evenflow1969
Gold Member
Results first, Ideology second. Thats how you get shit done, cry baby!!!!!!! You want to cry and accomplish nothing stay on the path you are on!!!!Idiots like PredFan have no interest in looking at the results of thier policies They do not care about the feelings of the family who are imprisoned by fifteen years of court trials. They do not care about the cost of the trials being significantly more than housing them in prison. They do not care that housing them in prison gets them off the street just as well as killing them with less undesirable side effect to the family and society. They do not care about anything but thinking they are always right and blaming lefty for all of their problems. They talk about fiscal consevative policies but do not want to roll up thier sleeves and do the work to figure one out, they just blame it on the lefty. They say and do things they do not think about and when proven wrong they say they did not do them. They say things like "I never said it was not following the law" and then look back and "Now he has been caught and there is an idiot left wing, George Soros supported Attorney General for Orange County who refuses to seek the death penalty which is the law in Florida." They call themselves conservatives but have no respect for conservative values such as the truth, personal responsibilty, respect, and results. They are not conservatives they are kindergarten, namby pamby, crying, wineing, i am rubber you are glue, panty wastes who bring shame on all true conservatives. True conservativesthat exhibited true conservative values like Ronald Reagan, Theodore Rosevelt, and Dwight D. Eisenhour who actually got things done. They governed, they did not complain like these fake conservative tee baggers flooding the boards today. Tee partiers go crawl under the rock ich you came from!!!!!!!!!!!!Don't care. There are guarantees that come with execution: the perp will never again be able to harm an innocent person, or get freed by a judge or a POTUS. We don't execute people to save money, we do it to remove the murderer from society.
No we don't. We do it for revenge. If we wanted to remove them from society then putting them in a hole and forgetting about them is faster, cheaper, and far more efficient while being even more effective.
Appeals for those serving life without parole are not automatic as death penalty cases are. That means nobody is going to file an appeal. What the death row inmate has is hope. Hope for a new trial on some technicality or some new evidence. Evidence that dozens of people are pouring over constantly. The person serving life without has no such hope. Any minor inconsistency in the trial can and often is grounds for a new trial. The death row inmate will often get two or sometimes even three new trials because of some minor technicality.
Life without parole is actually far more cruel if you are looking to make the baddie suffer. I mentioned hope above. A decade goes by and visitation from family dwindles because they know the baddie is never getting out. There is time and they can skip this week for a trip with friends. Life goes on in other words.
It is far more likely that the death penalty case will get that commutation to simple life which means they are eligible for parole. It happened in Indiana. A cop killer got out of prison despite being sentenced to death three times.
Gary officer's family outraged as his killer is released from prison
Those automatic appeals work. Not all the time, or even most of the time, but often enough to give the baddie hope.
So it is cheaper, more effective, and far easier to go with life without parole. It is also more cruel, and safer for the community.
That leaves the real reason we sentence people to death. Revenge. We want the satisfaction of watching the man die, hoping to see him cry out. Hoping to see the fear in his eye, or see him struggle and be forced onto the gurney. But that never happens. The condemned has time to accept his fate, and seek salvation through religion, through faith. Plus they give the condemned sedatives to calm them down just so they don't have a scene like the one above.
No one fights for the life without parole convict like they do for the death penalty sentence. They put them in a hole and forget about them.
I don't agree that we do it for revenge, but whatever, we don't do it to save money.
I've demonstrated that each argument in favor is at best wrong. It doesn't remove the criminal from society. Life without parole is very rarely commuted or overturned unless there is DNA evidence that proves the convicted didn't do the crime. While that happened far more frequently with death penalty cases.
So the only thing left is revenge. Unless you are less honest with yourself than you were here in this thread.
Look at the link I provided again. Three trials. Three guilty findings. Three times he was sentenced to death. Each time a small technical error in the trial was enough for a new trial to be granted. Finally the DA decided to go with the equivalent of a plea bargain. A year later the cop killer was released with time served.
Why would the DA do it? Well the conviction was based largely on witnesses. Those witnesses were getting older and more reluctant to testify again and again. The State was getting tired of paying for trials over and over again.
Eventually the witnesses would be unavailable. Either from moving or death in the natural cycle. Eventually the appeals court would rule that the State had flubbed it one too many times and overturn the conviction. So a cop killer goes free. All because someone wanted to make a statement about being tough on crime and showing that they supported the police.
How does that make the victims family feel better? I'm sure they were sick of the trials being done over and over again. The constant legal wrangling and nitpicking over the minutiae were certainly infuriating.
How much better off would they be if they heard life without parole? Knowing that the guilty would never be free again would put closure on the wound wouldn't it?
But instead they wanted to go for the big win and they lost it all. The cop killer is free. The cop is still dead. The family could never move on because of the trials and then more trials. Pain, frustration, anger, and no closure.
If you want to punish the guilty. Then life without parole is the answer.
Ohio executes Brett Hartmann in slaying of Highland Square woman
I knew one of the relatives in that case. I saw what it does to the family. The execution took fifteen years. A decade and a half of living nightmare. Always wondering if the guilty would go free. Always wondering if new trials would start it all over again.
He said he had no desire to spend the rest of his life in prison and was hoping to win a second trial and secure additional DNA testing. He said his family knows he is innocent, and he hopes the search for Snipes’ true killer continues.
“I think we’re lucky on death row because we have an out,” Hartmann said. “It’s a harsh structure in prison, but at least we’re not in for 50 to 60 years. Death row is its own little enigma. We are in our own little world.
“But being locked up and away from family, it’s tough. I’m tired of fighting and no one listening. I’m tired of begging for money [and tired] of prison. So, there’s some relief.”
He said to the Warden "I'm good, let's roll".
Fifteen years before closure could even begin.
That straw man took a lot of work to build.
"It is amazing what you can accomplish if you do not care who gets the credit." Harry S. Truman
"If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking." Geoge S. Patton
"It is only common sense to recognize that the great bulk of Americans, whether Republican or Democrat, face many common problems and agree on a number of basic objectives." Dwight D. Eisenhower
"The middle of the road is all of the usable surface. The extremes, right and left, are in the gutters." Dwight D. Eisenhower
Some words from people who actually did something!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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