Any board members enrolled in ACA yet?

[earlycuyler]

Impossible. Obama said when he campaigned there would be no fine for those who can't afford it.

There isn't.

So he doesnt get fined. So he still does not have health insurance. I thought the ACA was supposed to cover the uninsured?

All but 30 million.

 

[thereisnospoon]

That was the only reason? Of course not

Many were cut off when they got sick.

So many were simply not allowed it because of a pre-existing condition, which is not the case now. That will never change even if ACA goes away.

The industry got filthy rich by denying sick people insurance and making it overall very expensive.

If people with pre-existing conditions are allowed to buy "insurance," then it's no longer insurance. It's welfare. The industry did not get "filthy ******* rich" by denying people with pre-existing conditions. All it did is avoid going bankrupt. Now the entire country will go bankrupt.

So your answer is that anyone who is sick should not be treated if they can't pay for it on their own?? You do realize that under those guidelines about half of Americans should not be able to buy insurance. What you are saying is only healthy people should be able to buy insurance. Basically, you want insurance companies only providing insurance to those who need it the least. Luckily you don't speak for the majority of Americans.

Now, what I will agree with is that if we are going to insure those with pre-existing conditions, then they should be paying into the system if they can afford to, and doing so from day one. That is where the mandate comes in. I'm not sure what fantasy world you live in, but it must be wonderful.

That post is not even close to factual.
The practice of insuring the currently ill or injured is fiscally impossible because government regulations prevent the insurer from setting risk appropriate rates and deductibles.
I will explain. Those with pre existing conditions should be insurable. However, those customers should pay rates commensurate with the risk they present to the carrier.
Or, insuerers should be permitted to exclude the pre existing condition.
For example. Let's say a person has a heart condition. Currently laws and regulations make it impossible for carriers to cover this person. My idea is to exclude the condition from coverage but insure the person for other perils.
In other words, if the insured breaks a leg, it has nothing to do with the heart condition. The treatment for the broken leg should be covered.

 

[Vox]

My sons friend is a college student, makes 800 a month from a part time job, so he doesnt qualify for medicaid, he cant afford obama care either, He cant stay on his parents plan because his mom is dead and his dad is on SSDI...the poor kid will get slapped with a fine he cant afford. What a fucked up disaster.

You are a liar.

Really ? how so ? This^ up here, is exactly how it will go. If not pleas, show us otherwise. Bet you dont.

800$ per month is less than 10K per year and the kid is eligible for medicaid and social support( foodstamps, housing assistance and even welfare)
the poverty level for family of 1 is $11,490, so if he is filing ALONE he will be eligible. If his father is filing with him being dependednt that is what might mess up his eligibility for medicaid.
he should file taxes ALONE next year.

Federal Poverty Guidelines

 

[thereisnospoon]

fakey, go away.

Many of your TeaP congresscritters once again will be gone after next year's elections.

Your type are headed for political extinction.

That's a liberal talking point.

 

[earlycuyler]

But how much is the doctor getting paid? Insurance companies never pay the total bill. They pay less. I have seen it with my own medical care. Any doctor not part of a pre-negotiated fee schedule pretty much gets what ever the insurance company pays. These are new patients without a contract fee schedule. It is reasonable for doctors, ie. small business owners, to be leery of taking on new patients without knowing the impact on their bottom line.

At the end of the day, doctors are looking at a system which is relying on the cost model of a privately run, profit driven industry (the insurance part of it) to pay for something being driven by a not for profit government scheme. We know how this will end. It happened in California with partial electricity market deregulation in the late 1990s.

insurance companies pay something like 33 cents per dollar, medicare/medicaid - 17 cents per dollar.
same discrepancy is for the hospitals. that is the reason the bills sent are way overpriced - because nobody is going to pay that amount. it's a game. hospitals are covering for those without insurance and all who have insurance, plus medicaid/medicare are paying for those, which means all of us are.

You guys, probably, don't know this, but unlike the mantra that it is such a big loss for the hospital that uninsured are coming to the ER, the truth is that hospitals are making money only in 2 departments - in the OR and in the ER.

As usual, the lies you are being told are just lies.
Same is pertinent for the lie about nobody being able to enroll for insurance with pre-existing condition before obamacare.
It is the most horrendous lie in all this scum - you were ALWAYS able to enroll. It was a little bit more expensive than the others but not even close to the rates of obamacare exchanges.

Sorry, but you have no idea what you are talking about. Saying people with pre-existing conditions could buy insurance is a very bad half truth. What they could purchase, in most cases, were indemnity plans with a set maximum yearly benefit. I looked into these when I was denied coverage after moving from Colorado to Ohio. I had insurance in Colorado, but because I had a pre-existing condition, I was denied in Ohio. I had been paying about $350 per month in Colorado for a plan with a $2500 deductible. What was offered in Ohio was a plan that cost $900 per month and had a maximum benefit of $75,000 per year after a $5000 deductible. I don't know many people who would even bother thinking about purchasing such a monstrosity of a plan. Would you?

I have never been denied insurance over a preexisting condition. I was told as long as I was being treated for six months prior to getting the insurance I was covered. This being denied over preexisting conditions shit is way over blown. You may have to pay a bit more, but is that unreasonable ? All other types of insurance make you pay more or less depending on the circumstances. What I have now gives me discounts for doing certain things like not smoking as well as other life style changes. I'm curious who your employer is and who sells the plan you have. Its very familiar sounding.

 

[PoliticalChic]

And, the promise to insure all Americans? According to the CBO, in 2015 there will be 36 million uninsured nonelderly Americans.
http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/attachments/43472-07-24-2012-CoverageEstimates.pdf (table 3)

 

[thereisnospoon]

Nobody should enroll in the ACA unless he really wants to provide the government and its ACORN-O-Care henchthugs the complete compendium of one's most private financial, identify, and health details with which to be blackmailed, tracked, and harassed for the rest of his life...let alone the identity theft risk aspect.

Hopenchange!

I would not register on that Obamacare website for the simple fact that the site has numerous security holes. Any person that provides info on the site is leaving themselves wide open to ID theft.

 

[earlycuyler]

You are a liar.

Really ? how so ? This^ up here, is exactly how it will go. If not pleas, show us otherwise. Bet you dont.

800$ per month is less than 10K per year and the kid is eligible for medicaid and social support( foodstamps, housing assistance and even welfare)
the poverty level for family of 1 is $11,490, so if he is filing ALONE he will be eligible. If his father is filing with him being dependednt that is what might mess up his eligibility for medicaid.
he should file taxes ALONE next year.

Federal Poverty Guidelines

Depends on the state. But it doesnt hurt. I could make $2,000 les this year, and get Medicade next year I think going by those numbers. I just dont want to. If I could keep my Dr. I might.

 

[thereisnospoon]

The reactionary loons of the far right see their political demise on the near horizon and are starting to babble unintelligibly.

With your continued parroting of liberal talking points, it is clear you've lost control and have nothing to add to the discussion.

 

[auditor0007]

we all are and it is way cheaper that this crap called obamacare

No, it is not. Our health care system and insurance programs for it have been crippling the economy.

The system is going to change willingly or the economic factors will change it at a much greater cost.

yes, it is.

what is crippling our economy is EMTALA law and defensive medicine.
if one wants SERIOSLY decrease the costs - one starts with tort reform and EMTALA reform.
Since it was never even mentioned - the whole obamacare purpose is a rip-off of the taxpayers for the benefit of big businesses, not decresing costs ( they are only going to increase) and not getting help to the people.
It is as usual with dimocraps - financial benefit of the big fat cats, which own dimocraps on the backs of American taxpayers.
nothing new under the sun.

You know what? Everyone wants to ignore the real problem we have. We're all afraid of the boogeyman called dying. We will do anything and everything we can to extend a person's life for an extra month or two, no matter how much misery it actually causes them. What is the total cost of this? Probably a good 30% of our total healthcare spending. To prove out this point, all we hear is how Obamacare will create death panels, and that scares people to death, even though there are no death panels. But the point is that we are so afraid of dying that we do anything and everything to live a couple extra months in absolute misery.

Most other countries provide hospice care when people are deemed terminal. Yes, if the person's life can be prolonged for a few more years, then you treat them but not if it will only prolong their life a few more weeks. And yet, most of these other countries have longer life expectancy than the US. Why is that? It's because they put the bulk of their dollars into preventative care and try to keep people healthier so they can live a longer life. Yes, much of that is due to personal choices, but it is also about education and funding programs that lead to healthier lifestyles. Those countries extend people's lives on the front end while we do it on the back end. It's like maintaining your car. If you keep it well maintained at all times, you'll keep it running for over 300,000 miles. If you don't keep it maintained you end up having to replace the engine at 150,000 miles and you end up putting more and more money into the thing just to keep it running.

Why Does the U.S. Overspend on Health Care? One Simple Reason - DailyFinance

 

[Vox]

Nearly everyone in our organization takes part in an annual physical--provided as part of their healthcare insurance. Yes we do have some who simply choose not to do it.

You get advice on lowering your cholesterol, becoming more active, watching your weight, monitoring your blood pressure, healthy eating, the famous "10 things to do while watching TV" which is plastered in every break room in our office. If something is discovered, you can get a referral for more intensive treatment.

yearly check-ups do almost nothing if the patient is not following the advise - and that is the most often encountered issue.
people who need treatments with cholesterol or HTN and not doing it by "preventive measures" of yearly check-ups but on a constant regular basis.
Yerly check-ups do not change anything much except those preventive screening I have mentioned.
Those and yearly check-ups were ALWAYS "free" if you were insured. so nothing changed there, no matter how many lies obamacare brainwashing machine produced

 

[Vox]

But how much is the doctor getting paid? Insurance companies never pay the total bill. They pay less. I have seen it with my own medical care. Any doctor not part of a pre-negotiated fee schedule pretty much gets what ever the insurance company pays. These are new patients without a contract fee schedule. It is reasonable for doctors, ie. small business owners, to be leery of taking on new patients without knowing the impact on their bottom line.

At the end of the day, doctors are looking at a system which is relying on the cost model of a privately run, profit driven industry (the insurance part of it) to pay for something being driven by a not for profit government scheme. We know how this will end. It happened in California with partial electricity market deregulation in the late 1990s.

insurance companies pay something like 33 cents per dollar, medicare/medicaid - 17 cents per dollar.
same discrepancy is for the hospitals. that is the reason the bills sent are way overpriced - because nobody is going to pay that amount. it's a game. hospitals are covering for those without insurance and all who have insurance, plus medicaid/medicare are paying for those, which means all of us are.

You guys, probably, don't know this, but unlike the mantra that it is such a big loss for the hospital that uninsured are coming to the ER, the truth is that hospitals are making money only in 2 departments - in the OR and in the ER.

As usual, the lies you are being told are just lies.
Same is pertinent for the lie about nobody being able to enroll for insurance with pre-existing condition before obamacare.
It is the most horrendous lie in all this scum - you were ALWAYS able to enroll. It was a little bit more expensive than the others but not even close to the rates of obamacare exchanges.

Sorry, but you have no idea what you are talking about. Saying people with pre-existing conditions could buy insurance is a very bad half truth. What they could purchase, in most cases, were indemnity plans with a set maximum yearly benefit. I looked into these when I was denied coverage after moving from Colorado to Ohio. I had insurance in Colorado, but because I had a pre-existing condition, I was denied in Ohio. I had been paying about $350 per month in Colorado for a plan with a $2500 deductible. What was offered in Ohio was a plan that cost $900 per month and had a maximum benefit of $75,000 per year after a $5000 deductible. I don't know many people who would even bother thinking about purchasing such a monstrosity of a plan. Would you?

sorry, but it is YOU who have no idea what you are talking about.
I have a friend who has a son with a very serious pre-existing neurological condition - he IS buying a plan for at least 8 years now afor ~400$ per month ( do not know his deductible) and had never had any problems with getting it.
EVER.
obamacare or no obamacare.

So all you can tell is your particular situation, nothing more.
plus what you were offered in Ohio is pretty much a standard under obamacarefor a healthy person, with much higher deductuble ( 13,000, not 5,000)

 

[thereisnospoon]

You are buying insurance from an insurance company. The exchange is just a tool to help you buy it, and it is really mostly set up for those who think they might get a subsidy. In many cases, if you are not going to get a subsidy, you might be able to buy direct from any of those companies without going through the exchange. Some companies are forcing you to go through the exchange though, regardless of whether you will receive a subsidy or not, so either way, it makes sense to take a look at what is being offered through the exchange if you in fact are looking for insurance.

One last thing; if you are not expecting a subsidy or do not want one, then you only have to give them limited info. They don't need all of your financials unless you are hoping to receive a subsidy/tax credit.

Looks pretty simple. And to the uninformed, it may very well be. However insurance is only good when you use it.
The gaps in coverage are the issue. As well as the cost.
Most people will choose the cheapest or bronze plan. This plan covers just 60% of medical bills.

The Bronze Plan works fine for me. It may not be the best plan for everyone, but for me it works great. I'm looking at a plan that costs $300 per month and allows for an HSA. So now I will set aside at least as much money as I have been spending out of pocket every year anyway, which is between $1200 and $1500. My yearly physical is covered and things like colonoscopies are covered which I need every five years. I'm on no medication and likely won't need any for a very long time. So my overall costs per year to cover my insurance and all of my medical bills will be about $5000 which is what I'm paying now. The key is that if something goes very wrong such as me having a heart attack or getting cancer, then I am covered. Yes, under those circumstances I would end up spending another $5000 or so in that year, but so what?

Those who are on a lot of expensive meds are the ones who are going to be paying much more, either out of pocket or by purchasing a much more expensive plan.

First, ACA makes no allowance for HSA's.
Second, you may feel quite comfy with a $5000 deductible and an additional $5,000 in out of pocket expenses, buy most of us are rich guys like you who have that kind of cash laying around.
I have to laugh at your side...You whine that those living paycheck to paycheck needing Obamacare then to state that even with the plan out of pocket expenses can rage in the thousands.

 

[auditor0007]

Nobody should enroll in the ACA unless he really wants to provide the government and its ACORN-O-Care henchthugs the complete compendium of one's most private financial, identify, and health details with which to be blackmailed, tracked, and harassed for the rest of his life...let alone the identity theft risk aspect.

Hopenchange!

Yea, it's all one big conspiracy. The government is just the boogeyman.

 

[Papageorgio]

With the new rules in place, you will be taxed an extra $95 next year if you don't carry health insurance. Of course it is supposed to go up every year after that.

So, under that law, why would one carry insurance, unless they needed it, and then drop it when they don't? Just asking. Why would one do anything else?

 

[driveby]

No, it is not. Our health care system and insurance programs for it have been crippling the economy.

The system is going to change willingly or the economic factors will change it at a much greater cost.

Right, the "willing change" is so much cheaper that a 2.6 trillion dollar tax had to be forced down the throats of Americans.......

The 2.6 trillion is a conservative estimate and it only covers the first 10 years.......

Your numbers are questionable, the cost curve has been flattening since 2010, and you are going to change whether you like it or . . . you could have crafted something else but didn't.

The numbers are questionable because they keep going up everytime they run the projections. Plenty of other ideas were crafted, but you don't know that because your beloved democrats locked repubs out of the legislation. Now mark my words, when people really start finding out what's in it, you'll start to hear the "it was a republican idea" propaganda. Hell, you already heard it during the 2012 election season when americans were voicing their disapproval of Obamacare.......

 

[auditor0007]

If people with pre-existing conditions are allowed to buy "insurance," then it's no longer insurance. It's welfare. The industry did not get "filthy ******* rich" by denying people with pre-existing conditions. All it did is avoid going bankrupt. Now the entire country will go bankrupt.

QUOTE]

You are wrong. First - people with pre-existing conditions ALWAYS were able to get an insurance and second - that is what it is all about - it is health care - people who do not need it do not enroll.

The leftard media were so intensely brainwashing Americans with this lie about pre-existing condition, that eventually became better than Goebbels.

What is pre-existing condition?
It is ANY problem with your health - minor, moderate or major.
it is hypertension, it is overweight, it is iron-deficiency anemia, it is osteopenia, it is mitral valve prolapse, it is cancer in remission it is a history of broken ribs and vertebrae - it is ANYTHING.
There are basically NO people WITHOUT pre-existing conditions. At all.
So if hte claim would be true ( which is not) NOBODY would be eligible for insurance before obamacare.

Which is an absolute lie.
Did the people who were not able to enroll exist? yes, they did. was it because of their chronic ilnesses? no. it usually was directly connected to some kind of paperwork discrepancy - and sure enough, if there was a possibility for insurance company to deny coverage based on paperwork - they opted for it, especially if the chronic illness was costly.
But in the vast majority of cases all people having chronic illnesses did not have any problems enrolling.

There were 2 truths in the pre-obamacare propaganda lies - there were top amounts of possible spendings and you could have gone broke if you got sick - but the latter did not happen often, since people knew that and the process is relatively lengthy - you get sick, you are being treated, eventually your premium gets to be so high that the small company where you are working can't handle it anymore and fires you. If you are a middle-class American with a hous and some savings, the medical bill which eventually will come will take everything and only then you will be eligible for medicaid.
It was wrong, but that was not the scenario which most often happened.
Since the situation was not developing overnight and the people involved knew about waht is approaching, the preventive measures of hiding the assets were most often taken ( rightfully so) - house on the wife, savings on the sister and so on, so eventually by the time the person in question is faced to pay the bill - he does not have ANYTHING so he/she does not pay anything, and nothing can be taken from her/him.
It took some planning but what do you think lawyers are for?


anyway, as usual in all high-propaganda, high-lying cases, the reality was hidden behind the slogans and gullible people on all sides gladly beleived it.

Instead of checking the facts and realities.

You can't even quote a person correctly. I didn't quote that nonsense; Bripatidiot did. Secondly, and for the last time, you have no clue what you are talking about. But that's par for the course with you.

 

[driveby]

Looks pretty simple. And to the uninformed, it may very well be. However insurance is only good when you use it.
The gaps in coverage are the issue. As well as the cost.
Most people will choose the cheapest or bronze plan. This plan covers just 60% of medical bills.

The Bronze Plan works fine for me. It may not be the best plan for everyone, but for me it works great. I'm looking at a plan that costs $300 per month and allows for an HSA. So now I will set aside at least as much money as I have been spending out of pocket every year anyway, which is between $1200 and $1500. My yearly physical is covered and things like colonoscopies are covered which I need every five years. I'm on no medication and likely won't need any for a very long time. So my overall costs per year to cover my insurance and all of my medical bills will be about $5000 which is what I'm paying now. The key is that if something goes very wrong such as me having a heart attack or getting cancer, then I am covered. Yes, under those circumstances I would end up spending another $5000 or so in that year, but so what?

Those who are on a lot of expensive meds are the ones who are going to be paying much more, either out of pocket or by purchasing a much more expensive plan.

First, ACA makes no allowance for HSA's.
Second, you may feel quite comfy with a $5000 deductible and an additional $5,000 in out of pocket expenses, buy most of us are rich guys like you who have that kind of cash laying around.
I have to laugh at your side...You whine that those living paycheck to paycheck needing Obamacare then to state that even with the plan out of pocket expenses can rage in the thousands.

Exactly, Sandra Fluke can't afford a $20 pack of birth control pills, but she can afford a $5000 deductible.....

 

[Papageorgio]

Are you paying for your county's emergency room that takes the uninsured currently?

we all are and it is way cheaper that this crap called obamacare

And you can quote statistics backing up your rant? I doubt it. Considering the uninsured will now have insurance and get PREVENTATIVE care thus they are treated with pill therapy not scalpels and a trauma team.

Preventative care is much less expensive than acute care.

Yeah, pill therapy, that's the ticket, that's not preventative, that's masking but that's an issue for another thread.

 

[auditor0007]

It is illegal to cancel someone's health insurance simply because "They got sick."

And your "pre-existing condition" is the exact reason I gave. It is only good businness sense that denies insurance to people for pre-existing conditions.

So you have absolutely nothing.

Insurance companies have a long history of canceling people's insurance when they get sick. While they could not do it if you had employer based insurance, people with private plans were treated very differently. Most of the HIPAA laws did not pertain to those with individual or private plans. I lost my insurance a few years ago. In my situation, I had to move to a different state, but I had always been insured with a private plan. During the time that I had that plan, I was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver due to Hemochromatosis. When I moved, they said they could no longer insure me. I even applied with Anthem BCBS, the same company I had my insurance through when I was in Colorado. They are different companies with the same parent company, but they refused me insurance even though I had been with them for years.

that is one of the holes which was really problematic.
since you are a potential liver transplant and this is extremely costly, getting insured privately was difficult.
Not that there weren't bypass possibilities and people were using them, but the not employer-sponsored insurance might cause problems.
I hope you are doing well and wish you so.

Well I will thank you for that, and I am doing well thank you. I was diagnosed with cirrhosis in 2005. Average life expectancy for one diagnosed with early stage cirrhosis is 15 to 20 years, but there are exceptions and I'm a very likely exception. I stopped drinking alcohol immediately even though alcohol was not the cause. Over the next 18 months, they removed 90 pints of blood from me, one every fifth day. This got rid of all the excess iron my body had absorbed over the years which was the cause of the cirrhosis. I finally quit smoking also, as all those chemicals are bad for the liver.

Anyway, I have my liver checked every year by ultrasound and they check me for varices every two to three years. Varices are caused by portal hypertension in the veins, either in the stomach or esophagus. None found yet. Basically, there is zero sign of any advancement of my cirrhosis, and I intend to keep it that way. Living to 90 or 100 with my own liver is a much better option than relying on a transplanted liver for many obvious reasons.