Clinton campaign gets new conservative nod

[RetiredGySgt]

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight...them saying that the men who trashed Kerry didn't work with him or have any first hand knowledge couldn't possibly be relevant....

Except they DID work with him and DID have first hand knowledge. No boat went on patrol alone ( or very seldom did) they worked in teams. The crews mingled after action also discussing what did or did not happen. And let me tell you enlisted men love to tell others about the screw ups of their officers and the idiotic things they do. These are small boats with open decks. What is or is not happening in a fight is apparent to any boat in the team.

 

[Gunny]

I know, when given the choice of believing 8 guys Kerry paid to hob nob with him or over 200 Officers and enlisted that served with him also, who should we believe? Remind me again how he was in Cambodia on Christmas eve , sent there by a man not even President yet ferrying a special ops guy no one can find. That memory was SEARED into him. Of course when one checks the facts they find out that on Christmas eve he was actually in a base camp miles from cambodia. Even the 8 guys he paid agree he is wrong on that one.

Who should we believe? A Naval Officer that ADMITTED he covered up war crimes ( or he is lying about it), failed to report them ( or he is lying about it), used fake vets to back up his claims... or over 200 Officers and enlisted that were REALLY there and never saw the war crimes and never saw Kerry's heroics?

Who should we believe? A Naval officer that illegally met with an enemy of the Country and discussed how to thwart US goals with them and bring about a "peace" on terms the enemy would find acceptable.... or over 200 Officers and enlisted that never did anything quite so despicable?

I guess it depends on whether or not "winning" is all that matters.

As the links says, there really is no right or wrong to their opinions, and I have never used anything the Swiftboaters have said as evidence when arguing about John Kerry's service in Vietnam.

Where I question Kerry is a fundamental right or wrong. If he witnessed war crimes and did not report them immediately to his senior -- of which there is no record nor mention of such happening -- then he is guilty of violating the UCMJ on several counts. Dereliction of duty and conduct unbecoming an officer and gentleman come to find right off the bat. Then there's the fact that if his unit participated in war crimes and he was present and did not report them, then his as guilty as anyone.

Either that or he flat lied to Congress about what he allegedly witnessed.

My bet is on the latter. For one thing, it is hard for me to imagine that in 4 months he managed to witness more war crimes than exist in an Oliver Stone movie.

One can argue back and forth about the Swiftboaters all day, but I happen to agree with Snopes' assessment as far as those opinions for and against Kerry are concerned.

The facts in my argument however are undeniable.

 

[Swamp Fox]

The facts in my argument however are undeniable.

And yet the libs here will find a way to try and deny them all.

 

[Gunny]

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight...them saying that the men who trashed Kerry didn't work with him or have any first hand knowledge couldn't possibly be relevant....

It doesn't say that, and whether or not they were specifically assigned to his boat or not is irrelevant in the military. They lived on the same base, ate in the same mess and showered in the common head.

What you call firsthand knowledge doesn't exist when deployed in the military. Whether they knew each other personally or not, they knew who each other was, shared a communal lifestyle, and went on missions together at times.

I obsverved plenty of people and their behavior over the years in the Marines, on a daily basis, and did not knwo them personally nor was I assigned to the same unit. Just the way it is.

 

[Dogger]

The "right wing," huh? Odd I never heard of this so-called "representative" of the "right wing" before today. Must be a REALLY important dude.

If you haven't heard of him, he must not be important? Can you tell me who Norman Borlaug is without looking it up?

 

[AllieBaba]

Everybody knows that all US soldiers are liars and thugs, and all democratic politicians are noble and truthful.

 

[midcan5]

All this spin makes one's head ache. The conservatives want Hillary as they feel she is beatable, that is so obvious denying it is denying reality.

Swiftboaters? I am amazed that these bitter men were listened to, especially by servicemen and especially since Kerry could have taken the easy way out as Bush and Cheney did.

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0831-10.htm

 

[Dogger]

Everybody knows that all US soldiers are liars and thugs, . . . .

Name someone who has said that. Besides you.

And back it up.

 

[AllieBaba]

Dumbass, back up yourself.
"jreeves is simply upset that I dared to state the obvious, that the military has one purpose, to kill or destroy real or imagined enemies of America. Any other services that they provide are simply consequential.

They are hired thugs. ..........Everything bad happening over there is our fault. We need to get out of Iraq, all American businesses and military. We should push for a UN resolution to send in a coalition of peace keeprs from al countries that are not part of our current coalition."
Courtesy of Taomon, who's almost as big an idiot as you are.

Jillian calls the swift boaters the swiftboat liars.

So there you go, moron. Next time conduct your own search.

 

[Dogger]

Dumbass, back up yourself.

***[Remaining pointless drivel omitted]***

You said "Everybody knows that all US soldiers are liars and thugs, . . . ."

One person (even Taomon) does not mean everybody. I don't say all conservatives are loud mouthed jackasses just because you are. Some are; most are merely misguided.

And the Swiftboat Liars for Bush are liars. Jillian has backed that up. History backs her up.

And she didn't say all soldiers are liars, as you claimed. She said one group of lying asshole veterans were liars. That's a big difference, and if you can't understand, ask a thrid-grader to explain it to you.

 

[AllieBaba]

You're almost as stupid as Taomon is. You told me to name someone who said that. I named two. The rest of your post is just drivel.

 

[Dogger]

You're almost as stupid as Taomon is. You told me to name someone who said that. I named two. The rest of your post is just drivel.

You lied about Jillian, so that doesn't count.

Here's what you said "Everybody knows that all US soldiers are liars and thugs, . . . ."

Taomon said thugs, but not "liars and thugs". Even if you find several persons who said something that, you aren't even close to showing the view is widespread, and you claimed it was universal.

 

[jillian]

You lied about Jullian, so that doesn't count.

Here's what you said "Everybody knows that all US soldiers are liars and thugs, . . . ."

Taomon said thugs, but not "liars and thugs". Even if you find several persons who said something that, you aren't even close to showing the view is widespread, and you claimed it was universal.

Allie baby always misrepresents what "libs" say. It's a pathologic thing. We just kind of amuse ourselves with her and laugh at the blatant um... lack of relation to reality.

BTW, if you check, on Taomon's thread, *I* was the first one to kick the heck out of him for his comment.

Just to get us back to reality....

 

[AllieBaba]

You kicked him too.
I'm not sure if you were first.

 

[Dogger]

While waiting for her next piece of nonsense, I thought I'd review the thread where Taomon said soldiers were thugs. Oddly, no one agreed with him, while jillian and other liberals challenged him along everyone else.

If any consensus emerged from that thread, Is Allie Baba that dumbest bitch/arsehole posting today?, it seemed to be that Allie isn't respected by her peers on the right, and is held in contempt by the left, if they bother to regard her at all.

I couldn't even find a right winger that defended her. The best they could do was attack others. That's sad, no how much it's deserved.

 

[AllieBaba]

I don't need to be defended.

You may get zapped for dragging threads all over the place, btw. It's poor form.

 

[Dogger]

I don't need to be defended.

Since you can't be, that's okay.

 

[jillian]

I don't need to be defended.

You may get zapped for dragging threads all over the place, btw. It's poor form.

And maybe you should stop calling people stupd every time you have no answer to a point that is raised. It kind of diverts the discussion.

 

[AllieBaba]

Of course I can. I just don't bother when I'm obviously being baited.

And by an amateur, too.

 

[AllieBaba]

And maybe you should stop calling people stupd every time you have no answer to a point that is raised. It kind of diverts the discussion.

I only call people stupid when I answer a point, and when the answer is obvious besides.