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F-35s jets and S-400 missiles

Daryl Hunt

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No. Iranian or even Syrian forces are not protected by the Russian IADS. Russia is neutral in Syria-Israel conflict.
Russian equipment, ditzo.
You see, Iranian proxies overhelm USA-Israelis IADS sometimes, too. It's just a local game - exchange with missiles strikes without any significant result. "Disturbing fire" and "reconnaissance by combat".
The Jews can't use their aviation in Syrian or Iranian airspace as free as they wish, and the Arabs and Persians can't use their aviation in the Jewish airspace as free as they wish. "IADS in being", you know.
The Israelis know that in order to not set off the tinderbox, they need to show restraint. So they do what they must do to keep their borders safe from the Iranians. That means keeping an area that they need for refueling to strike or recon Iran clear of any and all missile sites. And it doesn't matter if it's a Syrian or an Iranian missile site. It gets taken out. The Russians know this and make sure they don't feed that tinderbox. But it doesn't stop the Russians from selling the Syrians the hardware.

As for Arab or Syrian Air Power operating in Israel, that just isn't happening. The closest thing to that would be some fringe groups lobbing a few unguided rockets and mortars in annoyance attacks. Iran supports those fringe groups. Israel knows who the real enemy is. And it's not really Syria nor an Arab State. If you care to check, neither Syria nor Iran are Arabs. And if either of them wants to get burnt real bad, they know all they have to do is start flying in Israel air space. BTW, in order for Iran to do this, they also would need refueling bases. Not Air to Air Refueling like the Israelis, but Iran would need to have refueling bases in Syria. Israel just won't let that happen.
It is not relevant. Ok. Lets compare two examples - Russia and Israel. Russia is interested in killing Turkish and Saudies proxies in Syria and desroying their facilities. Israel is interested in killing Iranian proxies in Syria and destroying their facilities.
Targets are equal. Russia use two dumb bombs FAB-500 (price - $100 each when they were new fifty years ago, now - less than zero) to destroy a weapons warehouse. $100×2=$200. IAF needs to launch twenty AGM-142 ($1500000 each) to destroy a same target (with 50/50 odds) 20×M1,5=$30M.
Do you see the difference? So, why the expences are so different? Yes, it is result of IADS existence. So, Syrian IADS is rather effective. Israel can't bomb Syrian targets as often as Russia do, so the most of Turkish and Saudies proxies are killed, and most of Iranian proxies are still alive.
I think the difference is to whom the Russians have supplied the good stuff. They have provided the good stuff to Syria but not Iran. Meanwhile, the Israelis don't need to spend that 150K per hit. They can do the same job with JDAMs at 27000 a copy. And Israel has plenty of those. Much more than either Syria or Iran has launchers. Yes, Russia can do it cheaper but not without raising the hackles of the rest of the entire world. Israel can attack Iran inside Syria and the only other country that will raise a stink will be Syria and they really don't want to get too antsy on their response.

The problem with attacking the Iranian Proxies is that they are mixed in with the various populations and Israel has to tread carefully in order to not raise the ire of the Arab Nations. And if Russia decides to attack Turk sites then they lose not only the support of most of the rest of the world but also the entire Arab Nations.

You paint a nice and tidy picture but I do wish it were that simple. It's not.
 

Silver Cat

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No. Iranian or even Syrian forces are not protected by the Russian IADS. Russia is neutral in Syria-Israel conflict.
Russian equipment, ditzo.
You see, Iranian proxies overhelm USA-Israelis IADS sometimes, too. It's just a local game - exchange with missiles strikes without any significant result. "Disturbing fire" and "reconnaissance by combat".
The Jews can't use their aviation in Syrian or Iranian airspace as free as they wish, and the Arabs and Persians can't use their aviation in the Jewish airspace as free as they wish. "IADS in being", you know.
The Israelis know that in order to not set off the tinderbox, they need to show restraint. So they do what they must do to keep their borders safe from the Iranians. That means keeping an area that they need for refueling to strike or recon Iran clear of any and all missile sites. And it doesn't matter if it's a Syrian or an Iranian missile site. It gets taken out. The Russians know this and make sure they don't feed that tinderbox. But it doesn't stop the Russians from selling the Syrians the hardware.

As for Arab or Syrian Air Power operating in Israel, that just isn't happening. The closest thing to that would be some fringe groups lobbing a few unguided rockets and mortars in annoyance attacks. Iran supports those fringe groups. Israel knows who the real enemy is. And it's not really Syria nor an Arab State. If you care to check, neither Syria nor Iran are Arabs. And if either of them wants to get burnt real bad, they know all they have to do is start flying in Israel air space. BTW, in order for Iran to do this, they also would need refueling bases. Not Air to Air Refueling like the Israelis, but Iran would need to have refueling bases in Syria. Israel just won't let that happen.
It is not relevant. Ok. Lets compare two examples - Russia and Israel. Russia is interested in killing Turkish and Saudies proxies in Syria and desroying their facilities. Israel is interested in killing Iranian proxies in Syria and destroying their facilities.
Targets are equal. Russia use two dumb bombs FAB-500 (price - $100 each when they were new fifty years ago, now - less than zero) to destroy a weapons warehouse. $100×2=$200. IAF needs to launch twenty AGM-142 ($1500000 each) to destroy a same target (with 50/50 odds) 20×M1,5=$30M.
Do you see the difference? So, why the expences are so different? Yes, it is result of IADS existence. So, Syrian IADS is rather effective. Israel can't bomb Syrian targets as often as Russia do, so the most of Turkish and Saudies proxies are killed, and most of Iranian proxies are still alive.
I think the difference is to whom the Russians have supplied the good stuff. They have provided the good stuff to Syria but not Iran. Meanwhile, the Israelis don't need to spend that 150K per hit. They can do the same job with JDAMs at 27000 a copy. And Israel has plenty of those. Much more than either Syria or Iran has launchers. Yes, Russia can do it cheaper but not without raising the hackles of the rest of the entire world. Israel can attack Iran inside Syria and the only other country that will raise a stink will be Syria and they really don't want to get too antsy on their response.

The problem with attacking the Iranian Proxies is that they are mixed in with the various populations and Israel has to tread carefully in order to not raise the ire of the Arab Nations. And if Russia decides to attack Turk sites then they lose not only the support of most of the rest of the world but also the entire Arab Nations.

You paint a nice and tidy picture but I do wish it were that simple. It's not.
1.As far as I know, the Jews very rarely use JDAMs in Syria. They rarely, and, looks like unsuccessfuly use even local SDBs. Their main munition are CMs, launched from outside Syrian airspace.
2. No problem. Russian Airforce attacked Turk's sites in Syria, and Erdogan capitulated. EU was impressed and decided to improve relationships with Russia.
 

Daryl Hunt

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Russian equipment, ditzo.
You see, Iranian proxies overhelm USA-Israelis IADS sometimes, too. It's just a local game - exchange with missiles strikes without any significant result. "Disturbing fire" and "reconnaissance by combat".
The Jews can't use their aviation in Syrian or Iranian airspace as free as they wish, and the Arabs and Persians can't use their aviation in the Jewish airspace as free as they wish. "IADS in being", you know.
The Israelis know that in order to not set off the tinderbox, they need to show restraint. So they do what they must do to keep their borders safe from the Iranians. That means keeping an area that they need for refueling to strike or recon Iran clear of any and all missile sites. And it doesn't matter if it's a Syrian or an Iranian missile site. It gets taken out. The Russians know this and make sure they don't feed that tinderbox. But it doesn't stop the Russians from selling the Syrians the hardware.

As for Arab or Syrian Air Power operating in Israel, that just isn't happening. The closest thing to that would be some fringe groups lobbing a few unguided rockets and mortars in annoyance attacks. Iran supports those fringe groups. Israel knows who the real enemy is. And it's not really Syria nor an Arab State. If you care to check, neither Syria nor Iran are Arabs. And if either of them wants to get burnt real bad, they know all they have to do is start flying in Israel air space. BTW, in order for Iran to do this, they also would need refueling bases. Not Air to Air Refueling like the Israelis, but Iran would need to have refueling bases in Syria. Israel just won't let that happen.
It is not relevant. Ok. Lets compare two examples - Russia and Israel. Russia is interested in killing Turkish and Saudies proxies in Syria and desroying their facilities. Israel is interested in killing Iranian proxies in Syria and destroying their facilities.
Targets are equal. Russia use two dumb bombs FAB-500 (price - $100 each when they were new fifty years ago, now - less than zero) to destroy a weapons warehouse. $100×2=$200. IAF needs to launch twenty AGM-142 ($1500000 each) to destroy a same target (with 50/50 odds) 20×M1,5=$30M.
Do you see the difference? So, why the expences are so different? Yes, it is result of IADS existence. So, Syrian IADS is rather effective. Israel can't bomb Syrian targets as often as Russia do, so the most of Turkish and Saudies proxies are killed, and most of Iranian proxies are still alive.
I think the difference is to whom the Russians have supplied the good stuff. They have provided the good stuff to Syria but not Iran. Meanwhile, the Israelis don't need to spend that 150K per hit. They can do the same job with JDAMs at 27000 a copy. And Israel has plenty of those. Much more than either Syria or Iran has launchers. Yes, Russia can do it cheaper but not without raising the hackles of the rest of the entire world. Israel can attack Iran inside Syria and the only other country that will raise a stink will be Syria and they really don't want to get too antsy on their response.

The problem with attacking the Iranian Proxies is that they are mixed in with the various populations and Israel has to tread carefully in order to not raise the ire of the Arab Nations. And if Russia decides to attack Turk sites then they lose not only the support of most of the rest of the world but also the entire Arab Nations.

You paint a nice and tidy picture but I do wish it were that simple. It's not.
1.As far as I know, the Jews very rarely use JDAMs in Syria. They rarely, and, looks like unsuccessfuly use even local SDBs. Their main munition are CMs, launched from outside Syrian airspace.
2. No problem. Russian Airforce attacked Turk's sites in Syria, and Erdogan capitulated. EU was impressed and decided to improve relationships with Russia.
Not so simple, is it.
 

Silver Cat

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You see, Iranian proxies overhelm USA-Israelis IADS sometimes, too. It's just a local game - exchange with missiles strikes without any significant result. "Disturbing fire" and "reconnaissance by combat".
The Jews can't use their aviation in Syrian or Iranian airspace as free as they wish, and the Arabs and Persians can't use their aviation in the Jewish airspace as free as they wish. "IADS in being", you know.
The Israelis know that in order to not set off the tinderbox, they need to show restraint. So they do what they must do to keep their borders safe from the Iranians. That means keeping an area that they need for refueling to strike or recon Iran clear of any and all missile sites. And it doesn't matter if it's a Syrian or an Iranian missile site. It gets taken out. The Russians know this and make sure they don't feed that tinderbox. But it doesn't stop the Russians from selling the Syrians the hardware.

As for Arab or Syrian Air Power operating in Israel, that just isn't happening. The closest thing to that would be some fringe groups lobbing a few unguided rockets and mortars in annoyance attacks. Iran supports those fringe groups. Israel knows who the real enemy is. And it's not really Syria nor an Arab State. If you care to check, neither Syria nor Iran are Arabs. And if either of them wants to get burnt real bad, they know all they have to do is start flying in Israel air space. BTW, in order for Iran to do this, they also would need refueling bases. Not Air to Air Refueling like the Israelis, but Iran would need to have refueling bases in Syria. Israel just won't let that happen.
It is not relevant. Ok. Lets compare two examples - Russia and Israel. Russia is interested in killing Turkish and Saudies proxies in Syria and desroying their facilities. Israel is interested in killing Iranian proxies in Syria and destroying their facilities.
Targets are equal. Russia use two dumb bombs FAB-500 (price - $100 each when they were new fifty years ago, now - less than zero) to destroy a weapons warehouse. $100×2=$200. IAF needs to launch twenty AGM-142 ($1500000 each) to destroy a same target (with 50/50 odds) 20×M1,5=$30M.
Do you see the difference? So, why the expences are so different? Yes, it is result of IADS existence. So, Syrian IADS is rather effective. Israel can't bomb Syrian targets as often as Russia do, so the most of Turkish and Saudies proxies are killed, and most of Iranian proxies are still alive.
I think the difference is to whom the Russians have supplied the good stuff. They have provided the good stuff to Syria but not Iran. Meanwhile, the Israelis don't need to spend that 150K per hit. They can do the same job with JDAMs at 27000 a copy. And Israel has plenty of those. Much more than either Syria or Iran has launchers. Yes, Russia can do it cheaper but not without raising the hackles of the rest of the entire world. Israel can attack Iran inside Syria and the only other country that will raise a stink will be Syria and they really don't want to get too antsy on their response.

The problem with attacking the Iranian Proxies is that they are mixed in with the various populations and Israel has to tread carefully in order to not raise the ire of the Arab Nations. And if Russia decides to attack Turk sites then they lose not only the support of most of the rest of the world but also the entire Arab Nations.

You paint a nice and tidy picture but I do wish it were that simple. It's not.
1.As far as I know, the Jews very rarely use JDAMs in Syria. They rarely, and, looks like unsuccessfuly use even local SDBs. Their main munition are CMs, launched from outside Syrian airspace.
2. No problem. Russian Airforce attacked Turk's sites in Syria, and Erdogan capitulated. EU was impressed and decided to improve relationships with Russia.
Not so simple, is it.
Any simulation is a simplication.
 

Silver Cat

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There is a funny promoting video from LaMers: "Give us more money, and may be, your F-35 will be able to fight S-400"
 

Daryl Hunt

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There is a funny promoting video from LaMers: "Give us more money, and may be, your F-35 will be able to fight S-400"
Thank you for showing why we can defeat the S-400 system even on a bad day. Hell, we can do it even better on a bad day. They same can't be said for the operations of the S-400.
 

Silver Cat

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There is a funny promoting video from LaMers: "Give us more money, and may be, your F-35 will be able to fight S-400"
Thank you for showing why we can defeat the S-400 system even on a bad day. Hell, we can do it even better on a bad day. They same can't be said for the operations of the S-400.
Watch the video one more time and try to understand what exactly they had demonstrated.
First of all, they show a preemptive strike against Russian Yars-complex, protected by S-400. Forgot about your nucleophobia, it's not in the fashion anymore. Both sides are openly preparing for the nuclear war, started with a sudden nuclear (mostly counter-force) strike.
Second - they don't suggest already working solution, they "are working" for it.
Third, Russian Iskanders have much more chances to hit a Patriot-defended airbase with American B-61-12 nukes, than F-35 with fururistic UAVs - S-400 defended Yars position.
Fourth, it's a promotion video, reality is much more complicated.
 

Daryl Hunt

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There is a funny promoting video from LaMers: "Give us more money, and may be, your F-35 will be able to fight S-400"
Thank you for showing why we can defeat the S-400 system even on a bad day. Hell, we can do it even better on a bad day. They same can't be said for the operations of the S-400.
Watch the video one more time and try to understand what exactly they had demonstrated.
First of all, they show a preemptive strike against Russian Yars-complex, protected by S-400. Forgot about your nucleophobia, it's not in the fashion anymore. Both sides are openly preparing for the nuclear war, started with a sudden nuclear (mostly counter-force) strike.
Second - they don't suggest already working solution, they "are working" for it.
Third, Russian Iskanders have much more chances to hit a Patriot-defended airbase with American B-61-12 nukes, than F-35 with fururistic UAVs - S-400 defended Yars position.
Fourth, it's a promotion video, reality is much more complicated.
You missed the penetration radar where they followed the holes that the F-35 created so the B-2 can get through as well as Gen 4 birds. It's not just about Nukes.
 

Silver Cat

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There is a funny promoting video from LaMers: "Give us more money, and may be, your F-35 will be able to fight S-400"
Thank you for showing why we can defeat the S-400 system even on a bad day. Hell, we can do it even better on a bad day. They same can't be said for the operations of the S-400.
Watch the video one more time and try to understand what exactly they had demonstrated.
First of all, they show a preemptive strike against Russian Yars-complex, protected by S-400. Forgot about your nucleophobia, it's not in the fashion anymore. Both sides are openly preparing for the nuclear war, started with a sudden nuclear (mostly counter-force) strike.
Second - they don't suggest already working solution, they "are working" for it.
Third, Russian Iskanders have much more chances to hit a Patriot-defended airbase with American B-61-12 nukes, than F-35 with fururistic UAVs - S-400 defended Yars position.
Fourth, it's a promotion video, reality is much more complicated.
You missed the penetration radar where they followed the holes that the F-35 created so the B-2 can get through as well as Gen 4 birds. It's not just about Nukes.
At what exactly second did you see B-2, or F-35, creating holes?
 

Daryl Hunt

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There is a funny promoting video from LaMers: "Give us more money, and may be, your F-35 will be able to fight S-400"
Thank you for showing why we can defeat the S-400 system even on a bad day. Hell, we can do it even better on a bad day. They same can't be said for the operations of the S-400.
Watch the video one more time and try to understand what exactly they had demonstrated.
First of all, they show a preemptive strike against Russian Yars-complex, protected by S-400. Forgot about your nucleophobia, it's not in the fashion anymore. Both sides are openly preparing for the nuclear war, started with a sudden nuclear (mostly counter-force) strike.
Second - they don't suggest already working solution, they "are working" for it.
Third, Russian Iskanders have much more chances to hit a Patriot-defended airbase with American B-61-12 nukes, than F-35 with fururistic UAVs - S-400 defended Yars position.
Fourth, it's a promotion video, reality is much more complicated.
You missed the penetration radar where they followed the holes that the F-35 created so the B-2 can get through as well as Gen 4 birds. It's not just about Nukes.
At what exactly second did you see B-2, or F-35, creating holes?
You didn't pay attention to the Radar Bubbles and the penetrating Aircraft flying around them (between the holes).
 

Silver Cat

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There is a funny promoting video from LaMers: "Give us more money, and may be, your F-35 will be able to fight S-400"
Thank you for showing why we can defeat the S-400 system even on a bad day. Hell, we can do it even better on a bad day. They same can't be said for the operations of the S-400.
Watch the video one more time and try to understand what exactly they had demonstrated.
First of all, they show a preemptive strike against Russian Yars-complex, protected by S-400. Forgot about your nucleophobia, it's not in the fashion anymore. Both sides are openly preparing for the nuclear war, started with a sudden nuclear (mostly counter-force) strike.
Second - they don't suggest already working solution, they "are working" for it.
Third, Russian Iskanders have much more chances to hit a Patriot-defended airbase with American B-61-12 nukes, than F-35 with fururistic UAVs - S-400 defended Yars position.
Fourth, it's a promotion video, reality is much more complicated.
You missed the penetration radar where they followed the holes that the F-35 created so the B-2 can get through as well as Gen 4 birds. It's not just about Nukes.
At what exactly second did you see B-2, or F-35, creating holes?
You didn't pay attention to the Radar Bubbles and the penetrating Aircraft flying around them (between the holes).
I paid enough attention to it.
There was no any B-2, and nobody "created" holes in the Air Defence.
 

Daryl Hunt

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Thank you for showing why we can defeat the S-400 system even on a bad day. Hell, we can do it even better on a bad day. They same can't be said for the operations of the S-400.
Watch the video one more time and try to understand what exactly they had demonstrated.
First of all, they show a preemptive strike against Russian Yars-complex, protected by S-400. Forgot about your nucleophobia, it's not in the fashion anymore. Both sides are openly preparing for the nuclear war, started with a sudden nuclear (mostly counter-force) strike.
Second - they don't suggest already working solution, they "are working" for it.
Third, Russian Iskanders have much more chances to hit a Patriot-defended airbase with American B-61-12 nukes, than F-35 with fururistic UAVs - S-400 defended Yars position.
Fourth, it's a promotion video, reality is much more complicated.
You missed the penetration radar where they followed the holes that the F-35 created so the B-2 can get through as well as Gen 4 birds. It's not just about Nukes.
At what exactly second did you see B-2, or F-35, creating holes?
You didn't pay attention to the Radar Bubbles and the penetrating Aircraft flying around them (between the holes).
I paid enough attention to it.
There was no any B-2, and nobody "created" holes in the Air Defence.
If you studied the radar bubbles you would see holes in it. Those holes create corridors which the 4th and 5th gen birds can evade detection. Birds like the F-35, F-22 and others can see those holes and help others through them. The F-22 and F-35 can create those holes by taking out select radar installations.

In Syria or anywhere else in the Middle East, there are glaring holes or corridors that are open. There just aren't enough decent Radar Installations to plug all the holes. Even Russia doesn't have enough to plug all their own holes in Mother Russia and neither does the US in Saudi Arabia. You can add Israel to that same list. The 5th Gen F-22, F-35 and B-2 can see those open corridors and fly through them uncontested. The reason you can't see them is that they know where you are looking and where you aren't looking.
 

Silver Cat

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Watch the video one more time and try to understand what exactly they had demonstrated.
First of all, they show a preemptive strike against Russian Yars-complex, protected by S-400. Forgot about your nucleophobia, it's not in the fashion anymore. Both sides are openly preparing for the nuclear war, started with a sudden nuclear (mostly counter-force) strike.
Second - they don't suggest already working solution, they "are working" for it.
Third, Russian Iskanders have much more chances to hit a Patriot-defended airbase with American B-61-12 nukes, than F-35 with fururistic UAVs - S-400 defended Yars position.
Fourth, it's a promotion video, reality is much more complicated.
You missed the penetration radar where they followed the holes that the F-35 created so the B-2 can get through as well as Gen 4 birds. It's not just about Nukes.
At what exactly second did you see B-2, or F-35, creating holes?
You didn't pay attention to the Radar Bubbles and the penetrating Aircraft flying around them (between the holes).
I paid enough attention to it.
There was no any B-2, and nobody "created" holes in the Air Defence.
If you studied the radar bubbles you would see holes in it. Those holes create corridors which the 4th and 5th gen birds can evade detection. Birds like the F-35, F-22 and others can see those holes and help others through them. The F-22 and F-35 can create those holes by taking out select radar installations.

In Syria or anywhere else in the Middle East, there are glaring holes or corridors that are open. There just aren't enough decent Radar Installations to plug all the holes. Even Russia doesn't have enough to plug all their own holes in Mother Russia and neither does the US in Saudi Arabia. You can add Israel to that same list. The 5th Gen F-22, F-35 and B-2 can see those open corridors and fly through them uncontested. The reason you can't see them is that they know where you are looking and where you aren't looking.
Sure. They can find a hole and bomb a farm with few deers, in the theory. In the practice of war, we need to attack important targets, and those important targets are often well-defended.
Returning to Defender-2020. Can our (and European) F-35 eliminate IADS in Kaliningrad region in the reasonable time, and allow previous generations aviation to destroy their Iskanders, airbases, tanks and so on, and then to help the Baltic States, or we have to find other ways (for example, Polish Zerg Rush)?
 

Daryl Hunt

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You missed the penetration radar where they followed the holes that the F-35 created so the B-2 can get through as well as Gen 4 birds. It's not just about Nukes.
At what exactly second did you see B-2, or F-35, creating holes?
You didn't pay attention to the Radar Bubbles and the penetrating Aircraft flying around them (between the holes).
I paid enough attention to it.
There was no any B-2, and nobody "created" holes in the Air Defence.
If you studied the radar bubbles you would see holes in it. Those holes create corridors which the 4th and 5th gen birds can evade detection. Birds like the F-35, F-22 and others can see those holes and help others through them. The F-22 and F-35 can create those holes by taking out select radar installations.

In Syria or anywhere else in the Middle East, there are glaring holes or corridors that are open. There just aren't enough decent Radar Installations to plug all the holes. Even Russia doesn't have enough to plug all their own holes in Mother Russia and neither does the US in Saudi Arabia. You can add Israel to that same list. The 5th Gen F-22, F-35 and B-2 can see those open corridors and fly through them uncontested. The reason you can't see them is that they know where you are looking and where you aren't looking.
Sure. They can find a hole and bomb a farm with few deers, in the theory. In the practice of war, we need to attack important targets, and those important targets are often well-defended.
Returning to Defender-2020. Can our (and European) F-35 eliminate IADS in Kaliningrad region in the reasonable time, and allow previous generations aviation to destroy their Iskanders, airbases, tanks and so on, and then to help the Baltic States, or we have to find other ways (for example, Polish Zerg Rush)?
In one word, Yes. This is why the AF F-35A is doing practices in non nato countries as I type this. The F-35A gets to practice against Russian made equipment in real time. Maybe not the S-400 but what they will be face with most. You honestly believe that Russia has the funds to field all that many S-400? They can barely afford the gas for the trucks to deliver them. Meanwhile, the US and others are fielding more and more F-35As. With the cost of crude down as it is, Russia is in serious trouble once again. They can't even afford to buy enough uniforms for their military to wear.
 

Silver Cat

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At what exactly second did you see B-2, or F-35, creating holes?
You didn't pay attention to the Radar Bubbles and the penetrating Aircraft flying around them (between the holes).
I paid enough attention to it.
There was no any B-2, and nobody "created" holes in the Air Defence.
If you studied the radar bubbles you would see holes in it. Those holes create corridors which the 4th and 5th gen birds can evade detection. Birds like the F-35, F-22 and others can see those holes and help others through them. The F-22 and F-35 can create those holes by taking out select radar installations.

In Syria or anywhere else in the Middle East, there are glaring holes or corridors that are open. There just aren't enough decent Radar Installations to plug all the holes. Even Russia doesn't have enough to plug all their own holes in Mother Russia and neither does the US in Saudi Arabia. You can add Israel to that same list. The 5th Gen F-22, F-35 and B-2 can see those open corridors and fly through them uncontested. The reason you can't see them is that they know where you are looking and where you aren't looking.
Sure. They can find a hole and bomb a farm with few deers, in the theory. In the practice of war, we need to attack important targets, and those important targets are often well-defended.
Returning to Defender-2020. Can our (and European) F-35 eliminate IADS in Kaliningrad region in the reasonable time, and allow previous generations aviation to destroy their Iskanders, airbases, tanks and so on, and then to help the Baltic States, or we have to find other ways (for example, Polish Zerg Rush)?
In one word, Yes. This is why the AF F-35A is doing practices in non nato countries as I type this. The F-35A gets to practice against Russian made equipment in real time. Maybe not the S-400 but what they will be face with most. You honestly believe that Russia has the funds to field all that many S-400? They can barely afford the gas for the trucks to deliver them. Meanwhile, the US and others are fielding more and more F-35As. With the cost of crude down as it is, Russia is in serious trouble once again. They can't even afford to buy enough uniforms for their military to wear.
In one word, No. There are two Air Defence Brigades (six regiments) on the tiny plot of land 105x208 km. And yes, I'm sure they are pretty real.
 

Daryl Hunt

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You didn't pay attention to the Radar Bubbles and the penetrating Aircraft flying around them (between the holes).
I paid enough attention to it.
There was no any B-2, and nobody "created" holes in the Air Defence.
If you studied the radar bubbles you would see holes in it. Those holes create corridors which the 4th and 5th gen birds can evade detection. Birds like the F-35, F-22 and others can see those holes and help others through them. The F-22 and F-35 can create those holes by taking out select radar installations.

In Syria or anywhere else in the Middle East, there are glaring holes or corridors that are open. There just aren't enough decent Radar Installations to plug all the holes. Even Russia doesn't have enough to plug all their own holes in Mother Russia and neither does the US in Saudi Arabia. You can add Israel to that same list. The 5th Gen F-22, F-35 and B-2 can see those open corridors and fly through them uncontested. The reason you can't see them is that they know where you are looking and where you aren't looking.
Sure. They can find a hole and bomb a farm with few deers, in the theory. In the practice of war, we need to attack important targets, and those important targets are often well-defended.
Returning to Defender-2020. Can our (and European) F-35 eliminate IADS in Kaliningrad region in the reasonable time, and allow previous generations aviation to destroy their Iskanders, airbases, tanks and so on, and then to help the Baltic States, or we have to find other ways (for example, Polish Zerg Rush)?
In one word, Yes. This is why the AF F-35A is doing practices in non nato countries as I type this. The F-35A gets to practice against Russian made equipment in real time. Maybe not the S-400 but what they will be face with most. You honestly believe that Russia has the funds to field all that many S-400? They can barely afford the gas for the trucks to deliver them. Meanwhile, the US and others are fielding more and more F-35As. With the cost of crude down as it is, Russia is in serious trouble once again. They can't even afford to buy enough uniforms for their military to wear.
In one word, No. There are two Air Defence Brigades (six regiments) on the tiny plot of land 105x208 km. And yes, I'm sure they are pretty real.
That won't even slow the F-35, F-22 or the B-2 down. There is going to be a swath cut right down the middle.
 

harmonica

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A really simple reason that Russia cannot withstand a long term conflict with the US is the size of the Russian economy, and the inefficiency of Socialist warcraft manufacturing.
???!!!.....they withstood Germany and Germany's Aliies
..tiny North Vietnam withstood the MIGHTY US for a VERY long term conflict AND Vietnam withstood and defeated France....with France and the US using much:
more sophisticated/more lethal/etc weapons
Naval and air supremacy
..stone age Afghanistan withstood the MIGHTY Britain and Russia
 

harmonica

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and as of AGM-88E you've got to move it pretty far since they added a millimeter wave radar that will search for objects that looks like IADS components

GPS jammers are even more vulnerable than search radars or targeting radars, they'd be picked off as part of the attrition of the system. Silver Cat is attempting to fall back on some notion that installing a few 70s era short range anti-aircraft trucks somehow makes this system impervious to attack from supersonic missiles yet I'm not sure there is even a single real world example of them stopping a cruise missile much less something coming in at mach 2.

He ignores the fact that Israel has been operating around and attacking Russian made IADs for decades with near impunity using 4th gen air assets, it's a shame those operators didn't get Silver Cat's memo that all you need is some GPS jammers and antiaircraft guns sprinkled about to become untouchable. They would have smacked themselves on the forehead and said "why didn't we think of that?" pure genius.
As I said earlier - "The smart pilots with the dumb bombs are much more effective than the dumb pilots with the smart bombs"
..I would say there are not too many ''dumb'' military pilots .....especially regarding air support ......the US had ''dumb'' pilots bomb their own troops in the Vietnam War .....they move fast--that's why they called them ''fast movers''' ...it's not easy putting dumb bombs on target--no matter who the pilot is ....
..maybe pilots with more training are better

...they usually don't put dumb people in a multi-million $ aircraft !
 

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