Article: "Democrats debate themselves: Why do we suck?"

[berg80]

Yep, we are not going to agree politically, and that is what really irks you people....Because you demand fealty....

I don't demand fealty to my beliefs. But I do demand fealty to the facts. And that is where Trumpleton's fall flat on their faces. The most glaring example being the Big Lie but there are hundreds of others. For instance.........

Crime: Red Delusions About Purple Reality

During last week’s Oklahoma gubernatorial debate Joy Hofmeister, the surprisingly competitive Democratic candidate, addressed Kevin Stitt, the Republican incumbent, who — like many in his party — is running as a champion of law and order.

“The fact is the rates of violent crime in Oklahoma are higher under your watch than New York and California,” she declared.

Stitt responded by laughing, and turned to the audience: “Oklahomans, do you believe we have higher crime than New York or California?”

But Hofmeister was completely correct. In fact, when it comes to homicide, the most reliably measured form of violent crime, it isn’t even close: In 2020 Oklahoma’s murder rate was almost 50 percent higher than California’s, almost double New York’s, and this ranking probably hasn’t changed.
Opinion | Crime: Red Delusions About Purple Reality

The gist of the article is the belief about crime being a problem in blue states of Dem's making is factually incorrect. But conservatives do a great job of getting their dishonest message out and a better job of getting people to believe it.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

PC is a term made up by right wingers to disparage efforts to stop racism. But that's not Identity politics.

PC is a method implemented by the Frankfurt School in Critical Theory (from which your communist shit CRT is derived). Yes, you're a motherfucking communist shit who need to be shot.

 

[pknopp]

Not really. Inflation has been low since Ronald Reagan destroyed the middle class by busting the unions.

If anything, Trump is probably at least partially to blame for inflation for not raising interest rates in 2017.

To note, the president doesn't raise the rates but they should have been raised long before 2017.

 

[j-mac]

I don't demand fealty to my beliefs. But I do demand fealty to the facts. And that is where Trumpleton's fall flat on their faces. The most glaring example being the Big Lie but there are hundreds of others. For instance.........

Crime: Red Delusions About Purple Reality

During last week’s Oklahoma gubernatorial debate Joy Hofmeister, the surprisingly competitive Democratic candidate, addressed Kevin Stitt, the Republican incumbent, who — like many in his party — is running as a champion of law and order.

“The fact is the rates of violent crime in Oklahoma are higher under your watch than New York and California,” she declared.

Stitt responded by laughing, and turned to the audience: “Oklahomans, do you believe we have higher crime than New York or California?”

But Hofmeister was completely correct. In fact, when it comes to homicide, the most reliably measured form of violent crime, it isn’t even close: In 2020 Oklahoma’s murder rate was almost 50 percent higher than California’s, almost double New York’s, and this ranking probably hasn’t changed.
Opinion | Crime: Red Delusions About Purple Reality

The gist of the article is the belief about crime being a problem in blue states of Dem's making is factually incorrect. But conservatives do a great job of getting their dishonest message out and a better job of getting people to believe it.

I see you got the talking points, right on que.

 

[Independent thinker]

I voted a week ago.

I'm sure your one vote will make a big difference. NOT. I was speaking in general. While your vote will be biased, those who are tired of paying Democrat's high prices and living with their high crime, won't be voting as you did. Apparently you like high prices and high crime. Then, when your side loses, you will be nonchalantly passing it off as, "History shows that the party in power loses seats in the midterms", followed by claims of election fraud and vote suppression and gerrymandering, even as you lose seats that can't even be gerrymandered. So, how do you plan to square up those two things?

 

[JoeB131]

No, but the US continues on a downward spiral thanks to stuff like this.

How? How has America been made any worse by people who love each other being able to get married?

Do you have any argument against Gay Marriage that doesn't involve "God Says It's Bad" and "I think it's Icky!" ?

We'll wait.

The world hasn’t ended due to climate change either despite multiple claims over the years, but that doesn’t stop the left from banging that drum ad nauseum.

Oh, I'll be the first one to admit that the more alarmist people like Al Gore are doing more harm than good.
But unless you are a brainless redneck, you can see the effects of global warming. End of October in Chicago, we are still having summer-like weather.

 

[SweetTea]

How? How has America been made any worse by people who love each other being able to get married?

Do you have any argument against Gay Marriage that doesn't involve "God Says It's Bad" and "I think it's Icky!" ?

I wasn’t just talking about gay marriage, but the erosion of the family structure is harming society. Out of wedlock births higher crime, etc. can all be attributed to ideas put forth by leftists who want no boundaries. If it feels good do it. It is shortsighted and child-like, but such is the mind of a typical liberal. Like I have said many times before, bells and whistles should be going off in your head that your opinions closely align with the average 16-year old. I’ve got news for you, it isn’t that kids have suddenly become wise beyond their years, it is that many physiological adults have never emotionally matured…yet another leftist gift to our country and society.

Oh, I'll be the first one to admit that the more alarmist people like Al Gore are doing more harm than good.
But unless you are a brainless redneck, you can see the effects of global warming. End of October in Chicago, we are still having summer-like weather.

LOL…unless you are a gullible fool, you would realize that climate is cyclical. There are LONG cycles. You also wouldn’t be so naive to believe that a) we are the sole cause of the issue b) that we can actually stop it and c) that other countries(China) could care less and we all live on the same planet. They are keeping people like you subservient while they continue to profit and buy beach houses. Ignorance and gullibility go hand in hand.

 

[JoeB131]

I wasn’t just talking about gay marriage, but the erosion of the family structure is harming society. Out of wedlock births higher crime, etc. can all be attributed to ideas put forth by leftists who want no boundaries. If it feels good do it. It is shortsighted and child-like, but such is the mind of a typical liberal. Like I have said many times before, bells and whistles should be going off in your head that your opinions closely align with the average 16-year old. I’ve got news for you, it isn’t that kids have suddenly become wise beyond their years, it is that many physiological adults have never emotionally matured…yet another leftist gift to our country and society.

again, I was probably more right wing than you are until I was about 46. Then I realized all the moral bullshit is exactly that... bullshit to get a bunch of fucking prudes to vote against their own economic interests.

We have high crime because we allow racism, poverty, and gun proliferation. The Europeans are more liberal than we are, and they have higher out of wedlock birth rates... but they have nowhere NEAR our crime levels.

The family is an obsolete, patriarchal structure, that frankly, most of society has outgrown. You guys whine all day about out of wedlock births, but never talk about divorce. Understandable, your "heroes" - Trump, Gingrich, Limbaugh - had no problem walking away from wives.

LOL…unless you are a gullible fool, you would realize that climate is cyclical. There are LONG cycles. You also wouldn’t be so naive to believe that a) we are the sole cause of the issue b) that we can actually stop it and c) that other countries(China) could care less and we all live on the same planet. They are keeping people like you subservient while they continue to profit and buy beach houses. Ignorance and gullibility go hand in hand.

Yes, you got the usual excuses to do nothing you rattle off. Let's do nothing because it would be too much trouble and might mildly inconvenience me.

The Chinese are making efforts to reduce greenhouse gases. Kind of tough, they know they will be more stressed by climate change than we will be, so they are making an effort.

Guest post: Why China is set to significantly overachieve its 2030 climate goals - Carbon Brief

China is continuing to build up its domestic fossil fuel production capacity and strengthening its portfolio for energy imports, even as it accelerates renewable power deployment. Yet our assessment shows the country is also set to significantly overachieve the targets it promised...

www.carbonbrief.org

 

[SweetTea]

again, I was probably more right wing than you are until I was about 46. Then I realized all the moral bullshit is exactly that... bullshit to get a bunch of fucking prudes to vote against their own economic interests.

If you became LESS Conservative as you aged then that is on you. Like I said, you became more closely aligned with the average 15-16 year old. You regressed, 16-year olds have not become wise. The other option is that your were kicked in the head by a donkey when you were 46. You woke up and saw the donkey standing beside you and viola, you are a Democrat for life. That would be more understandble.

We have high crime because we allow racism, poverty, and gun proliferation. The Europeans are more liberal than we are, and they have higher out of wedlock birth rates... but they have nowhere NEAR our crime levels.

Sure, racism and guns is causing poverty. Man you are stupid. If we just give these folks money it will solve the problem, right. Its the old chicken and the egg argument. The reality is that poor people have to make good decisions in order to escape poverty. It is all out there for them, but they to have some responsibility in the matter.

The family is an obsolete, patriarchal structure, that frankly, most of society has outgrown. You guys whine all day about out of wedlock births, but never talk about divorce. Understandable, your "heroes" - Trump, Gingrich, Limbaugh - had no problem walking away from wives.

Spoken like a true immoral, lefty.

The Chinese are making efforts to reduce greenhouse gases. Kind of tough, they know they will be more stressed by climate change than we will be, so they are making an effort

I can assure you they will not put green in front of profits. It won’t happen. They will be as ”dirty” as necessary.

Speaking of “green” and Europe, the liberal’s dream world, Germany has a major crisis because of the short-sighted leftist thinking of Merkel. Let’s go green, lets shut down nuclear plants, lets become MORE dependent energy from Russia in the short term as we transition to green. LOL, yeah, Trump tried to warn them, but, like you, they were too ignorant to get it. They have been brainwashed, also like you.

 

[JoeB131]

If you became LESS Conservative as you aged then that is on you. Like I said, you became more closely aligned with the average 15-16 year old. You regressed, 16-year olds have not become wise. The other option is that your were kicked in the head by a donkey when you were 46. You woke up and saw the donkey standing beside you and viola, you are a Democrat for life. That would be more understandble.

Nope. After 6 years of working for an unappreciative boss, he responded to my legitimate complaint about giving a job that should have been mine to a nepotism hire with "This is why I'm glad I don't have to deal with a union." That's when I realized that I don't make enough money to vote Republican, and if you aren't rich, you have no business voting for them.

Sure, racism and guns is causing poverty. Man you are stupid. If we just give these folks money it will solve the problem, right. Its the old chicken and the egg argument. The reality is that poor people have to make good decisions in order to escape poverty. It is all out there for them, but they to have some responsibility in the matter.

Uh, no, guy... check your privilege.

I can assure you they will not put green in front of profits. It won’t happen. They will be as ”dirty” as necessary.

Speaking of “green” and Europe, the liberal’s dream world, Germany has a major crisis because of the short-sighted leftist thinking of Merkel. Let’s go green, lets shut down nuclear plants, lets become MORE dependent energy from Russia in the short term as we transition to green. LOL, yeah, Trump tried to warn them, but, like you, they were too ignorant to get it. They have been brainwashed, also like you.

Uh, Germany is going to be just fine, guy.

Germany's Scholz: 'We will make it through this winter' – DW – 09/13/2022

Germany is set to cut off its dependence on Russian gas fully by the end of next year. The chancellor also celebrated efforts made to prepare for the coming winter.

www.dw.com

And Merkel didn't listen to Trump because he was a fucking idiot.

 

[j-mac]

Nope. After 6 years of working for an unappreciative boss, he responded to my legitimate complaint about giving a job that should have been mine to a nepotism hire with "This is why I'm glad I don't have to deal with a union." That's when I realized that I don't make enough money to vote Republican, and if you aren't rich, you have no business voting for them.



Uh, no, guy... check your privilege.



Uh, Germany is going to be just fine, guy.

Germany's Scholz: 'We will make it through this winter' – DW – 09/13/2022

Germany is set to cut off its dependence on Russian gas fully by the end of next year. The chancellor also celebrated efforts made to prepare for the coming winter.

www.dw.com

And Merkel didn't listen to Trump because he was a fucking idiot.

That’s it? You didn’t get a job you thought you were entitled to, so you turned into an America hating lib? Nah, not buying it…

 

[marvin martian]

There was a study done based on interviews with many Jan 6 insurrectionists. They were asked what their main motivation was. You'd think it was "stopping the steal", right? Nope. It was White Replacement.

Link?

 

[JoeB131]

That’s it? You didn’t get a job you thought you were entitled to, so you turned into an America hating lib? Nah, not buying it…

I love my country.

I have no use for the GOP, which has put the interests of the investor class over the good of the American people.

Sorry you are too stupid to get that, but you are really part of the problem. For the last 40 years, the GOP has been taking away from the working class, and you keep going right along with it because they play on your racial, religious and sexual fears.

 

[citygator]

Democrats Debate Themselves: Why Do We Suck?

If the party loses the midterms there will be no shortage of I-told-you-so explanations.

www.politico.com

Looks like the Democrats will be smeared (to some degree) here in a couple of weeks. I checked out this opinion piece to see what the pre-emptive self-reflection might look like.

Yes, the main reasoning for this will be that this is what has historically happened -- the party in power gets its ass kicked in off-year elections. Back and forth, back and forth, the two parties proving beyond any doubt that (a) they don't deserve too much power and (b) We the People wish they'd get the fuck over themselves and work together. And yes, if you look at the actual popular vote totals, the Dems still represent the most voters. That can only be denied by those who are being manipulated and lied to.

Both are true. BUT...

It doesn't look to me that the Democrats have yet looked honestly at what has (a) animated their political opponents and (b) kept other Americans from voting for them: Their positions on the wide range of issues that could be called "cultural". I've been screaming about Political Correctness and Identity Politics for the ten years I've been on this board, and now those tactics are coming home to roost. Do Democrats still feel that that's wrong, that those are winning issues for them at such a critical time?

PC/Identity Politics touches a wide range of topics, from the military to entertainment to education to crime. James Carville gets it. Bill Maher gets it. A few others get it. So do the Republicans. And now they're so energized and animated over them that they're on the verge of taking over our very electoral system over a lie from an obvious con man. Does this hit home to Democrats, at all? I don't see it in this opinion piece, or anywhere else.

I think this assessment is all wrong. Democrats arent suffering from woke-backlash. Democrats have responded poorly to the constant barrage of fake extreme positions the republicans ascribe to them. They don’t scream loudly enough and pointedly call out republicans for being the liars they are.

The electorate only responded to extremism these days. You’re either destroying America or keeping it from being destroyed but no one cares if your message is about running the county effectively.

The long list of liberal grievances on this site are not democratic positions or the results of democrats. People are stupid. There just is no getting around it.

 

[j-mac]

I love my country.

I have no use for the GOP, which has put the interests of the investor class over the good of the American people.

Sorry you are too stupid to get that, but you are really part of the problem. For the last 40 years, the GOP has been taking away from the working class, and you keep going right along with it because they play on your racial, religious and sexual fears.

Don’t generalize me with Democrat talking points simpleton…use your own words.

You said you turned democrat because you felt slighted for a position you felt entitled to…That’s not only childish, but a lie.

So tell me without talking points or platitudes, what is it you love about this country, and why you are a Democrat…

 

[j-mac]

I think this assessment is all wrong. Democrats arent suffering from woke-backlash. Democrats have responded poorly to the constant barrage of fake extreme positions the republicans ascribe to them. They don’t scream loudly enough and pointedly call out republicans for being the liars they are.

The electorate only responded to extremism these days. You’re either destroying America or keeping it from being destroyed but no one cares if your message is about running the county effectively.

The long list of liberal grievances on this site are not democratic positions or the results of democrats. People are stupid. There just is no getting around it.

I’ll agree that people are selfish, and superficial. But, explain in your own words, what “fake positions” Republicans are ascribing on to democrats that you think are wrong? And how you feel democrats have run the country “effectively“ in the past two years with control of both houses of Congress, and the presidency?

 

[SweetTea]

Nope. After 6 years of working for an unappreciative boss, he responded to my legitimate complaint about giving a job that should have been mine to a nepotism hire with "This is why I'm glad I don't have to deal with a union." That's when I realized that I don't make enough money to vote Republican, and if you aren't rich, you have no business voting for them.



Uh, no, guy... check your privilege.



Uh, Germany is going to be just fine, guy.

Germany's Scholz: 'We will make it through this winter' – DW – 09/13/2022

Germany is set to cut off its dependence on Russian gas fully by the end of next year. The chancellor also celebrated efforts made to prepare for the coming winter.

www.dw.com

And Merkel didn't listen to Trump because he was a fucking idiot.

You are the idiot, but idiots don't know they are idiots. Merkel screwed Germany.

 

[SweetTea]

Uh, no, guy... check your privilege

You're a white guy. What happened to your privilege? According to you, you don't make enough money to even be a Republican. Perhaps it takes more than just being a white male to be successful.

 

[Blaster]

The Democrats will soon be the minority party.

 

[JoeB131]

Don’t generalize me with Democrat talking points simpleton…use your own words.

You said you turned democrat because you felt slighted for a position you felt entitled to…That’s not only childish, but a lie.

No, I turned Democrat because I realize Republicans destroyed the protections that I should have enjoyed as a worker.

I go back to my Dad, who in the last year of his life, had SERIOUS medical issues (eventually dying at 56). But his company didn't dare fire him, the Union would have had their asses.

I only had minor medical issues, which had very little effect on my performance, but that was enough for my boss, who routinely fired people who had medical issues, including pregnancy.

I had a VERY GOOD case for age and medical discrimination, but that would have involved years of litigation.

So tell me without talking points or platitudes, what is it you love about this country, and why you are a Democrat…

The things I love about this country are the things that you probably hate about it. Such as America is a welcoming place to immigrants. I have a bias, of course. My father is an immigrant and I am currently dating an immigrant.

I am a Democrat because Republicans are fucking nuts....

You're a white guy. What happened to your privilege? According to you, you don't make enough money to even be a Republican. Perhaps it takes more than just being a white male to be successful.

White privilege means I can get a job and not be pulled over by the cops on a whim. It hardly means that I should be cool with the fact that within my lifetime, my rights as a worker have largely been stripped. I guess the Republicans will be happy when we acheive "equality" by making the white working class just as poor as minorities. They get a bit closer with every recession they inflict on us.

You are the idiot, but idiots don't know they are idiots. Merkel screwed Germany.

Except she's well regarded, while Trump, not so much.