Crowd stunned after valedictorian rips up speech, recites Lord’s prayer

[strollingbones]

question: where does your god tell you to pray?


when you answer that you may feel a wee bit sillie about this public pray issue.....

 

[AVG-JOE]

Well lets see what happens at next years graduation when an atheist gets the podium and starts to inform the crowd that there is no god and Jesus was just a nice man in a robe and sandals

How would ridiculing anything be an appropriate topic of a valedictory address?
Whether I agree with him or not, under those circumstances, this average Monkey would want to hear what the little Monkey believes in.

(My bold)

In the case @ hand, the student had stepped out of his persona as valedictorian. He'd donned the garb of believer. That's the problem.

The only reason the school district can insist on preapproving scripts from their podium, @ their graduation ceremony, in their building (presumably), is to prevent inappropriate remarks. As their legal counsel probably advised them, under the "barrage" of requests (?), complaints (?) from atheists (really? Are there that many in the Carolinas? Good on them!) - it was unwise to throw the podium open to inspiration by the Holy Spirit, or whatever the student claimed after the fact.

That's the issue - worst comes to worst, they could have killed power to the microphone/amplifier, & killed the lights & the AC, for that matter. The school board's problem - if any students/parents drag the district to court over this question - will be for the board to prove that they did everything in their power to prevent the disruption of the graduation ceremony. From what I see here, the board failed.

The kid worked hard to become the valedictorian, the podium was his. At that moment, in that venue, nobody was using taxpayer resources to promote one religion over another. The kid was well within his rights to take a moment and mention what his faith meant to him getting through his high school years as the top student in academics.

 

[strollingbones]

no he was not...he was suppose to give a speech not witness to the people....i am so sick of christians who do not read or know their bible but want to force their religion on others....simple as this.....no one stops you from praying we just dont want to be forced to hear it or be a part of it....

why is only your religious freedoms important?

 

[AVG-JOE]

Atheists, I support your right to free speech, just as I do everybody else.

You guys are acting like totalitarians if you condemn the boy.

It was his day. So take a hike, Spike.

I have no issues as long as atheists, da Jews, Mooslims and witches can present their religious views at the same forum

I'm sure Christians would be very understanding

The thesis of this discussion is defending each others right to be wrong.


Intolerance is the enemy in this discussion, not any viewpoint in particular.

 

[strollingbones]

come on all you prayers..where does your god tell you to pray?

 

[AVG-JOE]

no he was not...he was suppose to give a speech not witness to the people....i am so sick of christians who do not read or know their bible but want to force their religion on others....simple as this.....no one stops you from praying we just dont want to be forced to hear it or be a part of it....

why is only your religious freedoms important?

The point of this discussion needs to be the freedom of ALL to express beliefs.

It would be just as wrong for a bunch of busy-bodies to censor any other kid, provided the act being censored falls within the constraints of Civil Law.

 

[AVG-JOE]

^^ Another reason why Civil Law MUST trump Religious Law whenever the two conflict.

 

[Derideo_Te]

How would ridiculing anything be an appropriate topic of a valedictory address?
Whether I agree with him or not, under those circumstances, this average Monkey would want to hear what the little Monkey believes in.

(My bold)

In the case @ hand, the student had stepped out of his persona as valedictorian. He'd donned the garb of believer. That's the problem.

The only reason the school district can insist on preapproving scripts from their podium, @ their graduation ceremony, in their building (presumably), is to prevent inappropriate remarks. As their legal counsel probably advised them, under the "barrage" of requests (?), complaints (?) from atheists (really? Are there that many in the Carolinas? Good on them!) - it was unwise to throw the podium open to inspiration by the Holy Spirit, or whatever the student claimed after the fact.

That's the issue - worst comes to worst, they could have killed power to the microphone/amplifier, & killed the lights & the AC, for that matter. The school board's problem - if any students/parents drag the district to court over this question - will be for the board to prove that they did everything in their power to prevent the disruption of the graduation ceremony. From what I see here, the board failed.

The kid worked hard to become the valedictorian, the podium was his. At that moment, in that venue, nobody was using taxpayer resources to promote one religion over another. The kid was well within his rights to take a moment and mention what his faith meant to him getting through his high school years as the top student in academics.

Exactly right. He was NOT a public school employee. He was NOT coercing anyone else into praying either. He was expressing his own personal beliefs which he was entitled to do. As an Atheist this Monkey has absolutely no problem with what he did. The complaints most probably addressed the issue of the principal/teachers/coaches leading prayers in the school. This was a graduation ceremony and it would have been inappropriate for a school employee to have said a prayer as part of the ceremony. But the graduating Monkey had no such restrictions so he could do what he wanted. From a discipline point of view the school might have problems in the future but as far as this issues goes it is NOT what the OP is trying to pretend that it is a "slam" on Atheists.

 

[rightwinger]

no he was not...he was suppose to give a speech not witness to the people....i am so sick of christians who do not read or know their bible but want to force their religion on others....simple as this.....no one stops you from praying we just dont want to be forced to hear it or be a part of it....

why is only your religious freedoms important?

The point of this discussion needs to be the freedom of ALL to express beliefs.

It would be just as wrong for a bunch of busy-bodies to censor any other kid, provided the act being censored falls within the constraints of Civil Law.

Your freedom of speech means you cannot be arrested for what you say. This boy was not arrested. Freedom of Speech does not mean you can say anything you wish without consequences or criticism

There is a time and a place for everything. A valedictorian is not given the stage to spout anything he feels like saying. He cannot tell a dirty joke, spout hate about blacks and jews, speak out in favor of Democrats or Repuyblicans or advocate abortion. If he does, he will not be subject to arrest, but is open for criticism of his actions

 

[strollingbones]

okay why do the super saintly always want public prayer?

why? esp in consideration of what the bible says......o wait.....80% of you just put it on the coffee table for appearances and parrot whatever is the popular mantra of the day without any real clue as to what the bible says.....

 

[strollingbones]

matthew 6:6

 

[Derideo_Te]

Atheists, I support your right to free speech, just as I do everybody else.

You guys are acting like totalitarians if you condemn the boy.

It was his day. So take a hike, Spike.

This Atheist agrees with you.

The complaints most probably focused on school employees leading prayers.

The kid had the right to do what he did and this Atheist admires his guts to speak his mind.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Atheists, I support your right to free speech, just as I do everybody else.

You guys are acting like totalitarians if you condemn the boy.

It was his day. So take a hike, Spike.

I have no issues as long as atheists, da Jews, Mooslims and witches can present their religious views at the same forum

I'm sure Christians would be very understanding

If they get to be valedictorian then they should have the same opportunity. AJ has it right when he says this is about respecting the rights of all Monkeys to be wrong.

 

[rightwinger]

Atheists, I support your right to free speech, just as I do everybody else.

You guys are acting like totalitarians if you condemn the boy.

It was his day. So take a hike, Spike.

I have no issues as long as atheists, da Jews, Mooslims and witches can present their religious views at the same forum

I'm sure Christians would be very understanding

If they get to be valedictorian then they should have the same opportunity. AJ has it right when he says this is about respecting the rights of all Monkeys to be wrong.

Actually, its about respecting the monkeys in your audience

Even a minister asked to give a benediction understands that a different prayer is given to a Christian audience vs a secular audience. The Lords Prayer is a prayer to Christian beliefs. Forcing your religious beliefs on others is inappropriate in that forum the same as if an atheist had done the same to try to instruct the audience on his beliefs related to God.

 

[JakeStarkey]

I would support an atheist valedictorian who praised the scientific method and his rigid atheism as the basis for his success.

The kid was completely within his rights to do so, as you are to criticize him.

 

[Derideo_Te]

I have no issues as long as atheists, da Jews, Mooslims and witches can present their religious views at the same forum

I'm sure Christians would be very understanding

If they get to be valedictorian then they should have the same opportunity. AJ has it right when he says this is about respecting the rights of all Monkeys to be wrong.

Actually, its about respecting the monkeys in your audience

Even a minister asked to give a benediction understands that a different prayer is given to a Christian audience vs a secular audience. The Lords Prayer is a prayer to Christian beliefs. Forcing your religious beliefs on others is inappropriate in that forum the same as if an atheist had done the same to try to instruct the audience on his beliefs related to God.

While I agree that it was inappropriate there is a difference between a trained minister of religion giving a benediction and a a high school kid doing something on impulse. As you so appropriately pointed out earlier there are going to be discipline problems down the line for this high school from what he did. But he took a stand for what he believed in and rightly or wrongly he acted upon them. That he failed to respect everyone in the audience can be chalked up to youth and inexperience. Had this been done by a minister of religion a different standard would apply. So let's give him a pass and see what happens in the future.

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

The crowd was stunned.

Crowd stunned after valedictorian rips up speech, recites Lord's prayer - Washington Times

A South Carolina valedictorian garnered wild applause after he ripped up his pre-approved speech and delivered the Lord’s prayer at his high school graduation on Saturday.

The act was apparently in protest of the Pickens County School District’s decision to no longer include prayer at graduation ceremonies, Christian News reported. Officials said the decision was made after the district was barraged with complaints by atheist groups.

“He’s a graduate now. There’s nothing we can do about it, even if we wanted to.”

This is what it will take. It's impressive that this was done by a high school student. It will take ordinary people standing up to the religious bullying of atheists and not taking it anymore.

The only people doing the bullying are the Christians that expect my tax dollars to be used to promote their religion.

Are they using your tax dollars, or are they exempt from paying taxes? Two different things.

If a public employee in my tax jurisdiction is promoting his religion while he's on the clock - then that's using tax dollars to promote his religion.

Also, what about all of the HUGE companies like google, Amazon, ect who enjoy an extraordinarily low tax rate? Do you rally against those corporations with equal vigor?

.

. I have no problem with churches not paying taxes, they are non-profit entities and most of them do quite a bit of charitable work (except for the very tiny minority that are really a way for their pastors to live tax free) The problem I have is when public institutions used my tax dollars to promote a religion.

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

The kid exercised his right of free speech and religious expression without coercion or direction from adults.

Good for him.

Good for him.

The problem with his "protest" is that he didn't actually break any rules. The Valedictorian is not a public employee - its clear any speech he or she may give comes from them as a private citizen. They are thus free to make religious speech in their speeches. The problem comes with a public institution designs Christianity into the program by setting up a prayer organized by the school.

 

[Mr Natural]

They have valedictorians in South Carolina?

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

They have valedictorians in South Carolina?

THey have schools?