Citizen's home is raided because of a Facebook posting

[jon_berzerk]

It sure as hell looks like an M-16 to me, and I've seen a lot M-16's.

Frankly, they need to give the CPS a commendation for looking into this.

Even if it was an M16, which it only looks like superfiscially, it is no basis for police and bureaucrats to be raiding people's homes. I promise you that you haven't seen nearly as many weapons as I've personally worked on, let alone fired and qualified with.

A simple phone call to the parents would have been extreme enough, but at least they could make sure the kid was supervised.

People should not be this uptight about guns, LEAST OF ALL someone who fancies himself an "Eisenhouer Republican". Even the democrooks in the days of Ike weren't bed wetting thumb suckers.

When some obnoxious EPA buearucrat bangs on your door because you left a paper label on a glass bottle in the recycling bin don't come whining to the rest of us.

Guy, I was in the Army for 11 years. My MOS was 76Y, which meant that I was responsible for the Arms Vault.

And here's the thing. Ike wouldn't be pissing his pants in fear of a useless mutant like Wayne "Frothy" LaPeirre. Of course back in Ike's day, the NRA supported sensible gun laws.

That was before it got hijacked by the Gun Industry, and Nancy Lanza's crazy ass became the prime customer.

--LOL

really you had been in charge of the

22 vault

the bolt is too short for an m-16

 

[JoeB131]

[

The NRA is actually responding in opposition to "republicans" like you. They used be refered to as "Negotiate Rights Away". They learned their lessons from the growth of groups such as Gun Owners of America that aren't willing to "compromise" with statists and sacrifice rights for political expediency.

Thank God your ideas are being marginalized. Why don't you just admit you're a democrat? If it wasn't for spineless republicrats like you the likes of McCain wouldn't have had the chance to loose against the moonbat messiah. We'd be looking at the second term of Fred Thompson.

.

Yeah. Fred Thompson. that idiot!

Hey, how'd that work out? Oh, yeah, that's right. When Dick Wolf wasn't writing dialog for him, he wasn't half as impressive.

I guess the problem is, I don't see keeping guns out of the hands of a guy like Adam Lanza or Joker Holmes as being a Comprimise of "Rights". I see it as just common fuckin' sense. I don't want those guys wandering the streets with military grade weapons and I'm not sure why you do.

 

[M14 Shooter]

My facebook page has 8 (maybe 10) pics of my pre-teen sons firing my AR15 and M1A in a Friends of Camp Perry pop-up shoot at Camp Perry OH.
No one has broken down my door.
But then, I don't live in a state run by lunatics.

If I need to dress like that, it's too damn cold to go to the range!

Ohio, Thanksgiving weekend.

 

[Pete7469]

Yeah. Fred Thompson. that idiot!

Hey, how'd that work out? Oh, yeah, that's right. When Dick Wolf wasn't writing dialog for him, he wasn't half as impressive.

I guess the problem is, I don't see keeping guns out of the hands of a guy like Adam Lanza or Joker Holmes as being a Comprimise of "Rights". I see it as just common fuckin' sense. I don't want those guys wandering the streets with military grade weapons and I'm not sure why you do.

I guess Fred didn't want the power as bad as the rest. He impressed the hell out of me simply by not sucking leftwing envirocock in the 2008 debates.

Of course that makes him an "idiot" by the standards of statist republicrats like you.

I guess you're too stupid to understand that any psyco can get his hands on any sort of weapon he wants, regardless of whatever laws bed wetters like you endorse.

Lets imagine all guns in private hands are GONE, in the style of a magic wand.

Society begins to take things easy, cops don't even touch their weapons during traffic stops.

Then of course police get ambushed by nefarious characters and their guns are stolen. The problem increases as the reactionary idiots led by the likes of you demand more firepower in the hands of police, that still get taken by criminals.

The most despotic regimes in the world have fallen to completely disarmed masses, the most heavily armed governments couldn't keep rebels from killing troops and bombing shit. Yet here's your dumb ass demanding we turn the screws of tyranny on a pissed off population...

Thank God you're not commisioned, you'd be shot in the back by a private.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

It sure as hell looks like an M-16 to me, and I've seen a lot M-16's.

Frankly, they need to give the CPS a commendation for looking into this.

If you think that is an M-16, you need glasses,a shrink, or both.

Hmm...I wonder if my uncle still has that photo of him (age 12) holding a BAR...

Okay, whatever, guy. Admittably, I didn't study the picture like you fetishists did...

But here's the thing. That little loon goes and shoots up his classmates, people would get fired by the truckload for NOT following up, as well they should be.

How many little loons his age have shot up classrooms?

 

[jon_berzerk]

Yawn.

1. So what, it is legal.
2. It is possible to see any picture posted on Facebook, even the private ones. That is one of the many gripes intelligent people have with Facebook.
3. The caseworker required nothing because the caseworker had no reason to investigate.
4. Do you have a copy of the procedures? If not, how do you know they were followed?
5. Which proves that the idiots who said the father deliberately posted the picture to cause a problem were wrong. Weren't you one of those idiots?

CPS did the right thing. What about the rights of the concerned neighbors who called CPS? Don't they have the right to know there is not an Adam Lanza living next door?

The "concerned neighbors" should be named in public so we can all laugh at them.

exactly

the cps worker a state employee refused to give out her name to the family

if they could have they would have abused the families 2nd amendment rights

you will be surprised at how many state workers will just go along with

unconstitutional actions when push comes to shove

 

[Bfgrn]

[

The NRA is actually responding in opposition to "republicans" like you. They used be refered to as "Negotiate Rights Away". They learned their lessons from the growth of groups such as Gun Owners of America that aren't willing to "compromise" with statists and sacrifice rights for political expediency.

Thank God your ideas are being marginalized. Why don't you just admit you're a democrat? If it wasn't for spineless republicrats like you the likes of McCain wouldn't have had the chance to loose against the moonbat messiah. We'd be looking at the second term of Fred Thompson.

.

Yeah. Fred Thompson. that idiot!

Hey, how'd that work out? Oh, yeah, that's right. When Dick Wolf wasn't writing dialog for him, he wasn't half as impressive.

I guess the problem is, I don't see keeping guns out of the hands of a guy like Adam Lanza or Joker Holmes as being a Comprimise of "Rights". I see it as just common fuckin' sense. I don't want those guys wandering the streets with military grade weapons and I'm not sure why you do.

Have you ever wondered how someone like Hitler was able to carry out his murderous ways? He had to have a very large group of followers who would kill without conscience. Well, meet people like Pete, M14, Quantum, 2nd amend etc. They would be the ones who follow a Hitler. Not liberals.

 

[Beria]

The Stassi move home !

 

[JoeB131]

If you think that is an M-16, you need glasses,a shrink, or both.

Hmm...I wonder if my uncle still has that photo of him (age 12) holding a BAR...

Okay, whatever, guy. Admittably, I didn't study the picture like you fetishists did...

But here's the thing. That little loon goes and shoots up his classmates, people would get fired by the truckload for NOT following up, as well they should be.

How many little loons his age have shot up classrooms?

Too many...

 

[JoeB131]

[

Have you ever wondered how someone like Hitler was able to carry out his murderous ways? He had to have a very large group of followers who would kill without conscience. Well, meet people like Pete, M14, Quantum, 2nd amend etc. They would be the ones who follow a Hitler. Not liberals.

Good point.

 

[JoeB131]

[

I guess Fred didn't want the power as bad as the rest. He impressed the hell out of me simply by not sucking leftwing envirocock in the 2008 debates.

Of course that makes him an "idiot" by the standards of statist republicrats like you.

Here was the thing about your boy Freddy. You got PLAYED, son! The purpose of Thompson was to siphon off "conservative votes" (i.e. the folks who listen to Hate Radio) so a moderate establishment type could gain strength. Then Huckabee won Iowa and the establishment shit themselves. A "Christian" who didn't think Jesus central message was "Tax Cuts for Rich People"? BLASPHEMER!!!!! So the establishment tried to prop up Romney, but he was too Mormon for the Christian right, and they finally settled on McCain.

I guess you're too stupid to understand that any psyco can get his hands on any sort of weapon he wants, regardless of whatever laws bed wetters like you endorse.

Lets imagine all guns in private hands are GONE, in the style of a magic wand.

Society begins to take things easy, cops don't even touch their weapons during traffic stops.

Then of course police get ambushed by nefarious characters and their guns are stolen. The problem increases as the reactionary idiots led by the likes of you demand more firepower in the hands of police, that still get taken by criminals.

Here's the problem with your whole whacky scenario. Criminals aren't really the problem. Most gun deaths are sucides, domestic arguments, or the crazy person who had access to a gun and shouldn't have. We eliminate those, then we can concentrate on the "Criminals".

The most despotic regimes in the world have fallen to completely disarmed masses, the most heavily armed governments couldn't keep rebels from killing troops and bombing shit. Yet here's your dumb ass demanding we turn the screws of tyranny on a pissed off population...

Thank God you're not commisioned, you'd be shot in the back by a private.

Actually, it was a long time ago... but to the point, most of the population doesn't need guns. If they want guns, the rest of us are entitled to an assurance that you aren't a crazy person.

Seems reasonable to me.

Incidently, the troops loved me. Two guys you always want to be your buddy in the Army. The Supply Sergeant and the Head Cook.

 

[Bfgrn]

Please provide any federal, state or local proposed bills that would totally disarm the citizenry? You right wing gun nuts have taken reasonable and moderate gun sense and turned them into radical and extreme measures. The TRUTH is the only radicals and extremists are on the gun nut side.

This specific discussion is less about guns and gun control as it is about imposition of authority by agents of the state. It has less to do with pro-gun vs anti-gun advocacy than with individual disposition toward authority.


Back in the 1950s a highly respected psychiatrist, teacher, and lecturer, Dr. Erich Fromm, published the now classic work, Escape From Freedom (available from Amazon), in which he deals with the emergence of a social phenomenon called authoritarianism, now a widely recognized social observation within the Behavioral field. An updated observation of this behavioral phenomenon, The Authoritarians, was published by Prof. Robert Altemeyer in 2006 (also available from Amazon). The foregoing academic references are posted for benefit of any who wish to further explore in greater depth the phenomena referred to by behaviorists as the authoritarian/dominant and authoritarian/submissive personalities.

Jumping ahead, evidence of the emergence of a strongly authoritarian component in the American culture is the phenomenal rise in popularity of police drama. Anyone who doubts this is invited to compile a list of every movie or television drama, whether fictional, documentary, or fantasy (Spider Man, Batman, Judge Dredd, etc.) he/she can recall which deals with some form of law-enforcement theme. They will find the list is virtually endless, increasing and broadening in thematic scope every day. The popularity of this entertainment genre unmistakably affirms that a significant percentage of the American population harbors a preconscious fascination with and appreciation of forcefully imposed authority. Some enjoy this type of entertainment because it satisfies their authoritarian/dominant inclination. Others like it because it appeals to their authoritarian/submissive nature.

In the example of this thread, we see those who approve of four uniformed police officers (manifest authority) appearing on the doorstep of someone who has broken no laws nor harmed anyone. Some of those who approve of this occurrence are guided by their authoritarian/dominant tendency to support such behavior. Others approve of it because of their innate acceptance of authority and their willingness to submit. Both categories present some rationalized justification for behavior which is in fact a clear manifestation of authoritarian disposition.

Now I await angry criticism, which I intend to welcome by expanding the theme of this message onto the example of the Waco massacre -- which is far more relevant to this issue than it might seem to be at first glance.

I am VERY familiar with Altemeyer and the authoritarian personality. You best be careful with that kind of knowledge, because what Prof. Robert Altemeyer found in his studies is a small, maybe 1% of the left who will follow authoritarianism. Probably the far left. As far as widespread testing, it's just overwhelmingly conservative orientation.

This is not opinion, Altemeyer has tested literally tens of thousands of first-year college students and their parents, along with others, including some fifteen hundred American state legislators, over the course of some three decades. He has tested in the South and North of the United States. There is no database on authoritarians that even comes close in its scope to that which he has created, and, more importantly, these studies are empirical data, not partisan speculation.

 

[Pete7469]

Have you ever wondered how someone like Hitler was able to carry out his murderous ways? He had to have a very large group of followers who would kill without conscience. Well, meet people like Pete, M14, Quantum, 2nd amend etc. They would be the ones who follow a Hitler. Not liberals.

Of course if sniveling little bed wetters like you were the majority, the hitlers of the world would all have no problem rising up and taking power, with no one like us to resist them.

Since cowardly leftists are into cults of personality and leaders that promise craddle to grave care, I'm not sure how someone even as stupid as you appear to be can draw the conclusion people like us would follow a hitler, since we can't even tolerate your obama.

Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

 

[Pete7469]

Actually, it was a long time ago... but to the point, most of the population doesn't need guns. If they want guns, the rest of us are entitled to an assurance that you aren't a crazy person.

Seems reasonable to me.

There are no assurances in life. We just had a cop lose his mind and go on a murderspree until they roasted his ass in a mountain cabin.

It seems reasonable to me that people are responsible for their own security among other things, and not dependent on the state.

 

[Bfgrn]

Have you ever wondered how someone like Hitler was able to carry out his murderous ways? He had to have a very large group of followers who would kill without conscience. Well, meet people like Pete, M14, Quantum, 2nd amend etc. They would be the ones who follow a Hitler. Not liberals.

Of course if sniveling little bed wetters like you were the majority, the hitlers of the world would all have no problem rising up and taking power, with no one like us to resist them.

Since cowardly leftists are into cults of personality and leaders that promise craddle to grave care, I'm not sure how someone even as stupid as you appear to be can draw the conclusion people like us would follow a hitler, since we can't even tolerate your obama.

Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

Let's think about it for a moment. Liberals have been called 'cowardly leftists','sniveling little bed wetters', pacifists, tree huggers, statists and collectivists. But then we must also believe these would be the same people who would march lockstep and go door to door and brutally murder human beings.

This is coming from someone who willingly joins the most collectivist existence on the planet (military) and volunteers to KILL FOR THE STATE.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

[

The NRA is actually responding in opposition to "republicans" like you. They used be refered to as "Negotiate Rights Away". They learned their lessons from the growth of groups such as Gun Owners of America that aren't willing to "compromise" with statists and sacrifice rights for political expediency.

Thank God your ideas are being marginalized. Why don't you just admit you're a democrat? If it wasn't for spineless republicrats like you the likes of McCain wouldn't have had the chance to loose against the moonbat messiah. We'd be looking at the second term of Fred Thompson.

.

Yeah. Fred Thompson. that idiot!

Hey, how'd that work out? Oh, yeah, that's right. When Dick Wolf wasn't writing dialog for him, he wasn't half as impressive.

I guess the problem is, I don't see keeping guns out of the hands of a guy like Adam Lanza or Joker Holmes as being a Comprimise of "Rights". I see it as just common fuckin' sense. I don't want those guys wandering the streets with military grade weapons and I'm not sure why you do.

Have you ever wondered how someone like Hitler was able to carry out his murderous ways? He had to have a very large group of followers who would kill without conscience. Well, meet people like Pete, M14, Quantum, 2nd amend etc. They would be the ones who follow a Hitler. Not liberals.

I would follow Hitler? What evidence do you have that I have aver agreed with anything Hitler has said? I get accused all the time of being an anarchist, yet I am suddenly a follower of a big government blowhard?

You want to know who supported Hitler in the US? Margaret Sanger. What else is she known for? Planned Parenthood.

Want tot ell me again how people like you wouldn't like Hitler?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Okay, whatever, guy. Admittably, I didn't study the picture like you fetishists did...

But here's the thing. That little loon goes and shoots up his classmates, people would get fired by the truckload for NOT following up, as well they should be.

How many little loons his age have shot up classrooms?

Too many...

0 is too many?

No wonder you are afraid.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Please provide any federal, state or local proposed bills that would totally disarm the citizenry? You right wing gun nuts have taken reasonable and moderate gun sense and turned them into radical and extreme measures. The TRUTH is the only radicals and extremists are on the gun nut side.

This specific discussion is less about guns and gun control as it is about imposition of authority by agents of the state. It has less to do with pro-gun vs anti-gun advocacy than with individual disposition toward authority.


Back in the 1950s a highly respected psychiatrist, teacher, and lecturer, Dr. Erich Fromm, published the now classic work, Escape From Freedom (available from Amazon), in which he deals with the emergence of a social phenomenon called authoritarianism, now a widely recognized social observation within the Behavioral field. An updated observation of this behavioral phenomenon, The Authoritarians, was published by Prof. Robert Altemeyer in 2006 (also available from Amazon). The foregoing academic references are posted for benefit of any who wish to further explore in greater depth the phenomena referred to by behaviorists as the authoritarian/dominant and authoritarian/submissive personalities.

Jumping ahead, evidence of the emergence of a strongly authoritarian component in the American culture is the phenomenal rise in popularity of police drama. Anyone who doubts this is invited to compile a list of every movie or television drama, whether fictional, documentary, or fantasy (Spider Man, Batman, Judge Dredd, etc.) he/she can recall which deals with some form of law-enforcement theme. They will find the list is virtually endless, increasing and broadening in thematic scope every day. The popularity of this entertainment genre unmistakably affirms that a significant percentage of the American population harbors a preconscious fascination with and appreciation of forcefully imposed authority. Some enjoy this type of entertainment because it satisfies their authoritarian/dominant inclination. Others like it because it appeals to their authoritarian/submissive nature.

In the example of this thread, we see those who approve of four uniformed police officers (manifest authority) appearing on the doorstep of someone who has broken no laws nor harmed anyone. Some of those who approve of this occurrence are guided by their authoritarian/dominant tendency to support such behavior. Others approve of it because of their innate acceptance of authority and their willingness to submit. Both categories present some rationalized justification for behavior which is in fact a clear manifestation of authoritarian disposition.

Now I await angry criticism, which I intend to welcome by expanding the theme of this message onto the example of the Waco massacre -- which is far more relevant to this issue than it might seem to be at first glance.

I am VERY familiar with Altemeyer and the authoritarian personality. You best be careful with that kind of knowledge, because what Prof. Robert Altemeyer found in his studies is a small, maybe 1% of the left who will follow authoritarianism. Probably the far left. As far as widespread testing, it's just overwhelmingly conservative orientation.

This is not opinion, Altemeyer has tested literally tens of thousands of first-year college students and their parents, along with others, including some fifteen hundred American state legislators, over the course of some three decades. He has tested in the South and North of the United States. There is no database on authoritarians that even comes close in its scope to that which he has created, and, more importantly, these studies are empirical data, not partisan speculation.

That is pure bullshit.

 

[Mustang]

This specific discussion is less about guns and gun control as it is about imposition of authority by agents of the state. It has less to do with pro-gun vs anti-gun advocacy than with individual disposition toward authority.


Back in the 1950s a highly respected psychiatrist, teacher, and lecturer, Dr. Erich Fromm, published the now classic work, Escape From Freedom (available from Amazon), in which he deals with the emergence of a social phenomenon called authoritarianism, now a widely recognized social observation within the Behavioral field. An updated observation of this behavioral phenomenon, The Authoritarians, was published by Prof. Robert Altemeyer in 2006 (also available from Amazon). The foregoing academic references are posted for benefit of any who wish to further explore in greater depth the phenomena referred to by behaviorists as the authoritarian/dominant and authoritarian/submissive personalities.

Jumping ahead, evidence of the emergence of a strongly authoritarian component in the American culture is the phenomenal rise in popularity of police drama. Anyone who doubts this is invited to compile a list of every movie or television drama, whether fictional, documentary, or fantasy (Spider Man, Batman, Judge Dredd, etc.) he/she can recall which deals with some form of law-enforcement theme. They will find the list is virtually endless, increasing and broadening in thematic scope every day. The popularity of this entertainment genre unmistakably affirms that a significant percentage of the American population harbors a preconscious fascination with and appreciation of forcefully imposed authority. Some enjoy this type of entertainment because it satisfies their authoritarian/dominant inclination. Others like it because it appeals to their authoritarian/submissive nature.

In the example of this thread, we see those who approve of four uniformed police officers (manifest authority) appearing on the doorstep of someone who has broken no laws nor harmed anyone. Some of those who approve of this occurrence are guided by their authoritarian/dominant tendency to support such behavior. Others approve of it because of their innate acceptance of authority and their willingness to submit. Both categories present some rationalized justification for behavior which is in fact a clear manifestation of authoritarian disposition.

Now I await angry criticism, which I intend to welcome by expanding the theme of this message onto the example of the Waco massacre -- which is far more relevant to this issue than it might seem to be at first glance.

I am VERY familiar with Altemeyer and the authoritarian personality. You best be careful with that kind of knowledge, because what Prof. Robert Altemeyer found in his studies is a small, maybe 1% of the left who will follow authoritarianism. Probably the far left. As far as widespread testing, it's just overwhelmingly conservative orientation.

This is not opinion, Altemeyer has tested literally tens of thousands of first-year college students and their parents, along with others, including some fifteen hundred American state legislators, over the course of some three decades. He has tested in the South and North of the United States. There is no database on authoritarians that even comes close in its scope to that which he has created, and, more importantly, these studies are empirical data, not partisan speculation.

That is pure bullshit.

No it isn't. Read Jonathan Haidt's excellent book,

The Righteous Mind: Why Good People are Divided by Politics and Religion

In case it matters to you, the book is highly recommended by Mary Matalin.

 

[Bfgrn]

This specific discussion is less about guns and gun control as it is about imposition of authority by agents of the state. It has less to do with pro-gun vs anti-gun advocacy than with individual disposition toward authority.


Back in the 1950s a highly respected psychiatrist, teacher, and lecturer, Dr. Erich Fromm, published the now classic work, Escape From Freedom (available from Amazon), in which he deals with the emergence of a social phenomenon called authoritarianism, now a widely recognized social observation within the Behavioral field. An updated observation of this behavioral phenomenon, The Authoritarians, was published by Prof. Robert Altemeyer in 2006 (also available from Amazon). The foregoing academic references are posted for benefit of any who wish to further explore in greater depth the phenomena referred to by behaviorists as the authoritarian/dominant and authoritarian/submissive personalities.

Jumping ahead, evidence of the emergence of a strongly authoritarian component in the American culture is the phenomenal rise in popularity of police drama. Anyone who doubts this is invited to compile a list of every movie or television drama, whether fictional, documentary, or fantasy (Spider Man, Batman, Judge Dredd, etc.) he/she can recall which deals with some form of law-enforcement theme. They will find the list is virtually endless, increasing and broadening in thematic scope every day. The popularity of this entertainment genre unmistakably affirms that a significant percentage of the American population harbors a preconscious fascination with and appreciation of forcefully imposed authority. Some enjoy this type of entertainment because it satisfies their authoritarian/dominant inclination. Others like it because it appeals to their authoritarian/submissive nature.

In the example of this thread, we see those who approve of four uniformed police officers (manifest authority) appearing on the doorstep of someone who has broken no laws nor harmed anyone. Some of those who approve of this occurrence are guided by their authoritarian/dominant tendency to support such behavior. Others approve of it because of their innate acceptance of authority and their willingness to submit. Both categories present some rationalized justification for behavior which is in fact a clear manifestation of authoritarian disposition.

Now I await angry criticism, which I intend to welcome by expanding the theme of this message onto the example of the Waco massacre -- which is far more relevant to this issue than it might seem to be at first glance.

I am VERY familiar with Altemeyer and the authoritarian personality. You best be careful with that kind of knowledge, because what Prof. Robert Altemeyer found in his studies is a small, maybe 1% of the left who will follow authoritarianism. Probably the far left. As far as widespread testing, it's just overwhelmingly conservative orientation.

This is not opinion, Altemeyer has tested literally tens of thousands of first-year college students and their parents, along with others, including some fifteen hundred American state legislators, over the course of some three decades. He has tested in the South and North of the United States. There is no database on authoritarians that even comes close in its scope to that which he has created, and, more importantly, these studies are empirical data, not partisan speculation.

That is pure bullshit.

So convincing, backed up with documentation and footnotes...LOL

While not all conservatives are authoritarians; all highly authoritarian personalities are political conservatives.
Robert Altmeyer - The Authoritarians