Why should the poor not have to pay federal income tax

[CaughtInTheMid]

We each smoke about a pack a day, maybe a bit more.

When the fuck have I ever asked you to pay for my health care? Mind your own business, asshole.

Haha, if you don't understand how your smoking drives up the cost of healthcare for everyone else you're as clueless as can be.

Explain it to me. asshole.

do you know how group policies work? or how insurance companies determine their premiums?

 

[Flopper]

No. See the 16th amendment. The Constitution was amended precisely to make the income tax constitutional, therefore it is.

i don't need the history lesson. The constitution as written originally did not include an income tax. We recieved it when we received this wonderful fiat money. All tools for bigger and bigger government. It's working perfectly.

And it didn't include the Bill of Rights, abolitionism of slavery, a definition of citizenship, or women's right to vote and many other changes made necessary by the growth of the country.

Without taxes a government can not function and an amendment to constitution to provide revenue was needed.

 

[American Horse]

What would the Conservative reaction be to a change in the tax code that says you pay nothing on incomes until you breech the $25,000 a year mark? And once you do, you pay 5% on everything earned up to $35,000, 7% on everything up to $50,000 and 10% on everything up to $75,000.

After that, a graduated tax of 2% per $5,000 up to infinity.

Surely the poor would then pay and the rich (who benefit the most under our current system) would pay as well.

Why is it always screw the poor and middle class but coddle the rich with Conservatives? Are you all that rich or all that heartless?

No we're not heartless. We simply see the facts of the matter. The rich who have earned income pay the highest rate, 35%. Those who have unearned income, that is income from risking their wealth that has already been taxed are, by making that wealth available as capital, creating new jobs and new taxpayers. They can sit out a bad economy or punitive taxes, and largely, they are doing that now. If, for instance, they were taxed at the full earned income rate, they would in effect be double taxed, They could even take their wealth outside the country, and if they chose to remove themselves take all that potential wealth too.

Virtually all the corporations which don't pay federal taxes on income earned in the US do so with loopholes which were designed by our politicaians to serve the greater public interest by encouraging investment by those corporations into sectors the politicians deem productive for our economy. A write-off for accelerated depreciation encourages a corporation to make a capital investment that they probably would put off, but the tax break incentivizes them to move with immediacy.

Isn't economic growth measured by the exchange of capital for goods and services? If that capital is sequestered by just a very few in Cayman Islands bank accounts just to dodge taxes, why should that capital be regarded as important for our economy? It ain't moving! It's just earning tax dodges for those wealthy enough to afford them and interest which enhances their bottom line while Middle Class taxpayers are asked to pick up the slack.

Put as much capital into as many hands as possible and watch our economy soar. Sequester that wealth among the very few and disregard taxing that capital to reduce the federal deficit and we will continue to watch jobs go to Asia.

Very little is sequestered in the Cayman islands, and to the extent it is, we can bring that back, but not by taxing it at higher rates. Capital doesn't flee the US for other markets because it's not taxed, or regulated enough. Sarbanes-Oxley has increased the cost of new IPOs by a million dollars in the creation of each. Since that has happened the US has ceased being the the world leader in new IPOs, and takes a back seat to China. New IPO's are the source of whole new industries.

Quote:
WSJ - Deal Journal:
"2009 will go down as the year China ascended to the top of the IPO heap.

Businesses from the Middle Kingdom accounted for 183 deals in the year. The U.S.? Just 54.

Chinese companies alone sold $50.4 billion worth of shares, which accounted for 45% of the global IPO volume, according to data tracker Dealogic. The U.S.? $24 billion.

China International Capital finished as the top bookrunner globally–the first time a Chinese bank had done so. Prior to 2009, a Chinese bank had made the top 10 globally just once–China International Capital ranked ninth in 2000, according to Dealogic."

 

[Inthemiddle]

No one rich or poor, high income earner or minimun wage earner, pay tax on the first 19,000 this year.

That's not true. I had to.

 

[RDD_1210]

We each smoke about a pack a day, maybe a bit more.

When the fuck have I ever asked you to pay for my health care? Mind your own business, asshole.

Haha, if you don't understand how your smoking drives up the cost of healthcare for everyone else you're as clueless as can be.

Explain it to me. asshole.

Sure, but will it matter? Of course not. You'll either ignore my post or call me another name.

Here we go anyway...

When you purchase insurance, you're paying in to a pool of people who are all insured and risk is spread out among the entire pool. If someone in the group gets sick, the money collected from the entire pool is used to cover that persons costs. Now, when someone decides to smoke a pack a day they are more than likely going to have greater health problems in their lifetime. This means more hospital visits, more medicine, more costs. More costs that have to be passed on to the entire group through higher premiums. So thanks again for raising the cost of my healthcare.

 

[Ernie S.]

Haha, if you don't understand how your smoking drives up the cost of healthcare for everyone else you're as clueless as can be.

Explain it to me. asshole.

do you know how group policies work? or how insurance companies determine their premiums?

I do. You see, I don't have health insurance. I pay my bills myself, so I actually help hold down the cost of health care by paying more a bit more than ins. company negotiated rates and making up for freeloaders that get care without paying the bill. Get it?

 

[Ernie S.]

No. See the 16th amendment. The Constitution was amended precisely to make the income tax constitutional, therefore it is.

i don't need the history lesson. The constitution as written originally did not include an income tax. We recieved it when we received this wonderful fiat money. All tools for bigger and bigger government. It's working perfectly.

And it didn't include the Bill of Rights, abolitionism of slavery, a definition of citizenship, or women's right to vote and many other changes made necessary by the growth of the country.

Without taxes a government can not function and an amendment to constitution to provide revenue was needed.

Did the 16th amendment void equal protection? Unless you can show me where it didn't, a progressive tax is unconstitutional.

 

[RDD_1210]

Explain it to me. asshole.

do you know how group policies work? or how insurance companies determine their premiums?

I do. You see, I don't have health insurance. I pay my bills myself, so I actually help hold down the cost of health care by paying more a bit more than ins. company negotiated rates and making up for freeloaders that get care without paying the bill. Get it?

Bwahahahaha, so your NOT having health insurance is keeping costs down for us?? Holy fuck, I've heard it all now.

Ok, be honest, you're fucking with us, right????

 

[CaughtInTheMid]

Explain it to me. asshole.

do you know how group policies work? or how insurance companies determine their premiums?

I do. You see, I don't have health insurance. I pay my bills myself, so I actually help hold down the cost of health care by paying more a bit more than ins. company negotiated rates and making up for freeloaders that get care without paying the bill. Get it?

not really. if a person takes a job, and that company includes a benefits package as additional compensation, and a bunch of their employees smoke, have additional health problems and run up the premiums for the company, what's that got to do with freeloaders?? or for that matter, your question was mainly about smokers and additional health costs. so what do freeloaders have to do with that question?

 

[BlindBoo]

No one rich or poor, high income earner or minimun wage earner, pay tax on the first 19,000 this year.

That's not true. I had to.

Holy shit you are absolutely correct. I am wrong. That is the standard deduction and exemptions for a married couple filing jointly. The real number is $9,500.00. Mbad.

 

[grunt11b]

There is a whole lot of class warfare going on in this thread.

Not sure why so many people are jealous of the poor. If they have it so good, you're free to join them and reap those "rewards".

Anyone who bitches about the great advantages that a poor person has must lead one amazing life. Congrats.

I could care less about the advantages or disadvantages the poor do or do not have. It's when they vote in politicians who pick my pocket to feed them when they wont go earn it themselves that I dont like. When this happens is this not a new form of slavery? I bet we wont hear the lefties decrying this form of slavery anytime soon.

 

[Ernie S.]

Haha, if you don't understand how your smoking drives up the cost of healthcare for everyone else you're as clueless as can be.

Explain it to me. asshole.

Sure, but will it matter? Of course not. You'll either ignore my post or call me another name.

Here we go anyway...

When you purchase insurance, you're paying in to a pool of people who are all insured and risk is spread out among the entire pool. If someone in the group gets sick, the money collected from the entire pool is used to cover that persons costs. Now, when someone decides to smoke a pack a day they are more than likely going to have greater health problems in their lifetime. This means more hospital visits, more medicine, more costs. More costs that have to be passed on to the entire group through higher premiums. So thanks again for raising the cost of my healthcare.

See my earlier reply. Before you assume you know me, I suggest you ask questions, asshole.

 

[RDD_1210]

There is a whole lot of class warfare going on in this thread.

Not sure why so many people are jealous of the poor. If they have it so good, you're free to join them and reap those "rewards".

Anyone who bitches about the great advantages that a poor person has must lead one amazing life. Congrats.

I could care less about the advantages or disadvantages the poor do or do not have. It's when they vote in politicians who pick my pocket to feed them when they wont go earn it themselves that I dont like. When this happens is this not a new form of slavery? I bet we wont hear the lefties decrying this form of slavery anytime soon.

I love how dramatic you are. Oooh, slavery. Scary!

How is what you said any different than you voting for your republicans who you think are serving your best interests?

 

[NYcarbineer]

All we hear from the left is have the rich pay more. Give more . GIMME Why cant the poor pay something. Even if its 120 dollars a year .. YOu cant say a person cant afford 10 dollars a month .. I am sure they are wasting more then that on other things like fast food, cigarettes, booze. How many times I have been behind someone paying with food stamps and have beer and cigs they are about to buy as well. But, if that wasnt bad enough they dont pay they get EIC as well so the rich people are paying them for nothing.

You're suffering from class envy.

 

[Dot Com]

we need to remove mortgage deduction & child exemption hand-outs too

 

[RDD_1210]

Explain it to me. asshole.

Sure, but will it matter? Of course not. You'll either ignore my post or call me another name.

Here we go anyway...

When you purchase insurance, you're paying in to a pool of people who are all insured and risk is spread out among the entire pool. If someone in the group gets sick, the money collected from the entire pool is used to cover that persons costs. Now, when someone decides to smoke a pack a day they are more than likely going to have greater health problems in their lifetime. This means more hospital visits, more medicine, more costs. More costs that have to be passed on to the entire group through higher premiums. So thanks again for raising the cost of my healthcare.

See my earlier reply. Before you assume you know me, I suggest you ask questions, asshole.

Sorry, I assumed you were a "contributing member to society". My fault. I 'll remember who I'm talking to next time.

So now that we know you're either too dumb or too broke yourself to have health insurance, I LOVE that you think thats actually better. Jesus, you people amaze me.

Oh and thanks for ending your post with calling me a name, exactly as I said you would. I feel like Nostradomus.

 

[Ernie S.]

do you know how group policies work? or how insurance companies determine their premiums?

I do. You see, I don't have health insurance. I pay my bills myself, so I actually help hold down the cost of health care by paying more a bit more than ins. company negotiated rates and making up for freeloaders that get care without paying the bill. Get it?

Bwahahahaha, so your NOT having health insurance is keeping costs down for us?? Holy fuck, I've heard it all now.

Ok, be honest, you're fucking with us, right????

OK take your city Emergency ward. Someone without insurance or a bank account goes in with a broken arm. They get a cast and follow up care and ignore the bill. I go in with a broken leg and write a check. The cost of providing free service to Mr Arm is spread out among those that pay out of pocket even more so than people with insurance because the insurance companies negotiate a lower rate than I pay. Do you understand now? Or do you think hospitals don't seek to recover losses?

 

[NYcarbineer]

we need to remove mortgage deduction & child exemption hand-outs too

These idiots can't figure out that the only politically survivable way to start taxing the poor, if there is such a way,

would be to raise the taxes of the not-poor in the process.

Having said that, Mitt Romney's tax plan cuts taxes for upper incomes and raises them on lower incomes...

...that may be, however, one of the best reasons he's probably going to lose, once everyone starts talking about his plan in detail.

 

[Dot Com]

There is a whole lot of class warfare going on in this thread.

Not sure why so many people are jealous of the poor. If they have it so good, you're free to join them and reap those "rewards".

Anyone who bitches about the great advantages that a poor person has must lead one amazing life. Congrats.

I could care less about the advantages or disadvantages the poor do or do not have. It's when they vote in politicians who pick my pocket to feed them when they wont go earn it themselves that I dont like. When this happens is this not a new form of slavery? I bet we wont hear the lefties decrying this form of slavery anytime soon.

 

[grunt11b]

There is a whole lot of class warfare going on in this thread.

Not sure why so many people are jealous of the poor. If they have it so good, you're free to join them and reap those "rewards".

Anyone who bitches about the great advantages that a poor person has must lead one amazing life. Congrats.

I could care less about the advantages or disadvantages the poor do or do not have. It's when they vote in politicians who pick my pocket to feed them when they wont go earn it themselves that I dont like. When this happens is this not a new form of slavery? I bet we wont hear the lefties decrying this form of slavery anytime soon.

I love how dramatic you are. Oooh, slavery. Scary!

How is what you said any different than you voting for your republicans who you think are serving your best interests?

If someone Is taking what you have rightfully earned to give to someone else, does that not make you beholden to the person receiving what you have earned? Or to put it in better context, does that not make you a slave to the person who receives your labor? Call it drama all you want, but it is the truth.