Zone1 Can you be both a Catholic and an abortionist? (Poll)

[ding]

My argument is that pro-abortion politicians shouldn't be allowed to say they are Catholic.
They should bt Excommunicated from Catholicism and made to find a pro-choice church.

God gave everyone free will, right? Isn't that between them and God?

 

[ding]

Science says human life begins at conception. You do believe in science, don't you?

Only when it suits him.

 

[80zephyr]

Only when it suits him.

Science says: Biologists from 1,058 academic institutions around the world assessed survey items on when a human's life begins and, overall, 96% (5337 out of 5577) affirmed the fertilization view.

The Scientific Consensus on When a Human's Life Begins - PubMed

Peer-reviewed journals in the biological and life sciences literature have published articles that represent the biological view that a human's life begins at fertilization ("the fertilization view"). As those statements are typically offered without explanation or citation, the fertilization...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Science says: Biologists from 1,058 academic institutions around the world assessed survey items on when a human's life begins and, overall, 96% (5337 out of 5577) affirmed the fertilization view.

The Scientific Consensus on When a Human's Life Begins - PubMed

Peer-reviewed journals in the biological and life sciences literature have published articles that represent the biological view that a human's life begins at fertilization ("the fertilization view"). As those statements are typically offered without explanation or citation, the fertilization...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Yes human life begins at fertilization. It is happening inside a woman’s body. It’s none of your business what she does with it, she decides if she wants to take the risk of giving birth to the human life that began at fertilization.

When a woman delivers the human life that begins at fertilization as a human being living in a civil society at that point, you can have an interest in protecting that brand, new persons, life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness.

Before that, get your nose out of every woman’s uterus.

 

[80zephyr]

Yes human life begins at fertilization. It is happening inside a woman’s body. It’s none of your business what she does with it, she decides if she wants to take the risk of giving birth to the human life that began at fertilization.

When a woman delivers the human life that begins at fertilization as a human being living in a civil society at that point, you can have an interest in protecting that brand, new persons, life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness.

Before that, get your nose out of every woman’s uterus.

We disagree. I believe that ending a human life is murder. The great majority of women willingly engage in sex. They should willingly accept the consequences of that decision.

I suppose you believe a woman has the right to kill that baby even minutes before it is born?

 

[BreezeWood]

We disagree. I believe that ending a human life is murder. The great majority of women willingly engage in sex. They should willingly accept the consequences of that decision.

if it were willingly there would not be any consequences ... acts of nature are not their responsibility to determine one way or another.

 

[80zephyr]

if it were willingly there would not be any consequences ... acts of nature are not their responsibility to determine one way or another.

What?? You walk out of the house you accept the consequences,

 

[BreezeWood]

What?? You walk out of the house you accept the consequences,

if its raining i use an umbrella -

The number of women getting abortions in the U.S. actually went up in the first three months of 2024 compared with before the Supreme Court overturned Roe v Wade, a report released Wednesday found, reflecting the lengths that Democratic-controlled states went to expand access.

try not being a zealot, will do wonders for your personality disorder... misogynist.

 

[kyzr]

God gave everyone free will, right? Isn't that between them and God?

If they oppose church dogma they can be a heretic elsewhere, then its between them and God.

 

[ding]

If you oppose church dogma you can be a heretic elsewhere, then its between them and God.

Interesting response. Let me ask you this... is it virtuous if one is forced to be virtuous?

 

[ding]

If you oppose church dogma

What do you believe that means exactly? Are you suggesting that disagreement is grounds for excommunication? Could I agree that abortion is a moral evil and argue that mercy should be granted to women who have had abortions? Could I argue that those women are in need of forgiveness and healing even more so than others? Could I argue that Christ could forgive them? Could I argue that no one is worthy to enter under his roof but all he has to do is say the word and they would be healed?

Do you think I would be excommunicated for making those arguments? I don't.

 

[ding]

they can be a heretic elsewhere, then its between them and God.

It's always between each individual and God. Always.

 

[80zephyr]

if its raining i use an umbrella -



try not being a zealot, will do wonders for your personality disorder... misogynist.

If protecting human life is bad, I don't want to be good.

 

[BreezeWood]

If protecting human life is bad, I don't want to be good.

in fact your motivation is simply the latter you have accomplished by your own accord. misogynist.

 

[80zephyr]

in fact your motivation is simply the latter you have accomplished by your own accord. misogynist.

Lol. You lack facts. I don't.

 

[kyzr]

Interesting response. Let me ask you this... is it virtuous if one is forced to be virtuous?

"Virtue is it's own reward" (so is vice!)

Not killing a baby isn't virtuous.
Democrats want no restrictions on abortion, even including "partial birth abortions".
Democrat politicians who enable abortions should be Excommunicated from the Catholic Church.
Is abstaining from voting for abortions "virtuous", or should Catholic pols always vote pro-life?

To answer your question, no one is "forced" to do anything, we all have "free will".
The question is, should politicians value being Catholic, or does their job require that they support abortions and agnosticism?

 

[ding]

"Virtue is it's own reward" (so is vice!)

Not killing a baby isn't virtuous.
Democrats want no restrictions on abortion, even including "partial birth abortions".
Democrat politicians who enable abortions should be Excommunicated from the Catholic Church.
Is abstaining from voting for abortions "virtuous", or should Catholic pols always vote pro-life?

To answer your question, no one is "forced" to do anything, we all have "free will".
The question is, should politicians value being Catholic, or does their job require that they support abortions and agnosticism?

If you ban abortions you are most certainly forcing others to be virtuous.

 

[kyzr]

It's always between each individual and God. Always.

True, but the Church needs to enforce God's Laws against baby killers.
If a politician enables the killing of babies, that politician should NOT receive the sacraments.
That the Church does NOT Excommunicate pro-choice politicians shows that the church tacitly approves their behavior.

 

[ding]

True, but the Church needs to enforce God's Laws against baby killers.
If a politician enables the killing of babies, that politician should NOT receive the sacraments.
That the Church does NOT Excommunicate pro-choice politicians shows that the church tacitly approves their behavior.

If God grants man free will who are you to take that away?

Isn't that between God and them?

 

[kyzr]

What do you believe that means exactly? Are you suggesting that disagreement is grounds for excommunication? Could I agree that abortion is a moral evil and argue that mercy should be granted to women who have had abortions? Could I argue that those women are in need of forgiveness and healing even more so than others? Could I argue that Christ could forgive them? Could I argue that no one is worthy to enter under his roof but all he has to do is say the word and they would be healed?
Do you think I would be excommunicated for making those arguments? I don't.

1. We're not talking about a "minor theological disagreement", we're talking about infanticide. IMHO pro-choice politicians should be excommunicated from the Church. Infanticide is a totally unacceptable, period.

2. God will judge women who have had abortions.

3. Those women need to live with their decision. Forgiveness and healing aren't mine to give. If you know abortion is wrong, why are you arguing that it is good political policy? Is getting women's votes the ultimate goal, not human life?

4. Christ could forgive them. That doesn't make abortion any less a taking of a human life.

5. Your argument is that abortions are okay because we all know that Christ is merciful and everything will be forgiven. That is a specious argument. God the Father is the ultimate judge.

6. Making stupid arguments is not against Church teaching so no need to Excommunicate dumbass misguided souls.