Afterlife?

[jan]

Stress free existence sounds good. No murder, or school shootings...drama only for the fun of it, rather than the stress. Peaceful interactions with other heavenly beings that only emit positive vibes towards others. Yeah, I could handle that break over stressful striving that seems to encapsulate life as we know it being human.

No criminals sounds good...no crime...peace and beauty with lively discussion when desired. Yeah, I could call that heaven.

I don't want to be around people at all. I already put in an application to be grounds keeper and animal caretaker.

A soulful existence indeed! Nature and animals, it doesn't get much better than that.

I don't think nature or animals would factor in a constant state of bliss. Nature is a state of constant change and a tension. Without that change and tension you do not have nature, without nature there are no animals they become unnecessary because once you have a constant state the laws of cause and effect goes straight out the window.

Ok...what is your idea of a constant state of bliss?

 

[HaShev]

So then HaShev...how would you explain Jesus appearing to his disciples after his cruxifixion? Or, are we not considering the New Testament in this description of (lack of ) life after death?

1 Corinthians 15

The Resurrection of the Dead
12Now if Christ is preached, that He has been raised from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? 13But if there is no resurrection of the dead, not even Christ has been raised; 14and if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is vain, your faith also is vain.…
Cross References
1 Corinthians 15:12
But if it is preached that Christ has been raised from the dead, how can some of you say that there is no resurrection of the dead?1 Corinthians 15:14
And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith.
So...if there is no resurrection...that pretty much wipes out the entire Christian faith here.

Christianity teaches opposing ideologies because they formed the faith to be a combined new one world religion that Rome could be authority and benifactor to.
So the converged the opposing ideas 1) the Egyptian underworld mythology which Yeshu son of Mary learned wheb fleeing towards Egypt and Greek Death cult of Hades which believed in life in death, and yet they teach ressurection back into life through the Judaic teachings and plagiarization of the OT. It was Rabbi Yohoshua Ben Chananiah which taught ressurection ideas in the OT, and this became stolen and forged into the NT character through similar name and converging of stories to fit this image Rome was selling as a mask for Baal.
In fact in the Canaanite dying god mythology the son of baal called morning star-rev 22:16, dies to surpass his father Baal on the throne.
In the Jesus myth his ressurection is admitting to lying when he asks Mary to lie and say he ascended to his father- in John. They already claim he descended to hades not ascended, basically the devil being the gate keeper of hades is admittingly Jesus in the same book.
The apostles claim they don't recognize him so was it an impersonstor scam artist, and other writings claim he faked his death , but which christ,there were many all combine for the image Jesus, combined figures, faulty history dating, stories not adding up, all signs of a farce story where they can't ever keep their lies straight. Rome would have been better off writing a Johnny Knoxville movie if they didn't already.

 

[Gracie]

Stress free existence sounds good. No murder, or school shootings...drama only for the fun of it, rather than the stress. Peaceful interactions with other heavenly beings that only emit positive vibes towards others. Yeah, I could handle that break over stressful striving that seems to encapsulate life as we know it being human.

No criminals sounds good...no crime...peace and beauty with lively discussion when desired. Yeah, I could call that heaven.

I don't want to be around people at all. I already put in an application to be grounds keeper and animal caretaker.

A soulful existence indeed! Nature and animals, it doesn't get much better than that.

I don't think nature or animals would factor in a constant state of bliss. Nature is a state of constant change and a tension. Without that change and tension you do not have nature, without nature there are no animals they become unnecessary because once you have a constant state the laws of cause and effect goes straight out the window.

Ok...what is your idea of a constant state of bliss?

Who are you asking? According to Cynthia, robots.

 

[CynthiaZ]

Stress free existence sounds good. No murder, or school shootings...drama only for the fun of it, rather than the stress. Peaceful interactions with other heavenly beings that only emit positive vibes towards others. Yeah, I could handle that break over stressful striving that seems to encapsulate life as we know it being human.

No criminals sounds good...no crime...peace and beauty with lively discussion when desired. Yeah, I could call that heaven.

I don't want to be around people at all. I already put in an application to be grounds keeper and animal caretaker.

A soulful existence indeed! Nature and animals, it doesn't get much better than that.

I don't think nature or animals would factor in a constant state of bliss. Nature is a state of constant change and a tension. Without that change and tension you do not have nature, without nature there are no animals they become unnecessary because once you have a constant state the laws of cause and effect goes straight out the window.

Ok...what is your idea of a constant state of bliss?

To blow out the flame of conditioned existence. No more self, no more desire, no contingency. Complete emptiness. To be no thing.

 

[jon_berzerk]

That is what is limiting...eternal bliss. You cannot be a free agent in such a condition. You are limited to just one thing. In such a state there are no possibilities.

But...you won't know until you are dead if that is true, right?

been there done that

Been dead? Really? What say ye about the experience?

it was alright

Ummmmm...ok...no other commentary? Any near death experiences to go on record with?

i have elaborated on this site before

and probably will again

but not tonight

im going to bed soon

 

[jon_berzerk]

Stress free existence sounds good. No murder, or school shootings...drama only for the fun of it, rather than the stress. Peaceful interactions with other heavenly beings that only emit positive vibes towards others. Yeah, I could handle that break over stressful striving that seems to encapsulate life as we know it being human.

No criminals sounds good...no crime...peace and beauty with lively discussion when desired. Yeah, I could call that heaven.

I don't want to be around people at all. I already put in an application to be grounds keeper and animal caretaker.

A soulful existence indeed! Nature and animals, it doesn't get much better than that.

I don't think nature or animals would factor in a constant state of bliss. Nature is a state of constant change and a tension. Without that change and tension you do not have nature, without nature there are no animals they become unnecessary because once you have a constant state the laws of cause and effect goes straight out the window.

Like I said before.....whatever each individuals "bliss" is, will be their heaven. For me..animals and nature. Animals are necessary to ME. Therefore, MY heaven of bliss is them and the nature they are living in.

whatever each individuals "bliss" is, will be their heaven.

anything less would not be heaven

 

[jan]

Stress free existence sounds good. No murder, or school shootings...drama only for the fun of it, rather than the stress. Peaceful interactions with other heavenly beings that only emit positive vibes towards others. Yeah, I could handle that break over stressful striving that seems to encapsulate life as we know it being human.

No criminals sounds good...no crime...peace and beauty with lively discussion when desired. Yeah, I could call that heaven.

I don't want to be around people at all. I already put in an application to be grounds keeper and animal caretaker.

A soulful existence indeed! Nature and animals, it doesn't get much better than that.

I don't think nature or animals would factor in a constant state of bliss. Nature is a state of constant change and a tension. Without that change and tension you do not have nature, without nature there are no animals they become unnecessary because once you have a constant state the laws of cause and effect goes straight out the window.

Ok...what is your idea of a constant state of bliss?

Who are you asking? According to Cynthia, robots.

Yes, I was asking Cynthia.

 

[jan]

So then HaShev...how would you explain Jesus appearing to his disciples after his cruxifixion? Or, are we not considering the New Testament in this description of (lack of ) life after death?

1 Corinthians 15

The Resurrection of the Dead
12Now if Christ is preached, that He has been raised from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? 13But if there is no resurrection of the dead, not even Christ has been raised; 14and if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is vain, your faith also is vain.…
Cross References
1 Corinthians 15:12
But if it is preached that Christ has been raised from the dead, how can some of you say that there is no resurrection of the dead?1 Corinthians 15:14
And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith.
So...if there is no resurrection...that pretty much wipes out the entire Christian faith here.

Christianity teaches opposing ideologies because they formed the faith to be a combined new one world religion that Rome could be authority and benifactor to.
So the converged the opposing ideas 1) the Egyptian underworld mythology which Yeshu son of Mary learned wheb fleeing towards Egypt and Greek Death cult of Hades which believed in life in death, and yet they teach ressurection back into life through the Judaic teachings and plagiarization of the OT. It was Rabbi Yohoshua Ben Chananiah which taught ressurection ideas in the OT, and this became stolen and forged into the NT character through similar name and converging of stories to fit this image Rome was selling as a mask for Baal.
In fact in the Canaanite dying god mythology the son of baal called morning star-rev 22:16, dies to surpass his father Baal on the throne.
In the Jesus myth his ressurection is admitting to lying when he asks Mary to lie and say he ascended to his father- in John. They already claim he descended to hades not ascended, basically the devil being the gate keeper of hades is admittingly Jesus in the same book.
The apostles claim they don't recognize him so was it an impersonstor scam artist, and other writings claim he faked his death , but which christ,there were many all combine for the image Jesus, combined figures, faulty history dating, stories not adding up, all signs of a farce story where they can't ever keep their lies straight. Rome would have been better off writing a Johnny Knoxville movie if they didn't already.

So you only follow the Torah?

 

[jan]

But...you won't know until you are dead if that is true, right?

been there done that

Been dead? Really? What say ye about the experience?

it was alright

Ummmmm...ok...no other commentary? Any near death experiences to go on record with?

i have elaborated on this site before

and probably will again

but not tonight

im going to bed soon

Well, I'm sorry I missed your story. I'd love to hear about your experience sometime...perhaps some other time you're more awake and feel the urge?

Until then...I'll bid you goodnight.

 

[HaShev]

But come on we all know one persons bliss might be another's idea of hell.
Do you really think Pat Boones blissful top 40 music picks and fashion choices Hot scratchy sweaters with rudolph on them) is gonna be bliss for Jim Morrison?

 

[HaShev]

So you only follow the Torah

yes

 

[XploreR]

One of the carrots that Evangelical Christians like to dangle is that if you accept Jesus Christ as your "personal" as opposed to "universal" Lord and Savior is that you will not die and you get a golden ticket to the Kingdom of Heaven where Jesus will reign with his Apostles and everyone will be happy, praising the Lord and enjoying the bounty of goodies that Jesus will provide. Or something like that...you see with different Christian sects you get different views of the Afterlife, the Jehovah Witnesses believe that only a few go to heaven while most believers will live forever on a paradise earth, other Christians believe at the Resurrection of the Dead all believers will be translated into heaven and then there is the Rapture where believers go to heaven and then come back to earth to defeat Satan. But is an afterlife all that good? It seems to be boring to live forever doing nothing but worshiping Jesus all day long, and a eternity of nothing but happiness would nothing but monotonous and if everything is set up to make you happy then wouldn't that sap you of free will. It seems to me that people would not have much of a say or choice in anything they do, they would practically be robots. So what makes heaven seem like such a reward? If you really think about it, it seems more like a hell to me. What good would it do to live forever but have no free will?

Hi CynthiaZ. You've posed some interesting questions; similar to some I dealt with after my father's death. More than 20 years of personal research into those questions have provided me with some pretty solid answers. I hope I can be of some help to you. First, don't rely on the Bible as your only source of information. Since 1975, there's been an ever increasing--and now quite impressive--amount of evidence available for you to consider in the area called "Near-Death Experiences" or NDEs. They were named that by Dr. Raymond Moody before it was established that they were actually death experiences. I like to think of them as "Short Term Death Experiences," for that is precisely what they are. There are several good books written by the individuals who experienced death. My favorite recent one--a very powerful one--is called "Proof of Heaven," by Dr. Eben Alexander. He has followed that with a sequel detailing what he has learned from his own experience and following studies in a volume called, "A Map of Heaven." Both are excellent, powerful, thought provoking books, and an excellent starting point in your quest for answers. The Afterlife is much more complex than most people realize. There's an elaborate, profound, constant interaction between the spirit world and the physical. You and I and everyone else are participants in that interplay. Eternal life is a given. It's there for all of us. We don't have to qualify for it through some special activity or belief. We're already participants. Also, look into Past-Lives, or reincarnation. There's a lot of info out there about that too, and it's pertinent because we all reincarnate. Jesus himself taught reincarnation, but those teachings were removed from the religious writings by the Roman/Orthodox Church in 533 AD, and have been taboo in official Christianity since. That doesn't negate the fact that we all reincarnate though. Heaven is a place of intense love, joy and incredible beauty. Every NDE I’ve read about or interviewed personally reiterates those facts. Most don’t want to return to their bodies or lives here. Once back, they no longer fear death, knowing the joy awaiting them when they do finally leave. All have more patience, understanding, compassion, and love for their fellow creatures here on Earth after their NDE than they had before. All are changed for the better, permanently. Spiritual concerns replace material ones after NDEs. Heaven is a very positive place. In terms of no choices or lack of control or becoming “robots” in Heaven, that’s simply not so. In fact, the opposite is true. You have total control, with many choices, and complete freedom to pursue you own individual interests. It’s all very exciting.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

One of the carrots that Evangelical Christians like to dangle is that if you accept Jesus Christ as your "personal" as opposed to "universal" Lord and Savior is that you will not die and you get a golden ticket to the Kingdom of Heaven where Jesus will reign with his Apostles and everyone will be happy, praising the Lord and enjoying the bounty of goodies that Jesus will provide. Or something like that...you see with different Christian sects you get different views of the Afterlife, the Jehovah Witnesses believe that only a few go to heaven while most believers will live forever on a paradise earth, other Christians believe at the Resurrection of the Dead all believers will be translated into heaven and then there is the Rapture where believers go to heaven and then come back to earth to defeat Satan. But is an afterlife all that good? It seems to be boring to live forever doing nothing but worshiping Jesus all day long, and a eternity of nothing but happiness would nothing but monotonous and if everything is set up to make you happy then wouldn't that sap you of free will. It seems to me that people would not have much of a say or choice in anything they do, they would practically be robots. So what makes heaven seem like such a reward? If you really think about it, it seems more like a hell to me. What good would it do to live forever but have no free will?

Best, most honest answer I've discovered in a lifetime of study into religion is this:

I don't know. I've never died before.

 

[Dajjal]

I have had many messages from the spirit world, which denies the claim that you cannot come back and tell what the afterlife is like. The theory is that we inhabit many different realms which range from dark unpleasant places to paradise. It depends on our stage of spiritual evolution what level we go to. But it is not for eternity, it is only a respite between incarnations. According to the teachings I have studied we incarnate many, many times in a cycle of spiritual evolution that ultimately leads to a state of grace, or enlightenment. It is only when we achieve a state of spiritual grace that our cycle of incarnations ends, and then we continue to evolve as immortal beings.

See my thread 'spiritual teachings' for further information.

Spiritual teachings US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

 

[Abishai100]

Branding the Baton

Well, if there is an afterlife, at least we have more time to think about how to improve ourselves, though the labors involved suggest that immortality simply means an endless period of work and study.

Why do we bother making Hollywood (USA) movies about Jackie Robinson even though he is dead?

Why do we purchase computers with cute names?






Apple

 

[onefour1]

As an immortal you will no longer be under the constraints of mortality. You don't die, you don't starve, you won't have any physical need to sustain your life. No 8 to 5 job, no pains from growing old, no getting sick, no murders or death. People won't be controlled by money and bodily harm. The important things will be your interpersonal relationships with others. The richest guy will no longer be the most honored. The one who loves and cares for others will be exalted. You will not feel run down and tired but will be filled with vigor and energy. You will be able to do what you would like to do within the law but won't have to be subject to the labors of employment to sustain yourself. This will be a huge burden lifted from this mortal sphere. You will have much more freedom. You may take part in the oversight of other mortal worlds. Teaching and uplifting each other. You may even father or mother spirit children. Possibly help create worlds. There will be billions and billion to help progress and you could be fully engaged in helping others.

It may be that we get tired of things in this world because we just get tired. It is a condition of mortality. Being filled with health and energy and having the love of others and millions of friends to join you would be blissful. I believe there is a spirit of joy and happiness that far exceeds the joy and happiness we can achieve in this world. It will sustain you for all eternity.

 

[zaangalewa]

One of the carrots that Evangelical Christians like to dangle is that if you accept Jesus Christ as your "personal" as opposed to "universal" Lord and Savior is that you will not die and you get a golden ticket to the Kingdom of Heaven where Jesus will reign with his Apostles and everyone will be happy, praising the Lord and enjoying the bounty of goodies that Jesus will provide.

Now I understand why I never understood this "personal Jesus" concept. Thank you very much.

Or something like that...you see with different Christian sects you get different views of the Afterlife, the Jehovah Witnesses believe that only a few go to heaven while most believers will live forever on a paradise earth, other Christians believe at the Resurrection of the Dead all believers will be translated into heaven and then there is the Rapture where believers go to heaven and then come back to earth to defeat Satan. But is an afterlife all that good? It seems to be boring to live forever doing nothing but worshiping Jesus all day long,

Perhaps you could try to convince some souls not to stay in their personal hell any longer.

and a eternity of nothing but happiness would nothing but monotonous

What about an eternity of something and happiness?

and if everything is set up to make you happy then wouldn't that sap you of free will. It seems to me that people would not have much of a say or choice in anything they do, they would practically be robots.

So what makes heaven seem like such a reward? If you really think about it, it seems more like a hell to me. What good would it do to live forever but have no free will?

To agree with "the good" is free will. Why to agree with "the bad"? Only because of a test?