Abbas suggests Obama promised 67 lines - E. Jerusalem

[Sweet_Caroline]

Can you document that?

See 315 on this string.

OK, so?

That is a document?

This is.

Mandate For Palestine - The Legal Aspects of Jewish Rights

In particular the paragraph titled There Has Never Been a Sovereign Arab State in Palestine

 

[montelatici]

How could the Palestinians have been the citizens of Palestine then when Palestinians only came into existence in the mid 60's ?

What the heck are you talking about. Do some research before posting bullshit.


Palestinian Passport from 1943:

http://tinyurl.com/krgtv6r

If I may speak for toastman, I think he means it was not before the 1960's that the Arabs in Palestine began to talk about themselves as being a distinct people or nationality.

I have been on many political forums that discuss this issue, and this one has to have the least knowledgeable and most biased (pro-Israel) posters. Possibly because it is the only American-only forum I frequent.

The Palestinians (Muslim and Christians) thought of themselves as Palestinians centuries ago. More recently, and well before the 1960s, Palestinians held congresses throughout Palestine. The first Palestine Arab Congress met from 27 January to 10 February 1919, with 27 delegates from Muslim-Christian societies across Palestine.

I have no clue where you bozos get the idea that Palestinians weren't Palestinians until the 1960s. Israeli propaganda maybe?

Palestine Arab Congress - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[montelatici]

See 315 on this string.

OK, so?

That is a document?

This is.

Mandate For Palestine - The Legal Aspects of Jewish Rights

In particular the paragraph titled There Has Never Been a Sovereign Arab State in Palestine

So, The Latin Kingdom of Jerusalem was not a sovereign state. The propaganda is deafening.

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

What the heck are you talking about. Do some research before posting bullshit.


Palestinian Passport from 1943:

http://tinyurl.com/krgtv6r

If I may speak for toastman, I think he means it was not before the 1960's that the Arabs in Palestine began to talk about themselves as being a distinct people or nationality.

I have been on many political forums that discuss this issue, and this one has to have the least knowledgeable and most biased (pro-Israel) posters. Possibly because it is the only American-only forum I frequent.

The Palestinians (Muslim and Christians) thought of themselves as Palestinians centuries ago. More recently, and well before the 1960s, Palestinians held congresses throughout Palestine. The first Palestine Arab Congress met from 27 January to 10 February 1919, with 27 delegates from Muslim-Christian societies across Palestine.

I have no clue where you bozos get the idea that Palestinians weren't Palestinians until the 1960s. Israeli propaganda maybe?

Palestine Arab Congress - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

See number 321 above and get educated.

 

[montelatici]

If I may speak for toastman, I think he means it was not before the 1960's that the Arabs in Palestine began to talk about themselves as being a distinct people or nationality.

I have been on many political forums that discuss this issue, and this one has to have the least knowledgeable and most biased (pro-Israel) posters. Possibly because it is the only American-only forum I frequent.

The Palestinians (Muslim and Christians) thought of themselves as Palestinians centuries ago. More recently, and well before the 1960s, Palestinians held congresses throughout Palestine. The first Palestine Arab Congress met from 27 January to 10 February 1919, with 27 delegates from Muslim-Christian societies across Palestine.

I have no clue where you bozos get the idea that Palestinians weren't Palestinians until the 1960s. Israeli propaganda maybe?

Palestine Arab Congress - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

See number 321 above and get educated.

Do you really believe that anyone except brainwashed morons would use a Jewish propaganda site for obtaining facts. Grow up punk.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Why do you always deny the Jews their rights to free determination, and the treaty signed by the arab leaders giving Palestine to the Jews as their homeland. The only people pushed aside were the Jews who saw their allocation promised and signed for reduced to desert and indefensible land surrounded by hostile terrorists. The only agenda promoted was that of the arab league that wanted all the land and were prepared to break signed treaties to acquire the land.

As I said before Palestine has been under constant occupation for over 2,000 years until 1948 when it was released by the Mandate and the UN.

Surely Palestine has had more than its fair share of invasions, conquests, and occupations.

WWI was a turning point for Palestine. Palestine came into legal existence when it was separated from Turkish rule after WWI. Its land was defined by international borders. Palestinians were a nation of people distinct from their neighbors. The Palestinians were the citizens of Palestine.

The Palestinians had inalienable rights in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

The only reference to foreigners is that external interference is illegal.

How could the Palestinians have been the citizens of Palestine then when Palestinians only came into existence in the mid 60's ?

Drawing up the framework of nationality, Article 30 of the Treaty of Lausanne stated:

“Turkish subjects habitually resident in territory which in accordance with the provisions of the present Treaty is detached from Turkey will become ipso facto, in the conditions laid down by the local law, nationals of the State to which such territory is transferred.”​

Genesis of Citizenship in Palestine and Israel
----------------------------------
3.Q. What measures have been taken to bring the country under such political, administrative and economic conditions as will safeguard the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine, irrespective of race and religion? What are the effects of these measures?

A. The Palestinian Citizenship Order in Council which was made in August, 1925, provides for the acquisition of Palestinian citizenship by persons habitually resident in the country who were Ottoman subjects, and persons who were foreign subjects and take up permanent residence.

- See more at: Mandate for Palestine - Report of the Mandatory to the League of Nations (31 December 1925)

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

I have been on many political forums that discuss this issue, and this one has to have the least knowledgeable and most biased (pro-Israel) posters. Possibly because it is the only American-only forum I frequent.

The Palestinians (Muslim and Christians) thought of themselves as Palestinians centuries ago. More recently, and well before the 1960s, Palestinians held congresses throughout Palestine. The first Palestine Arab Congress met from 27 January to 10 February 1919, with 27 delegates from Muslim-Christian societies across Palestine.

I have no clue where you bozos get the idea that Palestinians weren't Palestinians until the 1960s. Israeli propaganda maybe?

Palestine Arab Congress - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

See number 321 above and get educated.

Do you really believe that anyone except brainwashed morons would use a Jewish propaganda site for obtaining facts. Grow up punk.

Oh I have more links. How about this?

 

[toastman]

Tinmore, does any of that refute what I said?

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

See number 321 above and get educated.

Do you really believe that anyone except brainwashed morons would use a Jewish propaganda site for obtaining facts. Grow up punk.

Oh I have more links. How about this?

And this

 

[P F Tinmore]

Tinmore, does any of that refute what I said?

Which "what I said" are you talking about?

 

[montelatici]

Do you really believe that anyone except brainwashed morons would use a Jewish propaganda site for obtaining facts. Grow up punk.

Oh I have more links. How about this?

And this

So the fact that Palestinians considered themselves Palestinians and held congresses as Palestinians as early as 1919 does not matter to you. To you the bullshit you have been fed trumps the truth and facts.

 

[ForeverYoung436]

OK, so?

That is a document?

This is.

Mandate For Palestine - The Legal Aspects of Jewish Rights

In particular the paragraph titled There Has Never Been a Sovereign Arab State in Palestine

So, The Latin Kingdom of Jerusalem was not a sovereign state. The propaganda is deafening.

The Latin Kingdom of Jerusalem was not a Sovereign Arab State. Since when were the European Christian Crusaders known as Arabs?

 

[RoccoR]

montelatici, et al,

I think there is a misunderstanding as to the meaning and intention of the descriptor: "Palestinian."

The resolutions of the Jerusalem Congress were:

• Palestine should be part of Arab Syria
• Rejection of French proposals for the area
• No foreign influence
• All foreign treaties referring to the area were voided
• To maintain friendly relations with Britain and the Allied powers, accepting help if it did not affect the country's independence

The original Arab Palestinian that you are referring to thought of themselves as part of the Ottoman State of Syria, which was not unreasonable. This is exactly how the Ottoman Empire thought of the territory. (I mentioned this before, in our talks a to why the Treaty of Lausanne never mentions "Palestine." But it did not make an impression.)

I have been on many political forums that discuss this issue, and this one has to have the least knowledgeable and most biased (pro-Israel) posters. Possibly because it is the only American-only forum I frequent.

The Palestinians (Muslim and Christians) thought of themselves as Palestinians centuries ago. More recently, and well before the 1960s, Palestinians held congresses throughout Palestine. The first Palestine Arab Congress met from 27 January to 10 February 1919, with 27 delegates from Muslim-Christian societies across Palestine.

I have no clue where you bozos get the idea that Palestinians weren't Palestinians until the 1960s. Israeli propaganda maybe?

Palestine Arab Congress - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(COMMENT)

Using your source (supra), you will no doubt note that it says: "The Congress rejected political Zionism, agreeing to accept British assistance if it did not impinge on Arab sovereignty in Palestine. Palestine was envisaged as part of an independent Syrian state, governed by Faisal of the Hashemite family."

While the Palestine Arab Congress attempted to establish a firm political base, it was not interested in a Palestinian Government; but rather, a Hashemite Government (similar to that of Trans-Jordan).

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

Oh I have more links. How about this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwBSWN4s9JU

And this

So the fact that Palestinians considered themselves Palestinians and held congresses as Palestinians as early as 1919 does not matter to you. To you the bullshit you have been fed trumps the truth and facts.

Wow, you certainly have problems absorbing facts.

 

[Roudy]

Of course they can't. They are still under 90 years of occupation.

The LoN Covenant called for the mandates to assist the people to independence. Britain violated the covenant by pushing the people aside and promoting the agenda of foreigners.

Why do you always deny the Jews their rights to free determination, and the treaty signed by the arab leaders giving Palestine to the Jews as their homeland. The only people pushed aside were the Jews who saw their allocation promised and signed for reduced to desert and indefensible land surrounded by hostile terrorists. The only agenda promoted was that of the arab league that wanted all the land and were prepared to break signed treaties to acquire the land.

As I said before Palestine has been under constant occupation for over 2,000 years until 1948 when it was released by the Mandate and the UN.

Surely Palestine has had more than its fair share of invasions, conquests, and occupations.

WWI was a turning point for Palestine. Palestine came into legal existence when it was separated from Turkish rule after WWI. Its land was defined by international borders. Palestinians were a nation of people distinct from their neighbors. The Palestinians were the citizens of Palestine.

The Palestinians had inalienable rights in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

The only reference to foreigners is that external interference is illegal.

Big elephant in the room Tinmore avoids is Arabs never considered themselves Palestinians. The term referred to Jews only until Arafat decided to hijack the name in the 60's. Like I said before the Arabs were offered their Muslim state state in Jordan, they refused and instead attacked the Jewish Palestine aka Israel. This conflict is about Arab Muslim intolerance and hatred of others. It has always been.

 

[Roudy]

And this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3n5-yG-6dU

So the fact that Palestinians considered themselves Palestinians and held congresses as Palestinians as early as 1919 does not matter to you. To you the bullshit you have been fed trumps the truth and facts.

Wow, you certainly have problems absorbing facts.

To be a die hard Palestinian Hamas supporter, a certain level of denial and mental illness is a requirement.

 

[Roudy]

Let us hear what other Arabs have said:

"There is no such country as Palestine. 'Palestine' is a term the Zionists invented. There is no Palestine in the Bible. Our country was for centuries part of Syria. 'Palestine' is alien to us. It is the Zionists who introduced it".
- Auni Bey Abdul-Hadi, Syrian Arab leader to British Peel Commission, 1937 -

"There is no such thing as Palestine in history, absolutely not".
- Professor Philip Hitti, Arab historian, 1946 -

"It is common knowledge that Palestine is nothing but Southern Syria".
- Representant of Saudi Arabia at the United Nations, 1956 -

Concerning the Holy Land, the chairman of the Syrian Delegation at the Paris Peace Conference in February 1919 stated:
"The only Arab domination since the Conquest in 635 c.e. hardly lasted, as such, 22 years".

 

[Roudy]

What other Arabs declared after the Six-Day War:

“Why is it that on June 4th 1967 I was a Jordanian and overnight I became a Palestinian?”
“We did not particularly mind Jordanian rule. The teaching of the destruction of Israel was a definite part of the curriculum, but we considered ourselves Jordanian until the Jews returned to Jerusalem. Then all of the sudden we were Palestinians - they removed the star from the Jordanian flag and all at once we had a Palestinian flag”.
“When I finally realized the lies and myths I was taught, it is my duty as a righteous person to speak out”.

-Former PLO terrorist

"There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are all part of one nation. It is only for political reasons that we carefully underline our Palestinian identity... yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity serves only tactical purposes. The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the continuing battle against Israel".

- Zuhair Muhsin, military commander of the PLO and member of the PLO Executive Council -

"You do not represent Palestine as much as we do. Never forget this one point: There is no such thing as a Palestinian people, there is no Palestinian entity, there is only Syria. You are an integral part of the Syrian people, Palestine is an integral part of Syria. Therefore it is we, the Syrian authorities, who are the true representatives of the Palestinian people".

- Syrian dictator Hafez Assad to the PLO leader Yassir Arafat -

"As I lived in Palestine, everyone I knew could trace their heritage back to the original country their great grandparents came from. Everyone knew their origin was not from the Canaanites, but ironically, this is the kind of stuff our education in the Middle East included. The fact is that today's Palestinians are immigrants from the surrounding nations! I grew up well knowing the history and origins of today's Palestinians as being from Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Morocco, Christians from Greece, muslim Sherkas from Russia, muslims from Bosnia, and the Jordanians next door. My grandfather, who was a dignitary in Bethlehem, almost lost his life by Abdul Qader Al-Husseni (the leader of the Palestinian revolution) after being accused of selling land to Jews. He used to tell us that his village Beit Sahur (The Shepherds Fields) in Bethlehem County was empty before his father settled in the area with six other families. The town has now grown to 30,000 inhabitants".

 

[P F Tinmore]

montelatici, et al,

I think there is a misunderstanding as to the meaning and intention of the descriptor: "Palestinian."

The resolutions of the Jerusalem Congress were:

• Palestine should be part of Arab Syria
• Rejection of French proposals for the area
• No foreign influence
• All foreign treaties referring to the area were voided
• To maintain friendly relations with Britain and the Allied powers, accepting help if it did not affect the country's independence

The original Arab Palestinian that you are referring to thought of themselves as part of the Ottoman State of Syria, which was not unreasonable. This is exactly how the Ottoman Empire thought of the territory. (I mentioned this before, in our talks a to why the Treaty of Lausanne never mentions "Palestine." But it did not make an impression.)

I have been on many political forums that discuss this issue, and this one has to have the least knowledgeable and most biased (pro-Israel) posters. Possibly because it is the only American-only forum I frequent.

The Palestinians (Muslim and Christians) thought of themselves as Palestinians centuries ago. More recently, and well before the 1960s, Palestinians held congresses throughout Palestine. The first Palestine Arab Congress met from 27 January to 10 February 1919, with 27 delegates from Muslim-Christian societies across Palestine.

I have no clue where you bozos get the idea that Palestinians weren't Palestinians until the 1960s. Israeli propaganda maybe?

Palestine Arab Congress - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(COMMENT)

Using your source (supra), you will no doubt note that it says: "The Congress rejected political Zionism, agreeing to accept British assistance if it did not impinge on Arab sovereignty in Palestine. Palestine was envisaged as part of an independent Syrian state, governed by Faisal of the Hashemite family."

While the Palestine Arab Congress attempted to establish a firm political base, it was not interested in a Palestinian Government; but rather, a Hashemite Government (similar to that of Trans-Jordan).

Most Respectfully,
R

The resolutions of the Jerusalem Congress were:

• Palestine should be part of Arab Syria
• Rejection of French proposals for the area
• No foreign influence
• All foreign treaties referring to the area were voided
• To maintain friendly relations with Britain and the Allied powers, accepting help if it did not affect the country's independence

They may have had a different vision for the future but they did firmly reject illegal foreign interference.

As did the Palestinians in general.

 

[toastman]

montelatici, et al,

I think there is a misunderstanding as to the meaning and intention of the descriptor: "Palestinian."

The resolutions of the Jerusalem Congress were:

• Palestine should be part of Arab Syria
• Rejection of French proposals for the area
• No foreign influence
• All foreign treaties referring to the area were voided
• To maintain friendly relations with Britain and the Allied powers, accepting help if it did not affect the country's independence

The original Arab Palestinian that you are referring to thought of themselves as part of the Ottoman State of Syria, which was not unreasonable. This is exactly how the Ottoman Empire thought of the territory. (I mentioned this before, in our talks a to why the Treaty of Lausanne never mentions "Palestine." But it did not make an impression.)

I have been on many political forums that discuss this issue, and this one has to have the least knowledgeable and most biased (pro-Israel) posters. Possibly because it is the only American-only forum I frequent.

The Palestinians (Muslim and Christians) thought of themselves as Palestinians centuries ago. More recently, and well before the 1960s, Palestinians held congresses throughout Palestine. The first Palestine Arab Congress met from 27 January to 10 February 1919, with 27 delegates from Muslim-Christian societies across Palestine.

I have no clue where you bozos get the idea that Palestinians weren't Palestinians until the 1960s. Israeli propaganda maybe?

Palestine Arab Congress - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(COMMENT)

Using your source (supra), you will no doubt note that it says: "The Congress rejected political Zionism, agreeing to accept British assistance if it did not impinge on Arab sovereignty in Palestine. Palestine was envisaged as part of an independent Syrian state, governed by Faisal of the Hashemite family."

While the Palestine Arab Congress attempted to establish a firm political base, it was not interested in a Palestinian Government; but rather, a Hashemite Government (similar to that of Trans-Jordan).

Most Respectfully,
R

The resolutions of the Jerusalem Congress were:

• Palestine should be part of Arab Syria
• Rejection of French proposals for the area
• No foreign influence
• All foreign treaties referring to the area were voided
• To maintain friendly relations with Britain and the Allied powers, accepting help if it did not affect the country's independence

They may have had a different vision for the future but they did firmly reject illegal foreign interference.

As did the Palestinians in general.

They also rejected sovereignty, independence and freedom