$15 Billion Unaccounted for in Iraq

[Toro]

The inspector general for the Defense Department said yesterday that the Pentagon cannot account for almost $15 billion worth of goods and services ranging from trucks, bottled water and mattresses to rocket-propelled grenades and machine guns that were bought from contractors in the Iraq reconstruction effort.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/22/AR2008052203751.html

One blogger made this observation

In fact, it appears as if virtually every procedure and law designed to prevent just this type of malfeasance was circumvented.

This spending was done in the midst of a national emergency and some of the usual safeguards couldn't be followed in the interest of national security and getting the job done quickly, right?

Nonsense. The Pentagon's own inspector general confirmed that this lack of concern for procedural safeguards was blatant and commonplace. That makes it hard to come to any conclusion other than that they were ignored rather than expedited or poorly executed.

It's also hard to come to any conclusion other than that the spending of taxpayer funds in Iraq bordered on, or actually was, simple and straightforward corruption.

Given the magnitude of the spending involved, Iraq may be the Bush administration's contribution to the biggest public corruption scandals of all time like Boss Tweed in New York, James Michael Curley in Boston, and Teapot Dome.

My question is whether any one, that is, any individual, will be prosecuted for their actions.

http://capitalgainsandgames.com/blog/stan-collender/336/bush-administrations-teapot-dome

 

[TheGoodShepherd]

The all volunteer army has been a disaster. The corporate business like structure of the U.S. army is a disgrace and a cancer.

It has led to intense corruption,malignant stupidity and outright theft.

 

[Gunny]

The all volunteer army has been a disaster. The corporate business like structure of the U.S. army is a disgrace and a cancer.

It has led to intense corruption,malignant stupidity and outright theft.

You are malignantly stupid beyond belief. It's been pretty-well established that you don't know one damned thing about the US military. Must you continue to prove it?

Since at the department procurement level the Army is and always has been "volunteers" and political appointees, on what do you base your stupid accusation?

The career force of the US military has always been volunteers; which, renders your baseless opinion as empty as your head.

Get a freakin' clue, huh?

 

[jillian]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/22/AR2008052203751.html

One blogger made this observation



http://capitalgainsandgames.com/blog/stan-collender/336/bush-administrations-teapot-dome

There's been talk about money being handed out and disappearing without any accountability for quite a while. It's disgusting.

The US flew nearly $12bn in shrink-wrapped $100 bills into Iraq, then distributed the cash with no proper control over who was receiving it and how it was being spent.
The staggering scale of the biggest transfer of cash in the history of the Federal Reserve has been graphically laid bare by a US congressional committee.

In the year after the invasion of Iraq in 2003 nearly 281 million notes, weighing 363 tonnes, were sent from New York to Baghdad for disbursement to Iraqi ministries and US contractors. Using C-130 planes, the deliveries took place once or twice a month with the biggest of $2,401,600,000 on June 22 2004, six days before the handover.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/feb/08/usa.iraq1

That said, it's not the fault of the military. It's the fault of the leaders.

GS is simply pathetic.

 

[TheGoodShepherd]

You are malignantly stupid

When will that light click on inside your head and demand you stop seeking a reply from me? How many posts and threads has it been now, where quoting me as if I would ever reply.

Use that big brain and take a hint.

I will not, under any circumstances talk, engage in, or debate you expect to remind you, that you're a waste of time.

I will never reply to you in any meaningful way. You have proven to be a hostile personality, valuing insults over substance and tirades over civility.

Again, stop seeking an answer from me.

You will never get it.

 

[jillian]

When will that light click on inside your head and demand you stop seeking a reply from me?

I will not, under any circumstances talk, engage in, or debate you expect to remind you, that you're a waste of time.

I will never reply to you in any meaningful way. You have proven to be a hostile personality, valuing insults over substance and tirades over civlity.

Again, stop seeking an answer from me.

You will never get it.

I don't think he cares if you reply to him or not. He's just pointing out that you're ignorant beyond belief. It's merely observation.... an accurate one, but observation nonetheless.

No need for you to respond. We can all observe the same thing.

 

[TheGoodShepherd]

I don't think he cares if you reply to him or not. He's just pointing out that you're ignorant beyond belief. It's merely observation.... an accurate one, but observation nonetheless.

No need for you to respond. We can all observe the same thing.

Are you going to sit there and agree to call me names?

Or are you going to put your money where your mouth is and discuss the actual issue?

Tell me where your point of contention is, and I will respond to it appropriately.

Calling me names, making broad accusations or agreeing with someone else hurling insults does nothing - I repeat - nothing to enhance any legitimate criticism you might have of my posts.

Throwing insults expose a member of message board with no class, no values and a shrewd hostility towards substantive discourse.

Either discuss the issue and bring serious arguments to the table; or go about your day thinking calling another poster names qualifies as serious discussion.

It's really up to you.

 

[jillian]

Are you going to sit there and agree to call me names?

Or are you going to put your money where your mouth is and discuss the actual issue?

Tell me where your point of contention is, and I will respond to it appropriately.

Calling me names, or agreeing with someone else hurling insults does nothing - I repeat - nothing to enhance any legitimate criticism you might have.

Either discuss the issue and bring serious arguments to the table; or go about your day thinking calling another poster names qualifies as serious discussion.

It's really up to you.

How do you discuss "facts" with someone who draws conclusions like you do? You aren't talking about facts. You're spewing opinion... and it's pretty ugly in there... so what "facts" would you have others debate?

 

[TheGoodShepherd]

How do you discuss "facts" with someone who draws conclusions like you do? You aren't talking about facts. You're spewing opinion... and it's pretty ugly in there... so what "facts" would you have others debate?

Again, are you going to discuss the issue?

Or will you waste everyone's time talking about me, as if I personally have anything to do with the claims I made.

 

[jillian]

Again, are you going to discuss the issue?

Or will you waste everyone's time talking about me, as if I personally have anything to do with the claims I made.

You aren't responsible for your own trashtalk? Are you channeling someone else, perhaps?

 

[TheGoodShepherd]

You aren't responsible for your own trashtalk? Are you channeling someone else, perhaps?

Again, are you going to discuss the issue, are you going to challenge the claims I made with seriousness?

They are there plain as day waiting for a response that isn't 'you're wrong because you're so ignorant!'

Or are you going to continue to launch unrelated nonsense like "You aren't responsible for your own trashtalk? Are you channeling someone else, perhaps."

Discuss the claims with substance, or fuck off to another thread and let your laziness prevail.

 

[cbi0090]

OMG! Can't account for it? What does that mean? They don't have a paper trail? I have to laugh when I hear stuff like this. Having worked for the Government and its accounting office I can tell you they operate under rules that are about as removed from reality as to be certifiably insane. What that might mean is that the backup documents are not in proper format, or not verifiable, or not using the proper f--king font!
It doesn't mean someone hasn't tried to justify it or attempted to provide the information that they need it just means they don't or won't recognize it and won't until it's all in order, which could take years.
When I worked for the Feds overseas we got a per diem. I could eat for $15/ day and stay at a hotel for $25/ day but my per diem was $190/ day?? Why, because you have to bribe the postal worker to get your mail, the maid and hotel manager to keep your stuff from getting stolen, the police at every little town you came to, the government workers, etc, etc, etc. U.S. accounting rules do not recognize graft as a legitimate expense so our company got around it by giving us enough and calling it a per diem and the Fed project manager had the good sense to give it the nod because he was realistic.
Now, if I had been a federal employee like our soldiers I/ we wouldn't have had that option. No, you have to have receipts for everything. Remember our troops are taught to be soldiers not accountants.

 

[TheGoodShepherd]

OMG! Can't account for it? What does that mean? They don't have a paper trail? I have to laugh when I hear stuff like this. Having worked for the Government and its accounting office I can tell you they operate under rules that are about as removed from reality as to be certifiably insane. What that might mean is that the backup documents are not in proper format, or not verifiable, or not using the proper f--king font!
It doesn't mean someone hasn't tried to justify it or attempted to provide the information that they need it just means they don't or won't recognize it and won't until it's all in order, which could take years.
When I worked for the Feds overseas we got a per diem. I could eat for $15/ day and stay at a hotel for $25/ day but my per diem was $190/ day?? Why, because you have to bribe the postal worker to get your mail, the maid and hotel manager to keep your stuff from getting stolen, the police at every little town you came to, the government workers, etc, etc, etc. U.S. accounting rules do not recognize graft as a legitimate expense so our company got around it by giving us enough and calling it a per diem and the Fed project manager had the good sense to give it the nod because he was realistic.
Now, if I had been a federal employee like our soldiers I/ we wouldn't have had that option. No, you have to have receipts for everything. Remember our troops are taught to be soldiers not accountants.

Wow.

I wish you had bothered to read the article. Your post has nothing to do with the claims made in the article especially the part about "Remember our troops are taught to be soldiers not accountants."

Read the article.

 

[Toro]

The all volunteer army has been a disaster. The corporate business like structure of the U.S. army is a disgrace and a cancer.

Could you explain what you mean by this. Its a broad-sweeping statement.

I am queasy about firms like Blackwater - with its neoNazi like symbolism and all - but I'm not sure why a volunteer army is a disaster and a worse option than an enlisted army.

 

[Gunny]

When will that light click on inside your head and demand you stop seeking a reply from me? How many posts and threads has it been now, where quoting me as if I would ever reply.

Use that big brain and take a hint.

I will not, under any circumstances talk, engage in, or debate you expect to remind you, that you're a waste of time.

I will never reply to you in any meaningful way. You have proven to be a hostile personality, valuing insults over substance and tirades over civility.

Again, stop seeking an answer from me.

You will never get it.

Why do you assume I seek an answer from you? You make a complete fool of yourself and I just like to help you out in that endeavor by highlighting it.

Contrary to your baseless accusation, you don't respond to me because you can't. Not responding ... except for the countless times you have informed me you're not responding to me ... only proves that fact.

Let's take your response to the original post for example. Stupid. Period. A display of absolute ignorance on your part. You've started two other threads making the same baseless claim and just got your ass whooped so bad by any and everybody that felt like it I'm surprised you haven't donned a paper bag over your head, changed your ID and moved to another board.

 

[Gunny]

Wow.

I wish you had bothered to read the article. Your post has nothing to do with the claims made in the article especially the part about "Remember our troops are taught to be soldiers not accountants."

Read the article.

Wow is right. His response is directly to the point. The problem here is that point seems to exceed your ability to grasp.

Not that your baseless, blind accusation in your original response in this thread has a damned thing to do with anything.

 

[Gunny]

Could you explain what you mean by this. Its a broad-sweeping statement.

I am queasy about firms like Blackwater - with its neoNazi like symbolism and all - but I'm not sure why a volunteer army is a disaster and a worse option than an enlisted army.

There are two threads in the military subform that he started making the same baseless claim and tapdances around for several pages in each. If you're interested, that is.

 

[jillian]

Could you explain what you mean by this. Its a broad-sweeping statement.

I am queasy about firms like Blackwater - with its neoNazi like symbolism and all - but I'm not sure why a volunteer army is a disaster and a worse option than an enlisted army.

There should never be a Blackwater or anything like it in this country.

As for the volunteer army, it isn't the problem. They do their jobs just fine for the most part. The problem comes from a) the sorry task they were asked to undertake (and which they seem to have done to the best of their ability); and b) the over-rotation of troops.

 

[TheGoodShepherd]

Could you explain what you mean by this. Its a broad-sweeping statement.

I am queasy about firms like Blackwater - with its neoNazi like symbolism and all - but I'm not sure why a volunteer army is a disaster and a worse option than an enlisted army.

Certainly, though you might have to wait until later tonight or tomorrow. Got some things to do.

 

[TheGoodShepherd]

Why do you assume I seek an answer from you? You make a complete fool of yourself and I just like to help you out in that endeavor by highlighting it.

Contrary to your baseless accusation, you don't respond to me because you can't. Not responding ... except for the countless times you have informed me you're not responding to me ... only proves that fact.

Let's take your response to the original post for example. Stupid. Period. A display of absolute ignorance on your part. You've started two other threads making the same baseless claim and just got your ass whooped so bad by any and everybody that felt like it I'm surprised you haven't donned a paper bag over your head, changed your ID and moved to another board.

Use that big brain and take a hint.

I will not, under any circumstances talk, engage in, or debate you expect to remind you, that you're a waste of time.