Capitalism is NOT Democratic: Democracy is NOT Capitalist

[dblack]

Extracting? How?

Profit!!!!

 

[georgephillip]

slavery existed long before the united states existed. Long before Adam Smith wrote Wealth of Nations…

Which doesn't alter the fact US capitalism was built on chattel slavery and hundreds of thousands Americans died to end that particular economic "Lost Cause".

Lost Cause of the Confederacy - Wikipedia

 

[georgephillip]

eftist theory, such as socialism, promotes slavery. The fact that an individual has no ability to own anything, the product of their labor…is slavery

Socialism depends on economic democracy.
Capitalism depends on authoritarianism.
You can't have political democracy with bringing democracy to the workplaces.

Economic Democracy

 

[struth]

Which doesn't alter the fact US capitalism was built on chattel slavery and hundreds of thousands Americans died to end that particular economic "Lost Cause".

Lost Cause of the Confederacy - Wikipedia

I think it's clear that the US was built on slavery, a practice that we took from other countries at the time, it's our orginial sin.....but it was capitalism that helped end slavery. Slavery runs counter to the princpals of capitlalism.

https://web.stanford.edu/group/mcnollgast/cgi-bin/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/asms-theory-of-sy.15.0725.print-version.pdf

 

[struth]

Socialism depends on economic democracy.
Capitalism depends on authoritarianism.
You can't have political democracy with bringing democracy to the workplaces.

Economic Democracy

hahha the opposite is true.

There is no democracy in socialism...people own nothing and make no choices....the Govt does

Captalism is the opposite. People are free to make choices, not the Govt. You dont like the quality of cheese produced by Company X, don't buy it...that's your vote...demand better, eitehr they produce better, or go out of business. In Socialism, you are stuck only with Govt cheese. Socialism makes the population a slave.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Finance capitalism works by extracting wealth from the productive economy.

Extracting? How?

Still no answer? Maybe a Marxist (DURR) economist can help you?

 

[georgephillip]

Capitalism promotes private, individual, ownership…the ability to make choice, that’s the opposite of slavery

Capitalism has a pair of deadly flaws: it relentlessly widens income/wealth inequality and it destroys nature. Both maladies are, at root, problems of property rights and must be addressed at that level which won't happen by "choosing" between Republican or Democrat in the voting booth.

Capitalism's Core Problem: The Case for Universal Property

 

[georgephillip]

If liberty and equality are chiefly to be found in democracy, they will be best attained when all persons alike share in government to the utmost.--Aristotle

I don't know if a majority of Americans are willing to consider the possibility that private fortunes do not exist without warfare and debt, but maybe they should.

 

[georgephillip]

Where did capitalism kill 5 million from lack of drinking water?

For Third World, Water Is Still a Deadly Drink (Published 1997)

 

[georgephillip]

without capitalism you are still working for the king, on the king's land. Equality means nothing in the King's kingdom.

Destroys nature? Now you are simply talking out your ass.

Do corporate CEOs and small business owners function more like monarchs or duly elected democratic leaders? Twenty-first century socialism is modeled more on the Mondragon corporation than on USSR state capitalism.

BOOKS / Carl Davidson : The Mondragon Cooperatives and 21st Century Socialism

 

[struth]

Capitalism has a pair of deadly flaws: it relentlessly widens income/wealth inequality and it destroys nature. Both maladies are, at root, problems of property rights and must be addressed at that level which won't happen by "choosing" between Republican or Democrat in the voting booth.

Capitalism's Core Problem: The Case for Universal Property

haha socialism does those things far worse

look at the environment created in the USSR and New Korea

Capitalism, private ownership, solves for the flaw of the commons because individuals care about keep their property clean

as far as the wealth gap..yea it will happen…the alternative is socialism where there is no wealth, everyone is poor and slaves to the state who owns it all. The only rich people are the party leaders in Moscow

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

For Third World, Water Is Still a Deadly Drink (Published 1997)

I don't have a subscription.
Cut and paste the portion that supports your claim.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Do corporate CEOs and small business owners function more like monarchs or duly elected democratic leaders? Twenty-first century socialism is modeled more on the Mondragon corporation than on USSR state capitalism.

BOOKS / Carl Davidson : The Mondragon Cooperatives and 21st Century Socialism

Do corporate CEOs and small business owners function more like monarchs or duly elected democratic leaders?

Why do I need an elected leader for a business that I own?

 

[struth]

I don't have a subscription.
Cut and paste the portion that supports your claim.

ironically it’s not a problem for counties that have adopted a capitalist system…but capitalist is helping, shipping in bottle water from private companies

 

[georgephillip]

Destroys nature? Now you are simply talking out your ass.

Capitalism poisons the planet for profit by plundering global resources, worsening pollution, and magnifies "natural disasters" It has already created an existential threat to human civilization we have never seen before.

Capitalism's Core Problem: The Case for Universal Property

"They found that natural ecosystems generate a global flow of benefits — including fresh water supply, soil formation, nutrient cycling, waste treatment, pollination, raw materials and climate regulation — worth between $25 trillion and $87 trillion a year.

"That compares with a gross world product of about $80 trillion.

"These calculations are precise enough to suggest that we are greatly confused about where our wealth today comes from.

"We think it comes from the fevered efforts of today’s businesses and workers, but in fact they merely add icing to a cake that was baked long ago."

 

[georgephillip]

Government is what destroys capitalism, and what man creates for himself. My work is my property, my labor is not the property of government, which is what you advocate.

Since government charters corporations and corporations drive the global economy, capitalism would not even exist in its current incarnation without the state.

Your property rights would be considerably more expensive to defend without government providing courts, police, and fire services.

 

[georgephillip]

Consequences, how about getting off you high horse and quit looking down your nose at the people you are no better than. You can be a man and state what you believe the consequences to be, instead of talking like you sit at the right hand of the king.

If I've given you the impression that I would do anything except cut off the right hand of the king, I apologize. I see today's world as a continuation of the Divine Right of Kings, and I have no intention of supporting our current (corporate) lords and masters:

The Divine Right of Capital by Marjorie Kelly

"All societies have world views, the 'unconscious mental habits' we use to make sense of the world – so deep, so pervasive as to be invisible.

"Aristocratic society in feudal times based its membership on property ownership. Back then, it was land. Today it’s wealth, or financial assets..."

Today, our worldview has a bias – that stockholders are to be paid as much as possible, while employees are to be paid as little as possible. 'Income for one group is declared good, and income for another group is declared bad.'"

 

[georgephillip]

If you have no skills, why should you enjoy equality?

From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs - Wikipedia

"The principle refers to free access to and distribution of goods, capital and services.[3]

"In the Marxist view, such an arrangement will be made possible by the abundance of goods and services that a developed communist system will be capable to produce; the idea is that, with the full development of socialism and unfettered productive forces, there will be enough to satisfy everyone's needs."

 

[danielpalos]

haha socialism does those things far worse

look at the environment created in the USSR and New Korea

Capitalism, private ownership, solves for the flaw of the commons because individuals care about keep their property clean

as far as the wealth gap..yea it will happen…the alternative is socialism where there is no wealth, everyone is poor and slaves to the state who owns it all. The only rich people are the party leaders in Moscow

Not at all. In our US case, socialism is about equality and equal protection of the laws.

The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs - Wikipedia

"The principle refers to free access to and distribution of goods, capital and services.[3]

"In the Marxist view, such an arrangement will be made possible by the abundance of goods and services that a developed communist system will be capable to produce; the idea is that, with the full development of socialism and unfettered productive forces, there will be enough to satisfy everyone's needs."

From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs​

That really worked out for the Soviet Union, eh?

"In the Marxist view, such an arrangement will be made possible by the abundance of goods and services that a developed communist system will be capable to produce

But they never do produce that abundance.