Will you condemn this murder?

[Phoenall]

And have the culprits been caught yet, I wonder what you will say if they happen to be islamonazi extremists ?
And are you not inciting racism towards the jews by blaming them for the death without any concrete evidence.

How many times have you blamed crimes on Palestinians ahead of conviction or concrete evidence? Sheesh...double standards The Israeli authorities seem pretty certain here, but we'll see.

And not once proven wrong because the Palestinians had been caught in the act, and that is the difference. Any lawyer worth the name would get any Israeli off on the charge because so many people have posted guilty verdicts on all forms of social media already. That is why this particular thread should have been taken down straight away and anyone that tried to resurrect it banned for a week.

well, at least you are honest about your double standard! Thanks for the confirmation

What double standards are those as I apply the same standards to all sides. If the Jews are caught red handed then I say they should face the same punishment as the Palestinians. Until this time I apply the legal stricture of SUB JUDICE so that I cant be blamed for being party to the failure of the court case against the guilty party. In this case I say that the settlers are innocent until proven guilty, unlike you who say the JOOOOOS are guilty and should burn for their crimes.

umh...you just implied that because Palestinians had "been caught in the act" - well, now - not with the kidnapping and murder of the 3 Israeli boys for instance. Were you one of the voices saying - hey, hold up, let's wait for more evidence?

The hamas leadership admitted that they were behind the kidnapping and murders. The suspects decided to go into hiding and when found to shoot it out with the IDF. The Israelis have the same recording facilities as the CIA/FBI and knew who was speaking on the phone, and gave the names of the people they wanted to question. You want more evidence than this because they were known terrorists, yet you want no evidence to arrest settlers because they are Jews. Want to explain your double standards and hypocrisy, or is it because your Jew hated is clouding your thoughts ?

 

[fanger]

A (as in one)
veteran Hamas official has said that the Islamist group was behind the kidnapping of three Israeli teenagers in the West Bank – an incident that was a major trigger for the current brutal war in Gaza.

Saleh al-Arouri, one of the founders of Hamas's military wing, made his comments at a conference in Istanbul, where he lives in exile. A tape of his comments was posted online by conference organisers.

"There was much speculation about this operation; some said it was a conspiracy," al-Arouri said at a meeting of the International Union of Islamic Scholars on Wednesday.

"The popular will was exercised throughout our occupied land, and culminated in the heroic operation by [Hamas's armed wing] the Qassam Brigades in imprisoning the three settlers in Hebron."

His claim has not been supported by any other member of Hamas.

Hamas official we were behind the kidnapping of three Israeli teenagers World news The Guardian

 

[Coyote]

Let's please stay on topic guys and not derail this thread with the mandate history.

 

[Hollie]

A (as in one)
veteran Hamas official has said that the Islamist group was behind the kidnapping of three Israeli teenagers in the West Bank – an incident that was a major trigger for the current brutal war in Gaza.

Saleh al-Arouri, one of the founders of Hamas's military wing, made his comments at a conference in Istanbul, where he lives in exile. A tape of his comments was posted online by conference organisers.

"There was much speculation about this operation; some said it was a conspiracy," al-Arouri said at a meeting of the International Union of Islamic Scholars on Wednesday.

"The popular will was exercised throughout our occupied land, and culminated in the heroic operation by [Hamas's armed wing] the Qassam Brigades in imprisoning the three settlers in Hebron."

His claim has not been supported by any other member of Hamas.

Hamas official we were behind the kidnapping of three Israeli teenagers World news The Guardian

The worlds gone all to hell when you can't trust your local affiliate Islamic terrorist spokes- beard.

 

[rylah]

Wow all this bullcake to try and convince us that blaming and judging before conviction is ok.

But the man point is to divide the Israeli public and convince the west that
blood libels against those Hebrew families in Judea and Shomron are
accepted.

Hey do You remember, not long ago when a lowlife creature
JUSTIFIED the MURDER OF CHILDREN AND INFANTS:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/threads/will-you-condemn-this-murder.434096/page-17#post-11993285

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

The UN does not designate terrorists organization in that way.

And just what are those "instructions from the UN"?

Helping Member States to counter terrorism - United Nations Action to Counter Terrorism

. Security Council resolution 1373 makes it mandatory for all states to eliminate the financing of terrorism, while resolution 1267 along with subsequent related resolutions freeze all the financial assets of Al Qaida and Taliban associates. Both those resolutions call for strict travel bans against potential terrorists. Subsequent Security Council resolutions also place Al Qaida and Taliban members under a strict arms embargo. The recently concluded International Convention for the Suppression of Nuclear Terrorism aims to prevent potential terrorists from acquiring nuclear weapons while resolution 1540 of the Security Council creates a mandatory set of measures for countries to implement in order to prevent terrorists from acquiring weapons of mass destruction.

And seeing as no nation has deemed Jews to be terrorists then it does not apply to Israel

Where does the UN designate the Palestinians as terrorists?

(COMMENT)

All terrorist activities hide behind the fact that the UN has not defined "terrorism" on the Global Level (a concept without a universally accepted definition); but rather --- an umbrella description on a level of political activism that employees a measure of depravity to coercion and intimidation a population of governed entity to accept a political end state. (Like pornography: You know it when you see it. Just as there is no true definition universally accepted for "political violence.") No one argues that the Palestinian Olympic Massacre, or the attack on October 15, 2003 when an explosion on a diplomatic convoy traveling through the Gaza Strip killed four Americans (and the several hundred hijackings, suicide bombings, and ambushes in between) were not Palestinian terrorist attacks designed to make a statement.

NOTE: To be clear, not all Palestinians are terrorists. However most Palestinians have provided material support to terrorist activities in one form or another. HAMAS is a political movement that opposes the basic tenants of the UN Charter [Article 2(4)] and the Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States; relative to the threat or use of force. It is a self-proclaimed Jihadist organization. The argument that it is a democratically elected governments (from nearly a decade ago) on goes to lend evidence that the People of Gaza support a government that supports terrorism; and lends protection training facilities and safe havens to other terrorist groups.
​

Terrorism, and the associated activities, are a crime(s) committed by persons, organizations or governments. These crimes or activities have, thus far, been defined either under individual domestic law of member nations, or by economic and/or security cooperatives. The European Union defines it as:

Article 1

Terrorist offences and fundamental rights and principles

1. Each Member State shall take the necessary measures to ensure that the intentional acts referred to below in points (a) to (i), as defined as offences under national law, which, given their nature or context, may seriously damage a country or an international organisation where committed with the aim of:

- seriously intimidating a population, or

- unduly compelling a Government or international organisation to perform or abstain from performing any act, or

- seriously destabilising or destroying the fundamental political, constitutional, economic or social structures of a country or an international organisation,
​

shall be deemed to be terrorist offences:

(a) attacks upon a person's life which may cause death;

(b) attacks upon the physical integrity of a person;

(c) kidnapping or hostage taking;

(d) causing extensive destruction to a Government or public facility, a transport system, an infrastructure facility, including an information system, a fixed platform located on the continental shelf, a public place or private property likely to endanger human life or result in major economic loss;

(e) seizure of aircraft, ships or other means of public or goods transport;

(f) manufacture, possession, acquisition, transport, supply or use of weapons, explosives or of nuclear, biological or chemical weapons, as well as research into, and development of, biological and chemical weapons;

(g) release of dangerous substances, or causing fires, floods or explosions the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(h) interfering with or disrupting the supply of water, power or any other fundamental natural resource the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(i) threatening to commit any of the acts listed in (a) to (h).
​

​

Terrorism as a form of political activism is recognized or defined by their organizational actions, or in the some cases, self-defined (Jihadists or Islamists).

Murder is a domestic crime. Depending on the intent, magnitude and purpose, it can be a war crime, a crime against humanity, terrorism, or any combination thereof. To be an terrorism, there must be the element of the threat or use of force to project intimidation or coercion. Clearly, when Leon Klinghoffer, a disabled jewish American appliance manufacturer, who was murdered and thrown overboard by Palestinian Terrorists (Abu Abbas) who pirated the cruise ship Achille Lauro in 1985; the Palestinian Terrorist were making a statement. Similarly, when three Israeli teenagers were kidnapped at the bus/hitchhiking stop at the Israeli settlement, and HAMAS official Salah al-Arouri (founder of the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, the Hamas military), and publicly acknowledged the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, was behind the kidnappings and murder, --- this event as well, was used as a means of coercion and intimidation (making a political statement). And the threat does not have to be militarily effective to create an atmosphere of intimidation:

"Are the tunnels a new calamity capable of changing the balance of power in Gaza? Probably not. It’s difficult to find instances when tunnel tactics have fundamentally altered the course of a war. They are, by nature, tactics born of desperation. But they have always been effective in sowing fear. It’s no coincidence that we’re hearing a lot about tunnels precisely when events in Gaza find the Israelis in desperate need of friends."
SOURCE: Washington Post Gerard DeGroot is a professor of history at the University of St Andrews in Scotland.
​

Over and over again, I've seen the Palestinian Terrorist try and hide behind the argument that there is no UN Definition for terrorist or terrorism, per sa, yet there is no question that the UN Security Council can recognize it when they see it. Not only does the UN have a complete Global Counter-Terrorism Strategy in place, but the Security Council has passed over three dozen Resolutions (since the beginning of the 21st Century) that implement the strategy.

The Palestinians (in particular HAMAS) need to argue this point (and the point that it is NOT an international conflict --- an argument in itself that is a double-edged sword) because UN Security Council Resolution 1373 stipulates that it: "Reaffirming the need to combat by all means, in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations, threats to international peace and security caused by terrorist acts."

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[fanger]

Wow all this bullcake to try and convince us that blaming and judging before conviction is ok.

But the man point is to divide the Israeli public and convince the west that
blood libels against those Hebrew families in Judea and Shomron are
accepted.

Hey do You remember, not long ago when a lowlife creature
JUSTIFIED the MURDER OF CHILDREN AND INFANTS:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/threads/will-you-condemn-this-murder.434096/page-17#post-11993285

you link to your own post, much of which is written in a foreign language, while this forum uses english

 

[RoccoR]

rylah, et al,

Yes, this needs to put in the proper perspective as a local law enforcement issue to be properly investigated.

Stop

Coyote, et al,

Yes, I have to agree.

Coyote, fanger, rylah, et al,

The original discussion centered around the "arson attack by suspected Jewish settlers in the West Bank." I don't know enough about the case and the investigative outcomes to make a comment specifically. But I would not jump to the conclusion that this unknown suspect was motivated by the political climate --- just yet. Nor would I jump to the conclusion that the target of the arson was the "18-month-old boy" (emphasized in the media article) or the family; not until there is some more information.

Most Respectfully,
R

Rocco,

This incidence is the latest in a number of similar arson attacks by religious extremists...Israeli authorities don't seem to be in much doubt.

While the target may not have been specifically the baby, the person or persons responsible for this knew they were firebombing a house that people lived in at a time when people would there. To say that they weren't targeting people is like saying the murderers of the Fogel family just happened to be passing by with their knives. Fire, knives - the intent is to kill people.

What has been really striking in all this is the emphasis on "suspected", "alleged", "don't jump to conclusions" which I agree with but is a concern that has sadly been lacking when the perpetrator is assumed to be Palestinian.

(COMMENT)

The concept is just as applicable to some of the criminal activity and events associated with the Palestinians.

And you are very correct, I have seen many cases in which the observers make assumptions and associations that are not held in evidence. My favorite of late was the indirect fire mission that lead to the death of several boys on the beach. While it was (ultimately) true that the impacts were a result of Israeli fires, it did not come from the Naval elements at some considerable stand-off range.

I think that the emotion raised on both sides --- as a result of a very prolonged conflict, has had an adverse effect on many. In some cases, the effect is the compulsion to kill what they believe is the enemy; the expression of a criminal mind.

Most Respectfully,
R

Once people choose to kill with deliberate disregard for the lives they are taking...and to me, there is little difference between the arsonist here and the killers of the Fogels earlier what does it say about the humanity of the person willing to do it? These actions - in combination with the burning alive of an Palestinian youth earlier and an increased number of serious assaults from both sides have upped the ante. Many of the perpetrators seem to be youths - even minors. People who's brains have not yet fully developed in terms of judgement and impulse. Where are the parents? How are they getting and making petrol bombs and molotov cocktails? What are they being taught? Are any of them horrified by the consequences of their actions?

The point that those are young people-SPOT ON.
But the question is - on which side is the brainwashing and recruitment being a tuned mechanism working with groups for decades versus reactionary steps of individuals...evenly unjustified.

(COMMENT)

The crime is what it is. And the Law Enforcement agency has to run its investigation and refer the case for prosecutorial action in the appropriate court.

The question of animosity and social discord between the two elements (Israeli-Palestinian) needs to be set aside until the trial. It should not play a part until the investigation is complete.

There may be a case of depraved indifference (incitement by an adult to commit a felony). It would seem to me that it should also be investigated and, given the evidence, considered for referral.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[rylah]

Wow all this bullcake to try and convince us that blaming and judging before conviction is ok.

But the man point is to divide the Israeli public and convince the west that
blood libels against those Hebrew families in Judea and Shomron are
accepted.

Hey do You remember, not long ago when a lowlife creature
JUSTIFIED the MURDER OF CHILDREN AND INFANTS:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/threads/will-you-condemn-this-murder.434096/page-17#post-11993285

you link to your own post, much of which is written in a foreign language, while this forum uses english

Showing what a despicable thing you wrote in Hebrew
about the murder of infants and children.

Just to put things in perspective, when being asked to condemn
a whole unconvict population to justify a blood libel.
Also to show who demands such bogus thing- what material they're built of.

I think it's most relevant to the topic.

 

[fanger]

Roccor

Also to blame, of course, are the law enforcement authorities, starting with the Judea and Samaria District Police – the most ridiculous and scandalous of all police districts, and not by chance. Nine Palestinian homes were torched in the past three years, according to B’Tselem. How many people have been prosecuted? None. So what happened in Duma on Friday? The fire was simply better, in the eyes of the arsonists and their minions.

Their minions also include the silent, the forgiving and all those who think the evil will remain forever within the confines of the West Bank. Their minions also include the Israelis who are convinced that the People of Israel is the chosen people, and as a result is permitted to do anything – including torching the homes of non-Jews, with their inhabitants inside.
read more: All Israelis Are Guilty of Setting a Palestinian Family on Fire Opinion Haaretz Daily Newspaper Israel News

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

The UN does not designate terrorists organization in that way.

And just what are those "instructions from the UN"?

Helping Member States to counter terrorism - United Nations Action to Counter Terrorism

. Security Council resolution 1373 makes it mandatory for all states to eliminate the financing of terrorism, while resolution 1267 along with subsequent related resolutions freeze all the financial assets of Al Qaida and Taliban associates. Both those resolutions call for strict travel bans against potential terrorists. Subsequent Security Council resolutions also place Al Qaida and Taliban members under a strict arms embargo. The recently concluded International Convention for the Suppression of Nuclear Terrorism aims to prevent potential terrorists from acquiring nuclear weapons while resolution 1540 of the Security Council creates a mandatory set of measures for countries to implement in order to prevent terrorists from acquiring weapons of mass destruction.

And seeing as no nation has deemed Jews to be terrorists then it does not apply to Israel

Where does the UN designate the Palestinians as terrorists?

(COMMENT)

All terrorist activities hide behind the fact that the UN has not defined "terrorism" on the Global Level (a concept without a universally accepted definition); but rather --- an umbrella description on a level of political activism that employees a measure of depravity to coercion and intimidation a population of governed entity to accept a political end state. (Like pornography: You know it when you see it. Just as there is no true definition universally accepted for "political violence.") No one argues that the Palestinian Olympic Massacre, or the attack on October 15, 2003 when an explosion on a diplomatic convoy traveling through the Gaza Strip killed four Americans (and the several hundred hijackings, suicide bombings, and ambushes in between) were not Palestinian terrorist attacks designed to make a statement.

NOTE: To be clear, not all Palestinians are terrorists. However most Palestinians have provided material support to terrorist activities in one form or another. HAMAS is a political movement that opposes the basic tenants of the UN Charter [Article 2(4)] and the Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States; relative to the threat or use of force. It is a self-proclaimed Jihadist organization. The argument that it is a democratically elected governments (from nearly a decade ago) on goes to lend evidence that the People of Gaza support a government that supports terrorism; and lends protection training facilities and safe havens to other terrorist groups.
​

Terrorism, and the associated activities, are a crime(s) committed by persons, organizations or governments. These crimes or activities have, thus far, been defined either under individual domestic law of member nations, or by economic and/or security cooperatives. The European Union defines it as:

Article 1

Terrorist offences and fundamental rights and principles

1. Each Member State shall take the necessary measures to ensure that the intentional acts referred to below in points (a) to (i), as defined as offences under national law, which, given their nature or context, may seriously damage a country or an international organisation where committed with the aim of:

- seriously intimidating a population, or

- unduly compelling a Government or international organisation to perform or abstain from performing any act, or

- seriously destabilising or destroying the fundamental political, constitutional, economic or social structures of a country or an international organisation,
​

shall be deemed to be terrorist offences:

(a) attacks upon a person's life which may cause death;

(b) attacks upon the physical integrity of a person;

(c) kidnapping or hostage taking;

(d) causing extensive destruction to a Government or public facility, a transport system, an infrastructure facility, including an information system, a fixed platform located on the continental shelf, a public place or private property likely to endanger human life or result in major economic loss;

(e) seizure of aircraft, ships or other means of public or goods transport;

(f) manufacture, possession, acquisition, transport, supply or use of weapons, explosives or of nuclear, biological or chemical weapons, as well as research into, and development of, biological and chemical weapons;

(g) release of dangerous substances, or causing fires, floods or explosions the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(h) interfering with or disrupting the supply of water, power or any other fundamental natural resource the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(i) threatening to commit any of the acts listed in (a) to (h).​

Terrorism as a form of political activism is recognized or defined by their organizational actions, or in the some cases, self-defined (Jihadists or Islamists).

Murder is a domestic crime. Depending on the intent, magnitude and purpose, it can be a war crime, a crime against humanity, terrorism, or any combination thereof. To be an terrorism, there must be the element of the threat or use of force to project intimidation or coercion. Clearly, when Leon Klinghoffer, a disabled jewish American appliance manufacturer, who was murdered and thrown overboard by Palestinian Terrorists (Abu Abbas) who pirated the cruise ship Achille Lauro in 1985; the Palestinian Terrorist were making a statement. Similarly, when three Israeli teenagers were kidnapped at the bus/hitchhiking stop at the Israeli settlement, and HAMAS official Salah al-Arouri (founder of the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, the Hamas military), and publicly acknowledged the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, was behind the kidnappings and murder, --- this event as well, was used as a means of coercion and intimidation (making a political statement). And the threat does not have to be militarily effective to create an atmosphere of intimidation:

"Are the tunnels a new calamity capable of changing the balance of power in Gaza? Probably not. It’s difficult to find instances when tunnel tactics have fundamentally altered the course of a war. They are, by nature, tactics born of desperation. But they have always been effective in sowing fear. It’s no coincidence that we’re hearing a lot about tunnels precisely when events in Gaza find the Israelis in desperate need of friends."
SOURCE: Washington Post Gerard DeGroot is a professor of history at the University of St Andrews in Scotland.
​

Over and over again, I've seen the Palestinian Terrorist try and hide behind the argument that there is no UN Definition for terrorist or terrorism, per sa, yet there is no question that the UN Security Council can recognize it when they see it. Not only does the UN have a complete Global Counter-Terrorism Strategy in place, but the Security Council has passed over three dozen Resolutions (since the beginning of the 21st Century) that implement the strategy.

The Palestinians (in particular HAMAS) need to argue this point (and the point that it is NOT an international conflict --- an argument in itself that is a double-edged sword) because UN Security Council Resolution 1373 stipulates that it: "Reaffirming the need to combat by all means, in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations, threats to international peace and security caused by terrorist acts."

Most Respectfully,
R

But Hamas are not terrorists in Palestine where they were elected and supported.

They don't buy into that foreign name calling crap.

Interesting @ 1:10

 

[P F Tinmore]

Roccor

Also to blame, of course, are the law enforcement authorities, starting with the Judea and Samaria District Police – the most ridiculous and scandalous of all police districts, and not by chance. Nine Palestinian homes were torched in the past three years, according to B’Tselem. How many people have been prosecuted? None. So what happened in Duma on Friday? The fire was simply better, in the eyes of the arsonists and their minions.

Their minions also include the silent, the forgiving and all those who think the evil will remain forever within the confines of the West Bank. Their minions also include the Israelis who are convinced that the People of Israel is the chosen people, and as a result is permitted to do anything – including torching the homes of non-Jews, with their inhabitants inside.
read more: All Israelis Are Guilty of Setting a Palestinian Family on Fire Opinion Haaretz Daily Newspaper Israel News

P F Tinmore, et al,

The UN does not designate terrorists organization in that way.

And just what are those "instructions from the UN"?

Helping Member States to counter terrorism - United Nations Action to Counter Terrorism

. Security Council resolution 1373 makes it mandatory for all states to eliminate the financing of terrorism, while resolution 1267 along with subsequent related resolutions freeze all the financial assets of Al Qaida and Taliban associates. Both those resolutions call for strict travel bans against potential terrorists. Subsequent Security Council resolutions also place Al Qaida and Taliban members under a strict arms embargo. The recently concluded International Convention for the Suppression of Nuclear Terrorism aims to prevent potential terrorists from acquiring nuclear weapons while resolution 1540 of the Security Council creates a mandatory set of measures for countries to implement in order to prevent terrorists from acquiring weapons of mass destruction.

And seeing as no nation has deemed Jews to be terrorists then it does not apply to Israel

Where does the UN designate the Palestinians as terrorists?

(COMMENT)

All terrorist activities hide behind the fact that the UN has not defined "terrorism" on the Global Level (a concept without a universally accepted definition); but rather --- an umbrella description on a level of political activism that employees a measure of depravity to coercion and intimidation a population of governed entity to accept a political end state. (Like pornography: You know it when you see it. Just as there is no true definition universally accepted for "political violence.") No one argues that the Palestinian Olympic Massacre, or the attack on October 15, 2003 when an explosion on a diplomatic convoy traveling through the Gaza Strip killed four Americans (and the several hundred hijackings, suicide bombings, and ambushes in between) were not Palestinian terrorist attacks designed to make a statement.

NOTE: To be clear, not all Palestinians are terrorists. However most Palestinians have provided material support to terrorist activities in one form or another. HAMAS is a political movement that opposes the basic tenants of the UN Charter [Article 2(4)] and the Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States; relative to the threat or use of force. It is a self-proclaimed Jihadist organization. The argument that it is a democratically elected governments (from nearly a decade ago) on goes to lend evidence that the People of Gaza support a government that supports terrorism; and lends protection training facilities and safe havens to other terrorist groups.
​

Terrorism, and the associated activities, are a crime(s) committed by persons, organizations or governments. These crimes or activities have, thus far, been defined either under individual domestic law of member nations, or by economic and/or security cooperatives. The European Union defines it as:

Article 1

Terrorist offences and fundamental rights and principles

1. Each Member State shall take the necessary measures to ensure that the intentional acts referred to below in points (a) to (i), as defined as offences under national law, which, given their nature or context, may seriously damage a country or an international organisation where committed with the aim of:

- seriously intimidating a population, or

- unduly compelling a Government or international organisation to perform or abstain from performing any act, or

- seriously destabilising or destroying the fundamental political, constitutional, economic or social structures of a country or an international organisation,
​

shall be deemed to be terrorist offences:

(a) attacks upon a person's life which may cause death;

(b) attacks upon the physical integrity of a person;

(c) kidnapping or hostage taking;

(d) causing extensive destruction to a Government or public facility, a transport system, an infrastructure facility, including an information system, a fixed platform located on the continental shelf, a public place or private property likely to endanger human life or result in major economic loss;

(e) seizure of aircraft, ships or other means of public or goods transport;

(f) manufacture, possession, acquisition, transport, supply or use of weapons, explosives or of nuclear, biological or chemical weapons, as well as research into, and development of, biological and chemical weapons;

(g) release of dangerous substances, or causing fires, floods or explosions the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(h) interfering with or disrupting the supply of water, power or any other fundamental natural resource the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(i) threatening to commit any of the acts listed in (a) to (h).​

Terrorism as a form of political activism is recognized or defined by their organizational actions, or in the some cases, self-defined (Jihadists or Islamists).

Murder is a domestic crime. Depending on the intent, magnitude and purpose, it can be a war crime, a crime against humanity, terrorism, or any combination thereof. To be an terrorism, there must be the element of the threat or use of force to project intimidation or coercion. Clearly, when Leon Klinghoffer, a disabled jewish American appliance manufacturer, who was murdered and thrown overboard by Palestinian Terrorists (Abu Abbas) who pirated the cruise ship Achille Lauro in 1985; the Palestinian Terrorist were making a statement. Similarly, when three Israeli teenagers were kidnapped at the bus/hitchhiking stop at the Israeli settlement, and HAMAS official Salah al-Arouri (founder of the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, the Hamas military), and publicly acknowledged the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, was behind the kidnappings and murder, --- this event as well, was used as a means of coercion and intimidation (making a political statement). And the threat does not have to be militarily effective to create an atmosphere of intimidation:

"Are the tunnels a new calamity capable of changing the balance of power in Gaza? Probably not. It’s difficult to find instances when tunnel tactics have fundamentally altered the course of a war. They are, by nature, tactics born of desperation. But they have always been effective in sowing fear. It’s no coincidence that we’re hearing a lot about tunnels precisely when events in Gaza find the Israelis in desperate need of friends."
SOURCE: Washington Post Gerard DeGroot is a professor of history at the University of St Andrews in Scotland.
​

Over and over again, I've seen the Palestinian Terrorist try and hide behind the argument that there is no UN Definition for terrorist or terrorism, per sa, yet there is no question that the UN Security Council can recognize it when they see it. Not only does the UN have a complete Global Counter-Terrorism Strategy in place, but the Security Council has passed over three dozen Resolutions (since the beginning of the 21st Century) that implement the strategy.

The Palestinians (in particular HAMAS) need to argue this point (and the point that it is NOT an international conflict --- an argument in itself that is a double-edged sword) because UN Security Council Resolution 1373 stipulates that it: "Reaffirming the need to combat by all means, in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations, threats to international peace and security caused by terrorist acts."

Most Respectfully,
R

But Hamas are not terrorists in Palestine where they were elected and supported.

They don't buy into that foreign name calling crap.

Interesting @ 1:10

And how many times were they REelected...when was their last election?

They haven't had elections since the US trashed their entire political system in 2007.

 

[rylah]

'cause they're (Hamas) never wrong...You're wicked, and a master at playing dumb.

I think this is why there were no more elections:

 

[Hollie]

Roccor

Also to blame, of course, are the law enforcement authorities, starting with the Judea and Samaria District Police – the most ridiculous and scandalous of all police districts, and not by chance. Nine Palestinian homes were torched in the past three years, according to B’Tselem. How many people have been prosecuted? None. So what happened in Duma on Friday? The fire was simply better, in the eyes of the arsonists and their minions.

Their minions also include the silent, the forgiving and all those who think the evil will remain forever within the confines of the West Bank. Their minions also include the Israelis who are convinced that the People of Israel is the chosen people, and as a result is permitted to do anything – including torching the homes of non-Jews, with their inhabitants inside.
read more: All Israelis Are Guilty of Setting a Palestinian Family on Fire Opinion Haaretz Daily Newspaper Israel News

P F Tinmore, et al,

The UN does not designate terrorists organization in that way.

Helping Member States to counter terrorism - United Nations Action to Counter Terrorism

. Security Council resolution 1373 makes it mandatory for all states to eliminate the financing of terrorism, while resolution 1267 along with subsequent related resolutions freeze all the financial assets of Al Qaida and Taliban associates. Both those resolutions call for strict travel bans against potential terrorists. Subsequent Security Council resolutions also place Al Qaida and Taliban members under a strict arms embargo. The recently concluded International Convention for the Suppression of Nuclear Terrorism aims to prevent potential terrorists from acquiring nuclear weapons while resolution 1540 of the Security Council creates a mandatory set of measures for countries to implement in order to prevent terrorists from acquiring weapons of mass destruction.

And seeing as no nation has deemed Jews to be terrorists then it does not apply to Israel

Where does the UN designate the Palestinians as terrorists?

(COMMENT)

All terrorist activities hide behind the fact that the UN has not defined "terrorism" on the Global Level (a concept without a universally accepted definition); but rather --- an umbrella description on a level of political activism that employees a measure of depravity to coercion and intimidation a population of governed entity to accept a political end state. (Like pornography: You know it when you see it. Just as there is no true definition universally accepted for "political violence.") No one argues that the Palestinian Olympic Massacre, or the attack on October 15, 2003 when an explosion on a diplomatic convoy traveling through the Gaza Strip killed four Americans (and the several hundred hijackings, suicide bombings, and ambushes in between) were not Palestinian terrorist attacks designed to make a statement.

NOTE: To be clear, not all Palestinians are terrorists. However most Palestinians have provided material support to terrorist activities in one form or another. HAMAS is a political movement that opposes the basic tenants of the UN Charter [Article 2(4)] and the Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States; relative to the threat or use of force. It is a self-proclaimed Jihadist organization. The argument that it is a democratically elected governments (from nearly a decade ago) on goes to lend evidence that the People of Gaza support a government that supports terrorism; and lends protection training facilities and safe havens to other terrorist groups.
​

Terrorism, and the associated activities, are a crime(s) committed by persons, organizations or governments. These crimes or activities have, thus far, been defined either under individual domestic law of member nations, or by economic and/or security cooperatives. The European Union defines it as:

Article 1

Terrorist offences and fundamental rights and principles

1. Each Member State shall take the necessary measures to ensure that the intentional acts referred to below in points (a) to (i), as defined as offences under national law, which, given their nature or context, may seriously damage a country or an international organisation where committed with the aim of:

- seriously intimidating a population, or

- unduly compelling a Government or international organisation to perform or abstain from performing any act, or

- seriously destabilising or destroying the fundamental political, constitutional, economic or social structures of a country or an international organisation,
​

shall be deemed to be terrorist offences:

(a) attacks upon a person's life which may cause death;

(b) attacks upon the physical integrity of a person;

(c) kidnapping or hostage taking;

(d) causing extensive destruction to a Government or public facility, a transport system, an infrastructure facility, including an information system, a fixed platform located on the continental shelf, a public place or private property likely to endanger human life or result in major economic loss;

(e) seizure of aircraft, ships or other means of public or goods transport;

(f) manufacture, possession, acquisition, transport, supply or use of weapons, explosives or of nuclear, biological or chemical weapons, as well as research into, and development of, biological and chemical weapons;

(g) release of dangerous substances, or causing fires, floods or explosions the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(h) interfering with or disrupting the supply of water, power or any other fundamental natural resource the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(i) threatening to commit any of the acts listed in (a) to (h).​

Terrorism as a form of political activism is recognized or defined by their organizational actions, or in the some cases, self-defined (Jihadists or Islamists).

Murder is a domestic crime. Depending on the intent, magnitude and purpose, it can be a war crime, a crime against humanity, terrorism, or any combination thereof. To be an terrorism, there must be the element of the threat or use of force to project intimidation or coercion. Clearly, when Leon Klinghoffer, a disabled jewish American appliance manufacturer, who was murdered and thrown overboard by Palestinian Terrorists (Abu Abbas) who pirated the cruise ship Achille Lauro in 1985; the Palestinian Terrorist were making a statement. Similarly, when three Israeli teenagers were kidnapped at the bus/hitchhiking stop at the Israeli settlement, and HAMAS official Salah al-Arouri (founder of the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, the Hamas military), and publicly acknowledged the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, was behind the kidnappings and murder, --- this event as well, was used as a means of coercion and intimidation (making a political statement). And the threat does not have to be militarily effective to create an atmosphere of intimidation:

"Are the tunnels a new calamity capable of changing the balance of power in Gaza? Probably not. It’s difficult to find instances when tunnel tactics have fundamentally altered the course of a war. They are, by nature, tactics born of desperation. But they have always been effective in sowing fear. It’s no coincidence that we’re hearing a lot about tunnels precisely when events in Gaza find the Israelis in desperate need of friends."
SOURCE: Washington Post Gerard DeGroot is a professor of history at the University of St Andrews in Scotland.
​

Over and over again, I've seen the Palestinian Terrorist try and hide behind the argument that there is no UN Definition for terrorist or terrorism, per sa, yet there is no question that the UN Security Council can recognize it when they see it. Not only does the UN have a complete Global Counter-Terrorism Strategy in place, but the Security Council has passed over three dozen Resolutions (since the beginning of the 21st Century) that implement the strategy.

The Palestinians (in particular HAMAS) need to argue this point (and the point that it is NOT an international conflict --- an argument in itself that is a double-edged sword) because UN Security Council Resolution 1373 stipulates that it: "Reaffirming the need to combat by all means, in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations, threats to international peace and security caused by terrorist acts."

Most Respectfully,
R

But Hamas are not terrorists in Palestine where they were elected and supported.

They don't buy into that foreign name calling crap.

Interesting @ 1:10

And how many times were they REelected...when was their last election?

They haven't had elections since the US trashed their entire political system in 2007.

I blame the Great Satan™ is a convenient excuse.

 

[Phoenall]

A (as in one)
veteran Hamas official has said that the Islamist group was behind the kidnapping of three Israeli teenagers in the West Bank – an incident that was a major trigger for the current brutal war in Gaza.

Saleh al-Arouri, one of the founders of Hamas's military wing, made his comments at a conference in Istanbul, where he lives in exile. A tape of his comments was posted online by conference organisers.

"There was much speculation about this operation; some said it was a conspiracy," al-Arouri said at a meeting of the International Union of Islamic Scholars on Wednesday.

"The popular will was exercised throughout our occupied land, and culminated in the heroic operation by [Hamas's armed wing] the Qassam Brigades in imprisoning the three settlers in Hebron."

His claim has not been supported by any other member of Hamas.

Hamas official we were behind the kidnapping of three Israeli teenagers World news The Guardian

Thank you for admitting that hamas admitted to being involved in the kidnapping and murder of 3 Israeli boys, sparking the start of the war last summer.

 

[Phoenall]

P F Tinmore, et al,

The UN does not designate terrorists organization in that way.

And just what are those "instructions from the UN"?

Helping Member States to counter terrorism - United Nations Action to Counter Terrorism

. Security Council resolution 1373 makes it mandatory for all states to eliminate the financing of terrorism, while resolution 1267 along with subsequent related resolutions freeze all the financial assets of Al Qaida and Taliban associates. Both those resolutions call for strict travel bans against potential terrorists. Subsequent Security Council resolutions also place Al Qaida and Taliban members under a strict arms embargo. The recently concluded International Convention for the Suppression of Nuclear Terrorism aims to prevent potential terrorists from acquiring nuclear weapons while resolution 1540 of the Security Council creates a mandatory set of measures for countries to implement in order to prevent terrorists from acquiring weapons of mass destruction.

And seeing as no nation has deemed Jews to be terrorists then it does not apply to Israel

Where does the UN designate the Palestinians as terrorists?

(COMMENT)

All terrorist activities hide behind the fact that the UN has not defined "terrorism" on the Global Level (a concept without a universally accepted definition); but rather --- an umbrella description on a level of political activism that employees a measure of depravity to coercion and intimidation a population of governed entity to accept a political end state. (Like pornography: You know it when you see it. Just as there is no true definition universally accepted for "political violence.") No one argues that the Palestinian Olympic Massacre, or the attack on October 15, 2003 when an explosion on a diplomatic convoy traveling through the Gaza Strip killed four Americans (and the several hundred hijackings, suicide bombings, and ambushes in between) were not Palestinian terrorist attacks designed to make a statement.

NOTE: To be clear, not all Palestinians are terrorists. However most Palestinians have provided material support to terrorist activities in one form or another. HAMAS is a political movement that opposes the basic tenants of the UN Charter [Article 2(4)] and the Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States; relative to the threat or use of force. It is a self-proclaimed Jihadist organization. The argument that it is a democratically elected governments (from nearly a decade ago) on goes to lend evidence that the People of Gaza support a government that supports terrorism; and lends protection training facilities and safe havens to other terrorist groups.
​

Terrorism, and the associated activities, are a crime(s) committed by persons, organizations or governments. These crimes or activities have, thus far, been defined either under individual domestic law of member nations, or by economic and/or security cooperatives. The European Union defines it as:

Article 1

Terrorist offences and fundamental rights and principles

1. Each Member State shall take the necessary measures to ensure that the intentional acts referred to below in points (a) to (i), as defined as offences under national law, which, given their nature or context, may seriously damage a country or an international organisation where committed with the aim of:

- seriously intimidating a population, or

- unduly compelling a Government or international organisation to perform or abstain from performing any act, or

- seriously destabilising or destroying the fundamental political, constitutional, economic or social structures of a country or an international organisation,
​

shall be deemed to be terrorist offences:

(a) attacks upon a person's life which may cause death;

(b) attacks upon the physical integrity of a person;

(c) kidnapping or hostage taking;

(d) causing extensive destruction to a Government or public facility, a transport system, an infrastructure facility, including an information system, a fixed platform located on the continental shelf, a public place or private property likely to endanger human life or result in major economic loss;

(e) seizure of aircraft, ships or other means of public or goods transport;

(f) manufacture, possession, acquisition, transport, supply or use of weapons, explosives or of nuclear, biological or chemical weapons, as well as research into, and development of, biological and chemical weapons;

(g) release of dangerous substances, or causing fires, floods or explosions the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(h) interfering with or disrupting the supply of water, power or any other fundamental natural resource the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(i) threatening to commit any of the acts listed in (a) to (h).​

Terrorism as a form of political activism is recognized or defined by their organizational actions, or in the some cases, self-defined (Jihadists or Islamists).

Murder is a domestic crime. Depending on the intent, magnitude and purpose, it can be a war crime, a crime against humanity, terrorism, or any combination thereof. To be an terrorism, there must be the element of the threat or use of force to project intimidation or coercion. Clearly, when Leon Klinghoffer, a disabled jewish American appliance manufacturer, who was murdered and thrown overboard by Palestinian Terrorists (Abu Abbas) who pirated the cruise ship Achille Lauro in 1985; the Palestinian Terrorist were making a statement. Similarly, when three Israeli teenagers were kidnapped at the bus/hitchhiking stop at the Israeli settlement, and HAMAS official Salah al-Arouri (founder of the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, the Hamas military), and publicly acknowledged the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, was behind the kidnappings and murder, --- this event as well, was used as a means of coercion and intimidation (making a political statement). And the threat does not have to be militarily effective to create an atmosphere of intimidation:

"Are the tunnels a new calamity capable of changing the balance of power in Gaza? Probably not. It’s difficult to find instances when tunnel tactics have fundamentally altered the course of a war. They are, by nature, tactics born of desperation. But they have always been effective in sowing fear. It’s no coincidence that we’re hearing a lot about tunnels precisely when events in Gaza find the Israelis in desperate need of friends."
SOURCE: Washington Post Gerard DeGroot is a professor of history at the University of St Andrews in Scotland.
​

Over and over again, I've seen the Palestinian Terrorist try and hide behind the argument that there is no UN Definition for terrorist or terrorism, per sa, yet there is no question that the UN Security Council can recognize it when they see it. Not only does the UN have a complete Global Counter-Terrorism Strategy in place, but the Security Council has passed over three dozen Resolutions (since the beginning of the 21st Century) that implement the strategy.

The Palestinians (in particular HAMAS) need to argue this point (and the point that it is NOT an international conflict --- an argument in itself that is a double-edged sword) because UN Security Council Resolution 1373 stipulates that it: "Reaffirming the need to combat by all means, in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations, threats to international peace and security caused by terrorist acts."

Most Respectfully,
R

But Hamas are not terrorists in Palestine where they were elected and supported.

They don't buy into that foreign name calling crap.

Interesting @ 1:10

beside the point as the rest of the civilised world sees them as terrorists, and it is not foreign name calling any more than your Zionism and hasbara is. Strangely Palestinians in gaza are now saying that hamas are terrorists and want to change the regime through the ballot box

 

[Phoenall]

Roccor

Also to blame, of course, are the law enforcement authorities, starting with the Judea and Samaria District Police – the most ridiculous and scandalous of all police districts, and not by chance. Nine Palestinian homes were torched in the past three years, according to B’Tselem. How many people have been prosecuted? None. So what happened in Duma on Friday? The fire was simply better, in the eyes of the arsonists and their minions.

Their minions also include the silent, the forgiving and all those who think the evil will remain forever within the confines of the West Bank. Their minions also include the Israelis who are convinced that the People of Israel is the chosen people, and as a result is permitted to do anything – including torching the homes of non-Jews, with their inhabitants inside.
read more: All Israelis Are Guilty of Setting a Palestinian Family on Fire Opinion Haaretz Daily Newspaper Israel News

P F Tinmore, et al,

The UN does not designate terrorists organization in that way.

Helping Member States to counter terrorism - United Nations Action to Counter Terrorism

. Security Council resolution 1373 makes it mandatory for all states to eliminate the financing of terrorism, while resolution 1267 along with subsequent related resolutions freeze all the financial assets of Al Qaida and Taliban associates. Both those resolutions call for strict travel bans against potential terrorists. Subsequent Security Council resolutions also place Al Qaida and Taliban members under a strict arms embargo. The recently concluded International Convention for the Suppression of Nuclear Terrorism aims to prevent potential terrorists from acquiring nuclear weapons while resolution 1540 of the Security Council creates a mandatory set of measures for countries to implement in order to prevent terrorists from acquiring weapons of mass destruction.

And seeing as no nation has deemed Jews to be terrorists then it does not apply to Israel

Where does the UN designate the Palestinians as terrorists?

(COMMENT)

All terrorist activities hide behind the fact that the UN has not defined "terrorism" on the Global Level (a concept without a universally accepted definition); but rather --- an umbrella description on a level of political activism that employees a measure of depravity to coercion and intimidation a population of governed entity to accept a political end state. (Like pornography: You know it when you see it. Just as there is no true definition universally accepted for "political violence.") No one argues that the Palestinian Olympic Massacre, or the attack on October 15, 2003 when an explosion on a diplomatic convoy traveling through the Gaza Strip killed four Americans (and the several hundred hijackings, suicide bombings, and ambushes in between) were not Palestinian terrorist attacks designed to make a statement.

NOTE: To be clear, not all Palestinians are terrorists. However most Palestinians have provided material support to terrorist activities in one form or another. HAMAS is a political movement that opposes the basic tenants of the UN Charter [Article 2(4)] and the Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States; relative to the threat or use of force. It is a self-proclaimed Jihadist organization. The argument that it is a democratically elected governments (from nearly a decade ago) on goes to lend evidence that the People of Gaza support a government that supports terrorism; and lends protection training facilities and safe havens to other terrorist groups.
​

Terrorism, and the associated activities, are a crime(s) committed by persons, organizations or governments. These crimes or activities have, thus far, been defined either under individual domestic law of member nations, or by economic and/or security cooperatives. The European Union defines it as:

Article 1

Terrorist offences and fundamental rights and principles

1. Each Member State shall take the necessary measures to ensure that the intentional acts referred to below in points (a) to (i), as defined as offences under national law, which, given their nature or context, may seriously damage a country or an international organisation where committed with the aim of:

- seriously intimidating a population, or

- unduly compelling a Government or international organisation to perform or abstain from performing any act, or

- seriously destabilising or destroying the fundamental political, constitutional, economic or social structures of a country or an international organisation,
​

shall be deemed to be terrorist offences:

(a) attacks upon a person's life which may cause death;

(b) attacks upon the physical integrity of a person;

(c) kidnapping or hostage taking;

(d) causing extensive destruction to a Government or public facility, a transport system, an infrastructure facility, including an information system, a fixed platform located on the continental shelf, a public place or private property likely to endanger human life or result in major economic loss;

(e) seizure of aircraft, ships or other means of public or goods transport;

(f) manufacture, possession, acquisition, transport, supply or use of weapons, explosives or of nuclear, biological or chemical weapons, as well as research into, and development of, biological and chemical weapons;

(g) release of dangerous substances, or causing fires, floods or explosions the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(h) interfering with or disrupting the supply of water, power or any other fundamental natural resource the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(i) threatening to commit any of the acts listed in (a) to (h).​

Terrorism as a form of political activism is recognized or defined by their organizational actions, or in the some cases, self-defined (Jihadists or Islamists).

Murder is a domestic crime. Depending on the intent, magnitude and purpose, it can be a war crime, a crime against humanity, terrorism, or any combination thereof. To be an terrorism, there must be the element of the threat or use of force to project intimidation or coercion. Clearly, when Leon Klinghoffer, a disabled jewish American appliance manufacturer, who was murdered and thrown overboard by Palestinian Terrorists (Abu Abbas) who pirated the cruise ship Achille Lauro in 1985; the Palestinian Terrorist were making a statement. Similarly, when three Israeli teenagers were kidnapped at the bus/hitchhiking stop at the Israeli settlement, and HAMAS official Salah al-Arouri (founder of the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, the Hamas military), and publicly acknowledged the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, was behind the kidnappings and murder, --- this event as well, was used as a means of coercion and intimidation (making a political statement). And the threat does not have to be militarily effective to create an atmosphere of intimidation:

"Are the tunnels a new calamity capable of changing the balance of power in Gaza? Probably not. It’s difficult to find instances when tunnel tactics have fundamentally altered the course of a war. They are, by nature, tactics born of desperation. But they have always been effective in sowing fear. It’s no coincidence that we’re hearing a lot about tunnels precisely when events in Gaza find the Israelis in desperate need of friends."
SOURCE: Washington Post Gerard DeGroot is a professor of history at the University of St Andrews in Scotland.
​

Over and over again, I've seen the Palestinian Terrorist try and hide behind the argument that there is no UN Definition for terrorist or terrorism, per sa, yet there is no question that the UN Security Council can recognize it when they see it. Not only does the UN have a complete Global Counter-Terrorism Strategy in place, but the Security Council has passed over three dozen Resolutions (since the beginning of the 21st Century) that implement the strategy.

The Palestinians (in particular HAMAS) need to argue this point (and the point that it is NOT an international conflict --- an argument in itself that is a double-edged sword) because UN Security Council Resolution 1373 stipulates that it: "Reaffirming the need to combat by all means, in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations, threats to international peace and security caused by terrorist acts."

Most Respectfully,
R

But Hamas are not terrorists in Palestine where they were elected and supported.

They don't buy into that foreign name calling crap.

Interesting @ 1:10

And how many times were they REelected...when was their last election?

They haven't had elections since the US trashed their entire political system in 2007.

WRONG the reason is that hamas knows that it would not win another election so has refused to hold elections since 2007. It has nothing to do with Israel or the USA

 

[P F Tinmore]

Roccor

Also to blame, of course, are the law enforcement authorities, starting with the Judea and Samaria District Police – the most ridiculous and scandalous of all police districts, and not by chance. Nine Palestinian homes were torched in the past three years, according to B’Tselem. How many people have been prosecuted? None. So what happened in Duma on Friday? The fire was simply better, in the eyes of the arsonists and their minions.

Their minions also include the silent, the forgiving and all those who think the evil will remain forever within the confines of the West Bank. Their minions also include the Israelis who are convinced that the People of Israel is the chosen people, and as a result is permitted to do anything – including torching the homes of non-Jews, with their inhabitants inside.
read more: All Israelis Are Guilty of Setting a Palestinian Family on Fire Opinion Haaretz Daily Newspaper Israel News

P F Tinmore, et al,

The UN does not designate terrorists organization in that way.

Where does the UN designate the Palestinians as terrorists?

(COMMENT)

All terrorist activities hide behind the fact that the UN has not defined "terrorism" on the Global Level (a concept without a universally accepted definition); but rather --- an umbrella description on a level of political activism that employees a measure of depravity to coercion and intimidation a population of governed entity to accept a political end state. (Like pornography: You know it when you see it. Just as there is no true definition universally accepted for "political violence.") No one argues that the Palestinian Olympic Massacre, or the attack on October 15, 2003 when an explosion on a diplomatic convoy traveling through the Gaza Strip killed four Americans (and the several hundred hijackings, suicide bombings, and ambushes in between) were not Palestinian terrorist attacks designed to make a statement.

NOTE: To be clear, not all Palestinians are terrorists. However most Palestinians have provided material support to terrorist activities in one form or another. HAMAS is a political movement that opposes the basic tenants of the UN Charter [Article 2(4)] and the Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States; relative to the threat or use of force. It is a self-proclaimed Jihadist organization. The argument that it is a democratically elected governments (from nearly a decade ago) on goes to lend evidence that the People of Gaza support a government that supports terrorism; and lends protection training facilities and safe havens to other terrorist groups.
​

Terrorism, and the associated activities, are a crime(s) committed by persons, organizations or governments. These crimes or activities have, thus far, been defined either under individual domestic law of member nations, or by economic and/or security cooperatives. The European Union defines it as:

Article 1

Terrorist offences and fundamental rights and principles

1. Each Member State shall take the necessary measures to ensure that the intentional acts referred to below in points (a) to (i), as defined as offences under national law, which, given their nature or context, may seriously damage a country or an international organisation where committed with the aim of:

- seriously intimidating a population, or

- unduly compelling a Government or international organisation to perform or abstain from performing any act, or

- seriously destabilising or destroying the fundamental political, constitutional, economic or social structures of a country or an international organisation,
​

shall be deemed to be terrorist offences:

(a) attacks upon a person's life which may cause death;

(b) attacks upon the physical integrity of a person;

(c) kidnapping or hostage taking;

(d) causing extensive destruction to a Government or public facility, a transport system, an infrastructure facility, including an information system, a fixed platform located on the continental shelf, a public place or private property likely to endanger human life or result in major economic loss;

(e) seizure of aircraft, ships or other means of public or goods transport;

(f) manufacture, possession, acquisition, transport, supply or use of weapons, explosives or of nuclear, biological or chemical weapons, as well as research into, and development of, biological and chemical weapons;

(g) release of dangerous substances, or causing fires, floods or explosions the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(h) interfering with or disrupting the supply of water, power or any other fundamental natural resource the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(i) threatening to commit any of the acts listed in (a) to (h).​

Terrorism as a form of political activism is recognized or defined by their organizational actions, or in the some cases, self-defined (Jihadists or Islamists).

Murder is a domestic crime. Depending on the intent, magnitude and purpose, it can be a war crime, a crime against humanity, terrorism, or any combination thereof. To be an terrorism, there must be the element of the threat or use of force to project intimidation or coercion. Clearly, when Leon Klinghoffer, a disabled jewish American appliance manufacturer, who was murdered and thrown overboard by Palestinian Terrorists (Abu Abbas) who pirated the cruise ship Achille Lauro in 1985; the Palestinian Terrorist were making a statement. Similarly, when three Israeli teenagers were kidnapped at the bus/hitchhiking stop at the Israeli settlement, and HAMAS official Salah al-Arouri (founder of the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, the Hamas military), and publicly acknowledged the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, was behind the kidnappings and murder, --- this event as well, was used as a means of coercion and intimidation (making a political statement). And the threat does not have to be militarily effective to create an atmosphere of intimidation:

"Are the tunnels a new calamity capable of changing the balance of power in Gaza? Probably not. It’s difficult to find instances when tunnel tactics have fundamentally altered the course of a war. They are, by nature, tactics born of desperation. But they have always been effective in sowing fear. It’s no coincidence that we’re hearing a lot about tunnels precisely when events in Gaza find the Israelis in desperate need of friends."
SOURCE: Washington Post Gerard DeGroot is a professor of history at the University of St Andrews in Scotland.
​

Over and over again, I've seen the Palestinian Terrorist try and hide behind the argument that there is no UN Definition for terrorist or terrorism, per sa, yet there is no question that the UN Security Council can recognize it when they see it. Not only does the UN have a complete Global Counter-Terrorism Strategy in place, but the Security Council has passed over three dozen Resolutions (since the beginning of the 21st Century) that implement the strategy.

The Palestinians (in particular HAMAS) need to argue this point (and the point that it is NOT an international conflict --- an argument in itself that is a double-edged sword) because UN Security Council Resolution 1373 stipulates that it: "Reaffirming the need to combat by all means, in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations, threats to international peace and security caused by terrorist acts."

Most Respectfully,
R

But Hamas are not terrorists in Palestine where they were elected and supported.

They don't buy into that foreign name calling crap.

Interesting @ 1:10

And how many times were they REelected...when was their last election?

They haven't had elections since the US trashed their entire political system in 2007.

WRONG the reason is that hamas knows that it would not win another election so has refused to hold elections since 2007. It has nothing to do with Israel or the USA

You need to come up to speed.

Deputy National Security Advisor, Elliott Abrams — who Newsweek recently described as “the last neocon standing” — has had it about for some months now that the U.S. is not only not interested in dealing with Hamas, it is working to ensure its failure. In the immediate aftermath of the Hamas elections, last January, Abrams greeted a group of Palestinian businessmen in his White House office with talk of a “hard coup” against the newly-elected Hamas government — the violent overthrow of their leadership with arms supplied by the United States. While the businessmen were shocked, Abrams was adamant — the U.S. had to support Fatah with guns, ammunition and training, so that they could fight Hamas for control of the Palestinian government. - See more at: Elliot Abrams Uncivil War Conflicts Forum​

-------------------------------

After failing to anticipate Hamas’s victory over Fatah in the 2006 Palestinian election, the White House cooked up yet another scandalously covert and self-defeating Middle East debacle: part Iran-contra, part Bay of Pigs. With confidential documents, corroborated by outraged former and current U.S. officials, the author reveals how President Bush, Condoleezza Rice, and Deputy National-Security Adviser Elliott Abrams backed an armed force under Fatah strongman Muhammad Dahlan, touching off a bloody civil war in Gaza and leaving Hamas stronger than ever.

The Gaza Bombshell Vanity Fair​

 

[Hollie]

Roccor

Also to blame, of course, are the law enforcement authorities, starting with the Judea and Samaria District Police – the most ridiculous and scandalous of all police districts, and not by chance. Nine Palestinian homes were torched in the past three years, according to B’Tselem. How many people have been prosecuted? None. So what happened in Duma on Friday? The fire was simply better, in the eyes of the arsonists and their minions.

Their minions also include the silent, the forgiving and all those who think the evil will remain forever within the confines of the West Bank. Their minions also include the Israelis who are convinced that the People of Israel is the chosen people, and as a result is permitted to do anything – including torching the homes of non-Jews, with their inhabitants inside.
read more: All Israelis Are Guilty of Setting a Palestinian Family on Fire Opinion Haaretz Daily Newspaper Israel News

P F Tinmore, et al,

The UN does not designate terrorists organization in that way.

(COMMENT)

All terrorist activities hide behind the fact that the UN has not defined "terrorism" on the Global Level (a concept without a universally accepted definition); but rather --- an umbrella description on a level of political activism that employees a measure of depravity to coercion and intimidation a population of governed entity to accept a political end state. (Like pornography: You know it when you see it. Just as there is no true definition universally accepted for "political violence.") No one argues that the Palestinian Olympic Massacre, or the attack on October 15, 2003 when an explosion on a diplomatic convoy traveling through the Gaza Strip killed four Americans (and the several hundred hijackings, suicide bombings, and ambushes in between) were not Palestinian terrorist attacks designed to make a statement.

NOTE: To be clear, not all Palestinians are terrorists. However most Palestinians have provided material support to terrorist activities in one form or another. HAMAS is a political movement that opposes the basic tenants of the UN Charter [Article 2(4)] and the Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States; relative to the threat or use of force. It is a self-proclaimed Jihadist organization. The argument that it is a democratically elected governments (from nearly a decade ago) on goes to lend evidence that the People of Gaza support a government that supports terrorism; and lends protection training facilities and safe havens to other terrorist groups.
​

Terrorism, and the associated activities, are a crime(s) committed by persons, organizations or governments. These crimes or activities have, thus far, been defined either under individual domestic law of member nations, or by economic and/or security cooperatives. The European Union defines it as:

Article 1

Terrorist offences and fundamental rights and principles

1. Each Member State shall take the necessary measures to ensure that the intentional acts referred to below in points (a) to (i), as defined as offences under national law, which, given their nature or context, may seriously damage a country or an international organisation where committed with the aim of:

- seriously intimidating a population, or

- unduly compelling a Government or international organisation to perform or abstain from performing any act, or

- seriously destabilising or destroying the fundamental political, constitutional, economic or social structures of a country or an international organisation,
​

shall be deemed to be terrorist offences:

(a) attacks upon a person's life which may cause death;

(b) attacks upon the physical integrity of a person;

(c) kidnapping or hostage taking;

(d) causing extensive destruction to a Government or public facility, a transport system, an infrastructure facility, including an information system, a fixed platform located on the continental shelf, a public place or private property likely to endanger human life or result in major economic loss;

(e) seizure of aircraft, ships or other means of public or goods transport;

(f) manufacture, possession, acquisition, transport, supply or use of weapons, explosives or of nuclear, biological or chemical weapons, as well as research into, and development of, biological and chemical weapons;

(g) release of dangerous substances, or causing fires, floods or explosions the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(h) interfering with or disrupting the supply of water, power or any other fundamental natural resource the effect of which is to endanger human life;

(i) threatening to commit any of the acts listed in (a) to (h).​

Terrorism as a form of political activism is recognized or defined by their organizational actions, or in the some cases, self-defined (Jihadists or Islamists).

Murder is a domestic crime. Depending on the intent, magnitude and purpose, it can be a war crime, a crime against humanity, terrorism, or any combination thereof. To be an terrorism, there must be the element of the threat or use of force to project intimidation or coercion. Clearly, when Leon Klinghoffer, a disabled jewish American appliance manufacturer, who was murdered and thrown overboard by Palestinian Terrorists (Abu Abbas) who pirated the cruise ship Achille Lauro in 1985; the Palestinian Terrorist were making a statement. Similarly, when three Israeli teenagers were kidnapped at the bus/hitchhiking stop at the Israeli settlement, and HAMAS official Salah al-Arouri (founder of the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, the Hamas military), and publicly acknowledged the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, was behind the kidnappings and murder, --- this event as well, was used as a means of coercion and intimidation (making a political statement). And the threat does not have to be militarily effective to create an atmosphere of intimidation:

"Are the tunnels a new calamity capable of changing the balance of power in Gaza? Probably not. It’s difficult to find instances when tunnel tactics have fundamentally altered the course of a war. They are, by nature, tactics born of desperation. But they have always been effective in sowing fear. It’s no coincidence that we’re hearing a lot about tunnels precisely when events in Gaza find the Israelis in desperate need of friends."
SOURCE: Washington Post Gerard DeGroot is a professor of history at the University of St Andrews in Scotland.
​

Over and over again, I've seen the Palestinian Terrorist try and hide behind the argument that there is no UN Definition for terrorist or terrorism, per sa, yet there is no question that the UN Security Council can recognize it when they see it. Not only does the UN have a complete Global Counter-Terrorism Strategy in place, but the Security Council has passed over three dozen Resolutions (since the beginning of the 21st Century) that implement the strategy.

The Palestinians (in particular HAMAS) need to argue this point (and the point that it is NOT an international conflict --- an argument in itself that is a double-edged sword) because UN Security Council Resolution 1373 stipulates that it: "Reaffirming the need to combat by all means, in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations, threats to international peace and security caused by terrorist acts."

Most Respectfully,
R

But Hamas are not terrorists in Palestine where they were elected and supported.

They don't buy into that foreign name calling crap.

Interesting @ 1:10

And how many times were they REelected...when was their last election?

They haven't had elections since the US trashed their entire political system in 2007.

WRONG the reason is that hamas knows that it would not win another election so has refused to hold elections since 2007. It has nothing to do with Israel or the USA

You need to come up to speed.

Deputy National Security Advisor, Elliott Abrams — who Newsweek recently described as “the last neocon standing” — has had it about for some months now that the U.S. is not only not interested in dealing with Hamas, it is working to ensure its failure. In the immediate aftermath of the Hamas elections, last January, Abrams greeted a group of Palestinian businessmen in his White House office with talk of a “hard coup” against the newly-elected Hamas government — the violent overthrow of their leadership with arms supplied by the United States. While the businessmen were shocked, Abrams was adamant — the U.S. had to support Fatah with guns, ammunition and training, so that they could fight Hamas for control of the Palestinian government. - See more at: Elliot Abrams Uncivil War Conflicts Forum​

-------------------------------

After failing to anticipate Hamas’s victory over Fatah in the 2006 Palestinian election, the White House cooked up yet another scandalously covert and self-defeating Middle East debacle: part Iran-contra, part Bay of Pigs. With confidential documents, corroborated by outraged former and current U.S. officials, the author reveals how President Bush, Condoleezza Rice, and Deputy National-Security Adviser Elliott Abrams backed an armed force under Fatah strongman Muhammad Dahlan, touching off a bloody civil war in Gaza and leaving Hamas stronger than ever.

The Gaza Bombshell Vanity Fair​

Reads like a fictional mystery novel: "sources", "government officials", "confidential documents", etc., none of which are produced.

 

[Challenger]

Roccor

Also to blame, of course, are the law enforcement authorities, starting with the Judea and Samaria District Police – the most ridiculous and scandalous of all police districts, and not by chance. Nine Palestinian homes were torched in the past three years, according to B’Tselem. How many people have been prosecuted? None. So what happened in Duma on Friday? The fire was simply better, in the eyes of the arsonists and their minions.

Their minions also include the silent, the forgiving and all those who think the evil will remain forever within the confines of the West Bank. Their minions also include the Israelis who are convinced that the People of Israel is the chosen people, and as a result is permitted to do anything – including torching the homes of non-Jews, with their inhabitants inside.
read more: All Israelis Are Guilty of Setting a Palestinian Family on Fire Opinion Haaretz Daily Newspaper Israel News

But Hamas are not terrorists in Palestine where they were elected and supported.

They don't buy into that foreign name calling crap.

Interesting @ 1:10

And how many times were they REelected...when was their last election?

They haven't had elections since the US trashed their entire political system in 2007.

WRONG the reason is that hamas knows that it would not win another election so has refused to hold elections since 2007. It has nothing to do with Israel or the USA

You need to come up to speed.

Deputy National Security Advisor, Elliott Abrams — who Newsweek recently described as “the last neocon standing” — has had it about for some months now that the U.S. is not only not interested in dealing with Hamas, it is working to ensure its failure. In the immediate aftermath of the Hamas elections, last January, Abrams greeted a group of Palestinian businessmen in his White House office with talk of a “hard coup” against the newly-elected Hamas government — the violent overthrow of their leadership with arms supplied by the United States. While the businessmen were shocked, Abrams was adamant — the U.S. had to support Fatah with guns, ammunition and training, so that they could fight Hamas for control of the Palestinian government. - See more at: Elliot Abrams Uncivil War Conflicts Forum​

-------------------------------

After failing to anticipate Hamas’s victory over Fatah in the 2006 Palestinian election, the White House cooked up yet another scandalously covert and self-defeating Middle East debacle: part Iran-contra, part Bay of Pigs. With confidential documents, corroborated by outraged former and current U.S. officials, the author reveals how President Bush, Condoleezza Rice, and Deputy National-Security Adviser Elliott Abrams backed an armed force under Fatah strongman Muhammad Dahlan, touching off a bloody civil war in Gaza and leaving Hamas stronger than ever.

The Gaza Bombshell Vanity Fair​

Reads like a fictional mystery novel: "sources", "government officials", "confidential documents", etc., none of which are produced.

Articles written by journalists tend not to give up sources because they're not obliged to, unlike scholarly articles. Journalists however, leave themselves open to legal challenges (libel). Has this account been challenged by any of the people mentioned in the courts? Have the events been disputed by any of those mentioned in the courts? Have there been any rebuttals that provide evidence contrary to what was written in Vanity Fair?

In June 2006 Hamas even agreed to recognise Israel's "right to exist" but that fact seemed to disappear pretty quickly. Climbdown as Hamas agrees to Israeli state World news The Guardian

Truth often sounds like fiction, and fiction often sounds like truth; the trick is to make an reasoned assessment of which is which.