Creation of Universe in Abrahamic faiths

[Sunni Man]

The problem with Dajjal and the other Islam haters is that they do not know how to read arabic.

So they pick the english translation that best backs up their Islamophobic agenda.

Knowing full well that any translation from arabic to english will have many conceptual and textual problems in the final translation.

And in no way conveys 100% the actual meaning of what is being said in the Quran or Hadiths.

 

[Sunni Man]

^^^ Here is the Surah 21:30 in the original arabic so that you can compare it to the translations.

اَوَلَمۡ يَرَ الَّذِيۡنَ كَفَرُوۡۤا اَنَّ السَّمٰوٰتِ وَالۡاَرۡضَ كَانَـتَا رَتۡقًا فَفَتَقۡنٰهُمَا* ؕ وَجَعَلۡنَا مِنَ الۡمَآءِ كُلَّ شَىۡءٍ حَىٍّ* ؕ اَفَلَا يُؤۡمِنُوۡنَ
‏

I can't read squiggle.

Which backs up my point.......

 

[Dajjal]

The problem with Dajjal and the other Islam haters is that they do not know how to read arabic.

So they pick the english translation that best backs up their Islamophobic agenda.

That must be why I posted about 18 translations. I am only interested in the most accurate translation, and will gladly reject any flawed one.

 

[Sunni Man]

This is why I don't spend a lot of time debating Islam haters like Dajjal about verses in the Quran or Hadiths.

They can't read arabic, so they use imperfect translations to support their anti-Islamic agenda.

Sadly, Dajjal sounds like an expert to the non muslims.

But in reality, he is just as clueless as they are when it come to understanding the Quran.

 

[Dajjal]

Like Arabic is some magic language that turns nonsense into truth.

 

[Dajjal]

Genesis 1:1-31

In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. The earth was without form and void, and darkness was over the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters. And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. And God saw that the light was good. And God separated the light from the darkness. God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, the first day. ...

Ok, lets forget the quran for a bit, and concentrate on the bible. I object to verse 1 which says Ge:1:1: In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

No he did not! as I have said the first things to be created were hydrogen atoms, they later formed the first stars, but no planets could exist until the first stars died as there were no heavy atoms.
We know the age of the earth is around 4 billion years and the universe is around 14 billion years.

SO NO, GOD DID NOT CREATE THE HEAVEN AND THE EARTH IN THE BEGINNING.

That is unless the original bible in aramic and hebrew said something different. I imagine we are all in the same boat there, as we all have to rely on a bible translation.

 

[Sunni Man]

^^^^ You really need to get a life.........

 

[Dajjal]

As can be seen, much of the quran is stolen from the bible.
First the bible and the quran both say the sun and moon are lights.

quran sura 71.16 And has made the Moon a light therein, and made the Sun a lamp.

Ge:1:16: And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

Both the bible and quran say water created life.

quran sura 21.30 And we have made from water every living thing. Will they not then believe.

Genesis:1 And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.

 

[Sunni Man]

^^^ Seriously, you need to get a life........

 

[Dajjal]

^^^ Seriously, you need to get a life........

You are the one just hanging around this thread kissing my ass.

 

[Sunni Man]

^^^ I am serious.....you really need to find a hobby.........

 

[Dajjal]

^^^ I am serious.....you really need to find a hobby.........

This is my hobby dumb head. It was my new years resolution to work twice as hard at undermining the stinky old quran.

 

[Sunni Man]

^^^ What a sad existence.........

 

[BecauseIKnow]

Dajjal I nicely asked in the beginning not to flame or do a disproof sense type of thread. I was going to get into the time discussion, and I will prepare that later. For now I just wanted to see what people get it out of those general verses. And the wider arrangement of what they could mean.

 

[Dajjal]

Dajjal I nicely asked in the beginning not to flame or do a disproof sense type of thread. I was going to get into the time discussion, and I will prepare that later. For now I just wanted to see what people get it out of those general verses. And the wider arrangement of what they could mean.

Looks like this thread will die without my contribution. Even sunni man is only on it as my troll.

 

[Dajjal]

This would obviously mean then people will look a the age of the Universe and compare it to what the chronology of the Bible is, which is a lengthy debate. And people are welcome to discuss that. We also have hadiths(collections of sayings) that state God in himself is bigger than the seven 'heavens'. Does anyone ever think about this aspect of religion and study it?

Rather than just encompass the organized tenets of these religions?

What are the seven heavens?

2.29 He it is Who created for you all that is in the earth. Then turned He to the heaven, and fashioned it as seven heavens. And He is knower of all things.

 

[BecauseIKnow]

This would obviously mean then people will look a the age of the Universe and compare it to what the chronology of the Bible is, which is a lengthy debate. And people are welcome to discuss that. We also have hadiths(collections of sayings) that state God in himself is bigger than the seven 'heavens'. Does anyone ever think about this aspect of religion and study it?

Rather than just encompass the organized tenets of these religions?

What are the seven heavens?

2.29 He it is Who created for you all that is in the earth. Then turned He to the heaven, and fashioned it as seven heavens. And He is knower of all things.

It must mean dimensions the way it's described.

 

[LuckyDuck01!]

1. Why would a deity create a tree of knowledge, and instruct his/her/its creations to not eat from it? If it's not to be used, there is no reason for its existence.
2. A talking serpent? Really?
The Abrahamic religions are only three out of about 700 established religions, with Hinduism and Buddhism (although Buddhism is actually a philosophy that people bring their religions into), close on their heels.
There is no more evidence of reality in the Abrahamic religions than there are any of the other 697 religions.
The beliefs that are growing more rapidly now, are those of atheism and agnosticism.

 

[BecauseIKnow]

That's why I titled it Abrahamic faiths, why wouldn't a deity instruct his creation? Yes, does that mean the serpent spoke a language as we humans know it? We don't know that, in fact Muhammad said God doesn't speak a language, he described it as something else. If you want the saying ill post it. And your excuse to defy the Abrahamic faiths is to list other religions? We know beliefs were always large and spread. You're welcome to bring the philosophies of other religions on the creation of the Universe.

 

[Dajjal]

Apart from the issue of, what the seven heavens might be, almost all the translations of
quran sura 2.29 say the earth was created before the heavens.
WHOOPS! another error in the words of God.
2.29
Pickthall- He it is Who created for you all that is in the earth. Then turned He to the heaven, and fashioned it as seven heavens. And He is knower of all things.

Yusuf Ali- It is He Who hath created for you all things that are on earth; Moreover His design comprehended the heavens, for He gave order and perfection to the seven firmaments; and of all things He hath perfect knowledge.

Hilali-Khan- He it is Who created for you all that is on earth. Then He Istawa (rose over) towards the heaven and made them seven heavens and He is the All-Knower of everything.

Shakir- He it is Who created for you all that is in the earth, and He directed Himself to the heaven, so He made them complete seven heavens, and He knows all things.

Sher Ali- HE it is WHO created for you all that is in the earth; then HE turned towards the heavens, and HE perfected them as seven heavens; and HE has perfect knowledge of all things.

Khalifa- He is the One who created for you everything on earth, then turned to the sky and perfected seven universes therein, and He is fully aware of all things.

Arberry- It is He who created for you all that is in the earth, then He lifted Himself to heaven and levelled them seven heavens; and He has knowledge of everything.

Palmer- It is He who created for you all that is in the earth, then he made for the heavens and fashioned them seven heavens; and He knows all things.

Rodwell- He it is who created for you all that is on Earth, then proceeded to the Heaven, and into seven Heavens did He fashion it: and He knoweth all things.

Sale- It is he who hath created for you whatsoever is on earth, and then set his mind to [the creation of] heaven, and formed it into seven heavens; he knoweth all things