communism Kills More Than Just People

Edgetho

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Although communism is the world record holder at fratricide, murder and torture (over 100 million dead directly attributable to communism)....

And even though most of our environMENTALists are decidedly in the same camp with communists, no one has taken them to task for what communists do, and have done, to the environment.

Read, learn, understand....

If You Think Communism Is Bad For People, Check Out What It Did To The Environment

Here, rivers flow red from steel mill waste, drinking water contains many times the European Community standards for heavy metals and other pollutants, and the air has killed so many trees — 75 percent in the Bitterfeld area — that even the most ambitious clean-up efforts now being planned would not reverse the damage. East Germany fills the air with sulfur dioxide at almost five times the West German rate and more than twice the Polish rate, according to a recent study. One chemical plant near here dumps 44 pounds of mercury into the Saale river each day — 10 times as much as the West German chemical company BASF pumps into the Rhine each year.
 

flacaltenn

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Although communism is the world record holder at fratricide, murder and torture (over 100 million dead directly attributable to communism)....

And even though most of our environMENTALists are decidedly in the same camp with communists, no one has taken them to task for what communists do, and have done, to the environment.

Read, learn, understand....

If You Think Communism Is Bad For People, Check Out What It Did To The Environment

Here, rivers flow red from steel mill waste, drinking water contains many times the European Community standards for heavy metals and other pollutants, and the air has killed so many trees — 75 percent in the Bitterfeld area — that even the most ambitious clean-up efforts now being planned would not reverse the damage. East Germany fills the air with sulfur dioxide at almost five times the West German rate and more than twice the Polish rate, according to a recent study. One chemical plant near here dumps 44 pounds of mercury into the Saale river each day — 10 times as much as the West German chemical company BASF pumps into the Rhine each year.

EXCELLENT topic. Relieved to have some REAL enviro discussion in this forum. The West Germans were APPALLED at the extent of the enviro carnage. And Merkel et al --- had sudden green conversions from all the guilt.

You don't have to just inspect Communist systems to see how this works. OUR GOVT is one of the major polluters in the United States. It has CAUSED AND IGNORED massive leaking cesspools of high level nuclear waste at its weapons plants. And our military bases are worse than most EPA toxic sites. Then you have the abused and ignored TVA power generation system that has a HORRIFIC record of enviro problems. It really is unaccountability that ALLOWS this behaviour. There is no "customer satisfaction" or "public relations" penalty for governments to pay when they pollute. And it's hard to get the "watchers" to police themselves..

That's how they can sell off trees for less than market value and shoot wild horses that they allowed to multiply. Or lease mining and fuel rights for sweetheart deals..

Seems like the Free Market actually has MANY incentives for enviro conscience than government will ever have.
 
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Abraham3

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Although communism is the world record holder at fratricide, murder and torture (over 100 million dead directly attributable to communism)....

And even though most of our environMENTALists are decidedly in the same camp with communists, no one has taken them to task for what communists do, and have done, to the environment.

Read, learn, understand....

If You Think Communism Is Bad For People, Check Out What It Did To The Environment

Here, rivers flow red from steel mill waste, drinking water contains many times the European Community standards for heavy metals and other pollutants, and the air has killed so many trees — 75 percent in the Bitterfeld area — that even the most ambitious clean-up efforts now being planned would not reverse the damage. East Germany fills the air with sulfur dioxide at almost five times the West German rate and more than twice the Polish rate, according to a recent study. One chemical plant near here dumps 44 pounds of mercury into the Saale river each day — 10 times as much as the West German chemical company BASF pumps into the Rhine each year.

EXCELLENT topic. Relieved to have some REAL enviro discussion in this forum.
HA HA HA Haha ha ha ha ha haaaaaaa
 

mamooth

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So what does this have to do with the US government? Only a someone on the extreme kook right fringe could ever seriously compare the current US government to communism.

My guess is that the capitalism cultists, rightfully ashamed of the environmental catastrophes that their policies so regularly bring about, are trying to deflect from their record of failure by flinging out this red herring.
 
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flacaltenn

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So what does this have to do with the US government? Only a someone on the extreme kook right fringe could ever seriously compare the current US government to communism.

My guess is that the capitalism cultists, rightfully ashamed of the environmental catastrophes that their policies so regularly bring about, are trying to deflect from their record of failure by flinging out this red herring.
Oh c'mon.. You really that dense? When governments scrimp on waste management or pollution controls --- is it GREED and PROFIT MOTIVE? Of course. They get away with it because their "customers" dont recognize them as capable of being polluters.. After all they are ENFORCERS of enviro justice. How could they be guilty? And if they get SUED for damaging the environment ---- IT AINT THEIR MONEY.. Theyll just print more.. And then to MY KNOWLLEDGE none of "the mgtmt of govt" has ever lost an election or been fired because of nuclear waste leaking into major rivers or violating EPA regs on military bases. Aint it great when you can just write a WAIVER for your rickety old coal burning plants at TVA? OR whats very cool is to invoke NATIONAL SECURITY as a license to pollute?

So those "Capitalistic Cultists" that leftist like you love to accuse of willful pollution have MANY MORE disincentives to wreck havoc than any govt has..
 
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Abraham3

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And then to MY KNOWLLEDGE none of "the mgtmt of govt" has ever lost an election or been fired because of nuclear waste leaking into major rivers or violating EPA regs on military bases.
I think Mitt Romney lost a large number of votes to Barack Obama due to George Bush's abysmal environmental record (including ignoring AGW).
 

mamooth

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It's just flac's favorite cherrypicking fallacy. The gubmint did this and this, therefore we can ignore the vastly worse record of the private sector and declare gubmint is pure evil.
 

flacaltenn

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And then to MY KNOWLLEDGE none of "the mgtmt of govt" has ever lost an election or been fired because of nuclear waste leaking into major rivers or violating EPA regs on military bases.
I think Mitt Romney lost a large number of votes to Barack Obama due to George Bush's abysmal environmental record (including ignoring AGW).
Too vague.. LINK PLEASE...
 

flacaltenn

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http://elr.info/sites/default/files/articles/15.10326.htmQUOTE=mamooth;8457938]It's just flac's favorite cherrypicking fallacy. The gubmint did this and this, therefore we can ignore the vastly worse record of the private sector and declare gubmint is pure evil.[/QUOTE]

IS IT vastly worse?? Do you know industry is hiding TONS of high level nuclear waste stored in 60 yr old leaking drums? Know where there's wetlands filled with toxic runoff and no REGULATORS in site because industry gave itself a waiver? You got a bunch of nuclear bomb craters from private industry or entire islands used for bombing practice??

Read up a bit.. you might actually have a unique thought..

Federal Supremacy and Sovereign Immunity Waivers in Federal Environmental Law

Only Congress can compromise federal supremacy and sovereign immunity.25*The leading case setting out the standard for interpreting these waivers is*Hancock v. Train,26*construing the waiver contained in the 1970 amendments to the Clean Air Act. As then written, the Act required federal facilities to comply with "Federal, State, interstate, and local requirements respecting control and abatement of air pollution to the same extent that any person is subject to such requirements." The Supreme Court considered whether this statutory language required federal facilities to obtain state air pollution permits, or whether adherence to the substantive requirements of state law was sufficient. Concluding that the permits need not be obtained, the Court explained, "Because of the fundamental importance of the principles shielding federal installations and activities from regulation by the States, an authorization of state regulation is found only when and to
Code:
the extent there is 'a clear congressional mandate,' 'specific congressional action' that makes this authorization of state regulation 'clear and unambiguous.'"27

Each of the four major federal environmental-mediaspecific statutes — the Clean Air Act, Federal Water Pollution Control Act (FWPCA), Resource Conservation and Recovery Act (RCRA), and Noise Control Act — includes a federal facilities provision measurable by the "clear and unambiguous" standard.28Congressional waivers of federal supremacy and sovereign immunity may be analyzed across six variables:

(1) The mandate for substantive compliance with state law;

(2) The mandate for procedural compliance with state law — permits and approvals;

(3) The payment of permit fees — or are they taxes?

(4) Penalties for noncompliance;

(5) State-directed cleanup of federal hazardous waste sites; and

(6) Specialized waivers for particular facilities.
 

Abraham3

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I think Mitt Romney lost a large number of votes to Barack Obama due to George Bush's abysmal environmental record (including ignoring AGW).
Too vague.. LINK PLEASE...
You've got some fucking balls. In multiple posts you tell us about study after study after study but don't provide a name or a link to ANY of them.

You want a link to "I think Mitt Romney lost a large number of votes..."? Well bend right down here, I've got your link for you... ;-(
 

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