual animals were slightly different.

Kind of like how some people are ugly and some are cute.

 

[westwall]

again Alpine----you are being stupid you do not know my credentials if professor salpolsky has stated that the fact that some people survived the bubonic plague because of a genetic mutation they happened to carry and the fact that this particular genetic mutation became MORE prevalent in the gene pool BECAUSE of that survival advantage and THIS PHENOMENON is an example of HUMAN EVOLUTION----then he is right. If he claims that humans of today are not comparable in physiology to humans of a thousand years ago and that there have been GROSS alterations in the human gene pool and thus in human physiology ----then he is NUTS

Sapolsky says, if you claim people(biologically) are the same as they were 1000 years ago, then sorry but you don't have any credentials as far as the biology is concerned.

Its your pick...

The question is would people 1000 years ago be able to breed with people of today and that answer is yes. If the good doctors statements were true, then the answer would be no.

 

[alpine]

again Alpine----you are being stupid you do not know my credentials if professor salpolsky has stated that the fact that some people survived the bubonic plague because of a genetic mutation they happened to carry and the fact that this particular genetic mutation became MORE prevalent in the gene pool BECAUSE of that survival advantage and THIS PHENOMENON is an example of HUMAN EVOLUTION----then he is right. If he claims that humans of today are not comparable in physiology to humans of a thousand years ago and that there have been GROSS alterations in the human gene pool and thus in human physiology ----then he is NUTS

Sapolsky says, if you claim people(biologically) are the same as they were 1000 years ago, then sorry but you don't have any credentials as far as the biology is concerned.

Its your pick...

The question is would people 1000 years ago be able to breed with people of today and that answer is yes. If the good doctors statements were true, then the answer would be no.

The question is obvious in my original post. Are they the same, biologically. There is no remark of "breeding" nor "physiology".

The answer is "no, they are not". Because environment shapes human and its biology and its behavior. It is a feedback loop between environment and biology of human that makes us whatever we are. Our modern society is a result of our changing environment and therefore biology and therefore thinking and behavior.

This is what Sapolsky claims and there are extensive scientific evidence to back this claim up. Anybody who wants more information on this subject can watch online classes from stanford university.

 

[alpine]

your statement is IDIOTIC the plague changed nothing there are some theories that some people who SURVIVED the plague did so because they were able ---based on their physiology, to withstand the specific bacerium YERSINNIA PESTIS ----thus more people who could not withstand Yersinnia pestis died than did those who could----that fact does not come close to CHANGING HUMAN BIOLOGY in any significant way

there are a lot more examples of population adaptation than that little one For example----in areas with lots of MALARIA there are more cases of HEMOGLOBINOPATHIES like THALASSEMIA than in places with less malaria-----because the bug needs healthy red blood cells for survival ------but no one in his right mind would describe that fact as PEOPLE ARE NOT THE SAME over there in the area of the MEDITERRNEAN------basically they are about the same as people from New Jersey. Stop playing with ideas that confuse you

Human culture is a part of the human evolution and it effects our biology. Metro dogs in russia changed in their physical appearance in just one generation, simply by migrating to a different environment, cultural area. Apes in different behavioral environments end up being different from their relatives and guess what, in a physical way. If the population is aggressive because the food sources are less in the environment which causes them to be fighting for it all the time, which makes the stronger males more dominant in the population, which ends up having males with more body size than a more peaceful population who doesn't need to fight for food much and parental behavior is more advantageous, which makes body size go down.

So your humans(!?) are so apart from all living things in the nature, they just stay as they are? You have to rethink that part of your logic...

You're describing natural selection, not biological changes. When stresses occur to a ecological system, those that have an advantage survive. Those that don't, die off. The biology doesn't change in the slightest.

Your ascribing changes to dogs is yet another example of natural selection. It was better for a dog to be smaller in the environment you describe so the dogs that were bigger died off before they could breed, the smaller dogs remained. Biology is the same. Just the genes of the individual animals were slightly different.

Kind of like how some people are ugly and some are cute.

You can check metro dogs in here

Moscow's Stray Dogs Evolving Greater Intelligence, Including a Mastery of the Subway | Popular Science

in 30 years, they simply evolved to a different physiology.

Epigenetics is what this is called. Only 5% of your dna is actually are coded genes. Rest is a complex network of switches that control expression of these genes. Same gene will act different in different environments, simple because environment has effect on these switches. Human environment starts in mothers womb, and keeps shaping him for his entire life. So culture and technology has extensive effects on how human genome will react, therefore changing its inner biology, hormones and receptors, how we feel, how we think, all together...

The way you describe it is the idea and thinking of the past science, everything being controlled by genes. I am offering you the understanding of the future, if you care...

 

[irosie91]

But say anything negative about the so called Holocaust in France and you will go to jail.

Sunni----do you lie so much because you love the rapist nabi? do you emulate the rapist?

for those who do not understand the ramblings of a nabi emulator----France suffered badly from the filth of islamo-nazism during world war II ------and it was noted that PERSISTENT NAZIS such as those criminals who escaped presecution at nuremburg by fleeing to muslim countries and in some cases embracing "the beauty" of islam----CONTINUED their careers by writing DENIALS OF THE ACTIONS OF MURDER COMITTED BY THE ISLAMO NAZIS------afterall-----they themselves were the islamo nazi criminals and the ones that got caught were being hanged -----but the MUSLIMS loved them as did the other PERSISTENT NAZIS For the reason that HOLOCAUST DENIAL was the program of persistent nazis ----countries like France and Austria and GERMANY itself out-lawed holocaust denial -------Holocaust deniers are ISLAMO NAZIS The literature written by the nazi war criminals is taught in muslim schools and mosques How do I know? ----I read the stuff in my youth------then was QUITE SHOCKED to hear it quoted chapter and verse from the mouths of PAKISTANIS and even muslims educated in India but in MUSLIM SCHOOLS The really odd thing---is that egyptian docs know it too-----but they re smart enough not to believe it Way back when I heard from pakistanis-----Iranians did not believe it either-----but now they do

 

[MJB12741]

All Western civilizations have had it with Islam.

 

[westwall]

Human culture is a part of the human evolution and it effects our biology. Metro dogs in russia changed in their physical appearance in just one generation, simply by migrating to a different environment, cultural area. Apes in different behavioral environments end up being different from their relatives and guess what, in a physical way. If the population is aggressive because the food sources are less in the environment which causes them to be fighting for it all the time, which makes the stronger males more dominant in the population, which ends up having males with more body size than a more peaceful population who doesn't need to fight for food much and parental behavior is more advantageous, which makes body size go down.

So your humans(!?) are so apart from all living things in the nature, they just stay as they are? You have to rethink that part of your logic...

You're describing natural selection, not biological changes. When stresses occur to a ecological system, those that have an advantage survive. Those that don't, die off. The biology doesn't change in the slightest.

Your ascribing changes to dogs is yet another example of natural selection. It was better for a dog to be smaller in the environment you describe so the dogs that were bigger died off before they could breed, the smaller dogs remained. Biology is the same. Just the genes of the individual animals were slightly different.

Kind of like how some people are ugly and some are cute.

You can check metro dogs in here

Moscow's Stray Dogs Evolving Greater Intelligence, Including a Mastery of the Subway | Popular Science

in 30 years, they simply evolved to a different physiology.

Epigenetics is what this is called. Only 5% of your dna is actually are coded genes. Rest is a complex network of switches that control expression of these genes. Same gene will act different in different environments, simple because environment has effect on these switches. Human environment starts in mothers womb, and keeps shaping him for his entire life. So culture and technology has extensive effects on how human genome will react, therefore changing its inner biology, hormones and receptors, how we feel, how we think, all together...

The way you describe it is the idea and thinking of the past science, everything being controlled by genes. I am offering you the understanding of the future, if you care...

Coyotes in Los Angeles are exactly the same. The dumb ones die by automobile so the smart ones remain. They have learned the river systems so they can transit wherever they wish, they know the neighborhoods with the most cats so have plenty to eat etc.

This is nothing new at all.

 

[irosie91]

the evolutionary changes in DOGS cannot be compared with Human evolution The environmental pressures on dogs ----are ENTIRELY different from that on humans in the past 1000 years In fact one of the most significant genetic pressures on dogs is SELECTIVE BREEDING Domesticated animals do not BREED FREELY-----their mates are chosen based on those traits deemed desirable by their human owners Wild animals are generally subject to a different set of pressures than HUMANS within HUMAN SOCIETY where the young are cared for AND the elderly are cared for

 

[alpine]

You're describing natural selection, not biological changes. When stresses occur to a ecological system, those that have an advantage survive. Those that don't, die off. The biology doesn't change in the slightest.

Your ascribing changes to dogs is yet another example of natural selection. It was better for a dog to be smaller in the environment you describe so the dogs that were bigger died off before they could breed, the smaller dogs remained. Biology is the same. Just the genes of the individual animals were slightly different.

Kind of like how some people are ugly and some are cute.

You can check metro dogs in here

Moscow's Stray Dogs Evolving Greater Intelligence, Including a Mastery of the Subway | Popular Science

in 30 years, they simply evolved to a different physiology.

Epigenetics is what this is called. Only 5% of your dna is actually are coded genes. Rest is a complex network of switches that control expression of these genes. Same gene will act different in different environments, simple because environment has effect on these switches. Human environment starts in mothers womb, and keeps shaping him for his entire life. So culture and technology has extensive effects on how human genome will react, therefore changing its inner biology, hormones and receptors, how we feel, how we think, all together...

The way you describe it is the idea and thinking of the past science, everything being controlled by genes. I am offering you the understanding of the future, if you care...

Coyotes in Los Angeles are exactly the same. The dumb ones die by automobile so the smart ones remain. They have learned the river systems so they can transit wherever they wish, they know the neighborhoods with the most cats so have plenty to eat etc.

This is nothing new at all.

However this is not the case here. These dogs are feral dogs to start with. They start living in the metro, in a whole different environment. Then they get selected of course, by behavior. You are selecting against an environmental change, a place for wolves, not cute dogs any more. So our metro dogs change into wolves(including appearance) in 30 years, from cute puppies. Cause evolution comes as a package when it comes to environmental effects to it. It is a long stream of switches just shift by a single environmental change, and whole deck shuffles.

So as you can see, cute dogs are turning into mean wolves, this is not coyotes getting smarter.

As I said, take it or leave it.

 

[alpine]

the evolutionary changes in DOGS cannot be compared with Human evolution The environmental pressures on dogs ----are ENTIRELY different from that on humans in the past 1000 years In fact one of the most significant genetic pressures on dogs is SELECTIVE BREEDING Domesticated animals do not BREED FREELY-----their mates are chosen based on those traits deemed desirable by their human owners Wild animals are generally subject to a different set of pressures than HUMANS within HUMAN SOCIETY where the young are cared for AND the elderly are cared for

So what is it that you are opposed to? Human doesn't change by social and cultural pressure? Our brains just get more open minded only by reading and learning and that's it? The aggression levels on humans doesn't and have not changed during those years as a result of technology and the ease of obtaining our needs? That human behaviour that obviously has changed over 1000 years has nothing to do with biology but only with... what?

 

[westwall]

You can check metro dogs in here

Moscow's Stray Dogs Evolving Greater Intelligence, Including a Mastery of the Subway | Popular Science

in 30 years, they simply evolved to a different physiology.

Epigenetics is what this is called. Only 5% of your dna is actually are coded genes. Rest is a complex network of switches that control expression of these genes. Same gene will act different in different environments, simple because environment has effect on these switches. Human environment starts in mothers womb, and keeps shaping him for his entire life. So culture and technology has extensive effects on how human genome will react, therefore changing its inner biology, hormones and receptors, how we feel, how we think, all together...

The way you describe it is the idea and thinking of the past science, everything being controlled by genes. I am offering you the understanding of the future, if you care...

Coyotes in Los Angeles are exactly the same. The dumb ones die by automobile so the smart ones remain. They have learned the river systems so they can transit wherever they wish, they know the neighborhoods with the most cats so have plenty to eat etc.

This is nothing new at all.

However this is not the case here. These dogs are feral dogs to start with. They start living in the metro, in a whole different environment. Then they get selected of course, by behavior. You are selecting against an environmental change, a place for wolves, not cute dogs any more. So our metro dogs change into wolves(including appearance) in 30 years, from cute puppies. Cause evolution comes as a package when it comes to environmental effects to it. It is a long stream of switches just shift by a single environmental change, and whole deck shuffles.

So as you can see, cute dogs are turning into mean wolves, this is not coyotes getting smarter.

As I said, take it or leave it.

Wrong again. If anything they have an advantage over the coyotes because they were familiar with the urban environment from the get go. The coyotes had to learn and learn fast before they were turned into flat fauna.

Almost all evolution is determined by the environment. That's why you see virtually no evolutionary activity near the equator and the poles because the environment stays the same. Evolutionary processes happen in the temperate zones where climate variability is the most pronounced and thus stress is introduced into the populations.

As I said, this is nothing new and is well documented in many places.

 

[alpine]

Coyotes in Los Angeles are exactly the same. The dumb ones die by automobile so the smart ones remain. They have learned the river systems so they can transit wherever they wish, they know the neighborhoods with the most cats so have plenty to eat etc.

This is nothing new at all.

However this is not the case here. These dogs are feral dogs to start with. They start living in the metro, in a whole different environment. Then they get selected of course, by behavior. You are selecting against an environmental change, a place for wolves, not cute dogs any more. So our metro dogs change into wolves(including appearance) in 30 years, from cute puppies. Cause evolution comes as a package when it comes to environmental effects to it. It is a long stream of switches just shift by a single environmental change, and whole deck shuffles.

So as you can see, cute dogs are turning into mean wolves, this is not coyotes getting smarter.

As I said, take it or leave it.

Wrong again. If anything they have an advantage over the coyotes because they were familiar with the urban environment from the get go. The coyotes had to learn and learn fast before they were turned into flat fauna.

Almost all evolution is determined by the environment. That's why you see virtually no evolutionary activity near the equator and the poles because the environment stays the same. Evolutionary processes happen in the temperate zones where climate variability is the most pronounced and thus stress is introduced into the populations.

As I said, this is nothing new and is well documented in many places.

Without genome changing, with all same genes, can the biology of a living thing be different in different environment or not? The main question is this. Because we know the genetic changes take long time. So for human biology to work different in 1000 years, the human genes should be able to act differently in different environment, especially social environment.

And the answer to this question is; yes it can. We know for a fact that living things can express a whole a lot different biological process with the same genome available to it in different environment. One gene will act whole a lot different in a different environment. This will cause the organism to change in behaviour and appearance in a rapid way. This is cause the gene is acting differently creates a whole a lot different biology in that living organism. This is called epigenetics.

If you agree with this fine. If not still fine by me. I could not care less.

So back the main idea, 1000 years ago people were much different from us (biologically). Therefore comparing holocaust that you can speak survivors of, to some stories from an age even people back then were biologically different from us if a thinking that is missing logic in it. The person in this act should look for help.

 

[westwall]

However this is not the case here. These dogs are feral dogs to start with. They start living in the metro, in a whole different environment. Then they get selected of course, by behavior. You are selecting against an environmental change, a place for wolves, not cute dogs any more. So our metro dogs change into wolves(including appearance) in 30 years, from cute puppies. Cause evolution comes as a package when it comes to environmental effects to it. It is a long stream of switches just shift by a single environmental change, and whole deck shuffles.

So as you can see, cute dogs are turning into mean wolves, this is not coyotes getting smarter.

As I said, take it or leave it.

Wrong again. If anything they have an advantage over the coyotes because they were familiar with the urban environment from the get go. The coyotes had to learn and learn fast before they were turned into flat fauna.

Almost all evolution is determined by the environment. That's why you see virtually no evolutionary activity near the equator and the poles because the environment stays the same. Evolutionary processes happen in the temperate zones where climate variability is the most pronounced and thus stress is introduced into the populations.

As I said, this is nothing new and is well documented in many places.

Without genome changing, with all same genes, can the biology of a living thing be different in different environment or not? The main question is this. Because we know the genetic changes take long time. So for human biology to work different in 1000 years, the human genes should be able to act differently in different environment, especially social environment.

And the answer to this question is; yes it can. We know for a fact that living things can express a whole a lot different biological process with the same genome available to it in different environment. One gene will act whole a lot different in a different environment. This will cause the organism to change in behaviour and appearance in a rapid way. This is cause the gene is acting differently creates a whole a lot different biology in that living organism. This is called epigenetics.

If you agree with this fine. If not still fine by me. I could not care less.

So back the main idea, 1000 years ago people were much different from us (biologically). Therefore comparing holocaust that you can speak survivors of, to some stories from an age even people back then were biologically different from us if a thinking that is missing logic in it. The person in this act should look for help.

The genome doesn't change for the most part. The genes are allready extant. The stress in the environment presents those creatures with that particular gene, the opportunity to reveal their advantage over the other creatures in that same environment. Occasionally genes are mutated by gamma radiation and the vast majority of those mutations are fatal to the organisms offspring.

Every once in awhile though, the mutation is beneficial in certain arenas, those arenas are exposed by environmental stress.

 

[alpine]

Wrong again. If anything they have an advantage over the coyotes because they were familiar with the urban environment from the get go. The coyotes had to learn and learn fast before they were turned into flat fauna.

Almost all evolution is determined by the environment. That's why you see virtually no evolutionary activity near the equator and the poles because the environment stays the same. Evolutionary processes happen in the temperate zones where climate variability is the most pronounced and thus stress is introduced into the populations.

As I said, this is nothing new and is well documented in many places.

Without genome changing, with all same genes, can the biology of a living thing be different in different environment or not? The main question is this. Because we know the genetic changes take long time. So for human biology to work different in 1000 years, the human genes should be able to act differently in different environment, especially social environment.

And the answer to this question is; yes it can. We know for a fact that living things can express a whole a lot different biological process with the same genome available to it in different environment. One gene will act whole a lot different in a different environment. This will cause the organism to change in behaviour and appearance in a rapid way. This is cause the gene is acting differently creates a whole a lot different biology in that living organism. This is called epigenetics.

If you agree with this fine. If not still fine by me. I could not care less.

So back the main idea, 1000 years ago people were much different from us (biologically). Therefore comparing holocaust that you can speak survivors of, to some stories from an age even people back then were biologically different from us if a thinking that is missing logic in it. The person in this act should look for help.

The genome doesn't change for the most part. The genes are allready extant. The stress in the environment presents those creatures with that particular gene, the opportunity to reveal their advantage over the other creatures in that same environment. Occasionally genes are mutated by gamma radiation and the vast majority of those mutations are fatal to the organisms offspring.

Every once in awhile though, the mutation is beneficial in certain arenas, those arenas are exposed by environmental stress.

Same gene, same genome, no difference what so ever, can act different in different environment or not? Simple enough I guess.

 

[irosie91]

Alpine----you have a deficient understanding of both population genetics and evolution. The POTENTIAL FOR ADAPTATION AND LEARNING----is the part you miss-----it does not require a change in the genome it requires some switching ons and offs

uhm I think it was west wall who reminded you that PEOPLE from all parts of the world can REPRODUCE WITH EACH OTHER ------also----if we revived some person from 2000 years ago------uhm---if it is a girl---you could reproduce with her-----that means that the your genomes are THAT SIMILAR (otherwise they would simply not "marry")

 

[alpine]

Alpine----you have a deficient understanding of both population genetics and evolution. The POTENTIAL FOR ADAPTATION AND LEARNING----is the part you miss-----it does not require a change in the genome it requires some switching ons and offs

uhm I think it was west wall who reminded you that PEOPLE from all parts of the world can REPRODUCE WITH EACH OTHER ------also----if we revived some person from 2000 years ago------uhm---if it is a girl---you could reproduce with her-----that means that the your genomes are THAT SIMILAR (otherwise they would simply not "marry")

Who told you anything about reproducing or having different genomes? I am calling the name epigenetics and what part of that you did not understand? Switches on the genome is what I am trying to explain you for the last couple days and for whatever reason you keep repeating the same things in return, like a broken record.

It does not require genetic changes for human biology to change. Human body will create a different biology depending on the environment. That's all you need to know. And also the fact that environment has changed plenty in 1000 years. Now you can put 1 and 1 together I hope. The answer is 2...

 

[irosie91]

no sweetheart----the BIOLOGY does not change------the physiology remains the same ---the real issue that seems like "change" is IN THE BRAIN ----your epigenetics thing is a minor issue

the brain of all humans has tremendous POTENTIAL that potential is actually the same across the board-------from completely illiterate societies to -----university professors

if you want to deal with little things like vitamin D metabolism-----ok play with EPIGENETICS Melanin content of the skin EXCITES YOU?

 

[alpine]

no sweetheart----the BIOLOGY does not change------the physiology remains the same ---the real issue that seems like "change" is IN THE BRAIN ----your epigenetics thing is a minor issue

the brain of all humans has tremendous POTENTIAL that potential is actually the same across the board-------from completely illiterate societies to -----university professors

if you want to deal with little things like vitamin D metabolism-----ok play with EPIGENETICS Melanin content of the skin EXCITES YOU?

Epigenetics is much more than that. It has effects all the way to the human behaviour. If you want to learn about it, just google it. You will find tons of knowledge. Or you can deny science and keep making ignorant comments on the subject.