Why do people put up with the US healthcare system?

[Redfish]

because in spite of obozocare, its the best in the world. the dems and libs are trying to bring it down to 3rd world status, and they may succeed. But today it is the best in the world.

and BTW, no one in the USA was denied medical care before obozocare. NO ONE. ACA was a fix for a problem that did not exist.

Bullshit. I had a pre-existing condition (misdiagnosed bulging disc) when I owned my own company and I wasn't even able to get insurance. It wasn't just an opt-out on back related issues, it was any kind of coverage.

were you turned away from a hospital or ER? Did any doctor refuse to treat you?

not being insured did not equal not being treated----------and you fricken well know it.

I was lucky enough not to have had any major issues when I was uninsured. It would have bankrupted me if I had. You're so full of shit it's coming out of your ears.

more bullshit. no one goes bankrupt SOLELY because of medical bills.

so your earlier claim that americans were refused care before ACA is a lie. thanks for admitting that.

It happens way too often jackass. How far do you think your modest self worth would go toward massive medical bills?

Hospitals do not get judgements against people for unpaid bills, they write them off or they are paid by Medicaid or some charity.

No one goes bankrupt just because of medical bills. It just does not happen.

 

[Redfish]

were you turned away from a hospital or ER? Did any doctor refuse to treat you?

not being insured did not equal not being treated----------and you fricken well know it.

I was lucky enough not to have had any major issues when I was uninsured. It would have bankrupted me if I had. You're so full of shit it's coming out of your ears.

more bullshit. no one goes bankrupt SOLELY because of medical bills.

so your earlier claim that americans were refused care before ACA is a lie. thanks for admitting that.

It happens way too often jackass. How far do you think your modest self worth would go toward massive medical bills?

Soooo... what happens when you can't pay for something?

In the case of medical coverage, either die or go bankrupt.

total bullshit, no one in the USA was denied medical care before ACA. NO ONE, not even those here illegally.

 

[Redfish]

All this shit started with the HMO's....

I don't know about "started", but HMO's definitely accelerated the problem.

and government run single payer is one big HMO. WTF is wrong with you, that you cannot see that?

 

[SAYIT]

How a bite from a stray dog shows the sick state of U.S. healthcare

"The first shot at Royal Angkor International Hospital cost $125." (Cambodia)

"Jan received her second Verorab shot at a clinic in northern Thailand. The bill this time: A mere $18.50"

"Things changed dramatically once the Kerns returned to this country. For her third shot, Jan visited Torrance Memorial Medical Center. It was a Sunday, and she had to go to the emergency room, so that added considerably to her cost. The tab for a single injection: $5,254.85."


"“It’s obvious that our system is unlike any other health system,” said Uwe Reinhardt, a healthcare economist at Princeton University. “Other systems were set up to care for patients. Ours was set up by the providers — the hospitals and drug companies — for their own benefit.”"

Most countries in the world have healthcare to treat patients, the US has healthcare to make healthcare providers money.

So much money gets wasted in corruption, it's something like 3% of US GDP at the very least.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. The sky is falling. I get it. Now maybe you should know that the patient pays only a small co-pay, if anything, and the insurer gets a deep discount ... perhaps as deep as 90% off. Pretty much nobody pays full price which may be why it is so outrageously high.

Why is it our whiny, sniveling, low-info, Chicken Little Loony Lefties either fail to tell the whole story or just don't know it?

Answer: Perhaps because they are whiny, sniveling, low-info, Chicken Little Loony Lefties.

 

[Redfish]

If insurance was to blame, then we would have skyrocketing auto, life, and home insurance.

Since we don't have skyrocketing auto, life, and home insurance, then something else is causing skyrocketing HEALTH insurance.

The reason health insurance is skyrocketing is because we don't buy it the same way we buy auto, life, and home insurance. We should be, if we want to get it under control.


We need to eliminate employer-sponsored health insurance (ESHI). ESHI drives up the cost of healthcare, and EVERYONE knows it. So why does ObamaCare more deeply embed ESHI?

Things that make you go, "Hmmmm..."

The reason ESHI was more deeply embedded in Obamacare is because it is a labor union boondoggle.

We should be buying our health insurance the same way we buy our auto, life, and home insurance. This provides us MAXIMUM leverage.

Instead, you are a total hostage to your employer's insurance. It's a take-it-or-leave-it proposition where you have ZERO leverage.

In turn, your employer is hostage to the insurance company. Small employers have almost no bargaining leverage at all with insurance companies, especially since the government limits the number of insurance companies your employer can buy from.

If you work at a small company, you are in a tiny risk pool. If one employee in your company suffers a catastrophic illness, everyone in the company suffers massive increases in premiums. That's just plain insane and would not happen if you bought your health insurance the same way you buy your auto, life, and home insurance.

In turn, the insurance company is hostage to the medical care providers in your geographical area.


So how come you can buy your auto insurance from ANY auto insurance company in America, thereby providing you with maximum bargaining power, and yet you can't buy health insurance from any health insurance company in America?

Things that make you go, "Hmmmmm..."


Here's the difference: The US government is the biggest market player in the health insurance market. You don't see that in the auto, life, or home insurance markets, now do you?

Things that make you go, "Hmmmmm..."

But wait. It's even worse than that. Not only is the US government the biggest player in the health insurance market, IT GETS TO WRITE THE RULES ALL THE OTHER PLAYERS HAVE TO PLAY BY!

What...the...FUCK?!?!?

How's that working out for you?

Imagine if you were a car maker, and you got to write the rules for your competitors.

Yeah. What would happen to the price and quality of cars? After all, you could be as slapdash and sloppy as you like since you have your competitors hog-tied.


We need LESS government in the market, not more! Jesus, every time the government gets more involved, things get worse. But then the fucking retards think it is because we need MOAR government!

Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over, expecting a different result.

Employee covered health insurance has become something that keeps the slaves in their place. Better not jump ship if there's no coverage where you're going.

your employer is offering you a benefit in order to keep you working for him, How awful!

liberal "logic" is an oxymoron.

 

[SAYIT]

Employee covered health insurance has become something that keeps the slaves in their place. Better not jump ship if there's no coverage where you're going.

Ah yes ... we are all just slaves to the master class.

 

[Redfish]

Employee covered health insurance has become something that keeps the slaves in their place. Better not jump ship if there's no coverage where you're going.

Ah yes ... we are all just slaves to the master class.

good post, those same liberals are totally willing to become slaves to their masters in government.

liberalism is a mental disease.

 

[frigidweirdo]

How a bite from a stray dog shows the sick state of U.S. healthcare

"The first shot at Royal Angkor International Hospital cost $125." (Cambodia)

"Jan received her second Verorab shot at a clinic in northern Thailand. The bill this time: A mere $18.50"

"Things changed dramatically once the Kerns returned to this country. For her third shot, Jan visited Torrance Memorial Medical Center. It was a Sunday, and she had to go to the emergency room, so that added considerably to her cost. The tab for a single injection: $5,254.85."


"“It’s obvious that our system is unlike any other health system,” said Uwe Reinhardt, a healthcare economist at Princeton University. “Other systems were set up to care for patients. Ours was set up by the providers — the hospitals and drug companies — for their own benefit.”"

Most countries in the world have healthcare to treat patients, the US has healthcare to make healthcare providers money.

So much money gets wasted in corruption, it's something like 3% of US GDP at the very least.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. The sky is falling. I get it. Now maybe you should know that the patient pays only a small co-pay, if anything, and the insurer gets a deep discount ... perhaps as deep as 90% off. Pretty much nobody pays full price which may be why it is so outrageously high.

Why is it our whiny, sniveling, low-info, Chicken Little Loony Lefties either fail to tell the whole story or just don't know it?

Oh, yeah, I know these discounts.

"Hey, I'll sell you this item that you can buy for 10 bucks for only 25,000 bucks."

"No thanks"

"Okay, HUGE discount of 90%, now it's only 10,000 bucks"

"But, 90% of 25,000 isn't 10,000"

"Okay then, 9,000, special price just for you"

"Deal".

Discounts and the drug is still $5,000 compared to like $20 elsewhere. Who needs discounts like that?

 

[SAYIT]

because of the skillful manipulation of facts and emotions. How else can you convince working people that unions are bad for them?

I don't know (and neither do you) that anyone believes unions are bad for them but clearly many no longer believe unions are good for them (thus the exodus over the last 50 years).

 

[Redfish]

How a bite from a stray dog shows the sick state of U.S. healthcare

"The first shot at Royal Angkor International Hospital cost $125." (Cambodia)

"Jan received her second Verorab shot at a clinic in northern Thailand. The bill this time: A mere $18.50"

"Things changed dramatically once the Kerns returned to this country. For her third shot, Jan visited Torrance Memorial Medical Center. It was a Sunday, and she had to go to the emergency room, so that added considerably to her cost. The tab for a single injection: $5,254.85."


"“It’s obvious that our system is unlike any other health system,” said Uwe Reinhardt, a healthcare economist at Princeton University. “Other systems were set up to care for patients. Ours was set up by the providers — the hospitals and drug companies — for their own benefit.”"

Most countries in the world have healthcare to treat patients, the US has healthcare to make healthcare providers money.

So much money gets wasted in corruption, it's something like 3% of US GDP at the very least.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. The sky is falling. I get it. Now maybe you should know that the patient pays only a small co-pay, if anything, and the insurer gets a deep discount ... perhaps as deep as 90% off. Pretty much nobody pays full price which may be why it is so outrageously high.

Why is it our whiny, sniveling, low-info, Chicken Little Loony Lefties either fail to tell the whole story or just don't know it?

Oh, yeah, I know these discounts.

"Hey, I'll sell you this item that you can buy for 10 bucks for only 25,000 bucks."

"No thanks"

"Okay, HUGE discount of 90%, now it's only 10,000 bucks"

"But, 90% of 25,000 isn't 10,000"

"Okay then, 9,000, special price just for you"

"Deal".

Discounts and the drug is still $5,000 compared to like $20 elsewhere. Who needs discounts like that?

If you want to go to Cambodia for medical treatment, go right ahead. No one is stopping you.

 

[Redfish]

because of the skillful manipulation of facts and emotions. How else can you convince working people that unions are bad for them?

I don't know (and neither do you) that anyone believes unions are bad for them but clearly many no longer believe unions are good for them (thus the exodus over the last 50 years).

in the 20s and 30s unions performed a needed function. But lets not forget who created the 40 hour work week, weekends, 8 hour work days, Does anyone know?



anyone






Henry Ford, not the UAW, Teamsters, or any other union.

 

[SAYIT]

Employee covered health insurance has become something that keeps the slaves in their place. Better not jump ship if there's no coverage where you're going.

your employer is offering you a benefit in order to keep you working for him, How awful! Liberal "logic" is an oxymoron.

I find social liberalism can and should be distinguished from the economic loony leftism exhibited by some here.

Social liberalism is a matter of (sometimes misguided) conscience. Social Security, for instance (and for all its imperfections) is rooted in the correct belief that many Americans would save little or nothing for retirement and everyone who works - and many who never work - benefit from it.

Economic loony leftism ("but, it will work this time!") is just ... loony.

One can be both socially liberal and economically conservative.

 

[JoeNormal]

Bullshit. I had a pre-existing condition (misdiagnosed bulging disc) when I owned my own company and I wasn't even able to get insurance. It wasn't just an opt-out on back related issues, it was any kind of coverage.

were you turned away from a hospital or ER? Did any doctor refuse to treat you?

not being insured did not equal not being treated----------and you fricken well know it.

I was lucky enough not to have had any major issues when I was uninsured. It would have bankrupted me if I had. You're so full of shit it's coming out of your ears.

more bullshit. no one goes bankrupt SOLELY because of medical bills.

so your earlier claim that americans were refused care before ACA is a lie. thanks for admitting that.

It happens way too often jackass. How far do you think your modest self worth would go toward massive medical bills?

Hospitals do not get judgements against people for unpaid bills, they write them off or they are paid by Medicaid or some charity.

No one goes bankrupt just because of medical bills. It just does not happen.

You are a willfully ignorant fool. Do you (did you) work in the health care industry or something?

Biggest Cause of Personal Bankruptcies? Medical Bills

 

[SAYIT]

How a bite from a stray dog shows the sick state of U.S. healthcare

"The first shot at Royal Angkor International Hospital cost $125." (Cambodia)

"Jan received her second Verorab shot at a clinic in northern Thailand. The bill this time: A mere $18.50"

"Things changed dramatically once the Kerns returned to this country. For her third shot, Jan visited Torrance Memorial Medical Center. It was a Sunday, and she had to go to the emergency room, so that added considerably to her cost. The tab for a single injection: $5,254.85."


"“It’s obvious that our system is unlike any other health system,” said Uwe Reinhardt, a healthcare economist at Princeton University. “Other systems were set up to care for patients. Ours was set up by the providers — the hospitals and drug companies — for their own benefit.”"

Most countries in the world have healthcare to treat patients, the US has healthcare to make healthcare providers money.

So much money gets wasted in corruption, it's something like 3% of US GDP at the very least.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. The sky is falling. I get it. Now maybe you should know that the patient pays only a small co-pay, if anything, and the insurer gets a deep discount ... perhaps as deep as 90% off. Pretty much nobody pays full price which may be why it is so outrageously high.

Why is it our whiny, sniveling, low-info, Chicken Little Loony Lefties either fail to tell the whole story or just don't know it?

Oh, yeah, I know these discounts.

"Hey, I'll sell you this item that you can buy for 10 bucks for only 25,000 bucks."

"No thanks"

"Okay, HUGE discount of 90%, now it's only 10,000 bucks"

"But, 90% of 25,000 isn't 10,000"

"Okay then, 9,000, special price just for you"

"Deal".

Discounts and the drug is still $5,000 compared to like $20 elsewhere. Who needs discounts like that?

OK, your analogy sucks but I'll play anyway: Because the cost of making that drug $20 to the patient is massive gov't intervention that stifles R&D (why do you suppose so many drugs and cures are developed in the US?), drags the economy as taxes must be collected and filtered through gov't fingers, diminishes quality control and purity to cut costs, and creates long waits for patient services.

There's a good reason many foreigners come to the US - many from socialized med countries - for med care and training (and pay handsomely for it). Put on your thinking cap and try to figure why.

 

[JoeNormal]

Employee covered health insurance has become something that keeps the slaves in their place. Better not jump ship if there's no coverage where you're going.

your employer is offering you a benefit in order to keep you working for him, How awful! Liberal "logic" is an oxymoron.

I find social liberalism can and should be distinguished from the economic loony leftism exhibited by some here.

Social liberalism is a matter of (sometimes misguided) conscience. Social Security, for instance (and for all its imperfections) is rooted in the correct belief that many Americans would save little or nothing for retirement and everyone who works - and many who never work - benefit from it.

Economic loony leftism ("but, it will work this time!") is just ... loony.

One can be both socially liberal and economically conservative.

I'm sure that neither you nor Redfish have ever come up with an idea for a business (or had an independent thought for that matter) that became impractical because of a loss of health care benefits.

 

[Redfish]

were you turned away from a hospital or ER? Did any doctor refuse to treat you?

not being insured did not equal not being treated----------and you fricken well know it.

I was lucky enough not to have had any major issues when I was uninsured. It would have bankrupted me if I had. You're so full of shit it's coming out of your ears.

more bullshit. no one goes bankrupt SOLELY because of medical bills.

so your earlier claim that americans were refused care before ACA is a lie. thanks for admitting that.

It happens way too often jackass. How far do you think your modest self worth would go toward massive medical bills?

Hospitals do not get judgements against people for unpaid bills, they write them off or they are paid by Medicaid or some charity.

No one goes bankrupt just because of medical bills. It just does not happen.

You are a willfully ignorant fool. Do you (did you) work in the health care industry or something?

Biggest Cause of Personal Bankruptcies? Medical Bills

If you took the time to actually look at the data you posted you would see that the title is misleading.

What is actually says is that most bankruptcies have some medical bills included. What it also says is that the bulk of the debt is in credit card debt, car payments, mortgages, etc.

What it also does not say is that most medical debt is either written off or paid by Medicaid, medicare, or some charity.

NO one files bankruptcy solely due to medical bills. Stop lying.

 

[Redfish]

Employee covered health insurance has become something that keeps the slaves in their place. Better not jump ship if there's no coverage where you're going.

your employer is offering you a benefit in order to keep you working for him, How awful! Liberal "logic" is an oxymoron.

I find social liberalism can and should be distinguished from the economic loony leftism exhibited by some here.

Social liberalism is a matter of (sometimes misguided) conscience. Social Security, for instance (and for all its imperfections) is rooted in the correct belief that many Americans would save little or nothing for retirement and everyone who works - and many who never work - benefit from it.

Economic loony leftism ("but, it will work this time!") is just ... loony.

One can be both socially liberal and economically conservative.

I'm sure that neither you nor Redfish have ever come up with an idea for a business (or had an independent thought for that matter) that became impractical because of a loss of health care benefits.

stop the bullshit, please. not having insurance does not mean you don't get treatment, it never has. The uninsured in the USA were, and are, paid for by the insured.

ACA changed nothing, all it did was create a massive new govt agency that we also have to now pay for.

 

[JoeNormal]

I was lucky enough not to have had any major issues when I was uninsured. It would have bankrupted me if I had. You're so full of shit it's coming out of your ears.

more bullshit. no one goes bankrupt SOLELY because of medical bills.

so your earlier claim that americans were refused care before ACA is a lie. thanks for admitting that.

It happens way too often jackass. How far do you think your modest self worth would go toward massive medical bills?

Hospitals do not get judgements against people for unpaid bills, they write them off or they are paid by Medicaid or some charity.

No one goes bankrupt just because of medical bills. It just does not happen.

You are a willfully ignorant fool. Do you (did you) work in the health care industry or something?

Biggest Cause of Personal Bankruptcies? Medical Bills

If you took the time to actually look at the data you posted you would see that the title is misleading.

What is actually says is that most bankruptcies have some medical bills included. What it also says is that the bulk of the debt is in credit card debt, car payments, mortgages, etc.

What it also does not say is that most medical debt is either written off or paid by Medicaid, medicare, or some charity.

NO one files bankruptcy solely due to medical bills. Stop lying.

You simply do not want to see what a scam health care has become. Answer the question: did you work in health care?

 

[Redfish]

Employee covered health insurance has become something that keeps the slaves in their place. Better not jump ship if there's no coverage where you're going.

your employer is offering you a benefit in order to keep you working for him, How awful! Liberal "logic" is an oxymoron.

I find social liberalism can and should be distinguished from the economic loony leftism exhibited by some here.

Social liberalism is a matter of (sometimes misguided) conscience. Social Security, for instance (and for all its imperfections) is rooted in the correct belief that many Americans would save little or nothing for retirement and everyone who works - and many who never work - benefit from it.

Economic loony leftism ("but, it will work this time!") is just ... loony.

One can be both socially liberal and economically conservative.

I'm sure that neither you nor Redfish have ever come up with an idea for a business (or had an independent thought for that matter) that became impractical because of a loss of health care benefits.

that post verifies how little you actually know.

 

[Redfish]

more bullshit. no one goes bankrupt SOLELY because of medical bills.

so your earlier claim that americans were refused care before ACA is a lie. thanks for admitting that.

It happens way too often jackass. How far do you think your modest self worth would go toward massive medical bills?

Hospitals do not get judgements against people for unpaid bills, they write them off or they are paid by Medicaid or some charity.

No one goes bankrupt just because of medical bills. It just does not happen.

You are a willfully ignorant fool. Do you (did you) work in the health care industry or something?

Biggest Cause of Personal Bankruptcies? Medical Bills

If you took the time to actually look at the data you posted you would see that the title is misleading.

What is actually says is that most bankruptcies have some medical bills included. What it also says is that the bulk of the debt is in credit card debt, car payments, mortgages, etc.

What it also does not say is that most medical debt is either written off or paid by Medicaid, medicare, or some charity.

NO one files bankruptcy solely due to medical bills. Stop lying.

You simply do not want to see what a scam health care has become. Answer the question: did you work in health care?

No, did you? and what does that have to do with the topic?

I had top secret and SAP security clearances most of my career. So I know that Hillary violated federal law regarding classified data. I know the rules. If I did what she did, I would be typing this in Leavenworth prison.