August 6

[eagle1462010]

Did you read the article about Thailand...........and how Japan had given orders to execute all POW's there..........which were saved when Japan Surrendered.......................

Guess you skipped over that.

 

[Unkotare]

“Doesn’t matter”? Loss of civilian life on that scale doesn’t matter? Our military leaders - men far your superior - would not be so cavalier.

Again dumb ass the japanese Government had NO INTENTION of surrendering. ...

That is your speculation at most. Read the links.

It is NOT speculation .....

It most certainly is. Read the links.

.....The Government had no intention of surrendering.

Speculation. Read the links.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Again dumb ass the japanese Government had NO INTENTION of surrendering. ...

That is your speculation at most. Read the links.

It is NOT speculation .....

It most certainly is. Read the links.

.....The Government had no intention of surrendering.

Speculation. Read the links.

You read the SOURCE document DUMB ASS it is coming directly FROM the Japanese high command. The Army REFUSED to surrender and staged a Coup when the Emperor ordered a surrender, NO SPECULATION INVOLVED just cold hard FACTS. The Army CONTROLLED the Japanese Government and absolutely REFUSED to surrender. No speculation no guess work just hard cold facts. You fucking RETARD.

 

[Unkotare]

Did you read the article about Thailand...........and how Japan had given orders to execute all POW's there..........which were saved when Japan Surrendered.......................

Guess you skipped over that.

If military leadership felt that were imminent, it would certainly be a strong consideration in making the decision. However, one wonders why this command was not activated by the invasion of Okinawa. Furthermore, why wouldn’t the annihilation of over 100,000 civilians trigger such a final act of nihilistic rage? Seems like something that would be part of negotiating terms of surrender.

The likelihood that there were different factions at odds within the collapsing government must have been considered by our military and political leadership.

With feelers out about negotiating terms of surrender, it would have to be evident that any such slaughter would obviate the possibility of a negotiated peace.

As I’ve said all along, it is a complex and problematic issue.

 

[Unkotare]

That is your speculation at most. Read the links.

It is NOT speculation .....

It most certainly is. Read the links.

.....The Government had no intention of surrendering.

Speculation. Read the links.

....NO SPECULATION INVOLVED just cold hard FACTS. ....

The FACT is that surrender was being considered and terms offered for negotiation. You just can’t control your emotions.

 

[Unkotare]

Japan was prostrate. It only required sitting on the ships surrounding it waiting for the white flags to go up. They had no more war making capacity. Yes, it is possible more Japanese would have died of starvation than died in the bombs, but the onus would be on Japanese leaders, not America's.
It is bad enough just living with the act. Cheering about it is quite sick.

Not if you lost two uncles at Pearl Harbor. Screw the Japs.

Father N Law was at Pearl when they attacked.................he never once talked about what he saw there...........Refused...........

As a Radioman in WWII...............he saw too many die and would not talk about it.....................My dad did ........was on a tender..............Kamikazee hit the ship..............useless but did it anyway................The Tires from the plane were Goodyear tires.........................

The Japanese can burn in hell. Should've dropped FOUR fucking bombs. Then shot all their leaders, killed all the men and sold all the women into the sex trade to pay back those lost American lives.

If you think I'm harsh, just consider what the Japs WOULD HAVE DONE had they won the war against us?

If you’re going to be an emo-queen, don’t pretend you’re interested in discussing history.

 

[Unkotare]

Japan’s Biological and Chemical Warfare in China during WWII

Unprecedented Scale of Biological/Chemical Warfare

The biological weapon attack in Zhejiang province is just one of many thousands of biological and chemical warfare attacks by the Japanese army in many parts of China during the Sino-Japanese War of 1931-1945. These included places in the provinces of Hunan, Jiangsu, Jilin, Kwangtung, Yunnan, and Heilongjiang.

As to chemical warfare, such as using poisonous gases, it has been estimated that during the 14 years of the Sino-Japanese War, Japan used poisonous gases more than 2,000 times in 77 counties of 14 provinces in direct violation of the 1925 Geneva Protocol on prohibition on the use of chemical weapons, which Japan had also signed. These attacks killed tens of thousands of Chinese, including many civilians.

Furthermore, when WWII came to a close, Japan abandoned a myriad of chemical weapons in China (as many as hundreds of thousands of poison gas weapons) by burying them underground or dumping them in rivers. Many have started to leak and led to civilian deaths and injuries. The United Nations’ Chemical Weapons Convention, which came into force in 1997, requires Japan to retrieve and dispose of these weapons. Major efforts for the toxic cleanup have been negotiated by the Chinese and Japanese governments. The Japanese consulting company Pacific Consultants International (PCI) won the exclusive contract from the Japanese government to retrieve these weapons, but unfortunately this company apparently resorted to fraudulent means to milk the contract. The former president and four others of PCI were arrested in May 2008 on suspicion of fraud. According to the contract, all the remaining poisonous shells and canisters were supposed to have been recovered and disposed of by spring 2007. After spending nearly 50 billion yen (or about U.S. $500 million), only 40,000 shells had been retrieved, and the completion deadline has been extended to 2012 (from the May 16, 2008 article “Chemical Weapons” in The Asahi Shimbun). Therefore, this continues to pose a major, serious health hazard for the Chinese population

So the atomic bomb‘s were dropped in an act of revenge on behalf of China? Really? Is that really what motivated our military decisions?

....these posts were to remind you what they did during this War................

.

It is all but certain that I have studied this history far more frequently and in greater depth than you, so you need not concern yourself with reminders.

 

[eagle1462010]

Japan’s Biological and Chemical Warfare in China during WWII

Unprecedented Scale of Biological/Chemical Warfare

The biological weapon attack in Zhejiang province is just one of many thousands of biological and chemical warfare attacks by the Japanese army in many parts of China during the Sino-Japanese War of 1931-1945. These included places in the provinces of Hunan, Jiangsu, Jilin, Kwangtung, Yunnan, and Heilongjiang.

As to chemical warfare, such as using poisonous gases, it has been estimated that during the 14 years of the Sino-Japanese War, Japan used poisonous gases more than 2,000 times in 77 counties of 14 provinces in direct violation of the 1925 Geneva Protocol on prohibition on the use of chemical weapons, which Japan had also signed. These attacks killed tens of thousands of Chinese, including many civilians.

Furthermore, when WWII came to a close, Japan abandoned a myriad of chemical weapons in China (as many as hundreds of thousands of poison gas weapons) by burying them underground or dumping them in rivers. Many have started to leak and led to civilian deaths and injuries. The United Nations’ Chemical Weapons Convention, which came into force in 1997, requires Japan to retrieve and dispose of these weapons. Major efforts for the toxic cleanup have been negotiated by the Chinese and Japanese governments. The Japanese consulting company Pacific Consultants International (PCI) won the exclusive contract from the Japanese government to retrieve these weapons, but unfortunately this company apparently resorted to fraudulent means to milk the contract. The former president and four others of PCI were arrested in May 2008 on suspicion of fraud. According to the contract, all the remaining poisonous shells and canisters were supposed to have been recovered and disposed of by spring 2007. After spending nearly 50 billion yen (or about U.S. $500 million), only 40,000 shells had been retrieved, and the completion deadline has been extended to 2012 (from the May 16, 2008 article “Chemical Weapons” in The Asahi Shimbun). Therefore, this continues to pose a major, serious health hazard for the Chinese population

So the atomic bomb‘s were dropped in an act of revenge on behalf of China? Really? Is that really what motivated our military decisions?

....these posts were to remind you what they did during this War................

.

It is all but certain that I have studied this history far more frequently and in greater depth than you, so you need not concern yourself with reminders.

That is very arrogant of you and disregards posts that don't favor your opinion................I again state that my father and uncles would disagree with you............They were there...........they fought that war..........you didn't...........and I didn't....

 

[Unkotare]

Japan’s Biological and Chemical Warfare in China during WWII

Unprecedented Scale of Biological/Chemical Warfare

The biological weapon attack in Zhejiang province is just one of many thousands of biological and chemical warfare attacks by the Japanese army in many parts of China during the Sino-Japanese War of 1931-1945. These included places in the provinces of Hunan, Jiangsu, Jilin, Kwangtung, Yunnan, and Heilongjiang.

As to chemical warfare, such as using poisonous gases, it has been estimated that during the 14 years of the Sino-Japanese War, Japan used poisonous gases more than 2,000 times in 77 counties of 14 provinces in direct violation of the 1925 Geneva Protocol on prohibition on the use of chemical weapons, which Japan had also signed. These attacks killed tens of thousands of Chinese, including many civilians.

Furthermore, when WWII came to a close, Japan abandoned a myriad of chemical weapons in China (as many as hundreds of thousands of poison gas weapons) by burying them underground or dumping them in rivers. Many have started to leak and led to civilian deaths and injuries. The United Nations’ Chemical Weapons Convention, which came into force in 1997, requires Japan to retrieve and dispose of these weapons. Major efforts for the toxic cleanup have been negotiated by the Chinese and Japanese governments. The Japanese consulting company Pacific Consultants International (PCI) won the exclusive contract from the Japanese government to retrieve these weapons, but unfortunately this company apparently resorted to fraudulent means to milk the contract. The former president and four others of PCI were arrested in May 2008 on suspicion of fraud. According to the contract, all the remaining poisonous shells and canisters were supposed to have been recovered and disposed of by spring 2007. After spending nearly 50 billion yen (or about U.S. $500 million), only 40,000 shells had been retrieved, and the completion deadline has been extended to 2012 (from the May 16, 2008 article “Chemical Weapons” in The Asahi Shimbun). Therefore, this continues to pose a major, serious health hazard for the Chinese population

So the atomic bomb‘s were dropped in an act of revenge on behalf of China? Really? Is that really what motivated our military decisions?

....these posts were to remind you what they did during this War................

.

It is all but certain that I have studied this history far more frequently and in greater depth than you, so you need not concern yourself with reminders.

That is very arrogant of you and disregards posts that don't favor your opinion................I again state that my father and uncles would disagree with you............They were there...........they fought that war..........you didn't...........and I didn't....

I have provided direct quotes from military LEADERS of the time.

 

[EGR one]

Democrats dumped a reasonable smart Vice President Henry Wallace and replaced him with a dumb little bean counter Missouri senator Harry Truman when they knew that FDR was dying and would not live out his 4th term. Truman became president within three months of becoming vice president just like the democrat radicals planned. Japan was defeated and dying with no air cover to resist constant daylight raids and no effective navy. There were Bushido army holdouts but they could have been starved into submission or ordered to surrender without the use of the horrible weapon. Truman was a stooge without a clue and refused to negotiate with the defeated Japanese except for unconditional surrender (one of the major conditions was not to execute the emperor and it was confirmed after we reduced men, women and children to hot ash). Meanwhile the Japanese holdouts were trying to negotiate terms with Stalin. Truman signed the order to drop the Bomb and the egg heads who developed the abomination got their wish to use it on (sub) humans.

Two much misinformation joined with nonsense. Truman and the US military knew that invading Japan would involve millions of deaths on both sides. The two A-bombs stopped that slaughter. Second, the fire bombing of Japanese cities slaughtered far more innocent civilians in a much more horrible way.

 

[eagle1462010]

Japan’s Biological and Chemical Warfare in China during WWII

Unprecedented Scale of Biological/Chemical Warfare

The biological weapon attack in Zhejiang province is just one of many thousands of biological and chemical warfare attacks by the Japanese army in many parts of China during the Sino-Japanese War of 1931-1945. These included places in the provinces of Hunan, Jiangsu, Jilin, Kwangtung, Yunnan, and Heilongjiang.

As to chemical warfare, such as using poisonous gases, it has been estimated that during the 14 years of the Sino-Japanese War, Japan used poisonous gases more than 2,000 times in 77 counties of 14 provinces in direct violation of the 1925 Geneva Protocol on prohibition on the use of chemical weapons, which Japan had also signed. These attacks killed tens of thousands of Chinese, including many civilians.

Furthermore, when WWII came to a close, Japan abandoned a myriad of chemical weapons in China (as many as hundreds of thousands of poison gas weapons) by burying them underground or dumping them in rivers. Many have started to leak and led to civilian deaths and injuries. The United Nations’ Chemical Weapons Convention, which came into force in 1997, requires Japan to retrieve and dispose of these weapons. Major efforts for the toxic cleanup have been negotiated by the Chinese and Japanese governments. The Japanese consulting company Pacific Consultants International (PCI) won the exclusive contract from the Japanese government to retrieve these weapons, but unfortunately this company apparently resorted to fraudulent means to milk the contract. The former president and four others of PCI were arrested in May 2008 on suspicion of fraud. According to the contract, all the remaining poisonous shells and canisters were supposed to have been recovered and disposed of by spring 2007. After spending nearly 50 billion yen (or about U.S. $500 million), only 40,000 shells had been retrieved, and the completion deadline has been extended to 2012 (from the May 16, 2008 article “Chemical Weapons” in The Asahi Shimbun). Therefore, this continues to pose a major, serious health hazard for the Chinese population

So the atomic bomb‘s were dropped in an act of revenge on behalf of China? Really? Is that really what motivated our military decisions?

....these posts were to remind you what they did during this War................

.

It is all but certain that I have studied this history far more frequently and in greater depth than you, so you need not concern yourself with reminders.

That is very arrogant of you and disregards posts that don't favor your opinion................I again state that my father and uncles would disagree with you............They were there...........they fought that war..........you didn't...........and I didn't....

I have provided direct quotes from military LEADERS of the time.

So.......and in the declassified documents the Japanese Army wanted to fight to the death...........

They were offered surrender and refused..............and they paid a price for it................

Countries were in no mood back then for playing any games.........they weren't kidding when they said to ash.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

It is NOT speculation .....

It most certainly is. Read the links.

.....The Government had no intention of surrendering.

Speculation. Read the links.

....NO SPECULATION INVOLVED just cold hard FACTS. ....

The FACT is that surrender was being considered and terms offered for negotiation. You just can’t control your emotions.

And yet even after 2 atomic bombs the Government of Japan REFUSED to surrender. And when the Emperor ordered the surrender the Government staged a Coup to stop the surrender. Yup sure sounds like they were just a couple days from surrender if ONLY we had waited.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Japan’s Biological and Chemical Warfare in China during WWII

Unprecedented Scale of Biological/Chemical Warfare

The biological weapon attack in Zhejiang province is just one of many thousands of biological and chemical warfare attacks by the Japanese army in many parts of China during the Sino-Japanese War of 1931-1945. These included places in the provinces of Hunan, Jiangsu, Jilin, Kwangtung, Yunnan, and Heilongjiang.

As to chemical warfare, such as using poisonous gases, it has been estimated that during the 14 years of the Sino-Japanese War, Japan used poisonous gases more than 2,000 times in 77 counties of 14 provinces in direct violation of the 1925 Geneva Protocol on prohibition on the use of chemical weapons, which Japan had also signed. These attacks killed tens of thousands of Chinese, including many civilians.

Furthermore, when WWII came to a close, Japan abandoned a myriad of chemical weapons in China (as many as hundreds of thousands of poison gas weapons) by burying them underground or dumping them in rivers. Many have started to leak and led to civilian deaths and injuries. The United Nations’ Chemical Weapons Convention, which came into force in 1997, requires Japan to retrieve and dispose of these weapons. Major efforts for the toxic cleanup have been negotiated by the Chinese and Japanese governments. The Japanese consulting company Pacific Consultants International (PCI) won the exclusive contract from the Japanese government to retrieve these weapons, but unfortunately this company apparently resorted to fraudulent means to milk the contract. The former president and four others of PCI were arrested in May 2008 on suspicion of fraud. According to the contract, all the remaining poisonous shells and canisters were supposed to have been recovered and disposed of by spring 2007. After spending nearly 50 billion yen (or about U.S. $500 million), only 40,000 shells had been retrieved, and the completion deadline has been extended to 2012 (from the May 16, 2008 article “Chemical Weapons” in The Asahi Shimbun). Therefore, this continues to pose a major, serious health hazard for the Chinese population

So the atomic bomb‘s were dropped in an act of revenge on behalf of China? Really? Is that really what motivated our military decisions?

....these posts were to remind you what they did during this War................

.

It is all but certain that I have studied this history far more frequently and in greater depth than you, so you need not concern yourself with reminders.

That is very arrogant of you and disregards posts that don't favor your opinion................I again state that my father and uncles would disagree with you............They were there...........they fought that war..........you didn't...........and I didn't....

I have provided direct quotes from military LEADERS of the time.

NONE of your leaders were INVOLVED in the fight with Japan. NONE of them. I Have Japanese documents from the Government that prove the Government refused to surrender even after 2 atomic bombs and they staged a coup when the emperor ordered a surrender.

 

[Unkotare]

So the atomic bomb‘s were dropped in an act of revenge on behalf of China? Really? Is that really what motivated our military decisions?

....these posts were to remind you what they did during this War................

.

It is all but certain that I have studied this history far more frequently and in greater depth than you, so you need not concern yourself with reminders.

That is very arrogant of you and disregards posts that don't favor your opinion................I again state that my father and uncles would disagree with you............They were there...........they fought that war..........you didn't...........and I didn't....

I have provided direct quotes from military LEADERS of the time.

NONE of your leaders were INVOLVED in the fight with Japan. ...

My leaders? You’re not American?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

....these posts were to remind you what they did during this War................

.

It is all but certain that I have studied this history far more frequently and in greater depth than you, so you need not concern yourself with reminders.

That is very arrogant of you and disregards posts that don't favor your opinion................I again state that my father and uncles would disagree with you............They were there...........they fought that war..........you didn't...........and I didn't....

I have provided direct quotes from military LEADERS of the time.

NONE of your leaders were INVOLVED in the fight with Japan. ...

My leaders? You’re not American?

Your leaders as in the ones you are citing dumb ass. NONE of them were ever in the Pacific theater and havdn't a clue about the Japanese and their behavior. Again JAPANESE GOVERNMENT DOCUMENTS show that the Government was not going to surrender even after two atomic Bombs they refused and the Emperor intervened and ordered a surrender, where upon the Army staged a Coup that failed in an attempt to stop the surrender.

 

[JoeB131]

There were choices. America made the worst one.

I would agree, but the thing is, we see the atom bomb as this existential threat, but to those folks, it was probably just another weapon in a war that had already killed 70 million.

Hindsight is always 20/20.

 

[peach174]

1945


73 years have passed since the first use of an atomic weapon in war. Most of the 150,000 victims were civilians. Women, children, the elderly. The effects of this new weapon on real people shocked the conscience of the world, and its use at that time is still debated to this day.

Regardless of one's position on Truman's decision, it is fitting to take a moment to remember so many lives taken and the horror of war in general. There is a reason the monument to the event in the city is called the Peace Park.

Perhaps one moment in history we will never repeat.

Same for the attack on Pearl Harbor

I don't believe that is the Point of the OP.................not sure........

I believe it is a point about Nuclear Weapons in General.

No one gives Japan a pass for attacking us.........and I'd go as far to say the Atom Bomb actually saved lives because it shortened the war.

But Nukes are dangerous to mankind...........and I hope mankind can keep a lid on them............

The war with Japan was already over. We did it to test them on a civilian population and show Russia our willingness to use them.

1945


73 years have passed since the first use of an atomic weapon in war. Most of the 150,000 victims were civilians. Women, children, the elderly. The effects of this new weapon on real people shocked the conscience of the world, and its use at that time is still debated to this day.

Regardless of one's position on Truman's decision, it is fitting to take a moment to remember so many lives taken and the horror of war in general. There is a reason the monument to the event in the city is called the Peace Park.

Perhaps one moment in history we will never repeat.

Same for the attack on Pearl Harbor

I don't believe that is the Point of the OP.................not sure........

I believe it is a point about Nuclear Weapons in General.

No one gives Japan a pass for attacking us.........and I'd go as far to say the Atom Bomb actually saved lives because it shortened the war.

But Nukes are dangerous to mankind...........and I hope mankind can keep a lid on them............

The war with Japan was already over. We did it to test them on a civilian population and show Russia our willingness to use them.

Test on Civilians?
They dropped fliers warning them about it.
They refused to believe it and stayed in both cities.

 

[Unkotare]

"...two days prior to Roosevelt's departure for Yalta, the president received a crucial, forty page memorandum from General Douglas MacArthur outlining five separate surrender overtures from highly placed Jap officials offering surrender terms which were virtually identical to the ones eventually dictated by the Allies to the Japanese in August."

Chicago Tribune History

 

[RetiredGySgt]

"...two days prior to Roosevelt's departure for Yalta, the president received a crucial, forty page memorandum from General Douglas MacArthur outlining five separate surrender overtures from highly placed Jap officials offering surrender terms which were virtually identical to the ones eventually dictated by the Allies to the Japanese in August."

Chicago Tribune History

And NONE of those officials ran the Government, There was a peace contingent but it was out of power. The Army ran the Government. And as the DOCUMENTS prove in August 1945 the Government run by the Army did NOT offer to surrender and did not agree to surrender after each of the Atomic bombs. Even after their "LIVING GOD" emperor ordered a surrender the Army staged a Coup to stop the surrender.

 

[Unkotare]

....
Your leaders as in the ones you are citing dumb ass. NONE of them were ever in the Pacific theater and havdn't a clue about the Japanese and their behavior........

Hmmm....how about Admiral Halsey? How about Admiral Nimitz? YOU understand the fighting in the Pacific much better than they did, right? If you had read the links like I repeatedly instructed you to, you wouldn't look so foolish now.