Dehumanization: Palestinians' most powerful enemy

[Daniyel]

No nation is clean of sin. But if people ask me to show sympathy for the same people who did the Ramallah lynch, then I'm sorry that I cannot force myself to feel it. If people blame me for saying those who sent to kill Helena Rapp are monsters and not human, not going to say "sorry" for that either.

They aren't all "the same people".

No, they're the ones who set the example for younger generations of Palestinian children

Do they? Sometimes I wonder if much of that is also media hype that emphasizes the worst because it sells. When kids are iinterviewed, they want to be doctors or teachers - clearly, there are other role models.

There's a lot of hate being taught and passed on - on both sides.

Hamas abusing children, assuming out of all the evidence one is true, and we have a worse situation than we can ever think of nevertheless if more true - both ways - it is probably one of the worse things you can ever do to a kid, manipulate his mind at young age - for the rest of his life and even further generations as well,and these are the people that suppose to lead and set an example for the Palestinians - be their best representative to the world, and if you ask me it deserve a death penalty.

 

[Forester]

There's a lot of hate being taught and passed on - on both sides.[/QUOTE]
Hamas abusing children, assuming out of all the evidence one is true, and we have a worse situation than we can ever think of nevertheless if more true - both ways - it is probably one of the worse things you can ever do to a kid, manipulate his mind at young age - for the rest of his life and even further generations as well,and these are the people that suppose to lead and set an example for the Palestinians - be their best representative to the world, and if you ask me it deserve a death penalty.[/QUOTE]

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

 

[Daniyel]

There's a lot of hate being taught and passed on - on both sides.

Hamas abusing children, assuming out of all the evidence one is true, and we have a worse situation than we can ever think of nevertheless if more true - both ways - it is probably one of the worse things you can ever do to a kid, manipulate his mind at young age - for the rest of his life and even further generations as well,and these are the people that suppose to lead and set an example for the Palestinians - be their best representative to the world, and if you ask me it deserve a death penalty.

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

 

[Forester]

[QUOTE="Forester, post:

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF. [/QUOTE]

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?[/QUOTE]

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.

 

[montelatici]

The dehumanization of the Palestinians by Israel and it's supporters IS an issue, but it's being conflated with a lot of other stuff in the OP.

Look at how the Palestinians are constantly referred to as "animals" etc etc - every individual tarred with the brush of extremists. Palestinian children die and the comments are along the line of "good riddance, one less future terrorist". This dehumanization is evident in the justice system where there are two different "systems" for the same offenses and children are brutally treated by Israeli officials. Israeli Jews can throw stones and get a slap on the wrist. Palestinians throw stones and get shot. Because they're "animals".

Over and over we see this dehumanization.

This latest conflict though - is not a good example. NO country can be expected to tolerate constant rocket fire into it's civilian population and Hamas kept escalating, putting it's people at risk. Would we, in our country tolerate this without a response? I seriously doubt it.

No people can tolerate decades of continuous oppression and occupation. Would Americans just accept being penned into Gulags for decades without striking out at their jailers? I seriously doubt it.

To start the ball rolling - all Hamas has to do is recognize Israel's right to exist as a sovereign nation. The fact that Fatah was willing to and Hamas was no speaks volumes about Hamas' intentions. There is also something to be said about Hamas' choice to hide armaments in and near hospitals and schools, something which has been independently verified - thus choosing to make them targets. Hamas is using it's people, not leading it's people.

1. No buildings that were housing civilians had arms stored there. You are parroting propaganda, as usual.

"UNRWA discovered rockets hidden in a vacant school in the Gaza Strip.

There's a lot of hate being taught and passed on - on both sides.

Hamas abusing children, assuming out of all the evidence one is true, and we have a worse situation than we can ever think of nevertheless if more true - both ways - it is probably one of the worse things you can ever do to a kid, manipulate his mind at young age - for the rest of his life and even further generations as well,and these are the people that suppose to lead and set an example for the Palestinians - be their best representative to the world, and if you ask me it deserve a death penalty.

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

So that's why you people kill 4 year olds. You know that the way you have been treating them they will hate you when they grow up. Makes sense. in a nation of sociopaths.

 

[Kondor3]

The Palestinians do, indeed, have a slight Public Relations problem...

One that their cowardice brought down upon their own heads...

Gallows humor?

And, this does nothing to (1) disprove the idea that the Palestinians have a Public Relations problem nor (2) disprove the idea that the Palestinians cowardly habit of embedding their war assets amongst their civilian populations is egregious and widespread and directly responsible for huge numbers of Palestinian civilian casualties - a state of affairs which they brought down upon their own heads.

Seems to be Hamas doing that.
Seems also that Israel has been caught using human sheilds.

Don't know about that, but, during the course of a 4-week 2000-dead war,it wouldn't surprise me all that much to see a few instances unfold here and there amongst the IDF as well, however...

1. if...IF... the IDF has done any of that, it's random and spontaneous, localized, scattered, and infrequent

2. with Hamas, it's ubiquitous and egregious, a matter of intentional policy, and commonplace

3.the IDF uses Enemy as shields

4. Hamas uses their own women and children as shields

The attempt at a moral equivalency here is rejected.

 

[Kondor3]

[QUOTE="Forester, post:

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?[/QUOTE]

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.[/QUOTE]

Killing a rattlesnake before it strikes is always a good idea.

 

[montelatici]

[QUOTE="Forester, post:

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.[/QUOTE]

Killing a rattlesnake before it strikes is always a good idea.[/QUOTE]

An example of dehumanization. These clowns are truly nutcases. It's like the old "the only good indian is a dead indian" rant of our forefathers. Seems like the Israeli clowns are a century or two behind developmentally.

 

[Forester]

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.[/QUOTE]

Killing a rattlesnake before it strikes is always a good idea.[/QUOTE]
It's actually a GREAT idea if Israel's wish is to be considered a perpetual ROGUE STATE. How many sanctions would it take for Israel to crumble? Not many. Boycott Israeli products/tourism!

 

[Kondor3]

[QUOTE="Forester, post:

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.

Killing a rattlesnake before it strikes is always a good idea.[/QUOTE]

An example of dehumanization. These clowns are truly nutcases. It's like the old "the only good indian is a dead indian" rant of our forefathers. Seems like the Israeli clowns are a century or two behind developmentally.[/QUOTE]

Blah, blah, blah... kill the Radical Muslim rattlesnake beforee it can strike... The West has that one right on.

 

[montelatici]

[QUOTE="Forester, post:

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.

Killing a rattlesnake before it strikes is always a good idea.

An example of dehumanization. These clowns are truly nutcases. It's like the old "the only good indian is a dead indian" rant of our forefathers. Seems like the Israeli clowns are a century or two behind developmentally.[/QUOTE]

Blah, blah, blah... kill the Radical Muslim rattlesnake beforee it can strike... The West has that one right on.[/QUOTE]


Especially the babies and 2 year olds. That's who the Israelis kill.

 

[Kondor3]

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.

Killing a rattlesnake before it strikes is always a good idea.[/QUOTE]
It's actually a GREAT idea if Israel's wish is to be considered a perpetual ROGUE STATE. How many sanctions would it take for Israel to crumble? Not many. Boycott Israeli products/tourism![/QUOTE]

Ahhhhhhh...

Another pro-Palestinian / anti-Israeli / BDS shill... cool.

Prattle-on, and wake us up when your nine-year-old pissant fly-speck Boycott actually yields any Real World results that point conclusively to your desired outcome, eh?

 

[Kondor3]

[QUOTE="Forester, post:

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.

Killing a rattlesnake before it strikes is always a good idea.

An example of dehumanization. These clowns are truly nutcases. It's like the old "the only good indian is a dead indian" rant of our forefathers. Seems like the Israeli clowns are a century or two behind developmentally.

Blah, blah, blah... kill the Radical Muslim rattlesnake beforee it can strike... The West has that one right on.[/QUOTE]

Especially the babies and 2 year olds. That's who the Israelis kill.[/QUOTE]


More automatic gainsay blah, blah, blah...

 

[Daniyel]

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.

It make sense to every rational mind that once somebody is pointing a gun with live ammo - you will shot him first.
Calling it "Extermination" is just another example of how people demonize or call it 'dehumanize' Israel proving my point earlier in this threat, there is no such "Extermination" except for exterminating a life danger threat - I could accept that, and everyone SHOULD.
It is also not considered a terrorism and does not violate ANY of the Geneva Conventions - if anyone even care about it anyways.
About the land issue, as you lately noticed, Egypt offered a fifth time bigger land to the Palestinians, and don't you forget the dozens of land and good gestures Israel made in the past, everything resulted in dead Israelis.
Land is not what they desire, and leaving Israel won't make any difference, not to mention these are not even their land in the first place, so basically you're saying that the violent one with the weakest claim should make the demands by even more violence? Are you fully aware of how necessary these land of our small and precious homeland? I'm sorry but I lost you on this one - where do you think are we going with this?
Peace is something I've thought about for a while now, I came to the simple conclusion, Israel must begin a one sided solution, either a mandate or fully recognition over the WB - with the Palestinians or not - or anything similar, but the point is that with the leadership of the Palestinians - and I'm not talking about the Hamas, the successor of The Grand Moufti, Ahmed Yasin, Yaser Arafat, and the rest, they are all violent terrorists, the only thing they ever achieved is barely to be called a small "victory" in the Palestinian-crisis it is the radicalism and violence flourishing, without putting an end to it, no peace will ever be real.
So in another words, the ball is in the Palestinian hand, and been there for decades, although the time is running up for them, it is only their role in a mutual process, not commitments/ceasefires/agreements to break or believe to be eternal, some people really expect that a conflict of over 70 years can be cured in a moment, so allow me to disagree, we all know its not reachable - for the rational mind -

 

[montelatici]

[QUOTE="Forester, post:

Actually, the worst thing you can do to a child in Gaza is to kill his/her entire family, which Israel is quite proficient in doing. It creates generations of warriors against Israel. Notice I DIDN'T use the word terrorist? I reserve that distinction for the IDF.

Here fixed the quotes,
Anyway - this is your point of view, because someone desire to kill me it doesn't mean I won't kill him early, makes sense?

It might possibly make sense in Israeli-speak, but to me, no. It's called extermination and is a violation of the Geneva Convention. It's also terrorism. Change tactics. Retreat to your own lands and make peace.

Killing a rattlesnake before it strikes is always a good idea.

An example of dehumanization. These clowns are truly nutcases. It's like the old "the only good indian is a dead indian" rant of our forefathers. Seems like the Israeli clowns are a century or two behind developmentally.

Blah, blah, blah... kill the Radical Muslim rattlesnake beforee it can strike... The West has that one right on.

Especially the babies and 2 year olds. That's who the Israelis kill.[/QUOTE]


More automatic gainsay blah, blah, blah...[/QUOTE]

No, just fact. Israeli Jews kill children, it's in their DNA. And, you support the murder of children.

 

[Kondor3]

...Calling it "Extermination" is just another example of how people demonize or call it 'dehumanize' Israel...

There is no point arguing with Radical Muslim or pro-Palestinian shills.

All one can do is to periodically call 'Bullshit' when they start shoveling it, so that they don't get away with their propagandizing unchallenged, and then walk away for a while, and let 'em stew.

 

[SAYIT]

An example of dehumanization. These clowns are truly nutcases. It's like the old "the only good indian is a dead indian" rant of our forefathers. Seems like the Israeli clowns are a century or two behind developmentally.

If they are it still puts them 11 or 12 centuries ahead of you Islamic clowns.

 

[Coyote]

The dehumanization of the Palestinians by Israel and it's supporters IS an issue, but it's being conflated with a lot of other stuff in the OP.

Look at how the Palestinians are constantly referred to as "animals" etc etc - every individual tarred with the brush of extremists. Palestinian children die and the comments are along the line of "good riddance, one less future terrorist". This dehumanization is evident in the justice system where there are two different "systems" for the same offenses and children are brutally treated by Israeli officials. Israeli Jews can throw stones and get a slap on the wrist. Palestinians throw stones and get shot. Because they're "animals".

Over and over we see this dehumanization.

This latest conflict though - is not a good example. NO country can be expected to tolerate constant rocket fire into it's civilian population and Hamas kept escalating, putting it's people at risk. Would we, in our country tolerate this without a response? I seriously doubt it.

No people can tolerate decades of continuous oppression and occupation. Would Americans just accept being penned into Gulags for decades without striking out at their jailers? I seriously doubt it.

To start the ball rolling - all Hamas has to do is recognize Israel's right to exist as a sovereign nation. The fact that Fatah was willing to and Hamas was no speaks volumes about Hamas' intentions. There is also something to be said about Hamas' choice to hide armaments in and near hospitals and schools, something which has been independently verified - thus choosing to make them targets. Hamas is using it's people, not leading it's people.

It has yet to be settled how much UNRWA knew about Hamas weapons in their "schools" and when they knew it:

UN admits its schools in Gaza were used to store Hamas rockets
Special to WorldTribune.com
GAZA CITY — The United Nations has acknowledged that its facilities in the Gaza Strip were storing Palestinian missiles and rockets.
The UN Relief and Works Agency has reported at least two incidents in which its schools were used for the storage of rockets amid the war with Israel. In both cases, the UN refused to confiscate the rockets and instead asked Hamas to retrieve the weapons.
“UNRWA strongly and unequivocally condemns the group or groups responsible for this flagrant violation of the inviolability of its premises under international law,” UNRWA said...

Western diplomats, however, said the UN returned as many as 20 rockets to Hamas. Canada has called for an investigation of the UN action.
“I was appalled to hear reports, one as recent as today, of stockpiles of rockets in a school run by the United Nations Relief and Works Agency in Gaza,” Canadian Foreign Minister John Baird said. “Even more alarming were reports that in the first case, officials with the United Nations returned these weapons to Hamas, a listed terrorist organization, once Israeli officials discovered their location.”

UN admits its schools in Gaza were used to store Hamas rockets - World Tribune World Tribune

There is no evidence showing that they knew their buildings were being used by Hamas to store weapons. That's just another bit of propaganda designed to discredit the UN by showing them to be "complicit" with Hamas. Shamefully transparent.

The UN is not in a legal position to confiscate weapons nor should it be expected to - that is not their role there nor should it be. It would subject their people to repercussions.

 

[Coyote]

The Palestinians do, indeed, have a slight Public Relations problem...

One that their cowardice brought down upon their own heads...

Gallows humor?

And, this does nothing to (1) disprove the idea that the Palestinians have a Public Relations problem nor (2) disprove the idea that the Palestinians cowardly habit of embedding their war assets amongst their civilian populations is egregious and widespread and directly responsible for huge numbers of Palestinian civilian casualties - a state of affairs which they brought down upon their own heads.

Seems to be Hamas doing that.
Seems also that Israel has been caught using human sheilds.

Don't know about that, but, during the course of a 4-week 2000-dead war,it wouldn't surprise me all that much to see a few instances unfold here and there amongst the IDF as well, however...

1. if...IF... the IDF has done any of that, it's random and spontaneous, localized, scattered, and infrequent

2. with Hamas, it's ubiquitous and egregious, a matter of intentional policy, and commonplace

3.the IDF uses Enemy as shields

4. Hamas uses their own women and children as shields

The attempt at a moral equivalency here is rejected.

From the article I linked to - Isaeli High Court: Israeli Soldiers Used Palestinians as Human Shields 1,200 Times.

That is not "if", nor is it random and spontaneous, localized, scattered, and infrequent.

 

[SAYIT]

The dehumanization of the Palestinians by Israel and it's supporters IS an issue, but it's being conflated with a lot of other stuff in the OP.

Look at how the Palestinians are constantly referred to as "animals" etc etc - every individual tarred with the brush of extremists. Palestinian children die and the comments are along the line of "good riddance, one less future terrorist". This dehumanization is evident in the justice system where there are two different "systems" for the same offenses and children are brutally treated by Israeli officials. Israeli Jews can throw stones and get a slap on the wrist. Palestinians throw stones and get shot. Because they're "animals".

Over and over we see this dehumanization.

This latest conflict though - is not a good example. NO country can be expected to tolerate constant rocket fire into it's civilian population and Hamas kept escalating, putting it's people at risk. Would we, in our country tolerate this without a response? I seriously doubt it.

No people can tolerate decades of continuous oppression and occupation. Would Americans just accept being penned into Gulags for decades without striking out at their jailers? I seriously doubt it.

To start the ball rolling - all Hamas has to do is recognize Israel's right to exist as a sovereign nation. The fact that Fatah was willing to and Hamas was no speaks volumes about Hamas' intentions. There is also something to be said about Hamas' choice to hide armaments in and near hospitals and schools, something which has been independently verified - thus choosing to make them targets. Hamas is using it's people, not leading it's people.

It has yet to be settled how much UNRWA knew about Hamas weapons in their "schools" and when they knew it:

UN admits its schools in Gaza were used to store Hamas rockets
Special to WorldTribune.com
GAZA CITY — The United Nations has acknowledged that its facilities in the Gaza Strip were storing Palestinian missiles and rockets.
The UN Relief and Works Agency has reported at least two incidents in which its schools were used for the storage of rockets amid the war with Israel. In both cases, the UN refused to confiscate the rockets and instead asked Hamas to retrieve the weapons.
“UNRWA strongly and unequivocally condemns the group or groups responsible for this flagrant violation of the inviolability of its premises under international law,” UNRWA said...

Western diplomats, however, said the UN returned as many as 20 rockets to Hamas. Canada has called for an investigation of the UN action.
“I was appalled to hear reports, one as recent as today, of stockpiles of rockets in a school run by the United Nations Relief and Works Agency in Gaza,” Canadian Foreign Minister John Baird said. “Even more alarming were reports that in the first case, officials with the United Nations returned these weapons to Hamas, a listed terrorist organization, once Israeli officials discovered their location.”

UN admits its schools in Gaza were used to store Hamas rockets - World Tribune World Tribune

There is no evidence showing that they knew their buildings were being used by Hamas to store weapons. That's just another bit of propaganda designed to discredit the UN by showing them to be "complicit" with Hamas. Shamefully transparent.

The UN is not in a legal position to confiscate weapons nor should it be expected to - that is not their role there nor should it be. It would subject their people to repercussions.

I see this from the Occam's Razor POV. The UN admits to finding Hamas rockets in 2 or 3 of their "schools." I'd say that is just the tip of the iceburg and complicity by at least some UNRWA people is a virtual lock. After all, UNRWA has played nanny to the hapless Arab "refugees" since 1949 and clearly is sympathetic to the Arab "cause." I believe the deafening UN silence on the latest conflict was a sign they did not want to have their dirty laundry (UNRWA complicity) aired publically. Furthermore I believe the war crimes charge in the ICC will quietly go away and changes in UNRWA's mission and funding will follow ... also quietly.