Zone1 Broad-brush reparations to all blacks is unconstituional

[Moonglow]

I have a case. When I was just a couple of years out of college, the manager’s job of the department in which I was working opened up, and I and a black girl applied. I had been working there longer, and my academic record (important when you’re just two years out of college) was far superior.

The director selected the black girl and admitted to me that I would have been her first choice but that she was under pressure to give the job to a black (and warned me she would deny the conversation). If I were to extrapolate the 15% raise it would have entailed, and apply that starting point to the rest of my career, my earnings would have been about $200,000 or $300,000 more.

But I did pretty well for myself regardless and enjoy an upper-middle class lifestyle.

I can tell you a story about a man named Jed....

 

[Lisa558]

I don't believe you.

Naturally. When there’s no defense for something, you deny it.

 

[bodecea]

I have a case. When I was just a couple of years out of college, the manager’s job of the department in which I was working opened up, and I and a black girl applied. I had been working there longer, and my academic record (important when you’re just two years out of college) was far superior.

The director selected the black girl and admitted to me that I would have been her first choice but that she was under pressure to give the job to a black (and warned me she would deny the conversation). If I were to extrapolate the 15% raise it would have entailed, and apply that starting point to the rest of my career, my earnings would have been about $200,000 or $300,000 more.

But I did pretty well for myself regardless and enjoy an upper-middle class lifestyle.

He picked an underaged girl?

 

[bodecea]

I don't believe you.

AA is a handy dandy excuse to explain why someone didn't get a job or advancement.

 

[Ms. Turquoise]

I have a case. When I was just a couple of years out of college, the manager’s job of the department in which I was working opened up, and I and a black girl applied. I had been working there longer, and my academic record (important when you’re just two years out of college) was far superior.

The director selected the black girl and admitted to me that I would have been her first choice but that she was under pressure to give the job to a black (and warned me she would deny the conversation). If I were to extrapolate the 15% raise it would have entailed, and apply that starting point to the rest of my career, my earnings would have been about $200,000 or $300,000 more.

But I did pretty well for myself regardless and enjoy an upper-middle class lifestyle.

Maybe they choose the girl who was the most beautiful. Sorry Lisa.

 

[Lisa558]

Maybe they choose the girl who was the most beautiful. Sorry Lisa.

1) That would have been me.

2) The director told me she HAD to pick the black girl. That’s affirmative action for ya.

 

[Ms. Turquoise]

1) That would have been me.

2) The director told me she HAD to pick the black girl. That’s affirmative action for ya.

If it's any consolation to you, just remember that for about three centuries White folks were chosen over Blacks for any job.

 

[Lisa558]

If it's any consolation to you, just remember that for about three centuries White folks were chosen over Blacks for any job.

What would that be consolation? The whites today and blacks today had nothing to do with it, and for my entire adult lifetime, blacks have been getting the advantage.

 

[Coyote]

The question has been raised as to why reparations to all blacks is unconstitutional, and the answer of course is that the government cannot give money to an entire race of people based solely on their skin color. Cases must be decided on an individual basis.

The following are two examoles: one of a black who deserves reparations, and another of those who don’t:

Deserves reparations:
Black 70-year-old who lived in Alabama: this particular black was deprived of equal rights for not being allowed to drink at certain water fountains, swim in certain public pools, or attend certain public schools.

Not qualified for reparations:
The children of the blacks in the below 1941 photo of CCNY college students, all of whom received a free college education. As a result, the children were raised by college-educated parents and probably went to college (and even grad school) themselves. These children would now be in their 70s, and THEIR own kids in their 40s.

IOW, the case for reparations has to be on an individual basis, not skin color.

The Frederick Douglass Society, CCNY 1941 · CUNY Digital History Archive

The CUNY Digital History Archive is a participatory project that centers the experiences of students, workers, faculty, community residents, retirees, and alumni of the City University of New York.

cdha.cuny.edu

If reparations are to be made they need to be for everyone harmed by a particular law or policy, not based on whether or not individuals within that group managed to be successful DESPITE those laws.

 

[Coyote]

This is true, but the point of the thread is to show why repararions based on race is unconstituional. It can be granted on an individual basis if damages are proven.

But that wasn’t the with reparations paid to the Japanese Americans, we interred. Why should we treat those who affected by JimCrowe differently?

 

[Lisa558]

If reparations are to be made they need to be for everyone harmed by a particular law or policy, not based on whether or not individuals within that group managed to be successful DESPITE those laws.

Unless those individuals has already taken advantage of other policies or practices intended to compensate for past racism.

 

[Lisa558]

But that wasn’t the with reparations paid to the Japanese Americans, we interred. Why should we treat those who affected by JimCrowe differently?

Because we KNOW they were interred. We do not know who was affected by Jim Crowe, and thus if they were they would have to explain it via an application.

 

[Coyote]

Unless those individuals has already taken advantage of other policies or practices intended to compensate for past racism.

That turns it into a subjective calculus at best. AA for example was set up to help multiple disadvantaged groups but it is difficult if not impossible to quantify what effect it had. You made a statement in one post that that attempts to do so by saying those who are college educated/children of college educated Blacks should not receive anything because they most likely benefited from AA. That’s pretty insulting since it presumes they all did not make it through their own hard work and merit. Reparations to Japanese Americans were not withheld if a person managed to become successful despite being interred.

 

[Coyote]

Because we KNOW they were interred. We do not know who was affected by Jim Crowe, and thus if they were they would have to explain it via an application.

We know who was effected by Jim Crowe. Every Black person in America that was alive during Jim Crowe.

 

[Coyote]

Unless those individuals has already taken advantage of other policies or practices intended to compensate for past racism.

How can you measure that?

 

[Lisa558]

That turns it into a subjective calculus at best. AA for example was set up to help multiple disadvantaged groups but it is difficult if not impossible to quantify what effect it had. You made a statement in one post that that attempts to do so by saying those who are college educated/children of college educated Blacks should not receive anything because they most likely benefited from AA. That’s pretty insulting since it presumes they all did not make it through their own hard work and merit. Reparations to Japanese Americans were not withheld if a person managed to become successful despite being interred.

It presumes, correctly, that they probably took advantage of Affirmative Action. They would have to show that they did NOT, and have not received any form of reparations, which is what AA is.

 

[Lisa558]

How can you measure that?

That’s what makes it so difficult. But it is not fair for a medical doctor, who got into his med school because he was black - and would have been rejected had he been white - and thus went on to a lucrative career to then on top of that get reparations. The odds are in any med school, 2/3rds of blacks who were admitted would have been rejected had they been white.

You honestly think that the white student with better grades and scores who had to give up on his dream of getting an M.D. should have to give money to the high-earning black doctor who got in because he was black?

You are very concerned with what is fair to blacks, but what about what is fair to whites?

 

[Coyote]

It presumes, correctly, that they probably took advantage of Affirmative Action. They would have to show that they did NOT, and have not received any form of reparations, which is what AA is.

It presumes something that can’t be backed by empirical data. What’s more, how would you prove a negative?

 

[Lisa558]

We know who was affected by Jim Crowe. Every Black person in America that was alive during Jim Crowe.

Not the black students who got free college educations in the 1940s along with my dad.

 

[Lisa558]

It presumes something that can’t be backed by empirical data. What’s more, how would you prove a negative?

They don’t have to prove a negative. They have to prove that they were robbed of an opportunity due to their being black.