A British care system.

BML

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I'm English but even this far away from America I take a an interest in your political system many parts that I simply can't understand. In spite of reading through this forum I'm still unable to understand the disagreement on the Obama Care system so perhaps some would be kind enough to explain the basic facts.
I'm 82 years of age and have a number of medical problems all of which I receive treatment for paid for from central taxation. That doesn't mean it is free because I have paid taxes all my life and still continue to pay tax such as VAT which is a tax on everything other than food and a few other things. We certainly don't get asked for a credit card if we are taken into hospital.
 

Penelope

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The ACA (aka Obamacare) was the best thing to happen in the US. It got rid of the pre-existing condition clause where the health ins companies could charge you an ungodly price for health ins the sicker you were. They only were allowed to charge on age, and if one smoked.

There was a limit of 16 grand for one to get on the ACA, and it went up according to the income and persons in the home, the gov helped to pay the costs.

Also included was expanded Medicaid and some states refused to expand their Medicaid. (mainly the GOP states)

It also included things like essential health benefits, and cancer screenings.

Everybody had to have some ins, whether it was on the ACA, expanded Medicaid, regular Medicaid, or job related healthcare or pay a small fine.

The GOP were against it since inception, and now with Trump its been blown apart. We are back to the pre ACA days where the health ins. companies being the gate keepers.

Now you will have to work for a company that offers shared healthcare and they can treat you like crap due to they offer part payment for healthcare. Back are the days when you regret getting diagnosed with a condition due to the health insurance costs and even refusal to cover you, with caps on insurance.

The GOP and the elites always talk about how bad the UK health system is.

Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act - Wikipedia
 

frigidweirdo

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The ACA (aka Obamacare) was the best thing to happen in the US. It got rid of the pre-existing condition clause where the health ins companies could charge you an ungodly price for health ins the sicker you were. They only were allowed to charge on age, and if one smoked.

There was a limit of 16 grand for one to get on the ACA, and it went up according to the income and persons in the home, the gov helped to pay the costs.

Also included was expanded Medicaid and some states refused to expand their Medicaid. (mainly the GOP states)

It also included things like essential health benefits, and cancer screenings.

Everybody had to have some ins, whether it was on the ACA, expanded Medicaid, regular Medicaid, or job related healthcare or pay a small fine.

The GOP were against it since inception, and now with Trump its been blown apart. We are back to the pre ACA days where the health ins. companies being the gate keepers.

Now you will have to work for a company that offers shared healthcare and they can treat you like crap due to they offer part payment for healthcare. Back are the days when you regret getting diagnosed with a condition due to the health insurance costs and even refusal to cover you, with caps on insurance.

The GOP and the elites always talk about how bad the UK health system is.

Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act - Wikipedia
Still the NHS is massively better than Obamacare.
 

Anathema

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I'm English but even this far away from America I take a an interest in your political system many parts that I simply can't understand. In spite of reading through this forum I'm still unable to understand the disagreement on the Obama Care system so perhaps some would be kind enough to explain the basic facts..
As someone who is totally against the ACA/Obamacare let me explain my take on it...

1. The law has no legal standing under the US Constitution. As currently written the US Constitution does not give the Government legitimate power to be involved in healthcare at all. Not even the existing Medicare system.

2. I am a believer in Personal Responsibly, not Government influence. It’s not my place to pay for your care any more than it’s your place to pay for mine.
 

frigidweirdo

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I'm English but even this far away from America I take a an interest in your political system many parts that I simply can't understand. In spite of reading through this forum I'm still unable to understand the disagreement on the Obama Care system so perhaps some would be kind enough to explain the basic facts..
As someone who is totally against the ACA/Obamacare let me explain my take on it...

1. The law has no legal standing under the US Constitution. As currently written the US Constitution does not give the Government legitimate power to be involved in healthcare at all. Not even the existing Medicare system.

2. I am a believer in Personal Responsibly, not Government influence. It’s not my place to pay for your care any more than it’s your place to pay for mine.
I'm for personal responsibility. But I'm also for socialized healthcare.

Why?

Because some people are born wrong. It's not their fault.
Some people are born right. They didn't decide this.

In fact, I'm someone who hardly ever goes to hospital. Last time I went was because I cut off the tip of my finger 5 years ago.

However I know some people who aren't so lucky.

Why should you be screwed senseless because of how you were born, or because something happened that was out of your control?
 

Penelope

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I'm English but even this far away from America I take a an interest in your political system many parts that I simply can't understand. In spite of reading through this forum I'm still unable to understand the disagreement on the Obama Care system so perhaps some would be kind enough to explain the basic facts..
As someone who is totally against the ACA/Obamacare let me explain my take on it...

1. The law has no legal standing under the US Constitution. As currently written the US Constitution does not give the Government legitimate power to be involved in healthcare at all. Not even the existing Medicare system.

2. I am a believer in Personal Responsibly, not Government influence. It’s not my place to pay for your care any more than it’s your place to pay for mine.
Yes I don't feel like having auto ins but I need it to drive. Or does the gov. make you have a drivers license, that costs money, and Medicare, we pay in , and I suppose the rich do not like it, they pay cash.
You believers in freedom make me ill, you believe in freedom to do whatever you please like carry guns.

Get over yourself. Actually the distribution of wealth is from the poor to the rich.
 

Anathema

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...Because some people are born wrong. It's not their fault.
Some people are born right. They didn't decide this.

In fact, I'm someone who hardly ever goes to hospital. Last time I went was because I cut off the tip of my finger 5 years ago.

However I know some people who aren't so lucky.

Why should you be screwed senseless because of how you were born, or because something happened that was out of your control?
I’m one of those people who was born wrong. Look up Sturgeon Weber Syndrome when you have a minute. I’ll go to my grave before I take a penny if Government healthcare.
 

Anathema

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Yes I don't feel like having auto ins but I need it to drive. Or does the gov. make you have a drivers license, that costs money, and Medicare, we pay in , and I suppose the rich do not like it, they pay cash.
You believers in freedom make me ill, you believe in freedom to do whatever you please like carry guns.

Get over yourself. Actually the distribution of wealth is from the poor to the rich.
Actually, that’s how wealth is supposed to follow, but that’s a separate topic.

You shouldn’t have to have auto insurance any more than I should have to have health insurance. Now if something catastrophic happens to either of us, we should be paying out of pocket for it, not having the Government cover our ass.
 

Penelope

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Yes I don't feel like having auto ins but I need it to drive. Or does the gov. make you have a drivers license, that costs money, and Medicare, we pay in , and I suppose the rich do not like it, they pay cash.
You believers in freedom make me ill, you believe in freedom to do whatever you please like carry guns.

Get over yourself. Actually the distribution of wealth is from the poor to the rich.
Actually, that’s how wealth is supposed to follow, but that’s a separate topic.

You shouldn’t have to have auto insurance any more than I should have to have health insurance. Now if something catastrophic happens to either of us, we should be paying out of pocket for it, not having the Government cover our ass.
You sound like someone who inherited a fortune, most of us are normal people.
 

Anathema

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You sound like someone who inherited a fortune, most of us are normal people.
LOL. I inherited nothing more than a work ethic and a sense of morality. I live slightly better than paycheck to paycheck, nothing more. When I die I hoe to leave just enough to cover my debts and burial, nothing more. I am by no means Rich.
 

frigidweirdo

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...Because some people are born wrong. It's not their fault.
Some people are born right. They didn't decide this.

In fact, I'm someone who hardly ever goes to hospital. Last time I went was because I cut off the tip of my finger 5 years ago.

However I know some people who aren't so lucky.

Why should you be screwed senseless because of how you were born, or because something happened that was out of your control?
I’m one of those people who was born wrong. Look up Sturgeon Weber Syndrome when you have a minute. I’ll go to my grave before I take a penny if Government healthcare.
Fine, but there are others.

I have members of my family who struggle to work. It's not about laziness, they do volunteer work, but there are times when they can't, and people they can't deal with. They'll never have the money they need to be able to pay for the healthcare they need.
 

Anathema

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I have members of my family who struggle to work. It's not about laziness, they do volunteer work, but there are times when they can't, and people they can't deal with. They'll never have the money they need to be able to pay for the healthcare they need.
I do too. My wife can’t work due to her PTSD. I provide her support. That’s what families, friends and local charities are for.
 

dblack

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I'm English but even this far away from America I take a an interest in your political system many parts that I simply can't understand. In spite of reading through this forum I'm still unable to understand the disagreement on the Obama Care system so perhaps some would be kind enough to explain the basic facts.
I'm 82 years of age and have a number of medical problems all of which I receive treatment for paid for from central taxation. That doesn't mean it is free because I have paid taxes all my life and still continue to pay tax such as VAT which is a tax on everything other than food and a few other things. We certainly don't get asked for a credit card if we are taken into hospital.
I guess you're curious why many Americans are opposed to ACA. Here's my take: I don't want Donald Trump, or any other elected official, making decisions regarding my family's health care. Period.
 

grainbely

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I'm English but even this far away from America I take a an interest in your political system many parts that I simply can't understand. In spite of reading through this forum I'm still unable to understand the disagreement on the Obama Care system so perhaps some would be kind enough to explain the basic facts..
As someone who is totally against the ACA/Obamacare let me explain my take on it...

1. The law has no legal standing under the US Constitution. As currently written the US Constitution does not give the Government legitimate power to be involved in healthcare at all. Not even the existing Medicare system.

2. I am a believer in Personal Responsibly, not Government influence. It’s not my place to pay for your care any more than it’s your place to pay for mine.
I love the "I am an an island" personal responsibility line. If you want to be an island and evade taxes I suggest you liquidate your assets and float out to international waters. You can be an island out there.
 

frigidweirdo

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I have members of my family who struggle to work. It's not about laziness, they do volunteer work, but there are times when they can't, and people they can't deal with. They'll never have the money they need to be able to pay for the healthcare they need.
I do too. My wife can’t work due to her PTSD. I provide her support. That’s what families, friends and local charities are for.
Isn't that what society is for? Should society look after those more unfortunate than others?

Society back in the day used to be small, a few hundred people who looked after each other. Society has grown too big that people don't care about each other.
 

Anathema

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Isn't that what society is for? Should society look after those more unfortunate than others?

Society back in the day used to be small, a few hundred people who looked after each other. Society has grown too big that people don't care about each other.
dblack hit the nail squarely on the head... Society and Gocernment are not the same thing. The individuals and private entities that make up Society offer free choice in who they support and who they don’t. Government simply steals our money to support those people who they believe should be supported.
 

frigidweirdo

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Isn't that what society is for? Should society look after those more unfortunate than others?

Society back in the day used to be small, a few hundred people who looked after each other. Society has grown too big that people don't care about each other.
dblack hit the nail squarely on the head... Society and Gocernment are not the same thing. The individuals and private entities that make up Society offer free choice in who they support and who they don’t. Government simply steals our money to support those people who they believe should be supported.
Well, the problem is that what government SHOULD be, it isn't. Government, especially with democratic govt, is where people's choices are made.

However in the US the two political parties tell people how to think, rather than the voters telling the politicians.

When you have gerrymandering like crazy, when you have Wyoming with a vote three times more powerful than California, and neither state even gets a say in the election anyway, only 12 states do, you know things are wrong.

In Germany people get a say. 95% of people get the representative of their choice.

In the US, i'm not sure if anyone does.

Certainly in the German election with FPTP (Like the US has) the CDU/CSU gained 37% of the vote and 77% of the seats. With PR they got only 33% of the vote and 34.7% of the seats.

The difference is clear that in the US the system decides, not the votes. When this happens you get what you get.

The US has some of the worst problems in the western world. Ghettos with gun violence worse than anywhere else.

People refuse to see reality because the politicians need them to listen to them, because otherwise they lose their cash cow.
 

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