Do you believe in Democracy? Ukrainian edition

[Missourian]

Because 68% of Ukrainians agree that it's time to end the Russo-Ukraine War though diplomatic settlement.

Are the people of Ukraine the final arbitrators of what is right for Ukraine, or should Zelensky ignore the will of the people "for their own good?"

I don't expect too many response. It's one heck of a conundrum for Ukrainian War supporters on the left.

Support democracy and admit President Trump was right?

Or support Fascism and admit they don't really give a damn about democracy when it doesn't serve their political purpose.

Ukrainian Support for War Effort Collapses

New data from Ukraine show the public favors ending the war with Russia through negotiations, as support for fighting until victory has plummeted.

news.gallup.com

 

[IM2]

Putin is the one who isn't trying diplomacy, idiot.

 

[TemplarKormac]

It's time for the war to end. It's time for us to stop dumping critical weapons on them and depleting our own stores in the process.

Sometimes there is no "underdog's gotta win" scenario.

 

[Old Rocks]

Because 68% of Ukrainians agree that it's time to end the Russo-Ukraine War though diplomatic settlement.

Are the people of Ukraine the final arbitrators of what is right for Ukraine, or should Zelensky ignore the will of the people "for their own good?"

I don't expect too many response. It's one heck of a conundrum for Ukrainian War supporters on the left.

Support democracy and admit President Trump was right?

Or support Fascism and admit they don't really give a damn about democracy when it doesn't serve their political purpose.



View attachment 1148569

Ukrainian Support for War Effort Collapses

New data from Ukraine show the public favors ending the war with Russia through negotiations, as support for fighting until victory has plummeted.

news.gallup.com

Another fool that has not learned the lesson of Sudetenland. Capitulation to the demands of Putin will only result in WW3.

 

[Old Rocks]

It's time for the war to end. It's time for us to stop dumping critical weapons on them and depleting our own stores in the process.

Sometimes there is no "underdog's gotta win" scenario.

So you cheer for the aggressor to be given what he has killed for. Which will only serve as a base for further aggression. And next time it will be NATO territory. And you will be cowardly enough that you will say we have no business there, either.

 

[IM2]

It's time for the war to end. It's time for us to stop dumping critical weapons on them and depleting our own stores in the process.

Sometimes there is no "underdog's gotta win" scenario.

We aren't depleting anything. We were selling old weapons. We shouldn't be giving in to Putin.

 

[Missourian]

Putin is the one who isn't trying diplomacy, idiot.

Zelensky rejects Trump's

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky on Saturday reaffirmed his commitment to the country's territorial integrity, insisting that Kyiv continues to claim all territories now under Russian control,

cdn-1.timesofoman.com

 

[Missourian]

Another fool that has not learned the lesson of Sudetenland. Capitulation to the demands of Putin will only result in WW3.

Is Europe going to put boots on the ground?

Do you think we should put American soldiers into another battlefield?

If not, what's the alternative?

Let Ukraine send it's citizens into the meat-grinder until nothing is left? The Ukrainian people's spirit is broken. 68% means almost three quarters of the population has given up.

If you have a plan, let's hear it.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Another fool that has not learned the lesson of Sudetenland. Capitulation to the demands of Putin will only result in WW3.

Who said anything about capitulating? Trump is doing what Reagan did to the Soviets—squeezing their economy to a point of near collapse, causing Putin to come running to the table.

You don't need bullets and bombs to destroy the enemy; money is a good weapon, too.

 

[MisterBeale]

US reportedly running out of key Patriot missiles

• US military Patriot missiles see heavy use in Ukraine, Middle East
• Interceptor supply down to 25% of what's needed for Pentagon's plans
• US sending more weapons to Ukraine after initially halting shipments

https://www.newsnationnow.com/us-news/military/patriot-missiles-us-ammo-supply/

If the U.S. continues to back the loser in this war, it will be a threat to our own security.


This war is over, the Russians will only want more concessions the more the west degrades and costs them.

Time to cut our losses.

Yes, Ukraine Started the War

Donald Trump has been flayed alive by Western media and leaders for saying Ukraine started the war. Here are facts, not myths, says Joe Lauria. By Joe Lauria Special to Consortium News The outcry spread quickly across the Western world: Donald Trump dared say Ukraine started the war.

consortiumnews.com

Russia’s Arrival in Dnipropetrovsk Puts Ukraine in Serious Dilemma​

June 10, 2025 By NEWS WIRE

Russia’s Arrival in Dnipropetrovsk Puts Ukraine in Serious Dilemma - 21st Century Wire

Andrew Korybko | Russia is now playing hardball, and latest moves may be enough to collapse the Ukrainian frontlines.

21stcenturywire.com

Russia’s Arrival In Dnipropetrovsk Puts Ukraine In A Dilemma

It’s very difficult to imagine how Ukraine can prevent any further Russian advances after this.

korybko.substack.com

". . . With an eye towards the endgame, it appears as though an inflection point is about to be reached or already has been in the sense of irreversibly shifting the military-strategic dynamics in Russia’s favor. It’s very difficult to imagine how Ukraine can extricate itself from this dilemma. All signs point to this being impossible, though the conflict has already surprised observers on both sides before, so it can’t be ruled out. Nevertheless, it’s a far-fetched scenario, and it’s more likely that Ukraine’s official defeat is nigh."

 

[TemplarKormac]

We aren't depleting anything. We were selling old weapons. We shouldn't be giving in to Putin.

Like I just got through saying, you can't hurt people with money alone. You can devastate someone without ever firing a shot.

 

[Missourian]

So you cheer for the aggressor to be given what he has killed for. Which will only serve as a base for further aggression. And next time it will be NATO territory. And you will be cowardly enough that you will say we have no business there, either.

You need the wisdom to accept that which cannot be changed.

From the moment Russia chose to attack Ukraine, this outcome was inevitable. It's basic risk verses benefit. The risk to Europe in attacking Russia directly is literally an all out war with no chance of winning, because Russia has more nuclear weapons than any other country on Earth.

What is the benefit? It took Russia three years to beat one smaller country. Russia isn't going to attack NATO. There is no benefit for Russia in that. They are depleted and exposed.

If annexing the ethnically Russia provinces of Ukraine and securing Russian access to a warm water port is the cost of averting WWIII ... that's a good trade.



That's the tactical reality.

 

[Missourian]

We shouldn't be giving in to Putin.

Do you have a plan to achieve that goal?

 

[MisterBeale]

US reportedly running out of key Patriot missiles​

• US military Patriot missiles see heavy use in Ukraine, Middle East
• Interceptor supply down to 25% of what's needed for Pentagon's plans
• US sending more weapons to Ukraine after initially halting shipments

​

https://www.newsnationnow.com/us-news/military/patriot-missiles-us-ammo-supply/

If the U.S. continues to back the loser in this war, it will be a threat to our own security.


This war is over, the Russians will only want more concessions the more the west degrades and costs them.

Time to cut our losses.

Yes, Ukraine Started the War

Donald Trump has been flayed alive by Western media and leaders for saying Ukraine started the war. Here are facts, not myths, says Joe Lauria. By Joe Lauria Special to Consortium News The outcry spread quickly across the Western world: Donald Trump dared say Ukraine started the war.

consortiumnews.com

Russia’s Arrival in Dnipropetrovsk Puts Ukraine in Serious Dilemma​

June 10, 2025 By NEWS WIRE

Russia’s Arrival in Dnipropetrovsk Puts Ukraine in Serious Dilemma - 21st Century Wire

Andrew Korybko | Russia is now playing hardball, and latest moves may be enough to collapse the Ukrainian frontlines.

21stcenturywire.com

Russia’s Arrival In Dnipropetrovsk Puts Ukraine In A Dilemma

It’s very difficult to imagine how Ukraine can prevent any further Russian advances after this.

korybko.substack.com

". . . With an eye towards the endgame, it appears as though an inflection point is about to be reached or already has been in the sense of irreversibly shifting the military-strategic dynamics in Russia’s favor. It’s very difficult to imagine how Ukraine can extricate itself from this dilemma. All signs point to this being impossible, though the conflict has already surprised observers on both sides before, so it can’t be ruled out. Nevertheless, it’s a far-fetched scenario, and it’s more likely that Ukraine’s official defeat is nigh."

The June 10th article is dated, it does appear Russia threw everything and the kitchen sink at the front, in anticipation of the summit?

BREAKING: MAJOR Russian Breakthrough in Pokrovsk!!​

Russia breaks through Ukraine frontlines days before Putin-Trump summit​

The escalation comes amid diplomatic tension, with Moscow accusing Britain of attempting to disrupt the forthcoming Trump-Putin meeting​

Russia breaks through Ukraine front lines days before Putin-Trump summit

The escalation comes amid diplomatic tension, with Moscow accusing Britain of attempting to disrupt the forthcoming Trump-Putin meeting

www.express.co.uk

Russian forces break through Ukraine frontline days before Putin-Trump summit

Around 100,000 Russian troops are believed to have travelled at least 10km north of the Ukrainian frontline - days before upcoming peace talks between Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin

www.mirror.co.uk

 

[Missourian]

The June 10th article is dated, it does appear Russia threw everything and the kitchen sink at the front, in anticipation of the summit?

BREAKING: MAJOR Russian Breakthrough in Pokrovsk!!​

Russia breaks through Ukraine frontlines days before Putin-Trump summit​

The escalation comes amid diplomatic tension, with Moscow accusing Britain of attempting to disrupt the forthcoming Trump-Putin meeting​

Russia breaks through Ukraine front lines days before Putin-Trump summit

The escalation comes amid diplomatic tension, with Moscow accusing Britain of attempting to disrupt the forthcoming Trump-Putin meeting

www.express.co.uk

Russian forces break through Ukraine frontline days before Putin-Trump summit

Around 100,000 Russian troops are believed to have travelled at least 10km north of the Ukrainian frontline - days before upcoming peace talks between Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin

www.mirror.co.uk

I saw this earlier today.

It looks like a massive envelopment maneuver.

(Red circle added by me)

Russia Punches Through Ukrainian Lines In Deepest Advance In A Year

Russia's advance in the east has resulted in Ukraine shifting some of its most experienced troops there in an attempt to blunt it.

www.twz.com

 

[GLASNOST]

Support democracy and admit President Trump was right?

Yes.

 

[Doc7505]

Is Europe going to put boots on the ground?

Do you think we should put American soldiers into another battlefield?

If not, what's the alternative?

Let Ukraine send it's citizens into the meat-grinder until nothing is left? The Ukrainian people's spirit is broken. 68% means almost three quarters of the population has given up.

If you have a plan, let's hear it.

~~~~~~
Europe is unprepared for war. Neither Germany, the UK and other countries except Poland are strong enough.
The UK can only muster about 25,000 men and has two weeks of munitions.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/50-battle-ready-germany-misses-military-targets-despite-scholzs-overhaul-2025-02-13/

xxxxxxxxxx​

Why the British army is so unprepared to send troops to Ukraine

Years of spending cuts have removed the ability of British forces to prosecute a war against a peer adversary for an extended time.

theconversation.com

 

[GLASNOST]

Is Europe going to put boots on the ground?

I'll be very angry if that happens. I am a war veteran myself and I do not want to see any of my 3 sons go through that shit.

Europe is unprepared for war. Neither Germany, the UK and other countries except Poland are strong enough.

Not even Poland. Bielarus will crush Poland within weeks.

Do you think we should put American soldiers into another battlefield?

No.

If you have a plan, let's hear it.

Let Russia complete its original goals and negociate or refuse everything else.

 

[JWBooth]

So you cheer for the aggressor to be given what he has killed for. Which will only serve as a base for further aggression. And next time it will be NATO territory. And you will be cowardly enough that you will say we have no business there, either.

 

[Missourian]

I'll be very angry if that happens. I am a war veteran myself and I do not want to see any of my 3 sons go through that shit.

Facts. Honestly, I believe that Europe, for all their talk, are smart enough to see that a war with Russia is a no win situation.