Canada Gets It Right...

[Toro]

Trust me, guys, a Conservative up in Canada, while he may have his/her share of conservative ideals, is at the end a RINO here in the US.

Conservatives in Canada tend to be more conservative on fiscal issues, free trade, defense and immigration. They are also the most pro-American party. They are not particularly conservative on social issues, at least not compared to the US, though this incarnation is a little more so. Religion plays little part as well compared to American politics. So many conservatives would consider the Tories as RINOs in America. That's why I feel very comfortable on the Right in Canada but not in America.

 

[Two Thumbs]

I was actively in involved in Canadian politics. I know the difference. And the Tories have been the party in power for the past four years. There were no liberals in office.

Damn Canadians don't speak English right! When will the English speaking world wise up and start speaking American!?!?!?!?!


OK

What's a Torie - liberal - conservative, in Canada?

since it seems to not mean the same thing as in Gods Country.

I'm sorry. A Tory is a Conservative. Same in Britain.

Thanks

Is a Candian conservative the same as an American conservative? Or are they more like republicans?

 

[Toro]

Damn Canadians don't speak English right! When will the English speaking world wise up and start speaking American!?!?!?!?!


OK

What's a Torie - liberal - conservative, in Canada?

since it seems to not mean the same thing as in Gods Country.

I'm sorry. A Tory is a Conservative. Same in Britain.

Thanks

Is a Candian conservative the same as an American conservative? Or are they more like republicans?

See above.

I would think most Canadian conservatives would register as Republicans in the US, though they would make the party more moderate. If I become an American, I will most likely register as a Republican.

 

[Robert]

I'm sorry. A Tory is a Conservative. Same in Britain.

Thanks

Is a Candian conservative the same as an American conservative? Or are they more like republicans?

See above.

I would think most Canadian conservatives would register as Republicans in the US, though they would make the party more moderate. If I become an American, I will most likely register as a Republican.

Canadian's as a whole are good solid people with a solid ethic that sadly is lacking in the states. If they manage to run out the liberal base in power and institute some common sense reforms I wouldn't mind again living there.

 

[Dr.Drock]

I'm moving to Canada to escape our horrifying Socialist/Progressive Nightmare here. Isn't that what most Lefty Wingnuts say when the Republicans are in Power? I'm just kidding though. I'm staying so i can help Conservatives take our Country back in 2012. Kudos Canada!

Libo, you understand this is just the canadian version of american republicans right?

Nothing conservative about it.

 

[B. Kidd]

I'm moving to Canada to escape our horrifying Socialist/Progressive Nightmare here. Isn't that what most Lefty Wingnuts say when the Republicans are in Power? I'm just kidding though. I'm staying so i can help Conservatives take our Country back in 2012. Kudos Canada!

Don't move to British Columbia as it's crawling with socialists. Alberta and Saskatchewan more to your liking.

 

[Oscar Wao]

Trust me, guys, a Conservative up in Canada, while he may have his/her share of conservative ideals, is at the end a RINO here in the US.

Conservatives in Canada tend to be more conservative on fiscal issues, free trade, defense and immigration. They are also the most pro-American party. They are not particularly conservative on social issues, at least not compared to the US, though this incarnation is a little more so. Religion plays little part as well compared to American politics. So many conservatives would consider the Tories as RINOs in America. That's why I feel very comfortable on the Right in Canada but not in America.

Don't they support UHC also? That's what I meant by RINOs. RINO in the sense that they still support social programs in Canada.

I could care less about religion and social issues. He could be a gay polygamist with 5 husbands and a devil worshiper for all I care.

 

[jgarden]

The people of Canadia took time out yesterday from the world's obsession with the dead bin Laden to pull off a voters' rebellion at the polls and tossed liberals out of office in favor of Conservatives, who campaigned, in part, on providing more jobs for their economy without raising taxes.

Sounds like they've finally done something right up there, eh?

Canada's Conservatives score massive election win - Yahoo! News

The Conservatives may have won the majority of electoral seats - but they did it with a mere 39.62% of the popular vote.

The demise of the Bloc and the decline of the Liberals resulted in major shifts of voter alliances within the Canafian political "universe," but when all is said and done that has translated into a mere 1.92 % increase in the popular support for the Conservatives since the 2008 Election (37.7%).

That 1.92% increase is thought to have come from the last-minute defection of right-wing Liberals, in response to Harper raising the "boggeyman" of a socialism during the last days of the campaign.

The reality is that the vast majority of Canadians continue to hold negative opinions concerning the Conservative Party, its leader and just about everything it stands for.

This Conservative's majority in seats is more in response to the structural "quirks" of the parliamentary system, rather than by some attempt by the national electorate to jump on the Tory poltical "bandwagon."

 

[Toro]

Trust me, guys, a Conservative up in Canada, while he may have his/her share of conservative ideals, is at the end a RINO here in the US.

Conservatives in Canada tend to be more conservative on fiscal issues, free trade, defense and immigration. They are also the most pro-American party. They are not particularly conservative on social issues, at least not compared to the US, though this incarnation is a little more so. Religion plays little part as well compared to American politics. So many conservatives would consider the Tories as RINOs in America. That's why I feel very comfortable on the Right in Canada but not in America.

Don't they support UHC also? That's what I meant by RINOs. RINO in the sense that they still support social programs in Canada.

I could care less about religion and social issues. He could be a gay polygamist with 5 husbands and a devil worshiper for all I care.

Conservatives would like to offer more private alternatives. However, they don't dare campaign on dismantling Medicare - what Canadians call Universal Healthcare. They would get destroyed. So implicitly, because Canadians want Medicare, the Conservatives support it as well.

 

[Oscar Wao]

Ah.

Too bad about the whole not being able to abolish UHC thing...

 

[Truthmatters]

Hmmm you mean the people of canada like their healthcare?

Even the conservatives.


I guess universal heaalthcare must work well

 

[Oscar Wao]

No, TM, the conservatives know going against UHC would be political suicide. Even if they are against it deep down, they have to keep their traps shut.

 

[Epsilon Delta]

The people of Canadia took time out yesterday from the world's obsession with the dead bin Laden to pull off a voters' rebellion at the polls and tossed liberals out of office in favor of Conservatives, who campaigned, in part, on providing more jobs for their economy without raising taxes.

Sounds like they've finally done something right up there, eh?

Canada's Conservatives score massive election win - Yahoo! News

The Conservatives may have won the majority of electoral seats - but they did it with a mere 39.62% of the popular vote.

The demise of the Bloc and the decline of the Liberals resulted in major shifts of voter alliances within the Canafian political "universe," hut when all is daid and done that has translated into a mere 1.92 % increase in the popular support for the Conservatives since the 2008 Election (37.7%).

That 1.92% increase is thought to have come from the last-minute defection of right-wing Liberals, in response to Harper raising the "boggeyman" of a socialism during the last days of the campaign.

The reality is that the vast majority of Canadians continue to hold negative opinions concerning the Conservative Party, its leader and just about everything it stands for.

This Conservative's majority in seats is more in response to the structural "quirks" of the parliamentary system, rather than by some attempt by the national electorate to jump on the Tory poltical "bandwagon."

Yeah, to be honest, I dunno how anyone could claim this as some sort of huuuuuge victory for worldwide conservatism. It's of course big in parliamentary terms and them getting the majority they've been hungry for since 2006, but if it's the general attitude of the Canadian public you wanna gauge, just looking at the numbers gives you an entirely different picture:

Conservatives: 5.8 million (39.6%)
New Democratic Party: 4.5 million (30.6%)
Liberals: 2.78 million (18.9%)
Bloc Quebecois: 0.89 million (6%)
Green Party: 0.57 million (3.9%)

The New Democrats increased their share of the vote by 2 million votes, and they're a pretty "left" party (self-identified as social-democratic), farther to the left than the Liberals (who lost ~600,000 votes, about equal the amount that conservatives gained) and the US Democrats. Even leaving out the nationalist Bloc you'd still be left with a "left" (Liberal, NDP, Green) total of ~7.85 million votes to the Conservatives' 5.8. As a caveat though, the Canadian Liberals, while pretty "liberal" in relation to the US would probably be considered fairly centrist party (especially true in this case since it's been sandwiched between a Right Party and a Left party) in most of the world. And again, like others have pointed out, the "Right" in Canada is not anywhere near the viciousness of the "Right" in the US, at the domestic level in any case.

One could also point out that the Liberals in Canada have been basically leaderless for the past 5 years. Stephane Dion and Ignatieff were a total joke. I'll never forget these commercials the conservatives had for Ignatieff in the last election, they basically just destroyed him (for Canadians out there, I'm talking about the "Micheal Ignatieff: Just Visiting" commercials). Either which way, it seems pretty unlikely for Canada to have a left-leaning government for a while now, unless the Liberals finally call it a day and merge with the NDP, or if a Bloc desintegration pushes the NDP further up (unlikely considering that most of the remaining Bloc voters would probably split between Liberals and Conservatives).

 

[Indy Terry]

I believe that a Torie in Canada lines up more as a conservative Democrat in the United States. The Tories back a lot of the socialist programs just not as whole heartedly as the Liberals. Nothing like Toronto but Edmonton and Calgary come to mind.

 

[Toro]

The people of Canadia took time out yesterday from the world's obsession with the dead bin Laden to pull off a voters' rebellion at the polls and tossed liberals out of office in favor of Conservatives, who campaigned, in part, on providing more jobs for their economy without raising taxes.

Sounds like they've finally done something right up there, eh?

Canada's Conservatives score massive election win - Yahoo! News

The Conservatives may have won the majority of electoral seats - but they did it with a mere 39.62% of the popular vote.

The demise of the Bloc and the decline of the Liberals resulted in major shifts of voter alliances within the Canafian political "universe," hut when all is daid and done that has translated into a mere 1.92 % increase in the popular support for the Conservatives since the 2008 Election (37.7%).

That 1.92% increase is thought to have come from the last-minute defection of right-wing Liberals, in response to Harper raising the "boggeyman" of a socialism during the last days of the campaign.

The reality is that the vast majority of Canadians continue to hold negative opinions concerning the Conservative Party, its leader and just about everything it stands for.

This Conservative's majority in seats is more in response to the structural "quirks" of the parliamentary system, rather than by some attempt by the national electorate to jump on the Tory poltical "bandwagon."

Yeah, to be honest, I dunno how anyone could claim this as some sort of huuuuuge victory for worldwide conservatism. It's of course big in parliamentary terms and them getting the majority they've been hungry for since 2006, but if it's the general attitude of the Canadian public you wanna gauge, just looking at the numbers gives you an entirely different picture:

Conservatives: 5.8 million (39.6%)
New Democratic Party: 4.5 million (30.6%)
Liberals: 2.78 million (18.9%)
Bloc Quebecois: 0.89 million (6%)
Green Party: 0.57 million (3.9%)

The New Democrats increased their share of the vote by 2 million votes, and they're a pretty "left" party (self-identified as social-democratic), farther to the left than the Liberals (who lost ~600,000 votes, about equal the amount that conservatives gained) and the US Democrats. Even leaving out the nationalist Bloc you'd still be left with a "left" (Liberal, NDP, Green) total of ~7.85 million votes to the Conservatives' 5.8. As a caveat though, the Canadian Liberals, while pretty "liberal" in relation to the US would probably be considered fairly centrist party (especially true in this case since it's been sandwiched between a Right Party and a Left party) in most of the world. And again, like others have pointed out, the "Right" in Canada is not anywhere near the viciousness of the "Right" in the US, at the domestic level in any case.

One could also point out that the Liberals in Canada have been basically leaderless for the past 5 years. Stephane Dion and Ignatieff were a total joke. I'll never forget these commercials the conservatives had for Ignatieff in the last election, they basically just destroyed him (for Canadians out there, I'm talking about the "Micheal Ignatieff: Just Visiting" commercials). Either which way, it seems pretty unlikely for Canada to have a left-leaning government for a while now, unless the Liberals finally call it a day and merge with the NDP, or if a Bloc desintegration pushes the NDP further up (unlikely considering that most of the remaining Bloc voters would probably split between Liberals and Conservatives).

Generally, though, Canada doesn't elect majority governments with majority votes. Majorities are usually won in Canada with 38% to 44% of the vote. In BC a couple of decades ago, if I recall correctly and I may be a little off, Glen Clarke and the NDP won a majority with 35% of the vote while the Liberals won 38%. In one of the elections - I think it was 1997, Chretien won all 105 seats in Ontario as the conservative vote split between the Reform and the PC. The conservative vote split in something like 50 seats, such that had they been one party, they would have won those seats. But it allowed the Liberals to slip through the middle. I think the Liberals won a majority that election of 160-165 seats and 38% of the vote.

I don't think the Liberals will ever merge with the NDP. They are two very different parties. And the Liberals aren't really "left" either. They are more centrists. In fact, in some ridings, it appears that the right leaning Liberals broke to the Tories.

And despite the NDP's great night, they won only 44 seats outside of Quebec. Over the past 35 years, Quebec has given massive majorities to the Liberals under Trudeau, then the Tories under Mulroney, then the Bloc under Bouchard and Duceppe, and now the NDP. None had any staying power. Will the NDP be any different? Probably not, given that the party has absolutely no history in the province.

The Tories, on the other hand, won 161 out of the 233 seats outside of Quebec. That is a pretty solid showing.

I can see a scenario where the NDP wins the next election, but most likely, the Tories will be in power for a decade while the Liberals regroup, as they will.

 

[auditor0007]

The people of Canadia took time out yesterday from the world's obsession with the dead bin Laden to pull off a voters' rebellion at the polls and tossed liberals out of office in favor of Conservatives, who campaigned, in part, on providing more jobs for their economy without raising taxes.

Sounds like they've finally done something right up there, eh?

Canada's Conservatives score massive election win - Yahoo! News

First of all, there is no such country as "Canadia." Second, they didn't "toss liberals out office." The conservatives were the ruling party and had won the last two elections.

Thought so. I don't think the Conservatives in Canada are quite as "conservative" as they are in the US either.

 

[auditor0007]

The people of Canadia took time out yesterday from the world's obsession with the dead bin Laden to pull off a voters' rebellion at the polls and tossed liberals out of office in favor of Conservatives, who campaigned, in part, on providing more jobs for their economy without raising taxes.

Sounds like they've finally done something right up there, eh?

Canada's Conservatives score massive election win - Yahoo! News

Let's see, the GOP/conservatives campaigned on creating jobs and not rasising taxes in 2010 and managed to win back the House. What's the first thing they focused on? They managed to change the definition of "rape".

Unemployment also went down ~1% since they took the House. If they had taken the Senate.... well, we might have gotten it down 2%.

But not to worry, people all around the world are learning that socialism is the dumbest idea next to communism and will no longer tolerate it.

And what exactly is it that the Republicans have done to bring down unemployment by 1%? I'm just curious. Not that the Dems have done anything, but what exactly have the Republicans done?

 

[auditor0007]

Conservatives in Canada tend to be more conservative on fiscal issues, free trade, defense and immigration. They are also the most pro-American party. They are not particularly conservative on social issues, at least not compared to the US, though this incarnation is a little more so. Religion plays little part as well compared to American politics. So many conservatives would consider the Tories as RINOs in America. That's why I feel very comfortable on the Right in Canada but not in America.

Don't they support UHC also? That's what I meant by RINOs. RINO in the sense that they still support social programs in Canada.

I could care less about religion and social issues. He could be a gay polygamist with 5 husbands and a devil worshiper for all I care.

Conservatives would like to offer more private alternatives. However, they don't dare campaign on dismantling Medicare - what Canadians call Universal Healthcare. They would get destroyed. So implicitly, because Canadians want Medicare, the Conservatives support it as well.

Why do they support such a horrible system? Why don't they get rid of UHC and embrace the US system? The first sentence was meant to be facetious, but still a serious question.

 

[auditor0007]

The Conservatives may have won the majority of electoral seats - but they did it with a mere 39.62% of the popular vote.

The demise of the Bloc and the decline of the Liberals resulted in major shifts of voter alliances within the Canafian political "universe," hut when all is daid and done that has translated into a mere 1.92 % increase in the popular support for the Conservatives since the 2008 Election (37.7%).

That 1.92% increase is thought to have come from the last-minute defection of right-wing Liberals, in response to Harper raising the "boggeyman" of a socialism during the last days of the campaign.

The reality is that the vast majority of Canadians continue to hold negative opinions concerning the Conservative Party, its leader and just about everything it stands for.

This Conservative's majority in seats is more in response to the structural "quirks" of the parliamentary system, rather than by some attempt by the national electorate to jump on the Tory poltical "bandwagon."

Yeah, to be honest, I dunno how anyone could claim this as some sort of huuuuuge victory for worldwide conservatism. It's of course big in parliamentary terms and them getting the majority they've been hungry for since 2006, but if it's the general attitude of the Canadian public you wanna gauge, just looking at the numbers gives you an entirely different picture:

Conservatives: 5.8 million (39.6%)
New Democratic Party: 4.5 million (30.6%)
Liberals: 2.78 million (18.9%)
Bloc Quebecois: 0.89 million (6%)
Green Party: 0.57 million (3.9%)

The New Democrats increased their share of the vote by 2 million votes, and they're a pretty "left" party (self-identified as social-democratic), farther to the left than the Liberals (who lost ~600,000 votes, about equal the amount that conservatives gained) and the US Democrats. Even leaving out the nationalist Bloc you'd still be left with a "left" (Liberal, NDP, Green) total of ~7.85 million votes to the Conservatives' 5.8. As a caveat though, the Canadian Liberals, while pretty "liberal" in relation to the US would probably be considered fairly centrist party (especially true in this case since it's been sandwiched between a Right Party and a Left party) in most of the world. And again, like others have pointed out, the "Right" in Canada is not anywhere near the viciousness of the "Right" in the US, at the domestic level in any case.

One could also point out that the Liberals in Canada have been basically leaderless for the past 5 years. Stephane Dion and Ignatieff were a total joke. I'll never forget these commercials the conservatives had for Ignatieff in the last election, they basically just destroyed him (for Canadians out there, I'm talking about the "Micheal Ignatieff: Just Visiting" commercials). Either which way, it seems pretty unlikely for Canada to have a left-leaning government for a while now, unless the Liberals finally call it a day and merge with the NDP, or if a Bloc desintegration pushes the NDP further up (unlikely considering that most of the remaining Bloc voters would probably split between Liberals and Conservatives).

Generally, though, Canada doesn't elect majority governments with majority votes. Majorities are usually won in Canada with 38% to 44% of the vote. In BC a couple of decades ago, if I recall correctly and I may be a little off, Glen Clarke and the NDP won a majority with 35% of the vote while the Liberals won 38%. In one of the elections - I think it was 1997, Chretien won all 105 seats in Ontario as the conservative vote split between the Reform and the PC. The conservative vote split in something like 50 seats, such that had they been one party, they would have won those seats. But it allowed the Liberals to slip through the middle. I think the Liberals won a majority that election of 160-165 seats and 38% of the vote.

I don't think the Liberals will ever merge with the NDP. They are two very different parties. And the Liberals aren't really "left" either. They are more centrists. In fact, in some ridings, it appears that the right leaning Liberals broke to the Tories.

And despite the NDP's great night, they won only 44 seats outside of Quebec. Over the past 35 years, Quebec has given massive majorities to the Liberals under Trudeau, then the Tories under Mulroney, then the Bloc under Bouchard and Duceppe, and now the NDP. None had any staying power. Will the NDP be any different? Probably not, given that the party has absolutely no history in the province.

The Tories, on the other hand, won 161 out of the 233 seats outside of Quebec. That is a pretty solid showing.

I can see a scenario where the NDP wins the next election, but most likely, the Tories will be in power for a decade while the Liberals regroup, as they will.

Having a third party in the US would wreak havoc on our system, because it is not set up for building coalitions, yet many people seem to cherish the thought of a major third party.

 

[jgarden]

Although Canada's NDP has never held power nationally, it has formed a number of provincial governments. Its predecessor formed a provincial government in Saskatchewan and proceeded to introduce its own working version of a public healthhcare system - that in turn gained widespread national attention.

During the late 1960's and early 1970's, the Liberals and Conservatives realized that public healthcare had now become popular among voters and incorporated NDP ideas into their own platforms. This has been a reoccuring in Canadian politics, whereby the 2 larger traditional non-socialist parties have denounced the NDP while repeatedly adopting those "socialist" ideas that gave gained widespread acceptance.

Quebec's own federal "separtist" party allowed that province to vent its frustations without actually separating. After 25 years, this party now seems to have "run-its-course" and has all but dusappeared during the 2011 election.

Unlike America, socialist, separatist and even "Green" parties have won seats in parliament and allowed to voice their opinions.