Double Standard In North Carolina - And Everywhere Else

[GotZoom]

Black on Black, Gang Related Drive-by Shooting:


DURHAM -- A $50,000 bond was set Wednesday for one of two teens accused in Durham's first homicide of 2006, the March fatal shooting of 24-year-old Alvin Lee Jones.

Nicholas Alexander Mack, 17, previously had been held without bond in the case.

He and Dontae Daevon Jones, 18, are charged with shooting Alvin Jones in the back at the Bentwood Park apartment complex on Junction Road in eastern Durham. Authorities have said the shooting apparently was gang-related.

Superior Court Judge Ron Stephens rejected a defense request that Mack's bond be set as low as $25,000.

"My focus is on community security," the judge said.

Prosecutors have said the Joneses and Mack were traveling together when they apparently opened fire on a group of other men. They said one of the bullets apparently struck Alvin Jones by mistake.

Official reports indicated that Dontae Jones had the initials "EDC" tattooed on his arm, standing for a gang known as the "East Durham Crips."

The fatal shooting occurred on territory claimed by a rival gang, Assistant District Attorney Jim Dornfried said in court Wednesday.

http://www.heraldsun.com/durham/4-726291.html
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Duke Lacrosse: White on Black. Just shows the "equality" of races and the influence African-Americans have over society.


DURHAM, NC (AP) -- Two Duke University students have posted $400,000 bond and are due to return to court May 15th. Reade Seligmann and Collin Finnerty were arrested early this morning on charges of raping and kidnapping a woman hired to dance at a party. Lawyers deny the 20-year-old lacrosse players raped the stripper, who says three players attacked her.


http://www.kvii.com/news/news_story.aspx?id=6403

 

[The ClayTaurus]

What amount of bond did the prosecuter ask for in each case?

 

[GotZoom]

What amount of bond did the prosecuter ask for in each case?

I don't know. The defense in the drive-by wanted a $25K bond but the judge rejected it.

The prosecutors ask for the highest they can get away with I'm sure.

I see the point you are heading to.

But could you imagine if the prosecutor agreed to a $50K bond for the Duke kids? There would have been protests in the streets.

 

[dmp]

There would have been protests in the streets.

OJ-Verdict-esque.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

I don't know. The defense in the drive-by wanted a $25K bond but the judge rejected it.

The prosecutors ask for the highest they can get away with I'm sure.

I see the point you are heading to.

But could you imagine if the prosecutor agreed to a $50K bond for the Duke kids? There would have been protests in the streets.

I understand your point, but often times the outrage at these judges is misplaced, as the prosecutor didn't ask for very much. How often does a prosecutor ask for 50k bond and the judge responds with "I disagree; 500k"? Rarely is what the prosecutor asked for included in these stories.

I think 50k isn't nearly enough for a murder suspect, but is it better to set a small bail and have riots over this rape case, or set a high one and not? Both families obviously had no problem posting it either way. If anything, it's a commentary on class division, yet again.

 

[GotZoom]

I understand your point, but often times the outrage at these judges is misplaced, as the prosecutor didn't ask for very much. How often does a prosecutor ask for 50k bond and the judge responds with "I disagree; 500k"? Rarely is what the prosecutor asked for included in these stories.

I think 50k isn't nearly enough for a murder suspect, but is it better to set a small bail and have riots over this rape case, or set a high one and not? Both families obviously had no problem posting it either way. If anything, it's a commentary on class division, yet again.

Class and Race..which more times than not, go hand in hand.

 

[Mr. P]

Duke Lacrosse: White on Black. Just shows the "equality" of races and the influence African-Americans have over society.

Well, I can tell ya race or the possibility of riot has nothing to do with the bond my wife nor any other Judge would set (IMO). There are many variables that are considered in setting the bond amount.

A few are:

1. Flight risk
2. Past history
3. Danger to society
4. Ability to make bond
5. Insurance that the accused will show for their hearing

#4. Is important in this first post. Most likely, the Judge knows there is no way this kid will be able to make the $50k bond, so he stays in jail. Did he bond out?

 

[jillian]

Class and Race..which more times than not, go hand in hand.

Yes. They do. Though I have to admit I'm having a bit of trouble with the Duke Lacross players' indictments. From what I'm hearing, there are time-stamped photos of the woman that show she was already injured at the time she got to where the players were; one of the boys supposedly was at an ATM where he was driven by a cab and his picture was caught on the bank's security cameras at the time of the alleged assault; the other boy was supposedly at a restaurant; and DNA was inconclusive. It sounds to me like there was a problem with identification of the perps and I think the DA made a huge mistake taking any position other than one which said "the matter is under investigation".

 

[GotZoom]

Well, I can tell ya race or the possibility of riot has nothing to do with the bond my wife nor any other Judge would set (IMO). There are many variables that are considered in setting the bond amount.

A few are:

1. Flight risk
2. Past history
3. Danger to society
4. Ability to make bond
5. Insurance that the accused will show for their hearing

#4. Is important in this first post. Most likely, the Judge knows there is no way this kid will be able to make the $50k bond, so he stays in jail. Did he bond out?

I understand completely. I still maintain that if it wasn't for the races involved and the high-profile status the Duke case has, things would be different.

As for your question about the bond. From the same article:

He also said that Mack had avoided prosecution in November for giving fictitious information to a police officer, and that he was bonded out of jail on a marijuana charge when the murder occurred last month.

But defense lawyer John Fitzpatrick argued that the shooting was an accident, and that Mack was not the gunman. He said another man in the car with Mack, identified only as Mike, was the probable killer.

"There's no one who can put a weapon in my client's possession at all," Fitzpatrick said. "Nobody puts a weapon in Mr. Mack's hand. Is there any independent witness who can say Mr. Mack had a weapon? The answer is clearly no."

Fitzpatrick said his client's family probably could afford the $50,000 bond.

If so, Judge Stephens ordered that Mack live with his mother, attend school daily, observe a 9 p.m. curfew and stay away from gang members.
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This guy lied to a police officer about his identity, was out on bond for a drug charge and then was involved in the shooting of another gang member.

I love the past paragraph. I can hear the judge now. "Now Nicholas, I know you were out on bond for a drug charge when you allegedly killed this rival gang member, but I am going to insist you stay at home with your mommy and go to school every day. Also, you have to be home by 9:00 every night and for goodness sakes Nicholas, don't talk to your other gang member friends."

Right. That should do it.

 

[GotZoom]

Yes. They do. Though I have to admit I'm having a bit of trouble with the Duke Lacross players' indictments. From what I'm hearing, there are time-stamped photos of the woman that show she was already injured at the time she got to where the players were; one of the boys supposedly was at an ATM where he was driven by a cab and his picture was caught on the bank's security cameras at the time of the alleged assault; the other boy was supposedly at a restaurant; and DNA was inconclusive. It sounds to me like there was a problem with identification of the perps and I think the DA made a huge mistake taking any position other than one which said "the matter is under investigation".

The prosecutor is positioning himself for re-election. He came out from day one and said they would be found guilty. Then the DNA comes back showing that NO ONE tested had matching DNA. Then he said he didn't need DNA. Then everything else came out about the inconsistencies of her story, bruises, time-stamped photos, receipts, witnessess, etc.

He isn't talking to anybody now.

 

[jillian]

The prosecutor is positioning himself for re-election. He came out from day one and said they would be found guilty. Then the DNA comes back showing that NO ONE tested had matching DNA. Then he said he didn't need DNA. Then everything else came out about the inconsistencies of her story, bruises, time-stamped photos, receipts, witnessess, etc.

He isn't talking to anybody now.

I think he may have shot himself in the genitalia and his chances for re-election are futterly ucked. :bat:

 

[GotZoom]

I think he may have shot himself in the genitalia and his chances for re-election are futterly ucked. :bat:

At least she is getting free college tuition out of it; courtesy of Jesse Jackson.

I wonder if that offer will stand once it is determined that she lied (if that is how it ends up).

 

[Mr. P]

I understand completely. I still maintain that if it wasn't for the races involved and the high-profile status the Duke case has, things would be different.

As for your question about the bond. From the same article:

He also said that Mack had avoided prosecution in November for giving fictitious information to a police officer, and that he was bonded out of jail on a marijuana charge when the murder occurred last month.

But defense lawyer John Fitzpatrick argued that the shooting was an accident, and that Mack was not the gunman. He said another man in the car with Mack, identified only as Mike, was the probable killer.

"There's no one who can put a weapon in my client's possession at all," Fitzpatrick said. "Nobody puts a weapon in Mr. Mack's hand. Is there any independent witness who can say Mr. Mack had a weapon? The answer is clearly no."

Fitzpatrick said his client's family probably could afford the $50,000 bond.

If so, Judge Stephens ordered that Mack live with his mother, attend school daily, observe a 9 p.m. curfew and stay away from gang members.
----
This guy lied to a police officer about his identity, was out on bond for a drug charge and then was involved in the shooting of another gang member.

I love the past paragraph. I can hear the judge now. "Now Nicholas, I know you were out on bond for a drug charge when you allegedly killed this rival gang member, but I am going to insist you stay at home with your mommy and go to school every day. Also, you have to be home by 9:00 every night and for goodness sakes Nicholas, don't talk to your other gang member friends."

Right. That should do it.

I know, and some are hard to stomach (I have yelled at the wife for some bonds she has set. Dumb, I know but, "What were you thinking"? ), but bond is not a punishment nor meant to be.

Now if he violates the conditions of his bond here, he would go back to jail and be held until his court date.

Keep allegedly, in mind too. Sometimes we hate it, but it is a good system overall.

 

[GotZoom]

I know, and some are hard to stomach (I have yelled at the wife for some bonds she has set. Dumb, I know but, "What were you thinking"? ), but bond is not a punishment nor meant to be.

Now if he violates the conditions of his bond here, he would go back to jail and be held until his court date.

Keep allegedly, in mind too. Sometimes we hate it, but it is a good system overall.

He already violated conditions of his bond. He was out on bond for a drug charge when the shooting occurred.

 

[jillian]

At least she is getting free college tuition out of it; courtesy of Jesse Jackson.

I wonder if that offer will stand once it is determined that she lied (if that is how it ends up).

Dunno.... I kind of think people shouldn't judge credibility on these things til after the evidence is in at trial... but I'm funny that way.

I think something probably happened to her, but the ID is messed up. The inter-racial recognition rate is pretty low no matter who is making the ID. (hence all of the Innocence Project's success).

As for Jackson, he's had so many opportunities to actually make a difference and gets caught up in the spotlight instead of the value of the cause.

 

[GotZoom]

Dunno.... I kind of think people shouldn't judge credibility on these things til after the evidence is in at trial... but I'm funny that way.

I think something probably happened to her, but the ID is messed up. The inter-racial recognition rate is pretty low no matter who is making the ID. (hence all of the Innocence Project's success).

As for Jackson, he's had so many opportunities to actually make a difference and gets caught up in the spotlight instead of the value of the cause.

Waiting until the end of the trial? Now that is a novel idea. But then certain people wouldn't be able to keep certain "agendas" in the limelight.

I have no doubt she was raped and attacked. Sounds like it happened before she even got there.

Jesse became too caught up in other women's pants and filling his own pocketbook by blackmailing major corporations to remember his cause.

 

[jillian]

Waiting until the end of the trial? Now that is a novel idea. But then certain people wouldn't be able to keep certain "agendas" in the limelight.

I have no doubt she was raped and attacked. Sounds like it happened before she even got there.

Jesse became too caught up in other women's pants and filling his own pocketbook by blackmailing major corporations to remember his cause.

I hear ya....

Gotta run now...back to work!

Laterz!

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Was the kid convicted for the drug offense that he violated bond for?

 

[GotZoom]

Was the kid convicted for the drug offense that he violated bond for?

Looks like he was awaiting trial.

 

[Mr. P]

He already violated conditions of his bond. He was out on bond for a drug charge when the shooting occurred.

I know, that's why I said, "Now if he violates the conditions of his bond here, he would go back to jail and be held until his court date.".
On the other hand...what were the conditions of his first bond? Were there any?