Dehumanization: Palestinians' most powerful enemy

[Coyote]

I think if there was solid evidence it *would* be aired publically for propaganda value if nothing else. The fact that it isn't speaks volumes.

I think their relative silence has more to do with the fact that Hamas screwed the pooch this time and Israel was within it's rights to go after them.

 

[SAYIT]

I think if there was solid evidence it *would* be aired publically for propaganda value if nothing else. The fact that it isn't speaks volumes.

I think their relative silence has more to do with the fact that Hamas screwed the pooch this time and Israel was within it's rights to go after them.

UNRWA's complicity seems obvious but it can't even be investigated. The sponsors of the UN's Palestinian Nanny Service need the illusion that they are the good guys and the UN needs the jobs and the funding but I do agree the conflict was Hamas's Big Blunder, thus the UN and international community's relative silence. I believe if the US allows it, Israel will press for changes in UNRWA's mission, funding and operations. This conflict will cost the Gazan's dearly.

 

[MJB12741]

For as long as the Palestinians & their supporters see the last conflict as a Hamas VICTORY, I join them in wishing them many many more like it to come.

 

[Kondor3]

The Palestinians do, indeed, have a slight Public Relations problem...

One that their cowardice brought down upon their own heads...

Gallows humor?

And, this does nothing to (1) disprove the idea that the Palestinians have a Public Relations problem nor (2) disprove the idea that the Palestinians cowardly habit of embedding their war assets amongst their civilian populations is egregious and widespread and directly responsible for huge numbers of Palestinian civilian casualties - a state of affairs which they brought down upon their own heads.

Seems to be Hamas doing that.
Seems also that Israel has been caught using human sheilds.

Don't know about that, but, during the course of a 4-week 2000-dead war,it wouldn't surprise me all that much to see a few instances unfold here and there amongst the IDF as well, however...

1. if...IF... the IDF has done any of that, it's random and spontaneous, localized, scattered, and infrequent

2. with Hamas, it's ubiquitous and egregious, a matter of intentional policy, and commonplace

3.the IDF uses Enemy as shields

4. Hamas uses their own women and children as shields

The attempt at a moral equivalency here is rejected.

From the article I linked to - Isaeli High Court: Israeli Soldiers Used Palestinians as Human Shields 1,200 Times.

That is not "if", nor is it random and spontaneous, localized, scattered, and infrequent.

You are citing an ancient 9-year-old article in the Washington Post which focused upon 1200 separate incidents spanning a five-year period, and nothing to do with the most recent Gaza War.

Both the figures and the court ruling were deemed highly questionable and were challenged at the time, and various ministries insisted upon a judicial review of that ruling.

Irrelevant to the most recent Gaza War.

And, even if true in its entirety, rather than only in part.

At least they're using the Enemy as shields.

Not their own women and children.

Huge frigging difference which constitutes the Elephant in the Room here.

 

[José]

If those hapless Palestinian "refugees" - and to a great extent, most Mideast Arabs - wanted less oppression they would toss off their failed leadership and failed societies and get on board the democracy train.

The punctuation mark wrapping the word refugee embodies the dehumanising paradigm through which you see the arab people of Palestine.

A blond, blue-eyed ukrainian Jew, being more than human, entitled to all the rights of a normal human being and then some, has the "right" to a fast-track immigration process to a region his ancestors never lived in.

Ukrainian Jew (as semitic as Mao Tse Tung)

New Amman Refugee Camp

By any definition of Sociology and Political Science, the territory occupied by the state of Israel is the historical homeland of these children and any state that denies their free access to their family's place of origin is by definition a supremacist state.

But while the ukrainian Jew would be received in his "homeland" with music and dozens of subsidies the only thing those children would get if they tried to do the same thing, being less than humans, is a bullet in the head.

 

[José]

Originally posted by José
the denial of their right to move freely in their homeland

their forced confinement to parts of Palestine they're not originally from

the brutal assassination of those who decide to fight back by the israeli war machine

Originally posted by Coyote
Woah dude.

That's a complete fabrication of my position.

It was a perfectly accurate description of your position.

Originally posted by Coyote
I'd dismantle all settlements on occupied territories.

Then, I'd defend the legally and historically defined borders of my nation with lethal force.

Would you build a wall Page 6 US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

Western Palestine is part of their historical homeland too and you advocate the use of lethal force if they fight for their right to live there.

A classic example of a group of human beings dehumanized due to their ethno-religious affiliation.

 

[José]

Originally posted by Coyote
This latest conflict though - is not a good example. NO country can be expected to tolerate constant rocket fire into it's civilian population and Hamas kept escalating, putting it's people at risk. Would we, in our country tolerate this without a response? I seriously doubt it.

Totally illegitimate comparison...

Let's compare apples with apples here.

Supremacist states with supremacist states.

Let's imagine America creates an ethnic enclave in Florida and herds 80% of its black and hispanic population surrounded by barbed wire and machine gun nests. Would Coyote still support the right of this white supremacist state to "defend" itself against the captive population? I seriously doubt it too.

Coyote's mind is ENTIRELY shaped by the paradigms created by WWII.

Absolute racial equality between whites and any other race.

That's why she'd be morally disgusted by an ethnic enclave created in Florida to preserve an artificial white majority in the US.

But she has no problem with Jews doing the same thing in Palestine.

 

[José]

Whites, blacks, hispanics = equally humans

Jews = super-humans

Palestinians = sub-humans

Coyote's mind follows the post-WWII paradigms I described in my opening post with a canine fidelity, perfectly, faithfully, to the point of being humorous, caricatural. : )

 

[José]

Just like an american landowner in 1790 couldn't see anything wrong with buying and selling blacks, treating human beings as merchandise, objectifying them, just like a south african white didn't see the confinement of blacks in Transkei and KwaZulu as ethnic supremacism, Coyote and Sayit genuinely, sincerely can't see anything wrong with a country surrounded by barbed wire, electric fence and walls to keep the native people of the region out.

As I said in the OP, the most striking characteristic of social paradigms in general and dehumanizing social paradigms in particular is the fact that most of the times the dehumanizer isn't even aware of his own dehumanization, of his own act of dehumanizing others.

Coyote and Sayit both had their formative years after 1948 so the dehumanizing paradigm of the palestinian people is so familiar to them they can't even recognize it as such. The paradigm is part of them, it is embedded into what they are, into the way they think.

The comparisons I created for the OP are a bit weird but they are right on the money:

(Dehumanizing paradigms are) Just like a fish who never realizes the presence of water around it. (because it was born in the pond, never experienced any other reality)

Like a computer program that runs on the background without the user even noticing it.

 

[Lipush]

There's a lot of hate being taught and passed on - on both sides.

Hamas abusing children, assuming out of all the evidence one is true, and we have a worse situation than we can ever think of nevertheless if more true - both ways - it is probably one of the worse things you can ever do to a kid, manipulate his mind at young age - for the rest of his life and even further generations as well,and these are the people that suppose to lead and set an example for the Palestinians - be their best representative to the world, and if you ask me it deserve a death penalty.[/QUOTE]

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF. [/QUOTE]

Wow, good thing you didn't use that word, cause, well...we care so much about your own pro-Jihadist terminology and all that... We have so much more fucks to give about that, too, so, well...

 

[Lipush]

Whites, blacks, hispanics = equally humans

Jews = super-humans

Palestinians = sub-humans

Coyote's mind follows the post-WWII paradigms I described in my opening post with a canine fidelity, perfectly, faithfully, to the point of being humorous, caricatural. : )

You think the exact same thing, just the other way around.

 

[Lipush]

[QUOTE="Forester, post:

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.

Killing a rattlesnake before it strikes is always a good idea.

An example of dehumanization. These clowns are truly nutcases. It's like the old "the only good indian is a dead indian" rant of our forefathers. Seems like the Israeli clowns are a century or two behind developmentally.

Blah, blah, blah... kill the Radical Muslim rattlesnake beforee it can strike... The West has that one right on.

Especially the babies and 2 year olds. That's who the Israelis kill.

More automatic gainsay blah, blah, blah...[/QUOTE]

No, just fact. Israeli Jews kill children, it's in their DNA. And, you support the murder of children.[/QUOTE]

You're one hell of a Nazi Hanazir, aren't you.

Tell us more about being balanced poster.

 

[Lipush]

[QUOTE="Forester, post:

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.

Killing a rattlesnake before it strikes is always a good idea.

An example of dehumanization. These clowns are truly nutcases. It's like the old "the only good indian is a dead indian" rant of our forefathers. Seems like the Israeli clowns are a century or two behind developmentally.

Blah, blah, blah... kill the Radical Muslim rattlesnake beforee it can strike... The West has that one right on.[/QUOTE]


Especially the babies and 2 year olds. That's who the Israelis kill.[/QUOTE]

The Fogels were soldiers, right.

Expecially the 3 months old. Occupier.

 

[Kondor3]

[QUOTE="Forester, post:

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.

Killing a rattlesnake before it strikes is always a good idea.

An example of dehumanization. These clowns are truly nutcases. It's like the old "the only good indian is a dead indian" rant of our forefathers. Seems like the Israeli clowns are a century or two behind developmentally.

Blah, blah, blah... kill the Radical Muslim rattlesnake beforee it can strike... The West has that one right on.

Especially the babies and 2 year olds. That's who the Israelis kill.

More automatic gainsay blah, blah, blah...[/QUOTE]

No, just fact. Israeli Jews kill children, it's in their DNA. And, you support the murder of children.[/QUOTE]

=================================================

"Israeli Jews kill children"?

"It's in their DNA"?

You are one sick phukk.

Always figured that it would turn out to be this particular symptom on your end.

It just took longer for The Hate to come oozing out of your skin than others like you.

Your stock around here just plummetted through the basement, my little Arab butt-floss.

You've now been officially removed from the list of Respectable Folk around here.

Opposition to Israel is one thing.

Jew-hating, of your particular flavor, is quite another.

The stuff that Auschwitz and Treblinka were made of.

Way-to-go, making the point that pro-Palestinian propaganda shills engage in far more and deeper dehumanization (of Jews) than the so-called dehumanization of Palestinians that is at-issue here.

Clown.

Asswipe.

 

[SAYIT]

Coyote's mind is ENTIRELY shaped by the paradigms created by WWII.

While you insist we completely ignore the lessons of WW2.
So how are your positions superior or more valid?
Millions of people were displaced during and following that war. All but the Arab "refugees" - who were rounded up and made wards of the UN - found new homes and made new lives.

 

[SAYIT]

No, just fact. Israeli Jews kill children, it's in their DNA. And, you support the murder of children.

"Israeli Jews kill children"?
"It's in their DNA"?
You are one sick phukk.
Always figured that it would turn out to be this particular symptom on your end.
It just took longer for The Hate to come oozing out of your skin than others like you.
Your stock around here just plummetted through the basement, my little Arab butt-floss.
You've now been officially removed from the list of Respectable Folk around here.
Opposition to Israel is one thing.
Jew-hating, of your particular flavor, is quite another.
The stuff that Auschwitz and Treblinka were made of.
Way-to-go, making the point that pro-Palestinian propaganda shills engage in far more and deeper dehumanization (of Jews) than the so-called dehumanization of Palestinians that is at-issue here.
Clown.
Asswipe.

As has often been confirmed by the nature of their posts, the vast majority of "pro-Palestinian" posters here actually know precious little about the conflict and the people of Israel and the territories and seem to care even less. What they do know is their hate for Jooos and no matter how vociferously they protest (and most do), they really just can't hide it.

 

[SAYIT]

Just like an american landowner in 1790 couldn't see anything wrong with buying and selling blacks, treating human beings as merchandise, objectifying them, just like a south african white didn't see the confinement of blacks in Transkei and KwaZulu as ethnic supremacism, Coyote and Sayit genuinely, sincerely can't see anything wrong with a country surrounded by barbed wire, electric fence and walls to keep the native people of the region out.

There is nothing unusual about countries building walls to keep out foreigners (Saudi builds northern border fence against infiltrators - Yahoo News) and in Israel's case, the fence not only keeps out an avowed enemy you seem to prefer at Israel's throat, but saves both Israeli and Arab lives. No wonder someone like you hates it so.

 

[SAYIT]

If those hapless Palestinian "refugees" - and to a great extent, most Mideast Arabs - wanted less oppression they would toss off their failed leadership and failed societies and get on board the democracy train.

The punctuation mark wrapping the word refugee embodies the dehumanising paradigm through which you see the arab people of Palestine.

The quotation mark around the word "refugee" is my way of casting doubt on the now 65 yr "refugee" status of those the UN signed up with the promise of "3 hots and a cot." Without UNRWA and the braying of peeps like you those "refugees" would long ago have settled into new homes, new lives and perhaps a state of their own making but instead have chosen to take the more convenient path, languishing in squalid "refugee" camps as wards of the UN Nanny Agency and eagerly serving as cannon fodder in your never-ending war against the Jews.

 

[Kondor3]

Originally posted by Coyote
This latest conflict though - is not a good example. NO country can be expected to tolerate constant rocket fire into it's civilian population and Hamas kept escalating, putting it's people at risk. Would we, in our country tolerate this without a response? I seriously doubt it.

Totally illegitimate comparison...

Let's compare apples with apples here.

Supremacist states with supremacist states.

Let's imagine America creates an ethnic enclave in Florida and herds 80% of its black and hispanic population surrounded by barbed wire and machine gun nests. Would Coyote still support the right of this white supremacist state to "defend" itself against the captive population? I seriously doubt it too.

Coyote's mind is ENTIRELY shaped by the paradigms created by WWII.

Absolute racial equality between whites and any other race.

That's why she'd be morally disgusted by an ethnic enclave created in Florida to preserve an artificial white majority in the US.

But she has no problem with Jews doing the same thing in Palestine.

Newsflash, New Meat...

As often as not, Coyote does all that she can to ensure that the Palestinians are not subjected to dehumanizing propaganda and unfair forms of scrutiny, to the point where many of the older denizens of this board-system see her as largely pro-Palestinian, with a bit of fairness and objectivity on behalf of the Israelis tossed-in for good measure.

I have personally gone toe-to-toe with her on dozens of occasions over the past year or more, and so have a great many other pro-Israeli posters that haunt this forum, and, even though many of us do not believe that many of her assessments and interpretations are correct or practical, there are very few of us who doubt her veracity and sincerity, along with her own fair share of formidable debate or dialogue skills.

Perhaps, after you've spent more than 10 minutes hanging-about here, you'll come to understand that.

 

[Coyote]

The Palestinians do, indeed, have a slight Public Relations problem...

One that their cowardice brought down upon their own heads...

Gallows humor?

And, this does nothing to (1) disprove the idea that the Palestinians have a Public Relations problem nor (2) disprove the idea that the Palestinians cowardly habit of embedding their war assets amongst their civilian populations is egregious and widespread and directly responsible for huge numbers of Palestinian civilian casualties - a state of affairs which they brought down upon their own heads.

Seems to be Hamas doing that.
Seems also that Israel has been caught using human sheilds.

Don't know about that, but, during the course of a 4-week 2000-dead war,it wouldn't surprise me all that much to see a few instances unfold here and there amongst the IDF as well, however...

1. if...IF... the IDF has done any of that, it's random and spontaneous, localized, scattered, and infrequent

2. with Hamas, it's ubiquitous and egregious, a matter of intentional policy, and commonplace

3.the IDF uses Enemy as shields

4. Hamas uses their own women and children as shields

The attempt at a moral equivalency here is rejected.

From the article I linked to - Isaeli High Court: Israeli Soldiers Used Palestinians as Human Shields 1,200 Times.

That is not "if", nor is it random and spontaneous, localized, scattered, and infrequent.

You are citing an ancient 9-year-old article in the Washington Post which focused upon 1200 separate incidents spanning a five-year period, and nothing to do with the most recent Gaza War.

Both the figures and the court ruling were deemed highly questionable and were challenged at the time, and various ministries insisted upon a judicial review of that ruling.

Irrelevant to the most recent Gaza War.

And, even if true in its entirety, rather than only in part.

At least they're using the Enemy as shields.

Not their own women and children.

Huge frigging difference which constitutes the Elephant in the Room here.

It's not irrelevent to the recent conflict because the charges of using human shields has been going on for a long time and that cartoon you uised certainly predates the current conflict.

Did the judicial review change the ruling?

At least they're using "the Enemy" as human shields?

Using Palestinian CHILDREN as human shields is acceptable to you? That is a "huge frigging difference"?