Why I Could Never Be GOP or Libertarian

[bayoubill]

Anyone who thinks they might like Ron Paul, read this:

Democracy - Not "The Free Market" - Will Save America's Middle Class

pretzel logic... chock fulla salty holes tied in knots...

 

[Crackerjack]

silly bozo sees a demand for liberty as the equivalent of selfishness.



What a douche silly bozo always is.

You think our government, the greatest government ever invented, is the problem and should disappear and let the corporations take over. You right wingers are just a fringe radical group and my mission is to let voters know your plans.

Literallly, you would privatize the Grand Canyon. At least Ron Paul would. Freak.

You're on a mission, huh? Seriously laughing at your gross overestimation of yourself.

You should make your mission be trying not to sound like a fucking retard, Captain Peepants. Try really hard now, m'kay?

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Why I Could Never Be GOP or Libertarian

Because you prefer totalitarian rulers and hate freedom?

 

[bayoubill]

silly bozo sees a demand for liberty as the equivalent of selfishness.



What a douche silly bozo always is.

You think our government, the greatest government ever invented, is the problem and should disappear and let the corporations take over. You right wingers are just a fringe radical group and my mission is to let voters know your plans.

Literallly, you would privatize the Grand Canyon. At least Ron Paul would. Freak.

OMYGOHD...! privatizing the Grand Canyon...?! how awful...!

 

[bayoubill]

If you are rich then you are greedy and selfish. If you are middle class and have an R next to your name, after the last 12 years, you are a fool.

Ok then I guess the Clintons, Kerrys, Obamas, Bidens, Pelosi's, and most of Hollywood are "greedy and selfish" too, huh?

I didn't read anymore than this. I hate this argument. No one is jealous of the rich. In fact, we look up to them. And most rich people are good. But they don't run the GOP. The GOP is run by multinational robber barons. Has been for hundreds of years. They hate us. They have waged class warefare on us. Sent jobs overseas, hire illegals, cut programs that help the poor, cut teachers, police and firefighters pay, etc. Most of the millionaires in country are patriotic. They didn't lie us into a war on purpose to bankrupt the country. And if Iraq wasn't a big enough fucking in the ass, then they asked for the bank bailout right when Bush was leaving office. Biggest bank robbery in world history.

My question is why do you side with these multinational corporations?

Do you feel you are a part of the group? Trust me, you are not. You just have a greedy mentality so you like what you hear from the GOP way. If they were in charge instead of FDR, you'd be a broke son of a bitch old man! No social security or medicare.

And don't give me the shit about how rich people got rich. They got rich before Bush got into power too. I didn't hate them before. What changed? The rules. They changed the rules and now things are harder for us but they have never been richer. And still you don't get it.

lol... "The GOP is run by multinational robber barons. Has been for hundreds of years."

ummm... the GOP came into existence 'bout 150 years ago, around about the time of Lincoln... you know, the GOP guy who set the slaves free...

 

[Oldstyle]

I want to hear from middle class and poor Ron Paul supporters. I want to hear how they think they will benefit from an every man for himself society. From what I can tell his approach would produce a small upper class and the middle class will become the working poor.

People don't realize it was liberal labor laws, FDR New Deal, tariffs and unions that produced the huge middle class we enjoyed for the last 50 years. It wasn't unregulated free trade. Unregulated Free trade sent 7 million good paying jobs out of the country because we make too much. And Ron Paul wants to double down on the idea? He and Paul Ryan are no different. Bad for America. Not the top 1% but the rest of us, BAD.

I'm sorry but what you've deemed "selfishness", Bobo...is the driving force made this country great in the first place. Liberal labor laws, FDR's New Deal, tariffs and unions are not what made America the country that others aspired to be...it was the concept that here was a country where if you were willing to work hard you could become as wealthy as you could dream. You for some reason think that you can legislate the return of high paying union jobs from overseas. So let me ask you how that's going to work...tariffs? You might want to look into Smoot Hawley and see how that turned out last time.

 

[Oldstyle]

If you are rich then you are greedy and selfish. If you are middle class and have an R next to your name, after the last 12 years, you are a fool.

Ok then I guess the Clintons, Kerrys, Obamas, Bidens, Pelosi's, and most of Hollywood are "greedy and selfish" too, huh?

I didn't read anymore than this. I hate this argument. No one is jealous of the rich. In fact, we look up to them. And most rich people are good. But they don't run the GOP. The GOP is run by multinational robber barons. Has been for hundreds of years. They hate us. They have waged class warefare on us. Sent jobs overseas, hire illegals, cut programs that help the poor, cut teachers, police and firefighters pay, etc. Most of the millionaires in country are patriotic. They didn't lie us into a war on purpose to bankrupt the country. And if Iraq wasn't a big enough fucking in the ass, then they asked for the bank bailout right when Bush was leaving office. Biggest bank robbery in world history.

My question is why do you side with these multinational corporations?

Do you feel you are a part of the group? Trust me, you are not. You just have a greedy mentality so you like what you hear from the GOP way. If they were in charge instead of FDR, you'd be a broke son of a bitch old man! No social security or medicare.

And don't give me the shit about how rich people got rich. They got rich before Bush got into power too. I didn't hate them before. What changed? The rules. They changed the rules and now things are harder for us but they have never been richer. And still you don't get it.

I'm curious...you've decided that the bank bailout was the biggest bank robbery in world history...yet that money was paid BACK by the banks. Strange thing to do is you're a "robber", wouldn't you say?

Now contrast that to the bailout of GM. THAT money hasn't been paid back, nor does it look like it will be for some time to come. So does that constitute "robbery" in your eyes? Or because it helped unions and was put forth by Barry...does that get a pass? I'm trying to get a feel for your rationale, here Bobo. So far all I see is a rather confused individual spouting left wing talking points that don't make much sense when examined even casually.

 

[sealybobo]

Listening to everything the GOP and Libertarians have to say, I have to say I viamently disagree with the direction they want to take America. They are a very selfish group.

Paul Ryan, the father of a Republican budget initiative that seeks to destroy Medicare and Social Security has continually invoked the name of Ayn Rand as his philosophical mentor and guide. Many other Republicans have do so too. They are embracing a philosophy which, according to Ayn Rand herself, is one of selfishness and is against all forms of Spirituality. The question any thoughtful Americans must ask themselves is: “Is this the America we want?”

And how do they get evangelicals to go along with them is beyond me.

Its a very selfish every man for himself mentality.

And Libertarians don't believe in the Commons. What are the Commons?

The Commons are resources that are owned by all of us. That includes the Grand Canyon, oil rights, power companies, roads, public airwaves, schools, etc.

Here is how they think. Libertarians think if we all own the land on which our sheep graze, we will each add one too many sheep until we destroy the land for future generations. That We the People can't manage the commons.

Libertarians think that if one person owns the land and charged everyone else grazing fees, he would be more committed to preserving it for the future than a village of farmers.

I disagree.

The reason you can't be a Libertarian or Republican is because you've bought into the old myths about what they stand for. Live and die by the talking points, but don't think for yourself or question the status quo or you might get kicked out of the leftie club.

Wrong! No one has ever given more time and discussion to this issue. I would take breaks and lunch with the head of the Michigan Libertarian Party many many times. Sorry, the answer to every problem is not less regulations. It may make sense to a simple mind, but I have thought it through and it would not benefit the middle class. Only the top 1%. Maybe 10%. Maybe even 20%.

Would you rather have 90% of us doing well or 80%. That is the difference between Democrats and Republicans. Under Dems you have high wages and low unemployment. If you go with the GOP or Ron Paul you will have 10% more unemployment than you should. And government will always and should always be the referee. You righties don't want a referee in the game of Business? You are crazy.

Us liberals have listened, even went along with your policies for literally 6 years. 2000-2006 you had it all. And we told you those policies would crash the economy. Free unregulated trade doesn't work and neither does trickle down. And it was YOU who bankrupted us with war. Oh yea, I forgot, Ron Paul is different. Well how well is Ron Paul doing with Republicans? Only 8% of the vote? Please work on winning the GOP nominee before you try to talk to us liberals about Ron Paul. As of now he isn't even an option. But you only argue with us. Why don't I see you ever arguing with Romney Republicans?

Now you come at us with a Ron Paul twist and expect us to bite? Much like the fake Tea Baggers you threw at us. Not exactly Bush but still not good for the middle class. Still anti Government and still backed by the billionaire Koch Brothers.

You middle class Republicans are so stupid. You talk about freedom but vote for corporations to own you and your government.

Low information voters!!! You gotta watch this.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YOh-rpvjYg]Family Guy - Undecided Voters - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Crackerjack]

lol... "The GOP is run by multinational robber barons. Has been for hundreds of years."

ummm... the GOP came into existence 'bout 150 years ago, around about the time of Lincoln... you know, the GOP guy who set the slaves free...

Clearly he meant dog years.

 

[sealybobo]

[/B]

Ok then I guess the Clintons, Kerrys, Obamas, Bidens, Pelosi's, and most of Hollywood are "greedy and selfish" too, huh?

I didn't read anymore than this. I hate this argument. No one is jealous of the rich. In fact, we look up to them. And most rich people are good. But they don't run the GOP. The GOP is run by multinational robber barons. Has been for hundreds of years. They hate us. They have waged class warefare on us. Sent jobs overseas, hire illegals, cut programs that help the poor, cut teachers, police and firefighters pay, etc. Most of the millionaires in country are patriotic. They didn't lie us into a war on purpose to bankrupt the country. And if Iraq wasn't a big enough fucking in the ass, then they asked for the bank bailout right when Bush was leaving office. Biggest bank robbery in world history.

My question is why do you side with these multinational corporations?

Do you feel you are a part of the group? Trust me, you are not. You just have a greedy mentality so you like what you hear from the GOP way. If they were in charge instead of FDR, you'd be a broke son of a bitch old man! No social security or medicare.

And don't give me the shit about how rich people got rich. They got rich before Bush got into power too. I didn't hate them before. What changed? The rules. They changed the rules and now things are harder for us but they have never been richer. And still you don't get it.

I'm curious...you've decided that the bank bailout was the biggest bank robbery in world history...yet that money was paid BACK by the banks. Strange thing to do is you're a "robber", wouldn't you say?

Now contrast that to the bailout of GM. THAT money hasn't been paid back, nor does it look like it will be for some time to come. So does that constitute "robbery" in your eyes? Or because it helped unions and was put forth by Barry...does that get a pass? I'm trying to get a feel for your rationale, here Bobo. So far all I see is a rather confused individual spouting left wing talking points that don't make much sense when examined even casually.

1. Thank Obama for the bankers paying back the money. I remember the wording the Bush team tried to slip by us when they handed over the bank robbery note and bag and said put all the money in the bag and hurry or else. Obama added oversight that Bush didn't want to put in. This story is too old otherwise I could easily find you the facts. I'm not going to waste my time. You'll have to trust me. I have a great memory and don't make shit up.
2. I have read the details of these bank loans and they were sweetheart deals. I don't remember the exact numbers but it was something like for every dollar pay back 50 cents. They got richer than ever dummy! OMG!

3. Isn't their between 9 and $13 trillion missing from the Federal Reserve? Google it.

4. If GM would have gone bankrupt and a chain reaction would have occured for sure, millions of pensions would have been stolen in the process. And guess who backs those pensions? US Tax payers. But knowing you right wingers, you would have just reniged somewhere down the line. This is just one thing you don't understand. I hate explaining to people who are clueless. Its like I'm in 12th grade history and you are in 4th.

5. Yes, I value the auto manufacturing industry and unions more than i do bankers who don't make shit.

6. General Motors Repays $8.1 Billion in Government Loans - ABC News

If you don't cry about how oil companies get tax breaks because you have oil investments, don't cry that GM paid back the loan with TARP. Who cares how they paid it back?

GM employees have been receiving profit sharing. Any of you non union schmucks getting any profit sharing? Chances are you haven't gotten a raise in 30 years. That's the average. Are you better than average? Well ladida!

 

[sealybobo]

[/B]

Ok then I guess the Clintons, Kerrys, Obamas, Bidens, Pelosi's, and most of Hollywood are "greedy and selfish" too, huh?

I didn't read anymore than this. I hate this argument. No one is jealous of the rich. In fact, we look up to them. And most rich people are good. But they don't run the GOP. The GOP is run by multinational robber barons. Has been for hundreds of years. They hate us. They have waged class warefare on us. Sent jobs overseas, hire illegals, cut programs that help the poor, cut teachers, police and firefighters pay, etc. Most of the millionaires in country are patriotic. They didn't lie us into a war on purpose to bankrupt the country. And if Iraq wasn't a big enough fucking in the ass, then they asked for the bank bailout right when Bush was leaving office. Biggest bank robbery in world history.

My question is why do you side with these multinational corporations?

Do you feel you are a part of the group? Trust me, you are not. You just have a greedy mentality so you like what you hear from the GOP way. If they were in charge instead of FDR, you'd be a broke son of a bitch old man! No social security or medicare.

And don't give me the shit about how rich people got rich. They got rich before Bush got into power too. I didn't hate them before. What changed? The rules. They changed the rules and now things are harder for us but they have never been richer. And still you don't get it.

lol... "The GOP is run by multinational robber barons. Has been for hundreds of years."

ummm... the GOP came into existence 'bout 150 years ago, around about the time of Lincoln... you know, the GOP guy who set the slaves free...

I don't care what they were called. Federalists, Republicans, Democrats. The Robber Baron's have alway had a party that represents them.

I'll draw the line from the day the rich tried to pull a coup on FDR. And even that got covered up by the so called "liberal" media. Google the Business Plot if you are unaware of what I am talking about.

You right wingers are not only NOT free, you are brainwashed.

Today sadly, both parties serve the Robber Barons. But at least the Democrats represent labor/unions too. When they don't, they lose elections. But Republicans don't punish their politicians when they screw us all over. That's being brainwashed.

Republicans deep down believe that the rich/corporations should run this country. That they would do better than our government has done. But that is not true. Our government has not done well because of their involvement. It no longer represents We the People.

We don't want corporations polluting. We don't want Wallstreet oil speculators gouging us at the pumps. We want the Bush tax breaks to end. We want jobs to stop going overseas, and we want the gap between the rich and poor to shrink back to where it should be. We want to stop spending more than the rest of the world on war. We want rich people to pay a little more to take care of the poor. We want social security and medicare. We want healthcare reform. We want a Post Office!

Too deep for a righty so I'll stop.

 

[sealybobo]

It is like Republicans think it is 1954

 

[dblack]

Sealy, I don't have much good to say about Republicans, but the reason you could never be a libertarian, apart from general ignorance and misunderstanding of what the term means, is that you just don't value freedom very much. You've said as much in this thread repeatedly and I think it gets to the heart of the matter more than any of the strawmen you're trying to build. There's not much more to it than that. You want government that takes care of us and solves our problems - that, to you, is more important than freedom and independence.

 

[Uncensored2008]

It is like Republicans think it is 1954

And you think it's 1917.

 

[bayoubill]

I didn't read anymore than this. I hate this argument. No one is jealous of the rich. In fact, we look up to them. And most rich people are good. But they don't run the GOP. The GOP is run by multinational robber barons. Has been for hundreds of years. They hate us. They have waged class warefare on us. Sent jobs overseas, hire illegals, cut programs that help the poor, cut teachers, police and firefighters pay, etc. Most of the millionaires in country are patriotic. They didn't lie us into a war on purpose to bankrupt the country. And if Iraq wasn't a big enough fucking in the ass, then they asked for the bank bailout right when Bush was leaving office. Biggest bank robbery in world history.

My question is why do you side with these multinational corporations?

Do you feel you are a part of the group? Trust me, you are not. You just have a greedy mentality so you like what you hear from the GOP way. If they were in charge instead of FDR, you'd be a broke son of a bitch old man! No social security or medicare.

And don't give me the shit about how rich people got rich. They got rich before Bush got into power too. I didn't hate them before. What changed? The rules. They changed the rules and now things are harder for us but they have never been richer. And still you don't get it.

lol... "The GOP is run by multinational robber barons. Has been for hundreds of years."

ummm... the GOP came into existence 'bout 150 years ago, around about the time of Lincoln... you know, the GOP guy who set the slaves free...

I don't care what they were called. Federalists, Republicans, Democrats. The Robber Baron's have alway had a party that represents them.

I'll draw the line from the day the rich tried to pull a coup on FDR. And even that got covered up by the so called "liberal" media. Google the Business Plot if you are unaware of what I am talking about.

You right wingers are not only NOT free, you are brainwashed.

Today sadly, both parties serve the Robber Barons. But at least the Democrats represent labor/unions too. When they don't, they lose elections. But Republicans don't punish their politicians when they screw us all over. That's being brainwashed.

Republicans deep down believe that the rich/corporations should run this country. That they would do better than our government has done. But that is not true. Our government has not done well because of their involvement. It no longer represents We the People.

We don't want corporations polluting. We don't want Wallstreet oil speculators gouging us at the pumps. We want the Bush tax breaks to end. We want jobs to stop going overseas, and we want the gap between the rich and poor to shrink back to where it should be. We want to stop spending more than the rest of the world on war. We want rich people to pay a little more to take care of the poor. We want social security and medicare. We want healthcare reform. We want a Post Office!

Too deep for a righty so I'll stop.

I love your passion, sealy...

but your ignorance/misunderstanding of basic truths is a bit hard to take...

reading assignment: the writings of philosophers from the Age of Enlightenment, as well as the writings of the Founding Fathers in The Federalist Papers...

 

[The T]

It is like Republicans think it is 1954

And you think it's 1917.

Is that Wilson in the WhiteHouse?

 

[The T]

Listening to everything the GOP and Libertarians have to say, I have to say I viamently disagree with the direction they want to take America. They are a very selfish group.

Paul Ryan, the father of a Republican budget initiative that seeks to destroy Medicare and Social Security has continually invoked the name of Ayn Rand as his philosophical mentor and guide. Many other Republicans have do so too. They are embracing a philosophy which, according to Ayn Rand herself, is one of selfishness and is against all forms of Spirituality. The question any thoughtful Americans must ask themselves is: “Is this the America we want?”

And how do they get evangelicals to go along with them is beyond me.

Its a very selfish every man for himself mentality.

And Libertarians don't believe in the Commons. What are the Commons?

The Commons are resources that are owned by all of us. That includes the Grand Canyon, oil rights, power companies, roads, public airwaves, schools, etc.

Here is how they think. Libertarians think if we all own the land on which our sheep graze, we will each add one too many sheep until we destroy the land for future generations. That We the People can't manage the commons.

Libertarians think that if one person owns the land and charged everyone else grazing fees, he would be more committed to preserving it for the future than a village of farmers.

I disagree.

The reason you can't be a Libertarian or Republican is because you've bought into the old myths about what they stand for. Live and die by the talking points, but don't think for yourself or question the status quo or you might get kicked out of the leftie club.

Wrong! No one has ever given more time and discussion to this issue. I would take breaks and lunch with the head of the Michigan Libertarian Party many many times. Sorry, the answer to every problem is not less regulations. It may make sense to a simple mind, but I have thought it through and it would not benefit the middle class. Only the top 1%. Maybe 10%. Maybe even 20%.

Would you rather have 90% of us doing well or 80%. That is the difference between Democrats and Republicans. Under Dems you have high wages and low unemployment. If you go with the GOP or Ron Paul you will have 10% more unemployment than you should. And government will always and should always be the referee. You righties don't want a referee in the game of Business? You are crazy.

Us liberals have listened, even went along with your policies for literally 6 years. 2000-2006 you had it all. And we told you those policies would crash the economy. Free unregulated trade doesn't work and neither does trickle down. And it was YOU who bankrupted us with war. Oh yea, I forgot, Ron Paul is different. Well how well is Ron Paul doing with Republicans? Only 8% of the vote? Please work on winning the GOP nominee before you try to talk to us liberals about Ron Paul. As of now he isn't even an option. But you only argue with us. Why don't I see you ever arguing with Romney Republicans?

Now you come at us with a Ron Paul twist and expect us to bite? Much like the fake Tea Baggers you threw at us. Not exactly Bush but still not good for the middle class. Still anti Government and still backed by the billionaire Koch Brothers.

You middle class Republicans are so stupid. You talk about freedom but vote for corporations to own you and your government.

Low information voters!!! You gotta watch this.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YOh-rpvjYg"]Family Guy - Undecided Voters - YouTube[/ame]

You do Realize that the creator of that cartoon is a flaming LIBERAL, don't you?

And consequently? he was making fun of uneducated pukes as you.

 

[Uncensored2008]

You do Realize that the creator of that cartoon is a flaming LIBERAL, don't you?

And consequently? he was making fun of uneducated pukes as you.

Leftists get their news from Comedy Central, and their opinions from cartoons.

Is it any wonder they vote for Barack Obama?

 

[The T]

You do Realize that the creator of that cartoon is a flaming LIBERAL, don't you?

And consequently? he was making fun of uneducated pukes as you.

Leftists get their news from Comedy Central, and their opinions from cartoons.

Is it any wonder they vote for Barack Obama?

Precisely. Television has them mesmurized...

 

[Liability]

silly bozo sees a demand for liberty as the equivalent of selfishness.



What a douche silly bozo always is.

You think our government, the greatest government ever invented, is the problem and should disappear and let the corporations take over. You right wingers are just a fringe radical group and my mission is to let voters know your plans.

Literallly, you would privatize the Grand Canyon. At least Ron Paul would. Freak.

No you anal pore. I think a government that transgresses the limits is the problem, you douche bag fuck wit.

And Ron Paul is a douche too. Just a different kind of douche.

You left wing fubars are scum.