You have to pay for ObamaCare? Oh...

[CrusaderFrank]

Go to a full Universal Single Payer System like that of Canada. Paid for out of an increase in income taxes, one that goes all the way to the top, no cutoff as in Social Security.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fexz8Ij-OBQ]Paul Krugman Canadian healthcare - YouTube[/ame]

Oops. Why don't Canadians like their plan?

 

[SwimExpert]

Go to a full Universal Single Payer System like that of Canada. Paid for out of an increase in income taxes, one that goes all the way to the top, no cutoff as in Social Security.

Or.....People could just pay for their own selves. Why should I pay higher taxes just to pay for someone else's health care?

Why don't you just move to Somalia and avoid paying taxes at all? Because if you move to any of the civilised nations, your taxes will go up by a good amount.

Because I am an American and live right here in America. There is no reason for me to move out of country just because you want to make changes that will be detrimental to a great many people. If you like universal coverage so much, YOU should move to Canada. You're the one who is looking for something you can't find here.

 

[Mac1958]

Or.....People could just pay for their own selves. Why should I pay higher taxes just to pay for someone else's health care?

I don't know about you, but I'm a tightwad. Ask my wife and kids, they have great fun teasing me.

And as I've looked at the economic landscape as it pertains to health care (I'm also a financial advisor, so that shit is pretty much mandatory in my little world), I have dug down a few layers and come up with the following realization: A healthier populace is good economics. That really gets my attention.

Having people fend for themselves for health care will clearly, ultimately cause decay in the general health of our populace - in fact, it obviously already has. Between our horrific eating habits and a lack of access to fundamental preventive and diagnostic care, holy shit, it's a wonder we've survived this long.

The macro problems with the ACA are (a) its horrific bloat and abject lack of attention to fundamental market behavior and (b) its stunning lack of attention to simplifying our comedicly stupid mix of FIVE different health care payment systems - individual, group, VA, Medicare, Medicaid, and indigent.

By the way, "comedicly" did not pass spell-check muster, fuck it.

The Left has to defend this pig, but the fact that they "did something" about our health care system doesn't mean it's not a big, steaming bowl of shit.

.

 

[Seawytch]

Go to a full Universal Single Payer System like that of Canada. Paid for out of an increase in income taxes, one that goes all the way to the top, no cutoff as in Social Security.

Or.....People could just pay for their own selves. Why should I pay higher taxes just to pay for someone else's health care?

For the same reason we pay for everyone's education and National Defense. A healthy, educated and protected populous is a prosperous one.

 

[Vox]

The ones who have to pay for it are the young, healthy, people who were stupid enough to put Obama in office. For them it will be a hard lesson about socialism.

hopefully.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Or.....People could just pay for their own selves. Why should I pay higher taxes just to pay for someone else's health care?

I don't know about you, but I'm a tightwad. Ask my wife and kids, they have great fun teasing me.

And as I've looked at the economic landscape as it pertains to health care (I'm also a financial advisor, so that shit is pretty much mandatory in my little world), I have dug down a few layers and come up with the following realization: A healthier populace is good economics. That really gets my attention.

Having people fend for themselves for health care will clearly, ultimately cause decay in the general health of our populace - in fact, it obviously already has. Between our horrific eating habits and a lack of access to fundamental preventive and diagnostic care, holy shit, it's a wonder we've survived this long.

The macro problems with the ACA are (a) its horrific bloat and abject lack of attention to fundamental market behavior and (b) its stunning lack of attention to simplifying our comedicly stupid mix of FIVE different health care payment systems - individual, group, VA, Medicare, Medicaid, and indigent.

By the way, "comedicly" did not pass spell-check muster, fuck it.

The Left has to defend this pig, but the fact that they "did something" about our health care system doesn't mean it's not a big, steaming bowl of shit.

.

The left wants single payer. The right forced this compromise. You know that. Why not say it?

 

[Vox]

Go to a full Universal Single Payer System like that of Canada. Paid for out of an increase in income taxes, one that goes all the way to the top, no cutoff as in Social Security.

Or.....People could just pay for their own selves. Why should I pay higher taxes just to pay for someone else's health care?

For the same reason we pay for everyone's education and National Defense. A healthy, educated and protected populous is a prosperous one.

it is not the same thing as defence.

But, a minimal medical care can be a universal one - paid not by income taxes, but by the federal sales tax - so finally those who are not paying anything in any taxes but use the services will pay for it as well.
Can be just 1%.
If you buy a yaht - you will pay more than when you buy a pair of cheap shoes. But everyone will pay - and that is fair.

 

[Vox]

Go to a full Universal Single Payer System like that of Canada. Paid for out of an increase in income taxes, one that goes all the way to the top, no cutoff as in Social Security.

Or.....People could just pay for their own selves. Why should I pay higher taxes just to pay for someone else's health care?

Why don't you just move to Somalia and avoid paying taxes at all? Because if you move to any of the civilised nations, your taxes will go up by a good amount.

why won't YOU just move to North Korea and finally enjoy the government takeover of your life?

 

[Seawytch]

Or.....People could just pay for their own selves. Why should I pay higher taxes just to pay for someone else's health care?

For the same reason we pay for everyone's education and National Defense. A healthy, educated and protected populous is a prosperous one.

it is not the same thing as defence.

But, a minimal medical care can be a universal one - paid not by income taxes, but by the federal sales tax - so finally those who are not paying anything in any taxes but use the services will pay for it as well.
Can be just 1%.
If you buy a yaht - you will pay more than when you buy a pair of cheap shoes. But everyone will pay - and that is fair.

No, it isn't the same...it's more important than defense.

We can have a public/private healthcare system. Everyone gets the same basic healthcare but if you can afford supplemental plans, you get one. We are America, we can do this.

 

[Vox]

For the same reason we pay for everyone's education and National Defense. A healthy, educated and protected populous is a prosperous one.

it is not the same thing as defence.

But, a minimal medical care can be a universal one - paid not by income taxes, but by the federal sales tax - so finally those who are not paying anything in any taxes but use the services will pay for it as well.
Can be just 1%.
If you buy a yaht - you will pay more than when you buy a pair of cheap shoes. But everyone will pay - and that is fair.

No, it isn't the same...it's more important than defense.

We can have a public/private healthcare system. Everyone gets the same basic healthcare but if you can afford supplemental plans, you get one. We are America, we can do this.

no, it is not. it is much less important than defense. Defense is the main reason the government has the right to exist altogether. Healthcare is not.

But I agree with you on a basic level and supplemental plans.
Do you agree that is should be paid by sales tax - so everybody will pay into the system?

 

[LoneLaugher]

Or.....People could just pay for their own selves. Why should I pay higher taxes just to pay for someone else's health care?

For the same reason we pay for everyone's education and National Defense. A healthy, educated and protected populous is a prosperous one.

it is not the same thing as defence.

But, a minimal medical care can be a universal one - paid not by income taxes, but by the federal sales tax - so finally those who are not paying anything in any taxes but use the services will pay for it as well.
Can be just 1%.
If you buy a yaht - you will pay more than when you buy a pair of cheap shoes. But everyone will pay - and that is fair.

Cool. Then the poor person can be taxed on 100% of his income for health care while the wealthy person is only taxed on a fraction of his. Great plan.

 

[Vox]

For the same reason we pay for everyone's education and National Defense. A healthy, educated and protected populous is a prosperous one.

it is not the same thing as defence.

But, a minimal medical care can be a universal one - paid not by income taxes, but by the federal sales tax - so finally those who are not paying anything in any taxes but use the services will pay for it as well.
Can be just 1%.
If you buy a yaht - you will pay more than when you buy a pair of cheap shoes. But everyone will pay - and that is fair.

Cool. Then the poor person can be taxed on 100% of his income for health care while the wealthy person is only taxed on a fraction of his. Great plan.

piss off, retard.

 

[Edgetho]

Out of 1.1 million assumed obamacare entrants...
Only 5 percent have paid premium..
Being reported on fox news...

You can issue a 'Binder' without money. You can cover people with no money down. I did it for years.

When you call in your new car to your Agent, and it's more money, your Agent doesn't insist that you come to his office with money before he binds it.

If he does, I'd be looking for a new Agent and a new Insurance Company.

Small potatoes. What's important is a couple things...

First, as of tomorrow, there will be fewer people with Health Insurance than there are today.

Three Million fewer from what I understand.

Secondly, a lot of the Insurance Companies don't even know who has coverage and who doesn't.

As usual, when dimocraps do things without Adult Supervision (Republicans) the result is always the same.

dimocraps haven't figured out yet that you can't just WANT something to be done and then WISH it into existence.

Typical of their 8-year-old mentality.

I think, this time, Republicans don't bail them out. Left to their own devices, dimocraps are WAY too stupid to make this work.

They're dimocraps

 

[Defiant1]

Or.....People could just pay for their own selves. Why should I pay higher taxes just to pay for someone else's health care?

I don't know about you, but I'm a tightwad. Ask my wife and kids, they have great fun teasing me.

And as I've looked at the economic landscape as it pertains to health care (I'm also a financial advisor, so that shit is pretty much mandatory in my little world), I have dug down a few layers and come up with the following realization: A healthier populace is good economics. That really gets my attention.

Having people fend for themselves for health care will clearly, ultimately cause decay in the general health of our populace - in fact, it obviously already has. Between our horrific eating habits and a lack of access to fundamental preventive and diagnostic care, holy shit, it's a wonder we've survived this long.

The macro problems with the ACA are (a) its horrific bloat and abject lack of attention to fundamental market behavior and (b) its stunning lack of attention to simplifying our comedicly stupid mix of FIVE different health care payment systems - individual, group, VA, Medicare, Medicaid, and indigent.

By the way, "comedicly" did not pass spell-check muster, fuck it.

The Left has to defend this pig, but the fact that they "did something" about our health care system doesn't mean it's not a big, steaming bowl of shit.

.

The left wants single payer. The right forced this compromise. You know that. Why not say it?

Since ACA passed with no Republican votes how is it the right's fault that Single Payer wouldn't pass?

How was it that the Messiah couldn't muster the only votes he needed from Democrats?

 

[LoneLaugher]

I don't know about you, but I'm a tightwad. Ask my wife and kids, they have great fun teasing me.

And as I've looked at the economic landscape as it pertains to health care (I'm also a financial advisor, so that shit is pretty much mandatory in my little world), I have dug down a few layers and come up with the following realization: A healthier populace is good economics. That really gets my attention.

Having people fend for themselves for health care will clearly, ultimately cause decay in the general health of our populace - in fact, it obviously already has. Between our horrific eating habits and a lack of access to fundamental preventive and diagnostic care, holy shit, it's a wonder we've survived this long.

The macro problems with the ACA are (a) its horrific bloat and abject lack of attention to fundamental market behavior and (b) its stunning lack of attention to simplifying our comedicly stupid mix of FIVE different health care payment systems - individual, group, VA, Medicare, Medicaid, and indigent.

By the way, "comedicly" did not pass spell-check muster, fuck it.

The Left has to defend this pig, but the fact that they "did something" about our health care system doesn't mean it's not a big, steaming bowl of shit.

.

The left wants single payer. The right forced this compromise. You know that. Why not say it?

Since ACA passed with no Republican votes how is it the right's fault that Single Payer wouldn't pass?

How was it that the Messiah couldn't muster the only votes he needed from Democrats?

When you fall asleep on a plane, are you amazed that you are in a different place when you wake up?

 

[Mac1958]

I don't know about you, but I'm a tightwad. Ask my wife and kids, they have great fun teasing me.

And as I've looked at the economic landscape as it pertains to health care (I'm also a financial advisor, so that shit is pretty much mandatory in my little world), I have dug down a few layers and come up with the following realization: A healthier populace is good economics. That really gets my attention.

Having people fend for themselves for health care will clearly, ultimately cause decay in the general health of our populace - in fact, it obviously already has. Between our horrific eating habits and a lack of access to fundamental preventive and diagnostic care, holy shit, it's a wonder we've survived this long.

The macro problems with the ACA are (a) its horrific bloat and abject lack of attention to fundamental market behavior and (b) its stunning lack of attention to simplifying our comedicly stupid mix of FIVE different health care payment systems - individual, group, VA, Medicare, Medicaid, and indigent.

By the way, "comedicly" did not pass spell-check muster, fuck it.

The Left has to defend this pig, but the fact that they "did something" about our health care system doesn't mean it's not a big, steaming bowl of shit.

.

The left wants single payer. The right forced this compromise. You know that. Why not say it?

Since ACA passed with no Republican votes how is it the right's fault that Single Payer wouldn't pass?

How was it that the Messiah couldn't muster the only votes he needed from Democrats?

They act is if a new plan had to be passed right away, right now, under some kind of deadline. Then, under that assumption, they create this pig. This is the kind of thing you'll get when you do something like that. Just pass "something" and we'll figure it out later.

They have to try to divert, but they own this, for better or worse.

.

 

[LoneLaugher]

The left wants single payer. The right forced this compromise. You know that. Why not say it?

Since ACA passed with no Republican votes how is it the right's fault that Single Payer wouldn't pass?

How was it that the Messiah couldn't muster the only votes he needed from Democrats?

They act is if a new plan had to be passed right away, right now, under some kind of deadline. Then, under that assumption, they create this pig. This is the kind of thing you'll get when you do something like that. Just pass "something" and we'll figure it out later.

They have to try to divert, but they own this, for better or worse.

.

There "they" go again.

"The best time to plant a tree is a thousand years ago. The next best time is now."......Chinese proverb.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Out of 1.1 million assumed obamacare entrants...
Only 5 percent have paid premium..
Being reported on fox news...

yes this what the exchange is looking like

lots of abandoned carts

 

[LoneLaugher]

it is not the same thing as defence.

But, a minimal medical care can be a universal one - paid not by income taxes, but by the federal sales tax - so finally those who are not paying anything in any taxes but use the services will pay for it as well.
Can be just 1%.
If you buy a yaht - you will pay more than when you buy a pair of cheap shoes. But everyone will pay - and that is fair.

Cool. Then the poor person can be taxed on 100% of his income for health care while the wealthy person is only taxed on a fraction of his. Great plan.

piss off, retard.

Ouch! You are gonna make me cry.

 

[WelfareQueen]

Go to a full Universal Single Payer System like that of Canada. Paid for out of an increase in income taxes, one that goes all the way to the top, no cutoff as in Social Security.

I'm not for this type of plan, but I'd prefer it to this ACA beast.

The Democrats could have at least opened a serious national dialogue on Single Payer, but they did not. Instead, they rushed and pushed through this hideous Frankenstein's monster by the barest of margins. And now, liberals are having to defend it for political reasons. They can't point at Romneycare, they voted for the ACA. It's all theirs.

I'd love to have been a fly on the wall when Reid and Pelosi and gang decided they didn't have the guts to make Single Payer a national conversation.

.

Reid, Pelosi, and Obama never wanted a conversation about single payer because all the polls showed Americans were very happy with their current coverage. To discuss single payer openly was a loser. Look what happened to Hillary. So they lied and then created a Frankenstein monster.