Do Natural Rights Actually Exist?

We can probably get past this and talk about what it is today and the effects is it is having today.

I'm struggling to see its benefits outweighed it's costs.
 
After reading Might is Right by Ragnar Redbeard, I have a different understanding of my rights, inalienable, or otherwise.
 
After reading Might is Right by Ragnar Redbeard, I have a different understanding of my rights, inalienable, or otherwise.
How so?

This thread trips up with the title. To even ask whether natural rights "exist", admits no understanding of the concept.
 
How so?

This thread trips up with the title. To even ask whether natural rights "exist", admits no understanding of the concept.
Basically you have to fight for your right to life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness, and to party. I got that last one from the Beastie Boys.
 
Do Natural Rights Actually Exist? If they do not then it's all intellectual bs. If they do, what are they? Can and do people who believe natural rights actually exist, agree on them -- what they are and are not?

I often see things similar to this Wikipedia entry:
Natural rights are those that are not dependent on the laws or customs of any particular culture or government, and so are universal, fundamental and inalienable (they cannot be repealed by human laws, though one can forfeit their enjoyment through one's actions, such as by violating someone else's rights).

Do natural rights trump laws? If so...
Do natural rights exist?

No.
 
I know people want the idea of natural rights to trump man-made laws, but what does nature say? Will nature punish if natural laws are ignored? Who gets to decide what are and are not natural rights?
I think that the term, natural rights, is a case of a bad name. There is nothing natural about rights at all; rights are an entirely human invention. It's a concept that exists only in humans' minds. Out in the natural world, rights don't exist. If we go up to a lion, we get eaten. It is only in the presence of (some) humans, do we get the right to life.

I think they call it natural right to emphasize the primacy of these rights. They want to convey that the right to life, the right to happiness and such are incredibly important and are not to be over-ridden by the laws of governments. They also call these rights inalienable, which is one more way of saying how important these rights are.
 
I think that the term, natural rights, is a case of a bad name. There is nothing natural about rights at all; rights are an entirely human invention. It's a concept that exists only in humans' minds. Out in the natural world, rights don't exist. If we go up to a lion, we get eaten. It is only in the presence of (some) humans, do we get the right to life.

I think they call it natural right to emphasize the primacy of these rights. They want to convey that the right to life, the right to happiness and such are incredibly important and are not to be over-ridden by the laws of governments. They also call these rights inalienable, which is one more way of saying how important these rights are.

MayorQuimby




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" Natural Rites Implies Goad Directed Inalienable Moralism "

* Realism Of Deontological Versus Consequentialism *

" No "
* No *

No
The natural law theorist assert that inalienable rites designated for hue mammon were directed by goad .

Any thing that can be alienated is alienable , even though such a thing could exist , as an existence of a thing does not necessitate inalienability ; thus , an assertion for inalienable rites as a goad given property of natural law theorists is baseless dogma .

The term right ( sic ) alludes to normative values , while the term right is applied through ignorance for chirality or handedness - Applying THe Term Rights As A Descriptor For Articles Of Constitution Is Slang And A Profound Error In Diction .
 
" Natural Rites Implies Goad Directed Inalienable Moralism "

* Realism Of Deontological Versus Consequentialism *


The natural law theorist assert that inalienable rites designated for hue mammon were directed by goad .

Any thing that can be alienated is alienable , even though such a thing could exist , as an existence of a thing does not necessitate inalienability ; thus , an assertion for inalienable rites as a goad given property of natural law theorists is baseless dogma .

The term right ( sic ) alludes to normative values , while the term right is applied through ignorance for chirality or handedness - Applying THe Term Rights As A Descriptor For Articles Of Constitution Is Slang And A Profound Error In Diction .

I fear you are all thinking in much too complex dead lines. Take just simple our planet: Who will desttroy the planet with nukes will just simple hurt the natural human rights of all human beings and also do suicide. In such a case it's totally unimportant wether this rights are known or unknown or written down or not written down or whether or what someone thinks about or not. And it exist by the way also animal rights. Everything what lives has rights. Everyone who destroys life without any very good reason to do so ignores this rights.

To know or not to know human rights is the same as to know or not to know electromagnetism. Without knowledge about electromagnetism you can live a wonderful life in trees like Gibbons. Same are you able to do without the awareness of human rights.

The German expression for "unalienable" human rights is by the way "unveräußerliche" Menschenrechte. "veräußern" means "to sell" - so verbaly means "unalienable" in German "unsellable". In sense that no one is able to sell what no one owns. Or is someone of you able to sell the sun, the moon and all stars or the whole universe?

 
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Exactly. It is the natural right of a tiger to eat a steak in the typical way how tigers do it. But we are predestined to be cultural and civilized animals. So we eat our steaks with chopsticks.

By the way: It's totally unreasonable when human beings eat predators - as for example cats or dogs - even in case no law exists which forbids this. But this hurts the natural rights of animals. We are predators on our own. We do not eat tigers - we eat cattles as also tigers do. But tigers have to get their fair share. They also have a right to exist.

With every species we lose, we also lose a voice of God.
Pope Francis
 
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" Optional And Alienable Contrary With Natural Rites Theory "

* Confusing Existential Possibilities With Assurances *

They also have a right to exist.
Some animals are extinct ; so apparently , an irrevocable entitlement for a rite to life did not and does not exist .
 
... Some animals are extinct ; so apparently , an irrevocable entitlement for a rite to life did not and does not exist .

What form of logic is this? "Some families are extinct from the natural catastrophe 'Nazis'. So apparently murder is and never was a crime?"

Believe it or not: Animals have rights - whether it exist laws to protect this rights or not. I said by the way not that no one should kill animals. I spoke about that it is wrong to kill an animal without good - better to say 'very good' or 'excellent' - reasons to do so.
 
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Do human rights exist?
Rights are a pile of crap. If you don't believe me, stand naked infront of a pride of lions on the Serengeti and tell them all of your rights.

We have responsibilities. Be responsible, do not stand naked on the Serengeti whispering to lions.
 
" Contemporary Natural Rites Theorists Deny Nature Of Implicit Freedoms "

* Anthropomorphic Personification Of Goad To Justify Public Policy Agenda *

So you prefer to live in anarchy, I guess. The strong will survive, the weak will die out until you alone live happily and contentedly in your world.
Prior to entering into a social civil contract for a collective state , individuals are subject to a moral relativism within nature - natural freedoms , by which free will may be supposed .

To improve ones opportunity for survival and for quality of life , individuals exchange natural freedoms for protections and endowments , according to a constitution , through retorts by a collective state as a greater individual .

The contemporary natural rites theorists continue to invoke gaod as its basis for self officiated principles upon which to implement its deontological traditions of moralism ( more all is them ) , while seeking daemon rat populism for democracy as tyranny by collective majority and against independence of the individual , without satisfying an enumerated rite of equal protection for negative liberties among individuals , that is constrainted for safety and security .

The natural rites theorist too often expects to bypass a criteria of proof for validity of its public policies , as its pundits seek to curtail natural freedoms that hue mammon is entitled to retain , as its pundits seek to avoid compliance with principles of non violence and of individualism , as its pundits seek to avoid compliance with the enumerated rite of us citizens for equal protection .

The theory of legal positivism challenges natural rites theory that rites are alienable and forwards perspectivism that relates no epistomological absolutes and not all perspectives are equally valid , which forwards consequentialism against dogmas of deonology maintained by natural rites theorists .

The principle of non violence defines violence as illegitimate aggression , where self defense against violence is legitimate aggression .

The principle of individualism defines violence as any illegitimate aggression against an individual , which deprives an individual of self ownership or of self determination , where self ownership entitles an individual to free roam , to free association and to progeny , and where self determination entitles an individual to private property and to willful intents through social civil contracts made valid by informed consent .

A valid perspective of us republic is that its espouses independence of the individual citizen , through equal protection of negative libeties among individuals , which is delimited by safety and or security .

Negative liberties represent protections , indiviudalism , independence .

Positive liberties represent endowments , collectivism , codependence .
 
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" Contemporary Natural Rites Theorists Deny Nature Of Implicit Freedoms "

* Anthropomorphic Personification Of Goad To Justify Public Policy Agenda *


Prior to entering into a social civil contract for a collective state ,

Aha - a fake-intellectual speaks with me.

individuals are subject to a moral relativism within nature - natural freedoms , by which free will may be supposed .

Natural human rights have nothing to do with "nature". There is no physical research "human rights". Natural means in this case God-given. It means such rights exceed the natural sphere of existence. I think if we like to be children of god (= free human beings) then we need to fight for all and every life. Otherwise we never will be able to be free. Who is free is able to obey truth, love and reason. Or with other words: "Someone is an adult when they do what their parents suggest - even though it's the best thing to do."

To improve ones opportunity for survival and for quality of life , individuals exchange natural freedoms for protections and endowments , according to a constitution , through retorts by a collective state as a greater individual .

The state as a greater individual? What nonsense is this? Nazi nonsense? Commie nonsense? How we govern ourselve is just simple an act of common values, common decisions and a common organisation. Sometimes criminals overtake.

The contemporary natural rites theorists continue to invoke gaod as its basis for self officiated principles upon which to implement its deontological traditions of moralism ( more all is them ) , while seeking daemon rat populism for democracy as tyranny by collective majority and against independence of the individual , without satisfying an enumerated rite of equal protection for negative liberties among individuals , that is constrainted for safety and security .

The natural rites theorist too often expects to bypass a criteria of proof for validity of its public policies , as its pundits seek to curtail natural freedoms that hue mammon is entitled to retain , as its pundits seek to avoid compliance with principles of non violence and of individualism , as its pundits seek to avoid compliance with the enumerated rite of us citizens for equal protection .

The theory of legal positivism challenges natural rites theory that rites are alienable and forwards perspectivism that relates no epistomological absolutes and not all perspectives are equally valid , which forwards consequentialism against dogmas of deonology maintained by natural rites theorists .

The principle of non violence defines violence as illegitimate aggression ,

No.

where self defense against violence is legitimate aggression .

You are absurde. Konrad Lorenz wrote once "Das sogenannte Böse" (=The so called evil) which explains very well why aggressions are not evil. But what he said is a million miles far from you. There's a need for aggressions - but there is also a big need to control the own aggressions.

The principle of individualism defines violence as any illegitimate aggression against an individual , which deprives an individual of self ownership or of self determination , where self ownership entitles an individual to free roam , to free association and to progeny , and where self determination entitles an individual to private property and to willful intents through social civil contracts made valid by informed consent .

A valid perspective of us republic is that its espouses independence of the individual citizen , through equal protection of negative libeties among individuals , which is delimited by safety and or security .

Negative liberties represent protections , indiviudalism , independence .

Positive liberties represent endowments , collectivism , codependence .

You seem to follow a strange form of political indoctrinaion. Compressed in only one expression I would say you follow a slave holder mentality. Freedom is freedom - that's it. A slave is only not bodily free in this world here in the moment now but I fear someone with a slave holder mentality never will be free.

 
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