DACA Schmocka: Let's discuss the REAL problem

[Norman]

So you do prefer communism?

No form of government is better or worse than any other....

It really kind of depends on the people involved.

So communism is just as good as capitalism?

Ok... you must be insane, but run with that... run with that.

 

[Unkotare]

...

DACA participants came to the United States legally as children, ...

Last, DACA participants have no knowledge of their birth country, often do not speak the language, and have no means to survive if compelled to return to their birth country – .....

So much false information there ^^^^^

You know someone can't support their position when they have to make up a load of bullshit to try and sugarcoat it.

 

[JoeB131]

So communism is just as good as capitalism?

Ok... you must be insane, but run with that... run with that.

Actually, both are equally evil... but let's run with that.

You just pretend that all the bad things that happened because of capitalism didn't happen, like the genocide of native Americans, Africans and Australians.

 

[Norman]

So communism is just as good as capitalism?

Ok... you must be insane, but run with that... run with that.

Actually, both are equally evil... but let's run with that.

You just pretend that all the bad things that happened because of capitalism didn't happen, like the genocide of native Americans, Africans and Australians.

Capitalism is as evil as communism?

Must be the dumbest statement I have read here, ever. 100 million dead apparently means nothing to you.

 

[JoeB131]

Capitalism is as evil as communism?

Must be the dumbest statement I have read here, ever. 100 million dead apparently means nothing to you.

And how many died when the Americas were colonized, and they just had to clear out those "natives" to get to the "Manifest Destiny"?

How about Australia, where the aboriginal people were almost completely exterminated.

How about the Congo?

A number of estimates have been made of the size of mortality displacement in the Congo between 1885 and 1908. The exact magnitude is disputed and a number of different estimates have been made:

• Roger Casement - population fall of three million[c]
• Adam Hochschild - population fall of 10 million.[d][40]
• Isidore Ndaywel è Nziem - population fall of 13 million.[52]
• Jan Vansina - population fall of around 25 percent between 1900 and 1919, due mainly to disease[e][33]

 

[Norman]

Capitalism is as evil as communism?

Must be the dumbest statement I have read here, ever. 100 million dead apparently means nothing to you.

And how many died when the Americas were colonized, and they just had to clear out those "natives" to get to the "Manifest Destiny"?

How about Australia, where the aboriginal people were almost completely exterminated.

How about the Congo?

A number of estimates have been made of the size of mortality displacement in the Congo between 1885 and 1908. The exact magnitude is disputed and a number of different estimates have been made:

• Roger Casement - population fall of three million[c]
• Adam Hochschild - population fall of 10 million.[d][40]
• Isidore Ndaywel è Nziem - population fall of 13 million.[52]
• Jan Vansina - population fall of around 25 percent between 1900 and 1919, due mainly to disease[e][33]

First of all, that's arguably not capitalism, but even if so, the genocide of the Indians ended hundreds of years ago, and now they too are reaping the benefits of capitalism.

You are blaming capitalism for diseases?? That's ******* ridiculous and invoking such means that you have no arguments.

Saying that capitalism is as bad as communism is bat-shit insane. The soviet block countries are still decades behind.

 

[JoeB131]

First of all, that's arguably not capitalism, but even if so, the genocide of the Indians ended hundreds of years ago, and now they too are reaping the benefits of capitalism.

Yeah, most Native AMerican reservations are still full of poverty, so they truly are reaping the benefits of Capitalism.

You are blaming capitalism for diseases?? That's ******* ridiculous and invoking such means that you have no arguments.

Diseases people were ONLY exposed to as part of an effort to wipe them out, enslave them and exploit their resources.

Let's enslave the Native Americans? What, they are dying in droves? Let's bring over africans as slaves to replace them!

Someone made a profit from that, and if you really want to blame communism for famines in the Ukraine, then you should give capitalism its due.

Saying that capitalism is as bad as communism is bat-shit insane. The soviet block countries are still decades behind.

Okay, let's look at that.

When were they not "Decades behind".

Let's look at WWI. Tsarist Russia was 'decades behind" the Germans and the west. Not a commie in sight.

Communist China is about to eclipse the US as the biggest economy. does that mean Communism works? Don't think so.

 

[Norman]

First of all, that's arguably not capitalism, but even if so, the genocide of the Indians ended hundreds of years ago, and now they too are reaping the benefits of capitalism.

Yeah, most Native AMerican reservations are still full of poverty, so they truly are reaping the benefits of Capitalism.

You are blaming capitalism for diseases?? That's ******* ridiculous and invoking such means that you have no arguments.

Diseases people were ONLY exposed to as part of an effort to wipe them out, enslave them and exploit their resources.

Let's enslave the Native Americans? What, they are dying in droves? Let's bring over africans as slaves to replace them!

Someone made a profit from that, and if you really want to blame communism for famines in the Ukraine, then you should give capitalism its due.

Saying that capitalism is as bad as communism is bat-shit insane. The soviet block countries are still decades behind.

Okay, let's look at that.

When were they not "Decades behind".

Let's look at WWI. Tsarist Russia was 'decades behind" the Germans and the west. Not a commie in sight.

Communist China is about to eclipse the US as the biggest economy. does that mean Communism works? Don't think so.

China is no longer communist, once they adapted free market reforms, the economy immediately sky-rocketed. No surprises there...

Once Russia abandoned communism, the same story, the economy immediately sky-rocketed.

Moron, communism doesn't work, at all. Death and poverty is all it produces. Learn some facts...

Native Americans are far richer than the Chinese or the Russians, still recovering from Communism.


After the end of communism, the east block countries have been catching up with the rest of the Europe, every year. Ironically, ending communism seems to mean equality.

 

[Unkotare]

....

Native Africans are far richer than the Chinese or the Russians.....

.....

??????????

 

[Norman]

....

Native Africans are far richer than the Chinese or the Russians.....

.....

??????????

Americans... Americans...

A other communist apologist appears?

 

[JoeB131]

China is no longer communist, once they adapted free market reforms, the economy immediately sky-rocketed. No surprises there...

Last time I checked, they were still run by the COMMUNIST party.

Again, bud, you are going into "No True Scotsman" territory here in your arguments. Capitalists can't be responsible for attrocities even if they call themselves capitalists, but Communists can't be responsible for prosperity when they are calling themselves communists?

Once Russia abandoned communism, the same story, the economy immediately sky-rocketed.

Actually, Russia is much poorer than it was under communism. Again, the fact you can get yourself a Russian bride really cheap should tell you that. I mean, I guess it's nice for guys who thought those brides you buy from the Philippines were too brown.

Moron, communism doesn't work, at all. Death and poverty is all it produces. Learn some facts...

Again, by that standard, Capitalism doesn't work, either. It produces death and poverty as well.

So why do we keep acting like those are THE ONLY two choices on the menu?

Native Americans are far richer than the Chinese or the Russians, still recovering from Communism.

 

[Correll]

Obviously the political "class" (har har) will be turning its attention to DACA soon. So here come the shallow platitudes, the bumper sticker sloganeering, the posturing before the teevee cameras, the goofy hyperbole and the personal insults & name-calling on yet another important issue.

My bold and fearless (!) prediction is that we're going to focus on the wall and employment practices and the tearing apart of families, screaming YOU'RE A RACIST AAUUUUGHH, etc. etc., and continue to ignore the one issue that is at the very core of this problem:

Mexico and much of South America remain a shit hole from which people are desperate to escape.

Let's try to avoid all the silly partisan behaviors listed above and discuss what America can actually do about that. How can we make it so that people south of the border have some reason to stay, while getting cooperation from those governments? Investment agreements with those countries? Some kind of military arrangement to deal with the cartels? Let's see if we can "exchange" some "ideas" on this without the thread spinning off the rails.

Mexico's economy has been growing ok for a long time now. Per capita income, (purchasing power parity) has grown to nearly 19,000 a year.


They are not that bad.


And interference from US will be greatly resented.



What would really help is to seal the ******* border and shut down the flow of money to the cartels.

 

[Correll]

No Mac, sorry; stabilization of our country must be our number 1 priority. Hell, if our economy grows and we need 50,000 more people, then invite them in if they want to come here. That is far better than needing 50,000, and 250,000 just walk in, and leave us with 200,000 extras we have to take care of.

But the stabilization of our country is the point. Don't we want them to not come here illegally? Isn't that the goal here?

We can spend money and resources building a wall, chasing them all down, imprisoning them for years and years, dealing with whatever crimes they commit.

Or we can re-direct those dollars and resources into an approach that would make them less likely to want to escape their hell holes in the first place.

Yes, this is about us, what's best for us. We're going to burn money and resources either way; I'd rather deal with the root problem than just apply band-aids.
.

America is always going to look attractive to Mexico's poor, and even middle class.


NO matter how much money we give to them.

 

[Norman]

China is no longer communist, once they adapted free market reforms, the economy immediately sky-rocketed. No surprises there...

Last time I checked, they were still run by the COMMUNIST party.

Again, bud, you are going into "No True Scotsman" territory here in your arguments. Capitalists can't be responsible for attrocities even if they call themselves capitalists, but Communists can't be responsible for prosperity when they are calling themselves communists?

Once Russia abandoned communism, the same story, the economy immediately sky-rocketed.

Actually, Russia is much poorer than it was under communism. Again, the fact you can get yourself a Russian bride really cheap should tell you that. I mean, I guess it's nice for guys who thought those brides you buy from the Philippines were too brown.

Moron, communism doesn't work, at all. Death and poverty is all it produces. Learn some facts...

Again, by that standard, Capitalism doesn't work, either. It produces death and poverty as well.

So why do we keep acting like those are THE ONLY two choices on the menu?

Native Americans are far richer than the Chinese or the Russians, still recovering from Communism.

I don't give a **** what the name of the party in China is called, I only care what they do, and what they are doing is not communism. Free markets are producing all the wealth, heck I have some investments in China. I am exploiting the Chinese workers, oh no!

Russia is much poorer under communism? Except their incomes have tripled, what a moron.

 

[Unkotare]

....

Native Africans are far richer than the Chinese or the Russians.....

.....

??????????

Americans... Americans.......

You meant Native Americans? Which Native Americans?

 

[Norman]

....

Native Africans are far richer than the Chinese or the Russians.....

.....

??????????

Americans... Americans.......

You meant Native Americans? Which Native Americans?

The ones living in America.

 

[Unkotare]

.....


And interference from US will be greatly resented.....

Resentment was pretty limited when we rescued their currency.

 

[Unkotare]

....

Native Africans are far richer than the Chinese or the Russians.....

.....

??????????

Americans... Americans.......

You meant Native Americans? Which Native Americans?

The ones living in America.

Which tribe?

 

[Norman]

....

Native Africans are far richer than the Chinese or the Russians.....

.....

??????????

Americans... Americans.......

You meant Native Americans? Which Native Americans?

The ones living in America.

Which tribe?

What does this have to do with anything? The average native-American is much richer than the average Russian, Cuban, or a Chinese person for that matter.

Hail capitalism...

 

[bripat9643]

yeah well, WE have been un-able to get RINO-DEM to dry up the "demand". Therefore WE elected Trump to stop the flow by using a big thick wall with Dogs, Guns and whatever.

Get the DEM-RINO to enact a reasonable guest worker program. Not simply a steady stream of DEM voters until collapse again into a giant Socialist hell-hole with misery for all.

Uh, guy, the reason we have misery now is because the wealthy are hoarding all the wealth, not because some folks at the bottom are doing jobs you don't want to do.

Commie bullshit.