Debunking Liberal Myths About the Rich and the Capital Gains Tax

[ThisIsMe]

The tax rate on taxable income over $44,726 starts at 22%. It is the same rate for short term capital gains. Only Long term capital gains are taxed at the discounted rate. They should be treated as income but it should be amortized over the number of years the investment was held.

Why? Why do you all want to tax something that someone isnt actually receiving? When they start withdrawing the money, then it should be taxed, not before.

The problem of taxing unrealized gains is that they can fluctuate. Some years you may make money, some years you may lose money. So, on the years that investments lose money, does that mean the government is going to issue you a check for the losses?

Also, you don’t want let them get their foot in the door on that, because, oh sure, at first they’ll tell you “we’re only going to tax the capital gains of people who’s stock portfolios are worth more than….1 million dollars”…but then over the years, they’ll find out that their new tax isn’t doing enough so they’ll come back and say “well, we have to lower that threshold to anyone who’s stock portfolios are worth…$750,000)…then $500,000, then $250,000 then “we must tax all capital gains no matter how much they are worth”…then “your house is worth $300,000? That value is an unrealized gain, so we need to have a tax on top of the taxes you already pay”

Then there are collections..let’s take art for example (could be anything). Let’s say you have an art collection worth…2 million dollars, now, you may never intend on selling that art, but it has an unrealized gain in it, so the government will say “we have to tax that”…even though it’s just art and you intend to keep it

Why is it so bad just let let investments grow tax free, and then start paying taxes when you decide to start taking it out?

 

[CowboyTed]

You are again mixing apples and oranges

You need to compare similar levels of income and rates paid

Capital Gains does not deserve a lower tax rate. Should be taxed at the same rate

There is a lot of things where this depends... Farms or family businesses defiantly deserve a break as usually the beneficiary has been working the business for decades and might be running the business as the parent (Owner) retired years previous.
Same things with Farms, it can take decades of multi generational family to build up a farm. Keeping a farm debt free is major advantage.

 

[BlindBoo]

Why? Why do you all want to tax something that someone isnt actually receiving?

WTF? The point is they are receiving income gains and should be taxed on that income like every US worker gets taxed on their income from labor.

 

[Vrenn]

There is a lot of things where this depends... Farms or family businesses defiantly deserve a break as usually the beneficiary has been working the business for decades and might be running the business as the parent (Owner) retired years previous.
Same things with Farms, it can take decades of multi generational family to build up a farm. Keeping a farm debt free is major advantage.

Thank you for bringing up severe corruption in our Farming. If I use the Farm Acts where money was supposed to go to the Farmers to help make up the damage done by the Tariffs then the corruption is in spades.

For instance, almost nothing made it to the actual multi generational farmers and ranchers. The bulk went to the Corporation Farms. It ended up going to the Lawyers in NY, Doctors in CA, just to name a few that actually owned the farms. What came out of it was more demise of the Multi Generational Farmers who either sold out to them and sold off their equipment to at least have something on the way out or the banks foreclosed and they exited with nothing. Each Corporate Owner was treated the same as an actual family owner. Sending an already uber rich person in another state a million bucks is criminal until all the funds are gone. NO wonder that the suicide rates of Multi Generational Farmers went way up.

As usual, the extreme wealthy figured out a way to cheat their way to getting the funds and cheating the ones that really needed it out of it. If this sounds like a RICO action, it is or it should be treated as such.

 

[jbander]

Liberals endlessly argue that the rich are not paying their fair share because many rich people do not pay income taxes but "only" pay capital gains taxes. Many rich people do not work for anyone and therefore do not receive a salary--and thus do not pay income taxes. These rich folks earn their money via capital gains and therefore they pay capital gains taxes.

Okay, well, if you make between $47K and $519K in capital gains, your capital gains tax rate is 15%. If you make over $519K in capital gains, your capital gains tax rate is 20%. This is well above the tax rate paid by most employed Americans. Tax data show that 77% of Americans pay an income tax rate of 15%. If your household income is between $22K than $89.4K, your income tax rate is only about 11% (since the income tax is graduated and the first $21K of household income is taxed at a rate of only 10%).

Anyone can confirm these facts by checking the federal capital gains tax brackets and the federal income tax brackets.

So, rich people who earn their money from capital gains do not pay a lower tax rate than most other Americans--they pay a higher tax rate than most other Americans.

Furthermore, these numbers do not include the enormous amount of taxes that many rich people pay in state and local property taxes, and the rich, unlike most other people, do not get a tax deduction for all of those taxes.

Bullshit people who make the amounts that these cap gain pigs make pay way more then 15%, you are lying and totally full of crap. You pigs are a joke . that tax rate is totally exist to transfer as much of the wealth of this country into the hands of the golden few. When people try this nonsense tell them to get fucked.

 

[jbander]

These people get their wealth handed to them from mommy and daddy.They earn nothing . they are not productive they are simply pigs in our society. Vampires living off the blood of good Americans.

 

[jbander]

Why should a group that has their income from capital gains that is totally non productive in our society have a advantage over the real producers in our society. You and your neighbor. All that tax rates is used in total by far with the most minute part of our population, They our the pigs of our society .

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Why should a group that has their income from capital gains that is totally non productive in our society have a advantage over the real producers in our society. You and your neighbor. All that tax rates is used in total by far with the most minute part of our population, They our the pigs of our society .

Why do you feel capital gains are totally non-productive?

 

[ThisIsMe]

WTF? The point is they are receiving income gains and should be taxed on that income like every US worker gets taxed on their income from labor.

But it’s not income unless they take the dividends. If it is just sitting in investments, then it’s not income.

 

[rightwinger]

But it’s not income unless they take the dividends. If it is just sitting in investments, then it’s not income.

And when you cash in……you should pay for your profits like any working man.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

And when you cash in……you should pay for your profits like any working man.

How much is that working man making?

 

[rightwinger]

How much is that working man making?

If a working man makes $50,000 off of his sweat labor and you make $50,000 off of an investment……you should not pay less in taxes.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

If a working man makes $50,000 off of his sweat labor and you make $50,000 off of an investment……you should not pay less in taxes.

Thanks for the actual numbers.

$50,000 income for a single earner means AGI of $36,150 (after Trump's $13,850 standard deduction)

$1100 in taxes on first $11,000 in income.
The next $25,150 in income is taxed at 12%, $3018.


That working man pays $4118 in federal income tax on his $50,000 of sweat labor.
4118/50000 = 8.236%

Now the fat cat, me, with my silver spoon type capital gains of $50,000 on top of my
undeserved, inflated, desk-job filthy lucre pay check........I pay 20% on my capital gains, if they're short-term (held for less than a year) or 15%, if they're long-term (held more than a year).

I'm paying 82-143% more than that sweaty guy.

There ain't no justice, eh?

 

[rightwinger]

Thanks for the actual numbers.

View attachment 932701

$50,000 income for a single earner means AGI of $36,150 (after Trump's $13,850 standard deduction)

$1100 in taxes on first $11,000 in income.
The next $25,150 in income is taxed at 12%, $3018.


That working man pays $4118 in federal income tax on his $50,000 of sweat labor.
4118/50000 = 8.236%

Now the fat cat, me, with my silver spoon type capital gains of $50,000 on top of my
undeserved, inflated, desk-job filthy lucre pay check........I pay 20% on my capital gains, if they're short-term (held for less than a year) or 15%, if they're long-term (held more than a year).

I'm paying 82-143% more than that sweaty guy.

There ain't no justice, eh?

Thanks

Where is the break even point between earned income and capital gains?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Thanks

Where is the break even point between earned income and capital gains?

With no other income, $80,882 in long-term capital gains pays the same as $80,882 in salary.
Subtract $13,850 standard deduction from both.
$10,055 in taxes.
The numbers would be higher for short-term capital gains.

2023 and 2024 Tax Brackets and Federal Income Tax Rates - NerdWallet

The seven federal income tax brackets for 2023 and 2024 are 10%, 12%, 22%, 24%, 32%, 35% and 37%. Your bracket depends on your taxable income and filing status.

www.nerdwallet.com

 

[jc456]

Those 77% don’t make in excess of $500K

You still haven’t said what the issue is? Do you know what income is?

 

[jbander]

These people are absolute idiots , it's not a different opinion its the pigs of this country being in control,because they are wealthy. It has to stop, all the money we need for paying off our debt is in these laws to pass the wealth of this nation into the hands of the golden few. They have nothing in the world to justify this thievery. Billionaires and billion dollar company paying nothing in taxes is the norm. Average billionaire pays 8.2% in taxes. Fuck them they are thieves. Stealing from you and your neighbors so they can add money to their bank account that they do nothing to earn it. First step is getting rid of the cap gain fake amount they get to pay for doing nothing. Just having so much money that they earn their income from their wealth alone.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

These people are absolute idiots , it's not a different opinion its the pigs of this country being in control,because they are wealthy. It has to stop, all the money we need for paying off our debt is in these laws to pass the wealth of this nation into the hands of the golden few. They have nothing in the world to justify this thievery. Billionaires and billion dollar company paying nothing in taxes is the norm. Average billionaire pays 8.2% in taxes. Fuck them they are thieves. Stealing from you and your neighbors so they can add money to their bank account that they do nothing to earn it. First step is getting rid of the cap gain fake amount they get to pay for doing nothing. Just having so much money that they earn their income from their wealth alone.

Billionaires and billion dollar company paying nothing in taxes is the norm.

When your income is zero, how much tax are you supposed to pay?

Average billionaire pays 8.2% in taxes.

You're so full of shit.

 

[jbander]

There is a lot of things where this depends... Farms or family businesses defiantly deserve a break as usually the beneficiary has been working the business for decades and might be running the business as the parent (Owner) retired years previous.
Same things with Farms, it can take decades of multi generational family to build up a farm. Keeping a farm debt free is major advantage.

Farms and family business need no break and deserve no break , where in the hell does that fit in . I think my occupation deserves tax breaks . So does everyone else. This is ridiculous. Every business in this country gain their profits off the back of working people , taxes makes life better for those working people. What is gained with our tax dollars is way more then what is gained by any specific business. In the order of important , there are many things more important then businesses. You know like people , education, quality of life, health care ,taking care of people in need. safe neighborhoods. fare wages. I'll add another 30 or 40 items before business comes up as important.

 

[jbander]

8.2%​

Average federal income tax rate for individuals in the Forbes 400 between 2010 and 2018

3 Alternatives for Taxing the Capital Gains of the Very Wealthy These are the thieves of this country. They paid to get laws to make this rape of mankind happen.