Can someone tell me when it was that Gays had different drinking fountains?...

[bodecea]

Strawman. I like how you like to keep telling me why I got married, and you're consistently wrong, and you can't be bothered to ask why I got married. The only reason I am not addressing that is you insist on telling me why you want me to have gotten married instead of wanting to know why I did. I'm not interested in taking out words you put in my mouth.

I'm only paraphrasing what you've said here. Your wife wanted a marriage license and you didn't. You got one because she NEEDED one. What part is wrong?

You can't "paraphrase" something that I never addressed. I said I am married, I never said anything about when I got married. When you say I said things I never addressed, that is just putting words in my mouth. I will tell you, if you ask without putting words in my mouth...

If you are against government being involved in marriage, why did you get government involved in your marriage? Seems a tad hypocritical.

 

[kaz]

I'm only paraphrasing what you've said here. Your wife wanted a marriage license and you didn't. You got one because she NEEDED one. What part is wrong?

You can't "paraphrase" something that I never addressed. I said I am married, I never said anything about when I got married. When you say I said things I never addressed, that is just putting words in my mouth. I will tell you, if you ask without putting words in my mouth...

If you are against government being involved in marriage, why did you get government involved in your marriage? Seems a tad hypocritical.

Ironic you finally asked me instead of putting words in my mouth. Unfortunately, I don't converse with little girls who aren't woman enough to express themselves with words and need to resort to endlessly negative repping me over and over again because even you know you're not capable of making a cogent argument.

 

[Seawytch]

Strawman. I like how you like to keep telling me why I got married, and you're consistently wrong, and you can't be bothered to ask why I got married. The only reason I am not addressing that is you insist on telling me why you want me to have gotten married instead of wanting to know why I did. I'm not interested in taking out words you put in my mouth.

I'm only paraphrasing what you've said here. Your wife wanted a marriage license and you didn't. You got one because she NEEDED one. What part is wrong?

You can't "paraphrase" something that I never addressed. I said I am married, I never said anything about when I got married. When you say I said things I never addressed, that is just putting words in my mouth. I will tell you, if you ask without putting words in my mouth...

Who is talking about when? Are you saying you wanted it and NEEDED it then, now you don't?

 

[Seawytch]

Can't get off this failed argument can you? Being gay does not change who you can marry. Being black did change who you could marry. You haven't come up with a counter example ... because there isn't one ...

I'm not allowed to marry the consenting adult of my choice because of gender...just like they weren't for race. Parallels are clear.



History News Network | Why the Ugly Rhetoric Against Gay Marriage Is Familiar to this Historian of Miscegenation

Neither can polygamists or narcissists or people who's dream don't want to marry them.

Polygamists are not a couple. Narcissists can obviously marry since you ARE married.

 

[bodecea]

You can't "paraphrase" something that I never addressed. I said I am married, I never said anything about when I got married. When you say I said things I never addressed, that is just putting words in my mouth. I will tell you, if you ask without putting words in my mouth...

If you are against government being involved in marriage, why did you get government involved in your marriage? Seems a tad hypocritical.

Ironic you finally asked me instead of putting words in my mouth. Unfortunately, I don't converse with little girls who aren't woman enough to express themselves with words and need to resort to endlessly negative repping me over and over again because even you know you're not capable of making a cogent argument.

If you are against government being involved in marriage, why would you get government involved in your marriage? Seems a tad hypocritical.

 

[Seawytch]

I'm only paraphrasing what you've said here. Your wife wanted a marriage license and you didn't. You got one because she NEEDED one. What part is wrong?

You can't "paraphrase" something that I never addressed. I said I am married, I never said anything about when I got married. When you say I said things I never addressed, that is just putting words in my mouth. I will tell you, if you ask without putting words in my mouth...

If you are against government being involved in marriage, why did you get government involved in your marriage? Seems a tad hypocritical.

He won't give you a straight answer because it's like I said. Someone in the relationship NEEDS the validation legal marriage provides.

 

[bodecea]

I'm not allowed to marry the consenting adult of my choice because of gender...just like they weren't for race. Parallels are clear.



History News Network | Why the Ugly Rhetoric Against Gay Marriage Is Familiar to this Historian of Miscegenation

Neither can polygamists or narcissists or people who's dream don't want to marry them.

Polygamists are not a couple. Narcissists can obviously marry since you ARE married.

Good catch on that one, SW.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

You endlessly make references to what the SCOTUS thinks as if they are some sort of great authority proving you correct.

That’s because the Supreme Court is the final authority as to what the Constitution means, thus proving her correct.

 

[kaz]

I'm only paraphrasing what you've said here. Your wife wanted a marriage license and you didn't. You got one because she NEEDED one. What part is wrong?

You can't "paraphrase" something that I never addressed. I said I am married, I never said anything about when I got married. When you say I said things I never addressed, that is just putting words in my mouth. I will tell you, if you ask without putting words in my mouth...

Who is talking about when? Are you saying you wanted it and NEEDED it then, now you don't?

Finally, a question of what I think, not a statement! Asking me "are you saying" is reasonable, telling me what I am saying is not. Particularly when it's not what I said.

I had my 25th wedding anniversary last November, it was a while ago. I was fairly libertarian then. I was for small government and against morality laws. I had read Atlas Shrugged, but considered myself a conservative, not a libertarian. Over time I realized that government less and less needs to be in our lives in ways in ways we just don't question and started thinking of myself as libertarian, not conservative. A couple examples, I was pro-life, I am now pro-choice. I supported a lot more foreign military intervention than I do now. My opposition to government marriage is more recent, the last 5-10 years or so, I don't remember exactly. My wife is a conservative Christian Korean, I wasn't getting her out of her parents house without a church wedding and a government license. So at the time I didn't oppose government marriage, it wasn't a problem for me.

Now, the government marriage is meaningless to me. I don't have vitriol for it, I just don't think it's necessary. I do nothing different than I would if we did not have a piece of paper from the government. My wife is not libertarian, she is conservative. She understands my view on marriage, she knows how much I hate government, but she rejects the idea of divorcing (legally) and "living together." It's critical to her, the government paper is meaningless to me.

Obviously, only a complete ass would go ahead and divorce her to make the point that even something that's meaningless to me (government marriage) is more important to me to have my way than something that is very important to my partner. If she dies, I won't get another government marriage. I never addressed whether I was for or against government marriage when I got married. Your accusations regarding our marriage were just wrong. She is OK, BTW, with not having a government marriage if I manage to end government marriage. So I have sign-off on my plan. It's just the implementation of that plan that may take a while...

 

[bodecea]

You endlessly make references to what the SCOTUS thinks as if they are some sort of great authority proving you correct.

That’s because the Supreme Court is the final authority as to what the Constitution means, thus proving her correct.

That's what makes Kaz's post so precious.....it's like he never took U.S. Government in school.

 

[kaz]

I'm not allowed to marry the consenting adult of my choice because of gender...just like they weren't for race. Parallels are clear.



History News Network | Why the Ugly Rhetoric Against Gay Marriage Is Familiar to this Historian of Miscegenation

Neither can polygamists or narcissists or people who's dream don't want to marry them.

Polygamists are not a couple. Narcissists can obviously marry since you ARE married.

Kiddie insults... And bam, you just lost the argument. You are saying a marriage is two people, no more, no less. That is as arbitrary as someone else who says it's a man and a woman. LOL. Your statement that it's about who you "want" to marry is belied. A poligamist can't marry who they want, a narcissist can't marry themselves. You have decreed it's two people. It's fine to think that, but you are just saying it's your rule, not their rule. Six of one, half dozen of the other, not a matter for the courts.

 

[kaz]

You endlessly make references to what the SCOTUS thinks as if they are some sort of great authority proving you correct.

That’s because the Supreme Court is the final authority as to what the Constitution means, thus proving her correct.

You're just begging the question.

 

[bodecea]

Neither can polygamists or narcissists or people who's dream don't want to marry them.

Polygamists are not a couple. Narcissists can obviously marry since you ARE married.

Kiddie insults... And bam, you just lost the argument. You are saying a marriage is two people, no more, no less. That is as arbitrary as someone else who says it's a man and a woman. LOL. Your statement that it's about who you "want" to marry is belied. A poligamist can't marry who they want, a narcissist can't marry themselves. You have decreed it's two people. It's fine to think that, but you are just saying it's your rule, not their rule. Six of one, half dozen of the other, not a matter for the courts.

I'd like to see Kaz sign a marriage license with himself.....does the ceremony require a full-length mirror?

 

[kaz]

You can't "paraphrase" something that I never addressed. I said I am married, I never said anything about when I got married. When you say I said things I never addressed, that is just putting words in my mouth. I will tell you, if you ask without putting words in my mouth...

If you are against government being involved in marriage, why did you get government involved in your marriage? Seems a tad hypocritical.

He won't give you a straight answer because it's like I said. Someone in the relationship NEEDS the validation legal marriage provides.

Actually, I just answered the same question which you asked me.

As for this statement, you won't give your partner what she needs and you don't? I consider that pathetic. My values are that if something is more important to my partner than me, I do it her way. According to you, that is not your value. Since we are both following our values, at least neither of us is being a hypocrite about it.

 

[kaz]

Polygamists are not a couple. Narcissists can obviously marry since you ARE married.

Kiddie insults... And bam, you just lost the argument. You are saying a marriage is two people, no more, no less. That is as arbitrary as someone else who says it's a man and a woman. LOL. Your statement that it's about who you "want" to marry is belied. A poligamist can't marry who they want, a narcissist can't marry themselves. You have decreed it's two people. It's fine to think that, but you are just saying it's your rule, not their rule. Six of one, half dozen of the other, not a matter for the courts.

I'd like to see Kaz sign a marriage license with himself.....does the ceremony require a full-length mirror?

yawn, that didn't even work on me when I was young enough to actually go to playgrounds...

 

[bodecea]

Kiddie insults... And bam, you just lost the argument. You are saying a marriage is two people, no more, no less. That is as arbitrary as someone else who says it's a man and a woman. LOL. Your statement that it's about who you "want" to marry is belied. A poligamist can't marry who they want, a narcissist can't marry themselves. You have decreed it's two people. It's fine to think that, but you are just saying it's your rule, not their rule. Six of one, half dozen of the other, not a matter for the courts.

I'd like to see Kaz sign a marriage license with himself.....does the ceremony require a full-length mirror?

yawn, that didn't even work on me when I was young enough to actually go to playgrounds...

Thus your reply, right?

 

[Seawytch]

Now, the government marriage is meaningless to me. I don't have vitriol for it, I just don't think it's necessary. I do nothing different than I would if we did not have a piece of paper from the government. My wife is not libertarian, she is conservative. She understands my view on marriage, she knows how much I hate government, but she rejects the idea of divorcing (legally) and "living together." It's critical to her, the government paper is meaningless to me.

Golly, then she can answer this contemptuous question you asked then can't she?

Why anyone needs government validation to feel "married" is beyond me.

 

[Seawytch]

Neither can polygamists or narcissists or people who's dream don't want to marry them.

Polygamists are not a couple. Narcissists can obviously marry since you ARE married.

Kiddie insults... And bam, you just lost the argument. You are saying a marriage is two people, no more, no less. That is as arbitrary as someone else who says it's a man and a woman. LOL. Your statement that it's about who you "want" to marry is belied. A poligamist can't marry who they want, a narcissist can't marry themselves. You have decreed it's two people. It's fine to think that, but you are just saying it's your rule, not their rule. Six of one, half dozen of the other, not a matter for the courts.

No, those are the parameters of the law. Nothing in the law needs to change for consenting adult same sex couples to marry. The law must change to allow legal polygamy. I don't care if the law changes, but polygamy is not analogous with gay marriage.

 

[bodecea]

Now, the government marriage is meaningless to me. I don't have vitriol for it, I just don't think it's necessary. I do nothing different than I would if we did not have a piece of paper from the government. My wife is not libertarian, she is conservative. She understands my view on marriage, she knows how much I hate government, but she rejects the idea of divorcing (legally) and "living together." It's critical to her, the government paper is meaningless to me.

Golly, then she can answer this contemptuous question you asked then can't she?

Why anyone needs government validation to feel "married" is beyond me.

He SHOULD ask. Or else be honest about how he feels about marriage.

 

[Gadawg73]

Strawman



Strawman. You are 100% backwards. I oppose government marriage because that is what is government favoring one person over another. I say specifically the reverse of this, government should treat ALL it's citizens the same. Eliminate the death tax for everyone, make parenting rights and responsibilities based on parentage and not paper. Make taxes flat. There is nothing government does with marriage that should be denied to anyone. Expanding that inequality doesn't make us more equal.

Well currently government is not treating everyone the same.
That ain't happening now or anytime soon so since government IS NOT getting out of the marriage business you need to address what IS happening now.
And that is gay folks are denied.
Either agin or for, not 'tweeners.
Real easy to dodge the relevant issues of the day with a "well, if frogs flew then they would not have to jump" rhetoric.
Real world is what happens now.

And what exactly am I supposed to take from this point?

That you do not pay attention.
Government now requires all straight folk to get a marriage license.
And they deny most all gay folk.
Sorry that I thought you knew those basic facts in this discussion.
Government now totally regulates marriage.
The fact that you believe government should not be in the marriage business is irrelevant.
They are. Full time.