Civil Servants under attack by the Right Wing.

[Harry Dresden]

Firefighters, cops and teachers are state and local employees, not federal bureaucrats.

Get a new scare tactic, because this dog don't hunt.

but he said CIVIL SERVANTS not just Federal ......am i right?....

You're right.

But the current budgetary battle heating up is with the federal budget.

This raises the question: What's the motivation for AFSCME propaganda in this given context?

first tell me what the SCM....stand for?.....

 

[thereisnospoon]

Firefighters? Cops? Emergency Workers? Teachers? Librarians?

Ugh..

It would take one of them..nearly 100 years to get make annual bonuses of a good number of CEOs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyCHV3DSQZE

I believe those civil servants took their jobs knowing what their compensation would be.
If they chose to, the could have done what was necessary to become a well paid CEO.

Are you saying that they made a bad choice by opting the career they chose?

Or are you saying that the CEO's made the right choice when opting for the career they chose?

The fact is some chose a career to serve and protect, others chose a career to serve themselves. Who is worth and actually earns a bonus of one or two or ten million dollars? How much is someone worth who puts themselves in harms way to save another.

Do you think a police officer who works in a town of less than 5,000 people where a law enforcement officer has not fired a gun in over 50 years, where the crime rate is so low, it is not even on the FBI crime stat grid deserves to make over $100,000 per year PLUS a lifetime pension and lifetime health insurance( free) for life?....Don;t think this does not exist?...link....http://www.nj.com/news/bythenumbers/.....Choose "Borough of Northvale"....And just look at the salaries for police officers there....
Oh, my friend's brother in law was police chief of a nearby town. He was forced to leave the department or face official misconduct departmental charges. He quit. He got to keep his pension on which he can afford a $700,000 home and pay about $14,000 per year in property taxes. This guy is forty five years old and never has to work another day in his life!!!!!! He also gets lifetime health insurance for himself, his spouse and his three kids for as long as those children live at home...This is equitable? The taxpayers should foot this bill?...This person's retirement and benefits will cost Town and State taxpayers well over $3million!!!!.....Even though there are people living in the same town who are struggling to get by on meager private sector wages and benefits.....Yeah, sounds fair to me.....Bullshit....This has to end. NOW!!!!

 

[thereisnospoon]

Firefighters, cops and teachers are state and local employees, not federal bureaucrats.

Get a new scare tactic, because this dog don't hunt.

One only needs to look at Chris Christie to know that this isn't the case. When Christie tore apart the teacher on youtube, many conservatives went wild with glee.

On which planet do you live?
What I saw was a man while trying to explain to the audience being interrupted by a teacher who was impolite and out of order.
He said to her that if she wanted to continue on, he'd simply ask her to be seated and go to another question. He also told her that if she wanted an answer and honest debate all she had to do was listen to his answer.
Christie explained his position very politely and in plain English. He was very professional. He did not tear anyone apart.
The fact of the matter is the teacher's union wants to continue to get free health insurance and Christie asked the union to pay just 2.5% of their insurance cost. That would be an average of $750 per teacher.
Off that, the NJEA has waged a propaganda war vs Christie. Christie was elected because he promised to reduce costs to taxpayers, end political cronyism, and bring under control salaries and benefits of public sector workers. Now if you think there's something wrong with that, shame on you.

 

[Oddball]

but he said CIVIL SERVANTS not just Federal ......am i right?....

You're right.

But the current budgetary battle heating up is with the federal budget.

This raises the question: What's the motivation for AFSCME propaganda in this given context?

first tell me what the SCM....stand for?.....

State, County and Municipal.

 

[thereisnospoon]

And you're begging the question, a questionable question at that since the OP stipulated "civil servants," rather than "federal employees," in order to ignore the point. You think the right wing doesn't include governors, mayors, and state legislators? The left counts ours. Strategic initiatives start at the local and state levels as a testing and proving ground.

Republicans at the state level benefit by federal bailout cash that keeps ASCME afloat, just like democrat politicians do....If the rollovers of guys like Bobby Jindal and Rick Perry doesn't demonstrate that, what would?

The current budgetary concern is federal overspending, not the state and local binges that were bailed out with the phony "stimulus" largess....That's context in which the OP propaganda is a misdirection and towering fail.

Those same politicians support party initiatives, especially the idealistic ones supportive of federal policies that mirror party wishes for those directions. That was my point. Thank you for ignoring it, as that is glaring evidence that you have no rational answer to it.

ASCME is kept afloat by dues paying members. Those members may see more hours at work and higher employment because of the stimulus, god forbid.
Those members and every state and federal employee are also members of their community, patrons of local businesses, taxpayers... productive and contributing members of society.

Dues?!!! What a bunch of nonsense. Public worker unions, wages and benefits are paid for by the TAXPAYERS..Don't try to sell that crap here, lady.
By design a government worker cannot be productive because government produces nothing. Government only consumes.
There is no denying that some public sector workers are in their jobs because they love the work. By and large however, most public sector employees are lazy slugs who "put in their time"....why is it that government agencies are the least liked or rather most hated of all.

 

[thereisnospoon]

And you're begging the question, a questionable question at that since the OP stipulated "civil servants,"

I'll beg this question: you use the term "civil servant," but who serves whom? I don't see government employees contributing to my retirement. I don't see factory workers designated as "never to be layed off." I don't see retail workers getting 5% raises in the middle of recessions as government employees do.

So shouldn't we really refer to those at the public trough as our "civil masters?" We the peasantry serve them, not the other way around.

Oh, for god's sake.
The vast majority of civil servants make at best an average income, work their asses off, and even at the state and local levels face MASSIVE and career ending layoffs. They spend money at local businesses, they pay taxes to their community, as your neighbors, they call the fire department if they see your house on fire and they might plow your mother's driveway.

What amazes me is that the idea that contracted benefits (overall very modest ones at that once upon a time when the American corporations understood sustainability) of government, local, and state employees are an obscenity is swallowed whole in the same breath that that excuses private industry for raising your prices based on the last dime the largest demographic has to spend, and paying their bureaucrats (ceos, its ALL administration, people, you pay for it to private, you pay for it to public) a damned sight more than our civil servants, even the State and local representatives.

Stop it..I am sick of the whining heard from the poor overworked underpaid public servant.
It's bullcrap. Why in the hell is it that in all the big union states where civil service workers are flush with high wages and bulbous benefit packages on the verge of bankruptcy?
Two things..One these states are run by liberals and Two they owe billions to the public worker unions who with every contract negotiation( now there's a misused term) use their political influence to coerce wage and benefit increases far and away above what the private sector sees.
My take on this is civil service salary and benefit packages should mirror those in the private sector.
This notion that public workers are nose to the grindstone fingers to the bone is a bunch of pro union propaganda nonsense.
The party for the public worker is over. No more high wages. No more defined benefit pensions, no more free health insurance, no more banking vacation and sick time.
There is NO MORE MONEY....OVER!!!!!

 

[thereisnospoon]

Nope. I am not a public company. I started my own comapny and although I struggled at the beginning, I am now a bit more comfortable...and I am happy to say I have employed many...and had many years where my employees were making more than I was...but in the end I have a company I will be able to sell...

But you didnt answer my question...

What does sitting with a CEO in a room have to do with anything?

Why are you jealous of a CEO's bonuses? Becuase he made a smarter career decision?

What about the CEO thats starts a company and fails? DO you have pity for him ; say life is unfairr do you say "you should have made smarter choices?"

And if that same CEO made it big......you would see him in a different light?

Why? Becuase he/she acheived success?

I ain't "jealous" of shit. I am angry at public subsidized "private" companies with executives making obscenes amount of cash. Make no mistake..it's on the public dole.

And I am angry at the very same political faction, the right wing, that on one hand facilitates this feckless theft of the public trust and on the other hand wants to gyp the very people that keep us safe, educated and healthy.

Please explain...how is it on the public dole?

she's off on a "power to the people" tangent..Typical left wing pro union bullshit.

 

[Oddball]

republicans at the state level benefit by federal bailout cash that keeps ascme afloat, just like democrat politicians do....if the rollovers of guys like bobby jindal and rick perry doesn't demonstrate that, what would?

The current budgetary concern is federal overspending, not the state and local binges that were bailed out with the phony "stimulus" largess....that's context in which the op propaganda is a misdirection and towering fail.

those same politicians support party initiatives, especially the idealistic ones supportive of federal policies that mirror party wishes for those directions. That was my point. Thank you for ignoring it, as that is glaring evidence that you have no rational answer to it.

Ascme is kept afloat by dues paying members. Those members may see more hours at work and higher employment because of the stimulus, god forbid.
Those members and every state and federal employee are also members of their community, patrons of local businesses, taxpayers... Productive and contributing members of society.

dues?!!! What a bunch of nonsense. Public worker unions, wages and benefits are paid for by the taxpayers..don't try to sell that crap here, lady.
By design a government worker cannot be productive because government produces nothing. Government only consumes.
There is no denying that some public sector workers are in their jobs because they love the work. By and large however, most public sector employees are lazy slugs who "put in their time"....why is it that government agencies are the least liked or rather most hated of all.

Q...F...T!

l

 

[uscitizen]

One thing for certain congress is not full of public servants.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Again...you're off the grid.

You don't seem to understand what happened exactly..

But there plenty of material out there to catch up.

Start here..

Google

I understand completely what happened.

One of my biggest clients (Innkeepers USA) is held by Lehman Brothers.

I not only got no bailout, my last contract got re-negotiated down by 40% and all my subsequent contracts got pulled.

But thanks for demonstrating, once again, what a sanctimonious know-nothing little useful idiot you are.

The idiot is in the mirror you view on a daily basis.

And stop flexing..that gut ain't gettin any smaller.

so what happened to your argument?....All out of gas I see. Typical lib.....riding the short bus again, eh genius?

 

[thereisnospoon]

Actually...you are making it quite clear that all you know of what happened was what some politicians wanted you to believe what happened.

I bet you are also convinced that Bush cherry picked intel for congress to review in regard to Iraq. You know...the intel MANY countries of the world came up with?

Likewise, I bet you are sure that the CIA lied to Pelosi. You know, the accusation that is quite serious yet she refused to have it investigated?

Yeah...that one....

I WORK on WALL STREET.

I was in the direct center of what happened.

Hmmmm...the market is open today.

Why are you on here posting all morning?

he's "working" from home......
I worked on Wall Street to..Back in the early 80's.....As a courier.
Big friggin deal...
I could have left it at "worked on wall Street" and would have told the truth.

 

[rhodescholar]

So you're pulling in multi-million dollar bonuses? Cool beans.

I've sat back in this thread watching an asshole like you continue to do EXACTLY what every ******* lowlife liberal/public union employee worker does, namely obfuscate and deflect with nonsensical UFT-written talking points - but no longer.

"Rich bankers..."

Give me a ******* break you ******* assholes already, I and most of the rest of the taxpaying public working in real jobs in the private sector will NOT tolerate this bullshit anymore, and even the fat-at-thebuffet-table public union employees realize now that the game is UP:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/11/nyregion/11publicworkers.html?hpw

" Privately, Public Employees See Cuts as Inevitable "

20% unemployment, no raises for years, reduced health benefits with higher co-pays, no retirement savings' guarantees, the days of the gold-plated public union employee benefits are OVER.

 

[rhodescholar]

I'm talking generally. I didn't watch the propaganda piece in the OP. Whether or not the states would be over their head (and CA would be, thanks in part to Schwarzenegger's job-killing environmental act in 2006 coupled with the bloated pension system) what the feds "blessed" upon the state of CA in the form of "stimulus spending" is just a drop in the bucket in terms of financial damage they have done by their action/inaction. Couple that with the bills they have left unpaid, such as the compensation for the imprisoned illegals. I'm just pointing out that their isn't as much greed by the states as much as there is fair retribution, imo. If the feds create the mess, the feds should clean it up. Nothing more, nothing less.

I've studied this issue for years, and one of the BEST articles on it is right here:

The Beholden State by Steven Malanga, City Journal Spring 2010

A long read, but well worth it. Now multiply CA's situation across the country in all 50 states...I predict national riots and civil uprisings attacking public union employees within 5 years, with attacks on illegals and long-time welfare parasites not long afterwards.

 

[rhodescholar]

Oh, for god's sake.The vast majority of civil servants make at best an average income, work their asses off, and even at the state and local levels face MASSIVE and career ending layoffs.

You are full of shit:

High Police Pay Fuels Nassau Squeeze - WSJ.com

"If you're looking for one of the reasons why Nassau County spends so much, start with police pay. The average salary of a sworn police officer in Nassau last year was $107,000. Cops receive free health care and up to five "blood days"—comp days for every time they donate blood. The total package, including fringe benefits and overtime, averages $202,400 per officer."

 

[rhodescholar]

The idiot is in the mirror you view on a daily basis.

And stop flexing..that gut ain't gettin any smaller.

You're an idiot, and a loser. There are plenty of intelligent liberals and left-wingers who can actually defend their points, sadly you are not one of them.

 

[rhodescholar]

The thread is the attack on Civil Servants..who've made contracts with their employers.

These "contracts" were not signed in good faith, idiot. They were signed by politicians more interested in buying votes to keep themselves in office - using MY ******* MONEY.

This is the very same rationale used by the right wing when they justify huge bonuses to failing financials executives that were saved by tax payer dollars. In addition to sucking in your money, Oddball's money and my money.

Except, idiot, the banks have paid their loans back - and the USG made a profit on most cases. When am I going to see a "profit" from paying out huge benefits to undeserving public union employees?

 

[Trajan]

Just some liberal loons scared to death they might lose their gold-laden diamond encrusted benefit and retirement package.

Hey!! thats my "gold-laden diamond encrusted benefit and retirement package" you're talikn bout asshole!!!!!

Geez...maybe fed workers should not have 12 holiday paid days off a year, plus 5 weeks off - and only have to work 30 years.

and its 14 days off PLUS a shutdown over Christmas for 2 weeks and 5 weeks vacation............,get it right.

 

[Trajan]

Firefighters? Cops? Emergency Workers? Teachers? Librarians?

Ugh..

It would take one of them..nearly 100 years to get make annual bonuses of a good number of CEOs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyCHV3DSQZE

Uuuummmmm. I guess the should have chosen to be CEOs instead of civil servants.

Name one CEO you've sat in a room with?

ooohhhoooooohhhooh pick me, pick me!!!!!

 

[rhodescholar]

Pro union propaganda proves nothing. it's whining. The union people are seething because their way of life is being challenged.
Here's the deal for all you folks who think public workers are deserving of their incredibly high wages and lifetime benefits...
The workers themselves are not being "attacked"...
What is happening is the taxpayers have had enough. There is no more money. Taxes cannot continue to be increased to pay for public worker benefits.
Example.....NJ Governor Christie asked the NJEA( teacher's union) to have it's members contribute 2.5% of the annual cost of their health insurance. Currently the teachers get that on the taxpayer's dime. The Union said no and the teachers attacked Christie saying he doesn't care about education and he hates children..
Look, public worker unions have been coercing high wages and the type of benefits that the private sector worker could only dream of. The most insulting part of this is when New York governor Andrew Cuomo, BTW a liberal democrat, proposed an annual property tax cap, the public worker unions went bonkers.
New Jersey already has a property tax increase cap of 2%...
At the end of the day, the wages and benefits are unsustainable. Once again, there is no more money...
Public worker wages and benefits should be brought in line with private sector wages and benefits.
There should be no more sick and vacation time banking, no more 8 hours pay for showing up for two hours and going home, no more civil service protection or 100% job security. Union workers are protected from living in the real world. Public sector workers should be treated equally to their private sector counterparts.
Lastly, public sector workers are "SERVICE" to the taxpayer. The severs should not be more well off than those they serve.
You will disagree with this. You oppose the majority. Just ask anyone where you live if they like paying $15k per year in property taxes or the plethora of other confiscations to fund this nonsense.

Great post.

 

[Trajan]

Firefighters? Cops? Emergency Workers? Teachers? Librarians?

Ugh..

It would take one of them..nearly 100 years to get make annual bonuses of a good number of CEOs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyCHV3DSQZE

Pro union propaganda proves nothing. it's whining. The union people are seething because their way of life is being challenged.
Here's the deal for all you folks who think public workers are deserving of their incredibly high wages and lifetime benefits...
The workers themselves are not being "attacked"...
What is happening is the taxpayers have had enough. There is no more money. Taxes cannot continue to be increased to pay for public worker benefits.
Example.....NJ Governor Christie asked the NJEA( teacher's union) to have it's members contribute 2.5% of the annual cost of their health insurance. Currently the teachers get that on the taxpayer's dime. The Union said no and the teachers attacked Christie saying he doesn't care about education and he hates children..
Look, public worker unions have been coercing high wages and the type of benefits that the private sector worker could only dream of. The most insulting part of this is when New York governor Andrew Cuomo, BTW a liberal democrat, proposed an annual property tax cap, the public worker unions went bonkers.
New Jersey already has a property tax increase cap of 2%...
At the end of the day, the wages and benefits are unsustainable. Once again, there is no more money...
Public worker wages and benefits should be brought in line with private sector wages and benefits.
There should be no more sick and vacation time banking, no more 8 hours pay for showing up for two hours and going home, no more civil service protection or 100% job security. Union workers are protected from living in the real world. Public sector workers should be treated equally to their private sector counterparts.
Lastly, public sector workers are "SERVICE" to the taxpayer. The severs should not be more well off than those they serve.
You will disagree with this. You oppose the majority. Just ask anyone where you live if they like paying $15k per year in property taxes or the plethora of other confiscations to fund this nonsense.

yup......