Build A Wall!!!

That is a wonderful post which represent the outstanding logic of the average pro-Palestinians poster here on USMB.
Creating a border despite the natural one in addition to the peace treaty!
Team Palestine must be very proud of you.

I said wall, not border.

Israel has a wall in the WB and a fence around gaza. It has been surrounded by enemies that have waged several war against it. It has been the victim of terrorism and bombings through most of the last 66 yrs.
A wall? Other countries have walls against their enemies, but when Israel built a wall the world ranted and screamed, but the wall saved lives and brought a certain calm as well as an increase in prosperity for the WB.
 
Israel has a wall in the WB and a fence around gaza. It has been surrounded by enemies that have waged several war against it. It has been the victim of terrorism and bombings through most of the last 66 yrs.
A wall? Other countries have walls against their enemies, but when Israel built a wall the world ranted and screamed, but the wall saved lives and brought a certain calm as well as an increase in prosperity for the WB.
If they have a wall then how are weapons getting to Hamas?
 
I don't know the exact process SYNTH but the weapons are smuggled in through tunnels from Egypt I think . Plus I suppose that some weapons are made by hamas [guess] .
 
Israel has a wall in the WB and a fence around gaza. It has been surrounded by enemies that have waged several war against it. It has been the victim of terrorism and bombings through most of the last 66 yrs.
A wall? Other countries have walls against their enemies, but when Israel built a wall the world ranted and screamed, but the wall saved lives and brought a certain calm as well as an increase in prosperity for the WB.
If they have a wall then how are weapons getting to Hamas?
Smuggling tunnels from Gaza to Egypt.
 
I think that Israel is an independent country SYNTH and Israel can do as it likes . I think that Israel has a wall anyway , I've seen pictures . uN , to heck with any uN involvement in America or Israel .
But their country was carved out of someone else's country.

There will never be peace if Israel is controlling Arab lives on formerly Arab land.




Was it care to provide some evidence of this fact that you seem so sure of. First a word of advise find out who was the legal owner of the land when Israel was granted independence by the UN.
 
I think that Israel is an independent country SYNTH and Israel can do as it likes . I think that Israel has a wall anyway , I've seen pictures . uN , to heck with any uN involvement in America or Israel .
But their country was carved out of someone else's country.

There will never be peace if Israel is controlling Arab lives on formerly Arab land.

You mean on former Ottoman Empire land. Hint: The Ottoman Empire is dead. You may as well be complaining about Israel occupying former Roman territory.



When the Ottoman empire died the land was transferred to the League of Nations who then became the legal owners. They decided to apportion the land into separate nations and created Syria, Iraq, Iran, Jordan and Israel. Palestine was an afterthought and came into existence in 1988, but is still not recognised as a fully fledged nation. The arab muslims had not owned the land since 1099
 
I think that Israel is an independent country SYNTH and Israel can do as it likes . I think that Israel has a wall anyway , I've seen pictures . uN , to heck with any uN involvement in America or Israel .
But their country was carved out of someone else's country.

There will never be peace if Israel is controlling Arab lives on formerly Arab land.




Was it care to provide some evidence of this fact that you seem so sure of. First a word of advise find out who was the legal owner of the land when Israel was granted independence by the UN.
palestine_1250_1125_bc.jpg


Here's one from 1853!
4i6Ckte.gif


1853_Mitchell_Map_of_Palestine,_Israel_and_the_Holy_Land_-_Geographicus_-_Palestine-mitchell-1850.jpg
 
thanks , good info on dates and ownership of these lost Ottoman lands Phoenall !!
 
I think that Israel is an independent country SYNTH and Israel can do as it likes . I think that Israel has a wall anyway , I've seen pictures . uN , to heck with any uN involvement in America or Israel .
But their country was carved out of someone else's country.

There will never be peace if Israel is controlling Arab lives on formerly Arab land.

You mean on former Ottoman Empire land. Hint: The Ottoman Empire is dead. You may as well be complaining about Israel occupying former Roman territory.



When the Ottoman empire died the land was transferred to the League of Nations who then became the legal owners. They decided to apportion the land into separate nations and created Syria, Iraq, Iran, Jordan and Israel. Palestine was an afterthought and came into existence in 1988, but is still not recognised as a fully fledged nation. The arab muslims had not owned the land since 1099

In what courtroom was that done?
4i6Ckte.gif
 
Synth, there was a region called Palestine, but never a country called Palestine.
 
I think that Israel is an independent country SYNTH and Israel can do as it likes . I think that Israel has a wall anyway , I've seen pictures . uN , to heck with any uN involvement in America or Israel .
But their country was carved out of someone else's country.

There will never be peace if Israel is controlling Arab lives on formerly Arab land.

You mean on former Ottoman Empire land. Hint: The Ottoman Empire is dead. You may as well be complaining about Israel occupying former Roman territory.



When the Ottoman empire died the land was transferred to the League of Nations who then became the legal owners. They decided to apportion the land into separate nations and created Syria, Iraq, Iran, Jordan and Israel. Palestine was an afterthought and came into existence in 1988, but is still not recognised as a fully fledged nation. The arab muslims had not owned the land since 1099

In what courtroom was that done?
4i6Ckte.gif
The one decided to transfer it to the Ottoman empire - history.
 
I think that Israel is an independent country SYNTH and Israel can do as it likes . I think that Israel has a wall anyway , I've seen pictures . uN , to heck with any uN involvement in America or Israel .
But their country was carved out of someone else's country.

There will never be peace if Israel is controlling Arab lives on formerly Arab land.




Was it care to provide some evidence of this fact that you seem so sure of. First a word of advise find out who was the legal owner of the land when Israel was granted independence by the UN.
palestine_1250_1125_bc.jpg


Here's one from 1853!
4i6Ckte.gif


1853_Mitchell_Map_of_Palestine,_Israel_and_the_Holy_Land_-_Geographicus_-_Palestine-mitchell-1850.jpg




All well and good but were is it stated who owned the land prior to the LoN who took it as war reparations in 1919. Now who's country was it when Israel came into existence in may 1948 ?
 
thanks , good info on dates and ownership of these lost Ottoman lands Phoenall !!



No problem it is a pleasure to enlighten team Palestine as to the real facts of who owned Palestine after the arab muslim lost it in 1099
 
I think that Israel is an independent country SYNTH and Israel can do as it likes . I think that Israel has a wall anyway , I've seen pictures . uN , to heck with any uN involvement in America or Israel .
But their country was carved out of someone else's country.

There will never be peace if Israel is controlling Arab lives on formerly Arab land.

You mean on former Ottoman Empire land. Hint: The Ottoman Empire is dead. You may as well be complaining about Israel occupying former Roman territory.



When the Ottoman empire died the land was transferred to the League of Nations who then became the legal owners. They decided to apportion the land into separate nations and created Syria, Iraq, Iran, Jordan and Israel. Palestine was an afterthought and came into existence in 1988, but is still not recognised as a fully fledged nation. The arab muslims had not owned the land since 1099

In what courtroom was that done?
4i6Ckte.gif




In Versailles when the allies laid out the terms of surrender to the Germans and its allies. It is known as the treaty of Versailles and here is a link to explain it

Treaty of Versailles - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
 
I think that Israel is an independent country SYNTH and Israel can do as it likes . I think that Israel has a wall anyway , I've seen pictures . uN , to heck with any uN involvement in America or Israel .
But their country was carved out of someone else's country.

There will never be peace if Israel is controlling Arab lives on formerly Arab land.

You mean on former Ottoman Empire land. Hint: The Ottoman Empire is dead. You may as well be complaining about Israel occupying former Roman territory.



When the Ottoman empire died the land was transferred to the League of Nations who then became the legal owners. They decided to apportion the land into separate nations and created Syria, Iraq, Iran, Jordan and Israel. Palestine was an afterthought and came into existence in 1988, but is still not recognised as a fully fledged nation. The arab muslims had not owned the land since 1099

In what courtroom was that done?
4i6Ckte.gif
The one decided to transfer it to the Ottoman empire - history.




In the palace of Versailles
 
Synthaholic, et al,

In a different kind of world, with a different kind of people, this might actually be workable. But we are talking about the Middle East, with the changes it has over time.

The Right-Wing extremists in the U.S. all want a wall with Mexico, but I never hear them scream for a wall around Israel. Why not? It's much smaller and easily doable.

Basically along the red line. Have it patrolled by a special United Nations force which would be paid for by the rich Arab states and Israel.
(COMMENT)

No self-respecting country and no self-respecting people, give-up the right to protect themselves; entrusting their safety and security into the hands of another; those that have no vested interest to risk their lives for the lives of others.

The continuing sage of the Arab-Israeli Conflict started when the turn-of-the-century Allied Powers saw the need to establish a Jewish National Home for their preservation, security and protection --- back then and into the future. The whole idea, from the western standpoint, was in recognition that the Jewish people were an oppressed people and very worthy of culture that needed special attention and a place of their own. While they never envisioned the Holocaust of the 1930's and 1940's, they were well aware of the abuse, victimization and oppression the Jewish Culture had suffered over the centuries; and were attempting to right the wrongs of the past.

When it became obvious to the Allied Powers that certain enemy territory was to become politically pliable, the flexible leaders of that day realized that the administration of certain territories, within such boundaries as may be determined by themselves, was to come into their charge. This territory, they recognized, had a historical connection to the Jewish people appeared suitable for reconstitution of the Jewish National Home, their place of retreat --- safety --- and comfort. Little did they realize, nearly a century ago, the were setting the conditions for a new 100 Years War. Today, as we approach the anniversary of those momentous decisions of the Balfour Declaration, The Faisal-Weizmann Agreement and the San Remo Convention, Israel (the reconstituted Jewish National Home) is still under duress by destructive forces, and the people and culture that were meant to be secured, preserved and protected, still face Jihad and Armed Struggle from those counterproductive elements that withhold recognition of "Israel" and the legitimacy of its presence on any part of Palestine, from the river to the sea; utterly failing to work out the "consummation of their national aspirations" (Arab or Jewish).

It is unlikely that given the criminal behaviors of the Arabs over the last century, and the history of oppression experienced by the Jewish People, are either going to disarm. Certainly the Jewish People are never going to allow the political pressures of the European Powers to place them in a position that would ever allow a brutal and violent culture of people like the Arabs to replicate the oppression of the Central European Powers of the 1930's and 1940's.

Just my opinion.

Most Respectfully,
R
 
15th post
Synthaholic, Phoenall, et al,

Exercising the right of self-determination, in the creation of a political state does not require court action, treaty or property transfer actions.

In what courtroom was that done?
4i6Ckte.gif
In Versailles when the allies laid out the terms of surrender to the Germans and its allies. It is known as the treaty of Versailles and here is a link to explain it

Treaty of Versailles - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
That was WWI, dude. Has nothing to do with Israel being created in 1948.
(COMMENT)

None of the contemporary Middle East States had any of that. While the treaties did set new governments, relinquished sovereignty, and established trusteeships, in the end, it is the power and organization of people that establish (or not) a state. Organizations like the League of Nations, the UN, and the governments like the Mandatory Powers, can help establish a viable state, it is not always required. In the case of Israel, while there was help in the background through the UN and other governments, in the end, under the concept of the right to self-determination, the Jewish Agency declared independence. Similarly, so did Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Iraq and Kuwait. In none of those cases was there a particular transfer from the trusteeship. Each was handled in it own way: Lebanon and Syria from French Mandates --- Jordan, Iraq and Kuwait British oversight. Saudi Arabian under the Saudi Royal Family merging and uniting the tribes. The question of how and under what authority Israel came into being is neither here - not there. It is under the vestiges and power of the right of self-determination. It now defends itself against foreign powers attempting to undermine it sovereignty.

Most Respectfully,
R
 
the maps depicts the lands belonging to the herbrews, land not just to the jordan river but on the east side as well.
the term palestine was given by the romans after the jewish revolts.
 
The Right-Wing extremists in the U.S. all want a wall with Mexico, but I never hear them scream for a wall around Israel. Why not? It's much smaller and easily doable.

View attachment 31350


Basically along the red line. Have it patrolled by a special United Nations force which would be paid for by the rich Arab states and Israel.

Then, disarm everything within the walls. The UN decides what enters the walled area.

Libs don't like walls. They like oppression. Note history.
 
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